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Track Weathering.

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  • kianholstead
    I am ready to weather my track. I have read the Z-tracks article where Jeffery talks about using Polly S Dull Red. I have also read Bill K s description of the
    Message 1 of 11 , Apr 27, 2002
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      I am ready to weather my track. I have read the Z-tracks article
      where Jeffery talks about using Polly S Dull Red. I have also read
      Bill K's description of the DeccoColor Marker from the Craft store
      cut on a bias to run down the track. The pen method seems to be
      easier. My track is alreay secured. I need to weather it and then do
      the ballast.

      Two questions:

      1) Do you weather the inside of the rails?
      2) The marker I found was dark brown. Nothing with a Rust color. Any
      chance there is stock number or colr name for the right marker?

      I find that I need to practice more before I do the track on my
      layout as I am getting too much paint on the ties. I guess the tip
      REALLY needs to be cut on an angle.

      Thanks for the help.

      Kian
    • zbendtrack@aol.com
      ... My perception is that most folks don t. The tops and insides of the rails are left for electrical connection to the wheels. It would also have a tendency
      Message 2 of 11 , Apr 28, 2002
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        Kian:

        > I am ready to weather my track. I have read the Z-tracks article
        > where Jeffery talks about using Polly S Dull Red. I have also read
        > Bill K's description of the DeccoColor Marker from the Craft store
        > Two questions:

        > 1) Do you weather the inside of the rails?

        My perception is that most folks don't. The tops and insides of the rails
        are left for electrical connection to the wheels. It would also have a
        tendency to rub off on the wheels of the loco and cars, creating other
        serious problems.

        > 2) The marker I found was dark brown. Nothing with a Rust color. Any
        > chance there is stock number or colr name for the right marker?

        At Michael's Arts and Crafts, they normally carry two colors: brown, and
        dark brown.

        The dark brown has absolutely no red color content in it, which real rust
        does.

        Just to show how bad I still am with the digital camera, I took a picture of
        the brown and dark brown pens, against a piece of "artwork" a friend gave me.
        I blew the focus, but the colors are what's important.

        The "artwork" is actually a piece of real rail that has been cut with a torch
        into a train shape, which has rusted (good, according to artists). Since I
        cannot control the color on your video adapter or monitor, hopefully, the
        "relative" colors will show that THIS piece of rail is just a bit darker than
        "brown" and not nearly as dark as "dark brown." And it has a LOT of red in
        it, just like the "brown" pen does.

        http://members.aol.com/zbendtrackpics/rail.jpg

        Rails in your neighborhood may be a very different color, however (discussed
        below).

        > I find that I need to practice more before I do the track on my
        > layout as I am getting too much paint on the ties. I guess the tip
        > REALLY needs to be cut on an angle.

        I've gone to more of a flat bladed screwdriver tip for "installed" track.
        While any "opps" on the plastic ties can be touched up with almost any paint
        that sticks to plastic, its a real pain. Better to stay off the tieplates in
        the first place.

        By the way, some of the things I've learned in the year since I posted the
        idea:

        1. The color of rust is clearly in the mind of the beholder. No two of us
        would agree on the "correct" color, I'm convinced.

        2. The actual color of rust is not constant, to my big awakening. It
        depends on the impurities intentionally put into the steel rails to make the
        steel stronger, or wear better, or bend better, or, or, or. It also depends
        on how much oil drops off the trains, local weather and a host of other
        variables. Since then, I've found at least 7 shades of "rust" round my own
        house (water pipes, lawn furniture, screws holding in the street numbers on
        the front of the house, etc.). Live and learn.

        3. The local fellow who hand laid his Z track on a coffee table layout hand
        painted his rails. Two custom mixed "rust color" coats with a dry brushed
        "oily black" top coat. Hours and hours of work. Looks fantastic.

        4. I've discovered I'm lazy. I'd never finish anything if I spent that much
        time on the track. Certainly, I take a deep, deep bow to those that take the
        time. It shows. But I needed something that is zip-zip-done. Just the
        "illusion of reality" works for me. Perhaps not for others.

        5. I still have not found any other brands of markers that stick to metal.
        I'm using the Decco paints on small parts of brass buildings. Seems to
        stick. Doesn't drown the details (i.e., wood grains). Trouble is, I've got
        all 14 of the colors. And that's clearly not enough colors. So the air
        brush is still needed.

        For what its worth....again.

        Bill K.
        Houston
      • jmac_han
        Hi Kian, Yes, I weather all visible surfaces of the rail except for the rail head and the inside edge of the rail head. You ll probably find that a brush will
        Message 3 of 11 , Apr 29, 2002
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          Hi Kian,

          Yes, I weather all visible surfaces of the rail except for the rail
          head and the inside edge of the rail head. You'll probably find that
          a brush will allow you to get inside the rails much easier than the
          paint pen. In any case, if you do not weather the insides of the
          rails you'll certainly notice the metal surface. Of course, if it is
          impossible to see the rail then it is not necessary to apply
          weathering.

          Make sure that you clean the rail heads well after painting. You'll
          probably find that your locos will need several good wheel cleanings
          until the paint has been worn off those spots that you missed with
          your chamois or other cleaner.

          Roadbed is always quite dirty except for the brand new stuff ;-)
          You can apply a wash of dilute india ink in rubbing alcohol or
          whatever you fancy to weather the ties and roadbed.

          Have fun,
          Jeffrey MacHan


          --- In z_scale@y..., "kianholstead" <kianholstead@y...> wrote:

          > Two questions:
          >
          > 1) Do you weather the inside of the rails?

          >
          > Kian
        • zbendtrack@aol.com
          Kian: Opps. Bad link on my part. I ll repeat just that part of the email, with the correct link. Bill K. Just to show how bad I still am with the digital
          Message 4 of 11 , Apr 29, 2002
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            Kian:

            Opps. Bad link on my part. I'll repeat just that part of the email, with
            the correct link.

            Bill K.

            Just to show how bad I still am with the digital camera, I took a picture of
            the brown and dark brown pens, against a piece of "artwork" a friend gave me.

            I blew the focus, but the colors are what's important.

            The "artwork" is actually a piece of real rail that has been cut with a torch
            into a train shape, which has rusted (good, according to artists). Since I
            cannot control the color on your video adapter or monitor, hopefully, the
            relative" colors will show that THIS piece of rail is just a bit darker than
            "brown" and not nearly as dark as "dark brown." And it has a LOT of red in
            it, just like the "brown" pen does.

            http://members.aol.com/zbendtrack/rust.jpg
          • zbendtrack@aol.com
            ... I value your opinions. What paints did you use that don t rub off on the flanges and wheels? And wind up in the electrical wipers? Listen and learn time.
            Message 5 of 11 , Apr 29, 2002
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              Jeffrey:

              > Yes, I weather all visible surfaces of the rail except for the rail
              > head and the inside edge of the rail head.

              I value your opinions. What paints did you use that don't rub off on the
              flanges and wheels? And wind up in the electrical wipers?

              Listen and learn time.

              Bill K.
            • Ole Rosted
              On Mon, 29 Apr 2002 10:25:32 EDT, you wrote: Hi Bill, ... Ok - they *are* a little out of fucus :-)) So are mine! I m beginning to think that light - lots of
              Message 6 of 11 , Apr 29, 2002
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                On Mon, 29 Apr 2002 10:25:32 EDT, you wrote:

                Hi Bill,

                >Just to show how bad I still am with the digital camera, I took a picture of
                >the brown and dark brown pens, against a piece of "artwork" a friend gave me.
                >
                >I blew the focus, but the colors are what's important.

                Ok - they *are* a little out of fucus :-))
                So are mine!
                I'm beginning to think that light - lots of light - is fundamental to
                close-up photography. In fact I believe that taking the pics outdoors
                on a lightly clouded, sunny day is the best way to get an even - and
                sufficient - lighting.

                What camera do you use? ( you may have told us but either I haven't
                seen it or I have forgotten it) Talk about "volatile memory" :-((

                I have added a page to my close-up "site" at

                http://home4.inet.tele.dk/rosted

                if anyone cares to see (some of) my attemts. I had some trouble with
                the navigation buttons (at the bottom of the pages. But they are
                working now.

                I didn't take the *good* pics on the pages, and my search for the
                artist hasn't revealed him/her.

                regards Ole Rosted
              • zbendtrack@aol.com
                ... Its a Casio QV-3000EX (same as the 3500 with minor changes). One of many, many good cameras out there these days. I ve actually made macro shots that were
                Message 7 of 11 , Apr 29, 2002
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                  Ole:

                  > Ok - they *are* a little out of focus :-))
                  > So are mine!
                  > What camera do you use?

                  Its a Casio QV-3000EX (same as the 3500 with minor changes). One of many,
                  many good cameras out there these days.

                  I've actually made macro shots that were crystal clear with a depth of field
                  from 0.7 inch thru 15 inches with it (lens to subject distances with a ruler
                  laying in the scene).

                  But as usual, I was in a hurry to get the "colors" on the web, and pooped a
                  shot just before retiring for the day. Haste makes waste clearly applied.
                  If anyone expresses any interest in a better shot, I'll redo it. But the
                  patches of red rust on the rail, and the pen tops, were the sole value.

                  The problem with a camera that has 15,000 combinations of settings, is to
                  learn (and remember) how all those options interact. More time is required.
                  The problem is with the short circuit behind the lens, not the camera. My
                  goal is to catch up with Dave's pictures.

                  Bill K.
                • kianholstead
                  Bill, thanks for the information. I didn t mean to start a whole new thread on photography though! But glad to help. ha! I went down today and bought the Decco
                  Message 8 of 11 , Apr 30, 2002
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                    Bill, thanks for the information. I didn't mean to start a whole new
                    thread on photography though! But glad to help. ha!

                    I went down today and bought the Decco DRK BRWN marker. That's the
                    color I was looking for!! The regular Brown is too red (for me). I
                    even was able to cut the tip so that nothing (or at least, very
                    little) got on the ties. By the way, Micheal's is having a 50% off
                    sale on all Decco Markers until this Saturday. A great deal!!

                    I have decided to use it on the inside of the rails too. I had to
                    agree with Jeffery that coating the lower portion of the inside of
                    the rail "perfected the look" to use his motto! So here I go...

                    Thanks to the two of you, I'll have great looking rails.

                    My next question for the group is about WEATHERING STRUCTURES. How?,
                    with what?, solution dilution %'s?, tips? tricks? etc. What works and
                    what doesn't.

                    And Jeffery, I've decided to make a go at making my Cortina into a 4-
                    seasons layout! Thanks for the photo inspiration!

                    I think I can, I think I can, I think I can...

                    Thanks again,

                    Kian
                  • jmac_han
                    My wife is the structure weathering expert in my household. I think that I promised that I would do an article in Ztrack telling the world all about her
                    Message 9 of 11 , May 1, 2002
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                      My wife is the structure weathering expert in my household. I think
                      that I promised that I would do an article in Ztrack telling the
                      world all about her techniques...maybe this Fall.

                      My rather limited talents in the structure weathering regard include
                      using india ink washes (a couple of drops of ink in a small bottle of
                      rubbing alcohol), dry brushing with various colours of paints, rust,
                      white, grimy black etc., dusting with weathering chalks, washes with
                      rust solutions and applications of ground cover materials for ivy,
                      and mosses. Just a few ideas...

                      Keep us informed of your 4-seasons project. I know you can, I know
                      you can, I know you can...

                      Cheers,
                      Jeffrey



                      --- In z_scale@y..., "kianholstead" <kianholstead@y...> wrote:

                      > My next question for the group is about WEATHERING STRUCTURES.
                      How?,
                      > with what?, solution dilution %'s?, tips? tricks? etc. What works
                      and
                      > what doesn't.
                      >
                      > And Jeffery, I've decided to make a go at making my Cortina into a
                      4-
                      > seasons layout! Thanks for the photo inspiration!
                      >
                      > I think I can, I think I can, I think I can...
                      >
                      > Thanks again,
                      >
                      > Kian
                    • Kari Tanskanen
                      Ole, I think there s no need to be that critical about depth of field. You are just pushing the technology to the limits. The Tuborg car picture is an extreme
                      Message 10 of 11 , May 3, 2002
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                        Ole,
                        I think there's no need to be that critical about depth of field.
                        You are just pushing the technology to the limits. The Tuborg car
                        picture
                        is an extreme close-up. And the green train shot from an angle is
                        difficult
                        because it requires a lot of depth of field. It's no use to compare with
                        those pictures somebody else took. They just show the advantage of
                        bigger
                        scales in this case. I don't know whether other digital cameras have
                        smaller apertures available or whether an expensive digital SLR would
                        help in this case, but I think that's about as good as it gets with
                        current state of technology.

                        Regards,
                        ===========================================================================
                        Kari Tanskanen ktanskan@...
                        http://tappi.me.tut.fi/~ktanskan/photo/z/
                        Tampere University of Technology Machine Design Laboratory
                        ===========================================================================


                        Ole Rosted wrote:
                        >
                        >
                        > Ok - they *are* a little out of fucus :-))
                        > So are mine!
                        > I'm beginning to think that light - lots of light - is fundamental to
                        > close-up photography. In fact I believe that taking the pics outdoors
                        > on a lightly clouded, sunny day is the best way to get an even - and
                        > sufficient - lighting.
                        >
                        > What camera do you use? ( you may have told us but either I haven't
                        > seen it or I have forgotten it) Talk about "volatile memory" :-((
                        >
                        > I have added a page to my close-up "site" at
                        >
                        > http://home4.inet.tele.dk/rosted
                        >
                        > if anyone cares to see (some of) my attemts. I had some trouble with
                        > the navigation buttons (at the bottom of the pages. But they are
                        > working now.
                        >
                        > I didn't take the *good* pics on the pages, and my search for the
                        > artist hasn't revealed him/her.
                        >
                        > regards Ole Rosted
                        >
                      • Ole Rosted
                        On Fri, 03 May 2002 10:07:51 +0300, Kari Tanskanen wrote: Hi Kari, ... What else are limits for? :-) Thanks for the mental support, Kari, I am/was sitting here
                        Message 11 of 11 , May 4, 2002
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                          On Fri, 03 May 2002 10:07:51 +0300, Kari Tanskanen wrote:

                          Hi Kari,

                          >Ole,
                          >I think there's no need to be that critical about depth of field.
                          >You are just pushing the technology to the limits.

                          What else are limits for? :-)

                          Thanks for the mental support, Kari, I am/was sitting here feeling
                          dumber and dumber. By no means an unfamiliar feeling, but nevertheless
                          difficult to get used to.

                          > They just show the advantage of bigger scales in this case.

                          That must be the only situation for Z to be disadvantageous?

                          >I don't know whether other digital cameras have
                          >smaller apertures available or whether an expensive digital SLR would
                          >help in this case,

                          I do!! - According to specs - that is. The Nikon DX1 and D100 have all
                          the things I need. Unfortunately I do *not* have what Nikon needs =
                          6.000 usd. OK the D100 is "only" half that price, but still beyond my
                          spending horizon.
                          And even if it weren't, I'm not convinced, that a better camera would
                          help me. There are people that can do whatever they want using a bent
                          nail and a piece of band-aid. And there is me. Sad but true :-(
                          Never mind - I'm having great fun anyway!

                          >but I think that's about as good as it gets with
                          >current state of technology.

                          Thank you!!

                          regards Ole Rosted
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