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Bridge clearance

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  • Michael Piersdorff
    Hey, youse guys! The Prinz Edward County Railway, which became the Picton Sub of the Central Ontario Railway and was eventually taken over by CN, has no
    Message 1 of 9 , Dec 3, 2010
      Hey, youse guys! The Prinz Edward County Railway, which became the Picton Sub of the Central Ontario Railway and was eventually taken over by CN, has no tunnels, no cuts, and not many fills - the original surveyors followed the flattest profile they could find. I doubt there was more than 50ft elevation change from one end to the other (30.5 miles) and the ruling grade was a short stretch at about 1.5%...but they did have a few bridges (more like trestles across creeks, but I will use a bit of license and use an MTL through-girder bridge). Sorry, Loren, no blasted portals...maybe next time.

      Michael

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    • Loren Snyder
      Michael, Straight and level works for me ... From: Michael Piersdorff Date: 12/3/2010 7:45:02 PM To: z_scale@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Z_Scale] Bridge
      Message 2 of 9 , Dec 3, 2010
        Michael,
        Straight and level works for me




        -------Original Message-------

        From: Michael Piersdorff
        Date: 12/3/2010 7:45:02 PM
        To: z_scale@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: [Z_Scale] Bridge clearance

        Hey, youse guys! The Prinz Edward County Railway, which became the Picton
        Sub of the Central Ontario Railway and was eventually taken over by CN, has
        no tunnels, no cuts, and not many fills - the original surveyors followed
        the flattest profile they could find. I doubt there was more than 50ft
        elevation change from one end to the other (30.5 miles) and the ruling grade
        was a short stretch at about 1.5%...but they did have a few bridges (more
        like trestles across creeks, but I will use a bit of license and use an MTL
        through-girder bridge). Sorry, Loren, no blasted portals...maybe next time.

        Michael


        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • Michael Piersdorff
        Thank you, Mark. I tried the 1 3/8 inch recommended in one of the other replies, and the grade is a bit steep (bit under 2% in one direction, bit over in the
        Message 3 of 9 , Dec 4, 2010
          Thank you, Mark. I tried the 1 3/8 inch recommended in one of the other replies, and the grade is a bit steep (bit under 2% in one direction, bit over in the other). I am trying to lengthen the run-up to the bridge, but is isn't easy on a 24 X 26 layout with a folded figure 8 (hello, Loren) layout. I will plug in the 1.2" you have given me, and see what result I get. I am using 3rdPlanIt software, so it isn't as if I have to rip out finished trackwork to make the change.

          Michael

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        • Don Avila
          *Michael: Don t forget you can have a dip or depression leading up to and under and leaving from under the bridge. That should help your grades. Most of my
          Message 4 of 9 , Dec 4, 2010
            *Michael:

            Don't forget you can have a dip or depression leading up to and under and
            leaving from under the bridge. That should help your grades. Most of my
            layout is 2% and have no problem and it has a TON of curves.

            ...don


            *
            On Sat, Dec 4, 2010 at 4:40 PM, Michael Piersdorff <ironduke@...>wrote:

            >
            >
            > Thank you, Mark. I tried the 1 3/8 inch recommended in one of the other
            > replies, and the grade is a bit steep (bit under 2% in one direction, bit
            > over in the other). I am trying to lengthen the run-up to the bridge, but is
            > isn't easy on a 24 X 26 layout with a folded figure 8 (hello, Loren) layout.
            > I will plug in the 1.2" you have given me, and see what result I get. I am
            > using 3rdPlanIt software, so it isn't as if I have to rip out finished
            > trackwork to make the change.
            >
            > Michael
            >
            > __________________________________________________________
            > TRY FREE IM TOOLPACK at http://www.imtoolpack.com/default.aspx?rc=if5
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            >
            >



            --
            *...don a* *- Northern Ohio, USA*


            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • Loren Snyder
            Michael, I feel your pain.....unlike Bill Clinton. Your layout length does present the challenge. The layout I did for MTL was 38 long thus allowing me
            Message 5 of 9 , Dec 4, 2010
              Michael,
              I feel your pain.....unlike Bill Clinton.

              Your layout length does present the challenge. The layout I did for MTL
              was 38" long thus allowing me more freedom in the % of grade. The MTL
              locos have no trouble negotiating the grade on the MTL layout.,

              I only gave myself enough clearance according to a normal boxcar height. At
              that time, (2005) MTL had not released the Gunderson stack nor had AZL
              released the high cube box car.

              Depending upon what cars you plan to run on your layout, I'd suggest taking
              some track and supports and make a test model to check for clearance. You
              may be able to squeeze in down to 1 1/4" clearance. Been some time since I
              played with my unscientific method of calculating, but I found the old eye
              ball technique worked for me.

              I had never heard of 3rdPlanit software back then, and still don't know a
              thing about it. I tend to use the old fashioned way of using household
              items to plan layouts........string, tape, foot ruler, and of course, the
              eye ball. Works for me, but then I hear a different drum beat.

              Keep on marching,
              Loren




              -------Original Message-------

              From: Michael Piersdorff
              Date: 12/4/2010 1:59:31 PM
              To: z_scale@yahoogroups.com
              Subject: [Z_Scale] Bridge clearance

              Thank you, Mark. I tried the 1 3/8 inch recommended in one of the other
              replies, and the grade is a bit steep (bit under 2% in one direction, bit
              over in the other). I am trying to lengthen the run-up to the bridge, but
              is isn't easy on a 24 X 26 layout with a folded figure 8 (hello, Loren)
              layout. I will plug in the 1.2" you have given me, and see what result I
              get. I am using 3rdPlanIt software, so it isn't as if I have to rip out
              finished trackwork to make the change.

              Michael


              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • FT. Dewey
              it has a TON of curves. Just out of curiosity, how much does each curve weigh? :-o                    DEWEY Sometimes the light at the end
              Message 6 of 9 , Dec 5, 2010
                "it has a TON of curves."

                Just out of curiosity, how much does each curve weigh? :-o                    DEWEY

                Sometimes the light at the end of the tunnel is an oncoming train.
                o o o o o o o . . . ______________________________
                o _____ || |
                .][__n_n_|DD[ ====_____ | |
                >(________|__|_[_________]_|____________________________|
                _/oo OOOOO oo` ooo ooo 'o!o!o o!o!o`
                -+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+

                --- On Sat, 12/4/10, Don Avila <zbarr474@...> wrote:

                From: Don Avila <zbarr474@...>
                Subject: Re: [Z_Scale] Bridge clearance
                To: z_scale@yahoogroups.com
                Date: Saturday, December 4, 2010, 4:05 PM

                *Michael:

                Don't forget you can have a dip or depression leading up to and under and
                leaving from under the bridge.  That should help your grades.  Most of my
                layout is 2% and have no problem and it has a TON of curves.

                ...don


                *
                On Sat, Dec 4, 2010 at 4:40 PM, Michael Piersdorff <ironduke@...>wrote:

                >
                >
                > Thank you, Mark. I tried the 1 3/8 inch recommended in one of the other
                > replies, and the grade is a bit steep (bit under 2% in one direction, bit
                > over in the other). I am trying to lengthen the run-up to the bridge, but is
                > isn't easy on a 24 X 26 layout with a folded figure 8 (hello, Loren) layout.
                > I will plug in the 1.2" you have given me, and see what result I get. I am
                > using 3rdPlanIt software, so it isn't as if I have to rip out finished
                > trackwork to make the change.
                >
                > Michael
                >
                > __________________________________________________________
                > TRY FREE IM TOOLPACK at http://www.imtoolpack.com/default.aspx?rc=if5
                > Capture screenshots, upload images, edit and send them to your friends
                > through IMs, post on Twitter®, Facebook®, MySpace™, LinkedIn® – FAST!

                >



                --
                *...don a*  *- Northern Ohio, USA*


                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



                ------------------------------------

                Z-scale:  minimum siZe, MAXIMUM enjoyment!
                Yahoo! Groups Links








                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              • Garth
                Depends on how many curves there are in your ton of curves. 2000/number of curves have a great weekend cheerz Garth
                Message 7 of 9 , Dec 5, 2010
                  Depends on how many curves there are in your ton of curves.

                  2000/number of curves


                  have a great weekend

                  cheerz Garth


                  --- In z_scale@yahoogroups.com, "FT. Dewey" <kc5uci_2@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > "it has a TON of curves."
                  >
                  > Just out of curiosity, how much does each curve weigh? :-o                    DEWEY
                  >
                  > Sometimes the light at the end of the tunnel is an oncoming train.
                  > o o o o o o o . . . ______________________________
                  > o _____ || |
                  > .][__n_n_|DD[ ====_____ | |
                  > >(________|__|_[_________]_|____________________________|
                  > _/oo OOOOO oo` ooo ooo 'o!o!o o!o!o`
                  > -+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
                  >
                  > --- On Sat, 12/4/10, Don Avila <zbarr474@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > From: Don Avila <zbarr474@...>
                  > Subject: Re: [Z_Scale] Bridge clearance
                  > To: z_scale@yahoogroups.com
                  > Date: Saturday, December 4, 2010, 4:05 PM
                  >
                  > *Michael:
                  >
                  > Don't forget you can have a dip or depression leading up to and under and
                  > leaving from under the bridge.  That should help your grades.  Most of my
                  > layout is 2% and have no problem and it has a TON of curves.
                  >
                  > ...don
                  >
                  >
                  > *
                  > On Sat, Dec 4, 2010 at 4:40 PM, Michael Piersdorff <ironduke@...>wrote:
                  >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > Thank you, Mark. I tried the 1 3/8 inch recommended in one of the other
                  > > replies, and the grade is a bit steep (bit under 2% in one direction, bit
                  > > over in the other). I am trying to lengthen the run-up to the bridge, but is
                  > > isn't easy on a 24 X 26 layout with a folded figure 8 (hello, Loren) layout.
                  > > I will plug in the 1.2" you have given me, and see what result I get. I am
                  > > using 3rdPlanIt software, so it isn't as if I have to rip out finished
                  > > trackwork to make the change.
                  > >
                  > > Michael
                  > >
                  > > __________________________________________________________
                  > > TRY FREE IM TOOLPACK at http://www.imtoolpack.com/default.aspx?rc=if5
                  > > Capture screenshots, upload images, edit and send them to your friends
                  > > through IMs, post on Twitter®, Facebook®, MySpace™, LinkedIn® â€" FAST!
                  > > 
                  > >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > --
                  > *...don a*  *- Northern Ohio, USA*
                  >
                  >
                  > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > ------------------------------------
                  >
                  > Z-scale:  minimum siZe, MAXIMUM enjoyment!
                  > Yahoo! Groups Links
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  >
                • mark2playz
                  Michael, I think you re really giving yourself a challenge trying the do a bridge in 24 x 26. I did it a while back on a 36 square. Try thinking of the layout
                  Message 8 of 9 , Dec 5, 2010
                    Michael,
                    I think you're really giving yourself a challenge trying the do a bridge in 24 x 26. I did it a while back on a 36" square. Try thinking of the layout being two separate loops: the goes-under loop with a grade that runs from 0 to about 3/4" and a goes-over loop that runs from 1 3/8 down to about 3/4". Then run a transition track between the two loops around the 3/4" height points on the two loops. You can get away with a 2+ % grade on a short transition track easier than on the main.
                    BTW: I also use 3rdPlanIt and I like it, although like Loren I still feel the urge to get out the colored pencils and grid paper.

                    Mark

                    --- In z_scale@yahoogroups.com, Michael Piersdorff <ironduke@...> wrote:
                    >
                    > Thank you, Mark. I tried the 1 3/8 inch recommended in one of the other replies, and the grade is a bit steep (bit under 2% in one direction, bit over in the other). I am trying to lengthen the run-up to the bridge, but is isn't easy on a 24 X 26 layout with a folded figure 8 (hello, Loren) layout. I will plug in the 1.2" you have given me, and see what result I get. I am using 3rdPlanIt software, so it isn't as if I have to rip out finished trackwork to make the change.
                    >
                    > Michael
                    >
                    > ____________________________________________________________
                    > TRY FREE IM TOOLPACK at http://www.imtoolpack.com/default.aspx?rc=if5
                    > Capture screenshots, upload images, edit and send them to your friends
                    > through IMs, post on Twitter®, Facebook®, MySpace™, LinkedIn® â€" FAST!
                    >
                  • Ed Dalman
                    Michael, Here is my 2¢. Were I can I will have 40 mm [1.575”] clearance from the top of the rails.  My minimum clearance is 35 mm [1.378”], which will be
                    Message 9 of 9 , Dec 5, 2010
                      Michael,
                      Here is my 2¢.
                      Were I can I will have 40 mm [1.575”] clearance from the top of the rails.  My minimum clearance is 35 mm [1.378”], which will be enough to include a catenary wire.  The absolute minimum (without catenary wire) is 30 mm [1.180”] and will give a 2 mm [0.078”] clearance on the highest car.
                      All the beZtzzz,
                      (Het aller beZte)
                      Ed

                      --- On Sun, 12/5/10, mark2playz <mark.markham@...> wrote:


                      From: mark2playz <mark.markham@...>
                      Subject: [Z_Scale] Re: Bridge clearance
                      To: z_scale@yahoogroups.com
                      Date: Sunday, December 5, 2010, 3:47 PM


                       





                      Michael,
                      I think you're really giving yourself a challenge trying the do a bridge in 24 x 26. I did it a while back on a 36" square. Try thinking of the layout being two separate loops: the goes-under loop with a grade that runs from 0 to about 3/4" and a goes-over loop that runs from 1 3/8 down to about 3/4". Then run a transition track between the two loops around the 3/4" height points on the two loops. You can get away with a 2+ % grade on a short transition track easier than on the main.
                      BTW: I also use 3rdPlanIt and I like it, although like Loren I still feel the urge to get out the colored pencils and grid paper.

                      Mark

                      --- In z_scale@yahoogroups.com, Michael Piersdorff <ironduke@...> wrote:
                      >
                      > Thank you, Mark. I tried the 1 3/8 inch recommended in one of the other replies, and the grade is a bit steep (bit under 2% in one direction, bit over in the other). I am trying to lengthen the run-up to the bridge, but is isn't easy on a 24 X 26 layout with a folded figure 8 (hello, Loren) layout. I will plug in the 1.2" you have given me, and see what result I get. I am using 3rdPlanIt software, so it isn't as if I have to rip out finished trackwork to make the change.
                      >
                      > Michael
                      >
                      > __________________________________________________________
                      > TRY FREE IM TOOLPACK at http://www.imtoolpack.com/default.aspx?rc=if5
                      > Capture screenshots, upload images, edit and send them to your friends
                      > through IMs, post on Twitter®, Facebook®, MySpaceâ„¢, LinkedIn® â€" FAST!
                      >











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