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Re: [Z_Scale] RE: THE BIG NEWS AT DENVER...

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  • Malcolm Cleaveland
    Alan, Absolutely! I remember an article, I think in N Scale magazine, where the author converted all his N scale rolling stock to MTL Z scale couplers.
    Message 1 of 11 , May 8, 2012
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      Alan,

      Absolutely! I remember an article, I think in N Scale magazine, where
      the author converted all his N scale rolling stock to MTL Z scale
      couplers. Unfortunately, Z scale is approaching, if it has not reached
      it, the point where things like wheel flanges cannot be in scale because
      it would never run reliably.

      I suppose it's very nice that some people are using Z components in the
      larger scales, but it does not really enlarge the Z market appreciably.
      We need to grow the Z market so companies like Microscale will be willing
      to produce Z products for our consumption.

      CheerZ,
      -- Malcolm Z
      MCZ Models

      On Tue, 8 May 2012, Alan Cox wrote:

      >> scalers do operating. This could be the game changer. Not that we need
      >> validation from all those other scales, but we might gain some converts.
      >
      > Some fine scalers already use Z coupling systems in larger scales where
      > they are more prototypically sized than the vendor ones.
      >
      > Alan
      >
    • Jeff
      All of MTL s rolling stock of drilled, I mean cast (but not tapped) coupler mount holes. Their new coupler boxes use push-pins instead of screws so it may be
      Message 2 of 11 , May 8, 2012
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        All of MTL's rolling stock of drilled, I mean cast (but not tapped) coupler mount holes. Their new coupler boxes use push-pins instead of screws so it may be easy.

        See the PFE's for example. I don't think the push-pin works on legacy cast frames now in use. Need to check ;)


        Jeff M
        SF Bay Area Z

        -----Original Message-----
        From: "trainssd" <greg@...>
        Sender: z_scale@yahoogroups.com
        Date: Tue, 08 May 2012 17:01:03
        To: <z_scale@yahoogroups.com>
        Reply-To: z_scale@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: [Z_Scale] Re: THE BIG NEWS AT DENVER...

        Was asking Don Fedjur why no body mounts in Z at the convention. With our broader curves, better operation, better backing of long trains, better appearance.

        With all the space "carved out" for the coupler/truck swing at the ends of a car, a snap-in piece of plastic with integral coupler box seems possible.

        Greg



        ------------------------------------

        Z-scale: minimum siZe, MAXIMUM enjoyment!
        Yahoo! Groups Links
      • Kevin Brady
        Hi all, There was a Z-scale modeler in England,I recall years ago who did exactly that. Dr D the point where things like wheel flanges cannot be in scale
        Message 3 of 11 , May 8, 2012
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          Hi all,
          There was a Z-scale modeler in England,I recall years ago who did
          exactly that.

          Dr D


          the point where things like wheel flanges cannot be in scale because
          > it would never run reliably.
          >
          >


          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • Lee Barry
          Malcolm,  I was in N for a goodly number of years and when I came to Z, I disposed of all my N stuff but a little I still have all of my Kato track. I d love
          Message 4 of 11 , May 8, 2012
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            Malcolm,

             I was in N for a goodly number of years and when I came to Z, I disposed of all my N stuff but a little I still have all of my Kato track.

            I'd love to have been able to go out there for 2 reasons: #1) to enjoy meeting a lot of the people I have talked to and dealt with in the scale and #2) to catch one of the Rockies home games to see if I could speak to Michael Cuddyer, right fielder of the Rockies coming over this year from the Twins. I knew his father when I lived in Norfolk,Va., my hometown, he , my brother, and I worked for The A&P grocery store chain and sometimes we would go the "Kings Head Inn", a pub near Old Dominion University on Hampton Blvd. But alas I had no funds so I had to remain home, but did get to see Michael Cuddyer hit a Grand Slam Homerun, a feat that has not been accomplished many times im the MLB. This was the 6th of his career.

            Maybe the Z scale community should look at having a convention in Atlanta next year. You know I think there are a lot of us here EAST OF THE MISSISSIPPI RIVER. In Atlanta my wife and I could stay with one of my 2 sisters who live in Athens,Ga. a 60 mile drive to Atlanta

            Lee Barry CEO LZPMRR Bristol,Va.
            --- On Tue, 5/8/12, Malcolm Cleaveland <mcleavel@...> wrote:


            From: Malcolm Cleaveland <mcleavel@...>
            Subject: Re: [Z_Scale] RE: THE BIG NEWS AT DENVER...
            To: "Alan Cox" <alan@...>
            Cc: z_scale@yahoogroups.com
            Date: Tuesday, May 8, 2012, 4:30 PM



             



            Alan,

            Absolutely! I remember an article, I think in N Scale magazine, where
            the author converted all his N scale rolling stock to MTL Z scale
            couplers. Unfortunately, Z scale is approaching, if it has not reached it, the point where things like wheel flanges cannot be in scale because it would never run reliably.

            I suppose it's very nice that some people are using Z components in the larger scales, but it does not really enlarge the Z market appreciably. We need to grow the Z market so companies like Microscale will be willing to produce Z products for our consumption.

            CheerZ,
            -- Malcolm Z
            MCZ Models
          • Alan Cox
            On Tue, 08 May 2012 11:30:59 -0500 (CDT) ... Nothing off the shelf is remotely close to that. The flange depth is probably close on the newer wheels - beyond
            Message 5 of 11 , May 8, 2012
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              On Tue, 08 May 2012 11:30:59 -0500 (CDT)
              Malcolm Cleaveland <mcleavel@...> wrote:

              > Alan,
              >
              > Absolutely! I remember an article, I think in N Scale magazine, where
              > the author converted all his N scale rolling stock to MTL Z scale
              > couplers. Unfortunately, Z scale is approaching, if it has not reached
              > it, the point where things like wheel flanges cannot be in scale because
              > it would never run reliably.

              Nothing off the shelf is remotely close to that. The flange depth is
              probably close on the newer wheels - beyond that dust starts to derail.
              The wheel width, flange width, fat and lumpy track and the huge gaping
              gaps in the pointwork are however nowhere near.

              Indeed N sized fine scale (fiNe, 2fs etc) is way finer than any
              commercial Z today. You could certainly do a Z fine scale using code 30
              rail or so, 1mm wide wheels and much finer pointwork if you were
              sufficiently inclined.

              > I suppose it's very nice that some people are using Z components in the
              > larger scales, but it does not really enlarge the Z market appreciably.

              I think it's good for another reason - it helps fund Z products !

              Alan
            • david.davidksmith
              There s nothing to prevent scaling down wheels and rails precisely to 1:220 (long ago I did it for N scale). For it to function, however, the trackwork must be
              Message 6 of 11 , May 8, 2012
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                There's nothing to prevent scaling down wheels and rails precisely to 1:220 (long ago I did it for N scale). For it to function, however, the trackwork must be nothing less than absolutely perfect, and the cars weighted well above standard practice. Sprung trucks and drivers are also a necessity. By this time, costs would be astronomical--over a hundred dollars per wheelset; a few hundred for one truck; perhaps a thousand for one car, and the track--I cannot even imagine it. In the end, though, for someone with bottomless pockets, completely accurate wheels and track are indeed feasible. Practical, however, they are not.

                Regards,
                David

                http://davidksmith.com/modeling.htm

                --- In z_scale@yahoogroups.com, Kevin Brady <kbvrod@...> wrote:
                >
                > Hi all,
                > There was a Z-scale modeler in England,I recall years ago who did
                > exactly that.
                >
                > Dr D
                >
                >
                > the point where things like wheel flanges cannot be in scale because
                > > it would never run reliably.
                > >
                > >
                >
                >
                > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                >
              • de Champeaux
                Hi folks. NZT s announcement is really great news. I do concur, it ll be great improvement over non-MTL couplers, such as AZL s Autolatch. However, as most of
                Message 7 of 11 , May 9, 2012
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                  Hi folks. NZT's' announcement is really great news. I do concur, it'll be great improvement over non-MTL couplers, such as AZL's Autolatch. However, as most of my rolling stock is MTL's Magnematic equipped, I can say that switching operations are already a reality on my layout... What I'm hoping with NZT's news? Non-MTL cars (AZL, FT, IM, etc), RTR with "switching-compatible" couplers, such as were FR and AZL's items prior to weird MTL's policy regarding coupler licencing.

                  Dom



                  ----------------------------------------------------------------------




                  From: Malcolm Cleaveland <mcleavel@...>
                  Sender: z_scale@yahoogroups.com
                  Date: Tue, 08 May 2012 10:57:27 -0500 (CDT)
                  To: <Z_scale@yahoogroups.com>
                  ReplyTo: z_scale@yahoogroups.com
                  Subject: [Z_Scale] RE: THE BIG NEWS AT DENVER...
                  Folks,

                  Cannot agree more. The moment I saw the flyer, the words "Game changer"
                  flashed through my mind. If anyone can do it, it's David K. Smith.

                  Since most Z scale rolling stock now has integral truck+coupler combos
                  instead of the more prototypical body mount couplers, it will be a
                  necessity for NZT to partner with AZL or some other truck+coupler producer
                  to make OEM rolling stock and convert old rolling stock from AZL,
                  Intermountain and Full Throttle. Who is going to step up to that
                  challenge? If NZT does come out with a truck+coupler combo as well as a
                  standalone coupler, I foresee a massive conversion job.

                  The prospect of practical switching in Z with AZL, Full Throttle and
                  Intermountain rolling stock is incredible. Most model RRers in the other
                  scales do not see Z as a credible model RRing venue because very few Z
                  scalers do operating. This could be the game changer. Not that we need
                  validation from all those other scales, but we might gain some converts.

                  CheerZ,
                  -- Malcolm Z
                • Reynard Wellman
                  HI David, I worked in Nn3 for a while and all in all, it s pretty close to actual scale parameters modeling... (turnouts hand-built with code 40 or code 30
                  Message 8 of 11 , May 9, 2012
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                    HI David,
                    I worked in Nn3 for a while and all in all, it's pretty close to actual "scale parameters" modeling...
                    (turnouts hand-built with code 40 or code 30 rail, etc) but even then, there are always fudge
                    factors to up with put. Hand building track and turnouts is very time consuming but it's fun
                    once you've collimated all the adjustments that make the layout operational.

                    I agree: To do similar "fine-scale" modeling in Z scale would require the resources
                    of a Swiss watchmaker and a layout built and operating in an Intel "clean room".
                    Even now, accumulations of dust and dander adversely affect my "off-the-shelf"
                    Z scale operations. And I can't imagine building code 20 track and turnouts!

                    Your new design for a Z scale coupler looks very promising and I wish you the
                    greatest success in manufacturing this elegant solution to our coupling & de-coupling woes.

                    Viva the innovator!

                    Reynard Wellman
                    http://www.micronart.com
                    On May 8, 2012, at 10:27 PM, david.davidksmith wrote:

                    > There's nothing to prevent scaling down wheels and rails precisely to 1:220 (long ago I did it for N scale). For it to function, however, the trackwork must be nothing less than absolutely perfect, and the cars weighted well above standard practice. Sprung trucks and drivers are also a necessity. By this time, costs would be astronomical--over a hundred dollars per wheelset; a few hundred for one truck; perhaps a thousand for one car, and the track--I cannot even imagine it. In the end, though, for someone with bottomless pockets, completely accurate wheels and track are indeed feasible. Practical, however, they are not.
                    >
                    > Regards,
                    > David
                    >
                    > http://davidksmith.com/modeling.htm
                    >
                    > --- In z_scale@yahoogroups.com, Kevin Brady <kbvrod@...> wrote:
                    > >
                    > > Hi all,
                    > > There was a Z-scale modeler in England,I recall years ago who did
                    > > exactly that.
                    > >
                    > > Dr D
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > the point where things like wheel flanges cannot be in scale because
                    > > > it would never run reliably.
                    > > >
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    > >
                    >
                    >



                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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