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P.S.....

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  • Alan Jones
    Can I just ask, what is the radius of Marklin Setrack? I assume that theyre class 52 2-10-0 runs around the 2nd radius setrack. This is the kind of loco Ive
    Message 1 of 17 , Aug 2, 2001
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      Can I just ask, what is the radius of Marklin Setrack? I assume that
      theyre class 52 2-10-0 runs around the 2nd radius setrack. This is
      the kind of loco Ive always wanted to run, but have never had the
      space for a H0 layout with curves generous enough to take it. Z is
      the perfect scale for me.
    • jmac_han@hotmail.com
      Hi Alan, All Märklin equipment will negotiate the minimum radius curve #8510 which has a 145mm radius (5.75 ). For the complete encyclopedia of info on set
      Message 2 of 17 , Aug 2, 2001
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        Hi Alan,

        All Märklin equipment will negotiate the minimum radius curve #8510
        which has a 145mm radius (5.75"). For the complete encyclopedia of
        info on set track measurments, see the file: Z Track Standards.pdf at

        http://groups.yahoo.com/group/z_scale/files/HandlayingZTrack/

        Cheers,
        Jeffrey MacHan

        --- In z_scale@y..., "Alan Jones" <alan@b...> wrote:
        > Can I just ask, what is the radius of Marklin Setrack? I assume
        that
        > theyre class 52 2-10-0 runs around the 2nd radius setrack. This is
        > the kind of loco Ive always wanted to run, but have never had the
        > space for a H0 layout with curves generous enough to take it. Z is
        > the perfect scale for me.
      • Helmut Paule
        ... From: Robert Allbritton To: Sent: Friday, August 03, 2001 4:17 AM Subject: RE: [z_scale] Re: P.S.... Hi
        Message 3 of 17 , Aug 2, 2001
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          ----- Original Message -----
          From: Robert Allbritton <robert@...>
          To: <z_scale@yahoogroups.com>
          Sent: Friday, August 03, 2001 4:17 AM
          Subject: RE: [z_scale] Re: P.S....

          Hi Rob, Hallo Jeffrey,

          At the Show, I run my ICE on Jeffrey's Layout,
          and I recall running it on St.Gotthards Line, also no problems !
          I have on my Layout R 145, I never had Trouble on the Curves !!!

          Well I should say, after I took out the Diodes !
          befor the ICE would hardly run at all....
          on Tracks or Catenary, powerd.

          "Z" Greetings Helmut
          >>>*<<<


          Jeffrey,
          Minor correction:
          Marklin claims the ICE 3 models need a minimum of 195 mm radius track. See:
          http://www.marklin.de/produkte/produkte_cdrom/index.php?page=detail&nr=88712
          Now, if it will actually work on 145 mm is another question. I don't have
          any 145 mm track, so I can not confirm.
          Best,
          -Rob
          -----Original Message-----
          From: jmac_han@... [mailto:jmac_han@...]
          Sent: Thursday, August 02, 2001 3:10 PM
          To: z_scale@yahoogroups.com
          Subject: [z_scale] Re: P.S.....
          Hi Alan,
          All Märklin equipment will negotiate the minimum radius curve #8510
          which has a 145mm radius (5.75"). For the complete encyclopedia of
          info on set track measurments, see the file: Z Track Standards.pdf at
          http://groups.yahoo.com/group/z_scale/files/HandlayingZTrack/
          Cheers,
          Jeffrey MacHan
          --- In z_scale@y..., "Alan Jones" <alan@b...> wrote:
          > Can I just ask, what is the radius of Marklin Setrack? I assume
          that
          > theyre class 52 2-10-0 runs around the 2nd radius setrack. This is
          > the kind of loco Ive always wanted to run, but have never had the
          > space for a H0 layout with curves generous enough to take it. Z is
          > the perfect scale for me.
          "Z" WARNING! HANDLE WITH CARE! Highly addictive in Small DoseZ!
          Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
          "Z" WARNING! HANDLE WITH CARE! Highly addictive in Small DoseZ!
          Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
        • stamperdream@yahoo.ca
          Hi Rob, I may stand corrected. I was quoting the PDF file preamble. You may recall that Helmut Paule ran his full 6-car ICE over the Val Ease Central at
          Message 4 of 17 , Aug 2, 2001
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            Hi Rob,

            I may stand corrected. I was quoting the PDF file preamble. You
            may recall that Helmut Paule ran his full 6-car ICE over the Val
            Ease Central at NTS2001. I can attest to the fact that the curves
            on the outside main line are 195mm minimum, not 145mm
            which can be found on the inside main line.

            The ICE is a 2001 release so the "All Märklin equipment will
            negotiate the minimum radius curve #8510" assertion no longer
            applies.

            Cheers,
            Jeffrey

            --- In z_scale@y..., "Robert Allbritton" <robert@p...> wrote:
            > Jeffrey,
            >
            > Minor correction:
            >
            > Marklin claims the ICE 3 models need a minimum of 195 mm
            radius track. See:
            >
            http://www.marklin.de/produkte/produkte_cdrom/index.php?page
            =detail&nr=88712
            >
            > Now, if it will actually work on 145 mm is another question. I
            don't have
            > any 145 mm track, so I can not confirm.
            >
            > Best,
            > -Rob
          • Helmut Paule
            ... From: Robert Allbritton To: Sent: Friday, August 03, 2001 5:12 AM Subject: RE: [z_scale] Re: P.S.....
            Message 5 of 17 , Aug 2, 2001
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              ----- Original Message -----
              From: Robert Allbritton <robert@...>
              To: <z_scale@yahoogroups.com>
              Sent: Friday, August 03, 2001 5:12 AM
              Subject: RE: [z_scale] Re: P.S.....

              Hallo Rob,

              Yep, so I was wrong on VAL EASE, is R 195 mm, sorry.
              Yes it is the ICE 8771 ...
              I think on both ICE, the special Couplers are in my Opinion great.
              Power is connected from front to end and vise versa!
              The TEE has a smaller Version.

              I changed a Railbus to this Coupler (shortened), to get better power
              to the Motor, the Car had powerpicup for the Lights, so it was easy.
              thank you all for the other Info...

              "Z" Greetings Helmut

              >>>*<<<

              Helmut,
              Yes you are correct, but your ICE is the first ICE (8771) correct? Marklin
              was only referring to the ICE 3 (87712) If you look at the 2001 export
              brochure on page 36 it says that the NS version of the ICE 3 (87713) is for
              195mm track and larger. It may have something to do with the non - standard
              couplers with a motor in the middle of the train - something unique to the
              ICE 3 models. It is also the only time I recall seeing Marklin note a
              minimum radius for a model.
              Speaking of corrections, allow me to correct myself! In a recent reply I
              said that I did not know of a Marklin starter set that used the 145 mm
              radius track. I was wrong. The new "Summer Fun" starter set (81520) uses 145
              mm radius track. I *believe* it is the first "catalog" starter set to do so.
              Best,
              -Rob
            • Robert Allbritton
              Jeffrey, Minor correction: Marklin claims the ICE 3 models need a minimum of 195 mm radius track. See:
              Message 6 of 17 , Aug 3, 2001
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                Jeffrey,

                Minor correction:

                Marklin claims the ICE 3 models need a minimum of 195 mm radius track. See:
                http://www.marklin.de/produkte/produkte_cdrom/index.php?page=detail&nr=88712

                Now, if it will actually work on 145 mm is another question. I don't have
                any 145 mm track, so I can not confirm.

                Best,
                -Rob

                -----Original Message-----
                From: jmac_han@... [mailto:jmac_han@...]
                Sent: Thursday, August 02, 2001 3:10 PM
                To: z_scale@yahoogroups.com
                Subject: [z_scale] Re: P.S.....


                Hi Alan,

                All Märklin equipment will negotiate the minimum radius curve #8510
                which has a 145mm radius (5.75"). For the complete encyclopedia of
                info on set track measurments, see the file: Z Track Standards.pdf at

                http://groups.yahoo.com/group/z_scale/files/HandlayingZTrack/

                Cheers,
                Jeffrey MacHan

                --- In z_scale@y..., "Alan Jones" <alan@b...> wrote:
                > Can I just ask, what is the radius of Marklin Setrack? I assume
                that
                > theyre class 52 2-10-0 runs around the 2nd radius setrack. This is
                > the kind of loco Ive always wanted to run, but have never had the
                > space for a H0 layout with curves generous enough to take it. Z is
                > the perfect scale for me.



                "Z" WARNING! HANDLE WITH CARE! Highly addictive in Small DoseZ!


                Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
              • Robert Allbritton
                Helmut, Yes you are correct, but your ICE is the first ICE (8771) correct? Marklin was only referring to the ICE 3 (87712) If you look at the 2001 export
                Message 7 of 17 , Aug 3, 2001
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                  Helmut,

                  Yes you are correct, but your ICE is the first ICE (8771) correct? Marklin
                  was only referring to the ICE 3 (87712) If you look at the 2001 export
                  brochure on page 36 it says that the NS version of the ICE 3 (87713) is for
                  195mm track and larger. It may have something to do with the non - standard
                  couplers with a motor in the middle of the train - something unique to the
                  ICE 3 models. It is also the only time I recall seeing Marklin note a
                  minimum radius for a model.

                  Speaking of corrections, allow me to correct myself! In a recent reply I
                  said that I did not know of a Marklin starter set that used the 145 mm
                  radius track. I was wrong. The new "Summer Fun" starter set (81520) uses 145
                  mm radius track. I *believe* it is the first "catalog" starter set to do so.

                  Best,
                  -Rob


                  -----Original Message-----
                  From: Helmut Paule [mailto:hpaule@...]
                  Sent: Thursday, August 02, 2001 4:33 PM
                  To: z_scale@yahoogroups.com
                  Subject: Re: [z_scale] Re: P.S.....



                  ----- Original Message -----
                  From: Robert Allbritton <robert@...>
                  To: <z_scale@yahoogroups.com>
                  Sent: Friday, August 03, 2001 4:17 AM
                  Subject: RE: [z_scale] Re: P.S....

                  Hi Rob, Hallo Jeffrey,

                  At the Show, I run my ICE on Jeffrey's Layout,
                  and I recall running it on St.Gotthards Line, also no problems !
                  I have on my Layout R 145, I never had Trouble on the Curves !!!

                  Well I should say, after I took out the Diodes !
                  befor the ICE would hardly run at all....
                  on Tracks or Catenary, powerd.

                  "Z" Greetings Helmut
                  >>>*<<<


                  Jeffrey,
                  Minor correction:
                  Marklin claims the ICE 3 models need a minimum of 195 mm radius track. See:
                  http://www.marklin.de/produkte/produkte_cdrom/index.php?page=detail&nr=88712
                  Now, if it will actually work on 145 mm is another question. I don't have
                  any 145 mm track, so I can not confirm.
                  Best,
                  -Rob
                  -----Original Message-----
                  From: jmac_han@... [mailto:jmac_han@...]
                  Sent: Thursday, August 02, 2001 3:10 PM
                  To: z_scale@yahoogroups.com
                  Subject: [z_scale] Re: P.S.....
                  Hi Alan,
                  All Märklin equipment will negotiate the minimum radius curve #8510
                  which has a 145mm radius (5.75"). For the complete encyclopedia of
                  info on set track measurments, see the file: Z Track Standards.pdf at
                  http://groups.yahoo.com/group/z_scale/files/HandlayingZTrack/
                  Cheers,
                  Jeffrey MacHan
                  --- In z_scale@y..., "Alan Jones" <alan@b...> wrote:
                  > Can I just ask, what is the radius of Marklin Setrack? I assume
                  that
                  > theyre class 52 2-10-0 runs around the 2nd radius setrack. This is
                  > the kind of loco Ive always wanted to run, but have never had the
                  > space for a H0 layout with curves generous enough to take it. Z is
                  > the perfect scale for me.
                  "Z" WARNING! HANDLE WITH CARE! Highly addictive in Small DoseZ!
                  Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                  "Z" WARNING! HANDLE WITH CARE! Highly addictive in Small DoseZ!
                  Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/





                  "Z" WARNING! HANDLE WITH CARE! Highly addictive in Small DoseZ!


                  Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                • WILLIAM AND BARBARA BROCK
                  Rob, Can you read German? I guess I need to get a translator. Best Will ... http://www.marklin.de/produkte/produkte_cdrom/index.php?page=detail&nr=88712 ...
                  Message 8 of 17 , Aug 3, 2001
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                    Rob,

                    Can you read German? I guess I need to get a
                    translator.

                    Best
                    Will
                    --- Robert Allbritton <robert@...> wrote:
                    > Jeffrey,
                    >
                    > Minor correction:
                    >
                    > Marklin claims the ICE 3 models need a minimum of
                    > 195 mm radius track. See:
                    >
                    http://www.marklin.de/produkte/produkte_cdrom/index.php?page=detail&nr=88712
                    >
                    > Now, if it will actually work on 145 mm is another
                    > question. I don't have
                    > any 145 mm track, so I can not confirm.
                    >
                    > Best,
                    > -Rob
                    >
                    > -----Original Message-----
                    > From: jmac_han@...
                    > [mailto:jmac_han@...]
                    > Sent: Thursday, August 02, 2001 3:10 PM
                    > To: z_scale@yahoogroups.com
                    > Subject: [z_scale] Re: P.S.....
                    >
                    >
                    > Hi Alan,
                    >
                    > All M�rklin equipment will negotiate the minimum
                    > radius curve #8510
                    > which has a 145mm radius (5.75"). For the complete
                    > encyclopedia of
                    > info on set track measurments, see the file: Z Track
                    > Standards.pdf at
                    >
                    >
                    http://groups.yahoo.com/group/z_scale/files/HandlayingZTrack/
                    >
                    > Cheers,
                    > Jeffrey MacHan
                    >
                    > --- In z_scale@y..., "Alan Jones" <alan@b...> wrote:
                    > > Can I just ask, what is the radius of Marklin
                    > Setrack? I assume
                    > that
                    > > theyre class 52 2-10-0 runs around the 2nd radius
                    > setrack. This is
                    > > the kind of loco Ive always wanted to run, but
                    > have never had the
                    > > space for a H0 layout with curves generous enough
                    > to take it. Z is
                    > > the perfect scale for me.
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > "Z" WARNING! HANDLE WITH CARE! Highly addictive in
                    > Small DoseZ!
                    >
                    >
                    > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
                    > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                    >
                    >
                    >


                    =====
                    WILLIAM BROCK

                    __________________________________________________
                    Do You Yahoo!?
                    Make international calls for as low as $.04/minute with Yahoo! Messenger
                    http://phonecard.yahoo.com/
                  • Robert Allbritton
                    Will, Nope - can t read it at all. But I can guess that Der ICE 3 ist für einen Radius ab 195 mm probably means The ICE 3 is for a Radius of 195 mm
                    Message 9 of 17 , Aug 4, 2001
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                      Will,

                      Nope - can't read it at all. But I can guess that "Der ICE 3 ist für einen
                      Radius ab 195 mm" probably means "The ICE 3 is for a Radius of 195 mm"

                      <grin>
                      -Rob

                      -----Original Message-----
                      From: WILLIAM AND BARBARA BROCK [mailto:wbbrock_2000@...]
                      Sent: Friday, August 03, 2001 9:23 PM
                      To: z_scale@yahoogroups.com
                      Subject: RE: [z_scale] Re: P.S.....


                      Rob,

                      Can you read German? I guess I need to get a
                      translator.

                      Best
                      Will
                      --- Robert Allbritton <robert@...> wrote:
                      > Jeffrey,
                      >
                      > Minor correction:
                      >
                      > Marklin claims the ICE 3 models need a minimum of
                      > 195 mm radius track. See:
                      >
                      http://www.marklin.de/produkte/produkte_cdrom/index.php?page=detail&nr=88712
                      >
                      > Now, if it will actually work on 145 mm is another
                      > question. I don't have
                      > any 145 mm track, so I can not confirm.
                      >
                      > Best,
                      > -Rob
                      >
                      > -----Original Message-----
                      > From: jmac_han@...
                      > [mailto:jmac_han@...]
                      > Sent: Thursday, August 02, 2001 3:10 PM
                      > To: z_scale@yahoogroups.com
                      > Subject: [z_scale] Re: P.S.....
                      >
                      >
                      > Hi Alan,
                      >
                      > All Märklin equipment will negotiate the minimum
                      > radius curve #8510
                      > which has a 145mm radius (5.75"). For the complete
                      > encyclopedia of
                      > info on set track measurments, see the file: Z Track
                      > Standards.pdf at
                      >
                      >
                      http://groups.yahoo.com/group/z_scale/files/HandlayingZTrack/
                      >
                      > Cheers,
                      > Jeffrey MacHan
                      >
                      > --- In z_scale@y..., "Alan Jones" <alan@b...> wrote:
                      > > Can I just ask, what is the radius of Marklin
                      > Setrack? I assume
                      > that
                      > > theyre class 52 2-10-0 runs around the 2nd radius
                      > setrack. This is
                      > > the kind of loco Ive always wanted to run, but
                      > have never had the
                      > > space for a H0 layout with curves generous enough
                      > to take it. Z is
                      > > the perfect scale for me.
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > "Z" WARNING! HANDLE WITH CARE! Highly addictive in
                      > Small DoseZ!
                      >
                      >
                      > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
                      > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                      >
                      >
                      >


                      =====
                      WILLIAM BROCK

                      __________________________________________________
                      Do You Yahoo!?
                      Make international calls for as low as $.04/minute with Yahoo! Messenger
                      http://phonecard.yahoo.com/


                      "Z" WARNING! HANDLE WITH CARE! Highly addictive in Small DoseZ!


                      Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                    • bjkronen@aol.com
                      ... Babelfish usually stumbles pretty bad on German-English translations. This time it produced something that has some value. Babelfish is at:
                      Message 10 of 17 , Aug 4, 2001
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                        Will:

                        > Can you read German? I guess I need to get a
                        > translator.

                        Babelfish usually stumbles pretty bad on German-English translations. This
                        time it produced something that has some value. Babelfish is at:

                        http://babelfish.altavista.com/

                        The translation follows. Rob almost got it right (better than I did).

                        Now I have a question. Is there only one motor in the ICE3, that being in
                        the mid-train restaurant car? Or does one (but not both) of the slope nosed
                        engines also come equipped with a motor?

                        Regards,
                        Bill Kronenberger
                        Houston

                        -=-=-=-=-=-=

                        88712 triebwagenzug ICE 3 model: High-speed course intertown center express
                        (ICE 3). Series 406 of the German course AG (railways AG). 1 final car 406,0,
                        1. Class. 1 mittelwagen on-board restaurant 406,3,1 mittelwagen 406,6, 2.
                        Class. 1 final car 406,5, 2. Class. Model: Central car on-board restaurant
                        with new 5-pin mini club engine on all 4 axles propelled. Lighting of the two
                        final cars and the mittelwagens 2. Class with maintenance-free light emitting
                        diodes. Special clutches, which fit only the model of the ICE 3, permit a
                        close Zusammenkuppeln of the course. Course length 465 mm. On the Eurailspeed
                        in Berlin at the end of of October 1998 was presented the third ICE
                        generation, the ICE 3, to the public for the first time. With a whole number
                        of technological Raffinessen the new ICE presents itself and will contribute
                        to shorten the travel times further. With the ICE 3 those becomes vehicle
                        variety on the tracks of the German course AG (railways AG) around a very
                        salient manifestation enriches. Above all the optical page of the new ICE 3
                        captivates by the elegant, windschnittige front portion, which sets new
                        yardsticks in its aerodynamic form. The most salient technical modification
                        is however the propulsion principle. Where so far with the ICE 1 and ICE 2
                        the drive sat in the respective triebkoepfen, now the entire propulsion
                        technology is distributed under the car boxes at the new generation of the
                        ICE 3. The ICE 3 is generally used as achtteilige unit and can be united with
                        a further unit. A part of the courses is equipped for the current system of
                        the German course AG (railways AG) and as series 403 is defined. Another
                        section is prepared than four-system courses for the transnational
                        application in Europe. Triebzuege the called series 406 are predominantly
                        intended for international course runs. Also the interior equipment
                        captivates by its appropriate and responding Ambiente. Particularly
                        attractively the passenger compartment is direct behind the engine driver,
                        who permits a direct view of the cockpit and the free distance by a glaswand.
                        1999 the initial start-up of the vehicles takes place and in the year 2000 is
                        the first courses to the Expo in Hanover to be used. By motorizing the
                        restaurant car with the Maerklin mini club model the special features of the
                        final cars can be to a large extent model-faithfully copied. The ICE 3 is
                        intended for a radius starting from 195 mm.
                      • Helmut Paule
                        ... From: Robert Allbritton To: Sent: Saturday, August 04, 2001 9:14 AM Subject: RE: [z_scale] Re: P.S.....
                        Message 11 of 17 , Aug 4, 2001
                        • 0 Attachment
                          ----- Original Message -----
                          From: Robert Allbritton <robert@...>
                          To: <z_scale@yahoogroups.com>
                          Sent: Saturday, August 04, 2001 9:14 AM
                          Subject: RE: [z_scale] Re: P.S.....

                          Rob
                          Don't want to brag...
                          if I translate:
                          The ICE 3 is for Radi of 195 mm AND GREATER !
                          "Z" Greetings Helmut
                          >>>*<<<


                          Will,

                          Nope - can't read it at all. But I can guess that "Der ICE 3 ist für einen
                          Radius ab 195 mm" probably means "The ICE 3 is for a Radius of 195 mm"

                          <grin>
                          -Rob

                          -----Original Message-----
                          From: WILLIAM AND BARBARA BROCK [mailto:wbbrock_2000@...]
                          Sent: Friday, August 03, 2001 9:23 PM
                          To: z_scale@yahoogroups.com
                          Subject: RE: [z_scale] Re: P.S.....


                          Rob,

                          Can you read German? I guess I need to get a
                          translator.

                          Best
                          Will
                          --- Robert Allbritton <robert@...> wrote:
                          > Jeffrey,
                          >
                          > Minor correction:
                          >
                          > Marklin claims the ICE 3 models need a minimum of
                          > 195 mm radius track. See:
                          >
                          http://www.marklin.de/produkte/produkte_cdrom/index.php?page=detail&nr=88712
                          >
                          > Now, if it will actually work on 145 mm is another
                          > question. I don't have
                          > any 145 mm track, so I can not confirm.
                          >
                          > Best,
                          > -Rob
                          >
                          > -----Original Message-----
                          > From: jmac_han@...
                          > [mailto:jmac_han@...]
                          > Sent: Thursday, August 02, 2001 3:10 PM
                          > To: z_scale@yahoogroups.com
                          > Subject: [z_scale] Re: P.S.....
                          >
                          >
                          > Hi Alan,
                          >
                          > All Märklin equipment will negotiate the minimum
                          > radius curve #8510
                          > which has a 145mm radius (5.75"). For the complete
                          > encyclopedia of
                          > info on set track measurments, see the file: Z Track
                          > Standards.pdf at
                          >
                          >
                          http://groups.yahoo.com/group/z_scale/files/HandlayingZTrack/
                          >
                          > Cheers,
                          > Jeffrey MacHan
                          >
                          > --- In z_scale@y..., "Alan Jones" <alan@b...> wrote:
                          > > Can I just ask, what is the radius of Marklin
                          > Setrack? I assume
                          > that
                          > > theyre class 52 2-10-0 runs around the 2nd radius
                          > setrack. This is
                          > > the kind of loco Ive always wanted to run, but
                          > have never had the
                          > > space for a H0 layout with curves generous enough
                          > to take it. Z is
                          > > the perfect scale for me.
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          > "Z" WARNING! HANDLE WITH CARE! Highly addictive in
                          > Small DoseZ!
                          >
                          >
                          > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
                          > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                          >
                          >
                          >


                          =====
                          WILLIAM BROCK

                          __________________________________________________
                          Do You Yahoo!?
                          Make international calls for as low as $.04/minute with Yahoo! Messenger
                          http://phonecard.yahoo.com/


                          "Z" WARNING! HANDLE WITH CARE! Highly addictive in Small DoseZ!


                          Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/




                          "Z" WARNING! HANDLE WITH CARE! Highly addictive in Small DoseZ!


                          Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                        • Robert Allbritton
                          Will, Bill, Et Al... Yes, The ICE 3 only has one power car: the restaurant. Now here is where it gets a little funky... History: With the old ICE (Marklin 8871
                          Message 12 of 17 , Aug 4, 2001
                          • 0 Attachment
                            Will, Bill, Et Al...

                            Yes, The ICE 3 only has one power car: the restaurant. Now here is where it
                            gets a little funky...

                            History: With the old ICE (Marklin 8871 - Intercity Experimental or ICE-V)
                            You had two locomotives at each end, but only the front locomotive would
                            pick up power for both motors. The front loco would use power from its
                            pickups, and then also send the power back through special power conducting
                            couplers to the rear locomotive. It used diodes to make sure only the front
                            loco's power pickups were operational. The coach lights come directly from
                            pick ups in each coach's wheels. This was done for old fashioned train
                            control where you create a small section of track that a signal can power on
                            or off. If you want the head of the train to stop where the power is off,
                            then you need to draw the power for both motors from the front.

                            The 88711 - which was the same model with ICE-I livery and "AMTRAK" labels
                            plastered over the "DB" logos - looked neat, but totally inaccurate. The
                            ICE-I did actually run in the Northeast corridor from New York to DC in
                            revenue service - at about the same time I was getting into Z scale (1993?)
                            but the ICE-I had significant changes from the 8871 IC Experimental -
                            different nose on the power cars and they got rid of the funky connectors
                            between the coaches. While I'm on this rant, the IC Experimental never ran
                            with more than 3 coaches, because they only built 3! On the other hand, this
                            is Z scale, and since we do not have a proper ICE-I or ICE-II, we have to
                            make do with what the powers that be at Marklin will bestow upon us... ok -
                            rant over - I feel better now.

                            Today: The ICE 3 has its motor in the middle, but the motor restaurant car
                            has no power pick ups. This time Marklin is using the same basic technique:
                            draw power from pick ups on the control cab cars (no motor on the ends) and
                            send it back to the middle through power conducting couplers. The coaches
                            still light themselves the same way: through their own power pick ups on
                            each individual car. I think the 195 mm radius curve thing has to do with
                            the fact that this is one of the first Marklin models that is designed to
                            push cars, rather than pull them. They probably had too many derailments
                            pushing long trains through 145 mm curves, especially when they are laid in
                            opposite directions back to back. Its just a theory.

                            DCC bit: I modified my ICE 3 for digital in my hotel room at NTS in St.
                            Louis. I got a Digitrax DZ121 in there using techniques similar to putting
                            it in the SBB Re460 class (although I still need about .01 mm of height - it
                            is not perfect yet - the shell is riding a little high on the chassis) I
                            re-wired it so that the DCC decoder always draws power from *both* control
                            cab cars. This helped quite a bit. I'm sure the same can be done for analog
                            ICE 3 models by simply removing the diodes in the motor restaurant car.

                            Best,
                            -Rob
                            (I obviously had waaaaaay too much coffee this morning!)

                            -----Original Message-----
                            From: bjkronen@... [mailto:bjkronen@...]
                            Sent: Saturday, August 04, 2001 9:58 AM
                            To: z_scale@yahoogroups.com
                            Subject: Re: [z_scale] Re: P.S.....


                            Will:

                            > Can you read German? I guess I need to get a
                            > translator.

                            Babelfish usually stumbles pretty bad on German-English translations. This
                            time it produced something that has some value. Babelfish is at:

                            http://babelfish.altavista.com/

                            The translation follows. Rob almost got it right (better than I did).

                            Now I have a question. Is there only one motor in the ICE3, that being in
                            the mid-train restaurant car? Or does one (but not both) of the slope nosed
                            engines also come equipped with a motor?

                            Regards,
                            Bill Kronenberger
                            Houston

                            -=-=-=-=-=-=



                            "Z" WARNING! HANDLE WITH CARE! Highly addictive in Small DoseZ!


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                          • Robert Allbritton
                            Helmut, So that is what the last word means! I was just hidiing my ignorance by leaving off the final word in the sentence. Best, -Rob ... From: Helmut
                            Message 13 of 17 , Aug 4, 2001
                            • 0 Attachment
                              Helmut,

                              So that is what the last word means! I was just hidiing my ignorance by
                              leaving off the final word in the sentence. <grin>

                              Best,
                              -Rob

                              -----Original Message-----
                              From: Helmut Paule [mailto:hpaule@...]
                              Sent: Saturday, August 04, 2001 10:12 AM
                              To: z_scale@yahoogroups.com
                              Subject: Re: [z_scale] Re: P.S.....



                              ----- Original Message -----
                              From: Robert Allbritton <robert@...>
                              To: <z_scale@yahoogroups.com>
                              Sent: Saturday, August 04, 2001 9:14 AM
                              Subject: RE: [z_scale] Re: P.S.....

                              Rob
                              Don't want to brag...
                              if I translate:
                              The ICE 3 is for Radi of 195 mm AND GREATER !
                              "Z" Greetings Helmut
                              >>>*<<<


                              Will,

                              Nope - can't read it at all. But I can guess that "Der ICE 3 ist für einen
                              Radius ab 195 mm" probably means "The ICE 3 is for a Radius of 195 mm"

                              <grin>
                              -Rob

                              -----Original Message-----
                              From: WILLIAM AND BARBARA BROCK [mailto:wbbrock_2000@...]
                              Sent: Friday, August 03, 2001 9:23 PM
                              To: z_scale@yahoogroups.com
                              Subject: RE: [z_scale] Re: P.S.....


                              Rob,

                              Can you read German? I guess I need to get a
                              translator.

                              Best
                              Will
                              --- Robert Allbritton <robert@...> wrote:
                              > Jeffrey,
                              >
                              > Minor correction:
                              >
                              > Marklin claims the ICE 3 models need a minimum of
                              > 195 mm radius track. See:
                              >
                              http://www.marklin.de/produkte/produkte_cdrom/index.php?page=detail&nr=88712
                              >
                              > Now, if it will actually work on 145 mm is another
                              > question. I don't have
                              > any 145 mm track, so I can not confirm.
                              >
                              > Best,
                              > -Rob
                              >
                              > -----Original Message-----
                              > From: jmac_han@...
                              > [mailto:jmac_han@...]
                              > Sent: Thursday, August 02, 2001 3:10 PM
                              > To: z_scale@yahoogroups.com
                              > Subject: [z_scale] Re: P.S.....
                              >
                              >
                              > Hi Alan,
                              >
                              > All Märklin equipment will negotiate the minimum
                              > radius curve #8510
                              > which has a 145mm radius (5.75"). For the complete
                              > encyclopedia of
                              > info on set track measurments, see the file: Z Track
                              > Standards.pdf at
                              >
                              >
                              http://groups.yahoo.com/group/z_scale/files/HandlayingZTrack/
                              >
                              > Cheers,
                              > Jeffrey MacHan
                              >
                              > --- In z_scale@y..., "Alan Jones" <alan@b...> wrote:
                              > > Can I just ask, what is the radius of Marklin
                              > Setrack? I assume
                              > that
                              > > theyre class 52 2-10-0 runs around the 2nd radius
                              > setrack. This is
                              > > the kind of loco Ive always wanted to run, but
                              > have never had the
                              > > space for a H0 layout with curves generous enough
                              > to take it. Z is
                              > > the perfect scale for me.
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              > "Z" WARNING! HANDLE WITH CARE! Highly addictive in
                              > Small DoseZ!
                              >
                              >
                              > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
                              > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                              >
                              >
                              >


                              =====
                              WILLIAM BROCK

                              __________________________________________________
                              Do You Yahoo!?
                              Make international calls for as low as $.04/minute with Yahoo! Messenger
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                              "Z" WARNING! HANDLE WITH CARE! Highly addictive in Small DoseZ!


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                              "Z" WARNING! HANDLE WITH CARE! Highly addictive in Small DoseZ!


                              Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                            • Helmut Paule
                              ... From: Robert Allbritton To: Cc: Sent: Saturday, August 04, 2001 10:44 AM
                              Message 14 of 17 , Aug 5, 2001
                              • 0 Attachment
                                ----- Original Message -----
                                From: Robert Allbritton <robert@...>
                                To: <z_scale@yahoogroups.com>
                                Cc: <Z_Scale_DCC@yahoogroups.com>
                                Sent: Saturday, August 04, 2001 10:44 AM
                                Subject: RE: [z_scale] Re: P.S.....ICE 3 DCC

                                Hi Robert,
                                Thanks for the enlightenment's on:
                                rant, ICE3, DCC-bit ....
                                like to know more about your DCC-bit for ICE 8871 (2,3 pole)

                                > Yes, The ICE 3 only has one power car: the restaurant.
                                > Now here is where it gets a little funky...
                                > History: With the old ICE (Marklin 8871 - Intercity Experimental or ICE-V)
                                > feel better now.

                                Good ! (grin)

                                > DCC bit: I modified my ICE 3 for digital in my hotel room at NTS in
                                St.Louis.

                                Any Pictures available ?

                                "Z" Greetings Helmut
                              • WILLIAM AND BARBARA BROCK
                                Rob, That is a very good deduction based on that small piece of information. I guess I did not try to read it when the whole thing came up, and decifer the
                                Message 15 of 17 , Aug 5, 2001
                                • 0 Attachment
                                  Rob,

                                  That is a very good deduction based on that small
                                  piece of information. I guess I did not "try to read
                                  it" when the whole thing came up, and decifer the
                                  individual pieces. It still would be nice to know
                                  some German though.

                                  Best,
                                  Will
                                  --- Robert Allbritton <robert@...> wrote:
                                  > Will,
                                  >
                                  > Nope - can't read it at all. But I can guess that
                                  > "Der ICE 3 ist f�r einen
                                  > Radius ab 195 mm" probably means "The ICE 3 is for a
                                  > Radius of 195 mm"
                                  >
                                  > <grin>
                                  > -Rob
                                  >
                                  > -----Original Message-----
                                  > From: WILLIAM AND BARBARA BROCK
                                  > [mailto:wbbrock_2000@...]
                                  > Sent: Friday, August 03, 2001 9:23 PM
                                  > To: z_scale@yahoogroups.com
                                  > Subject: RE: [z_scale] Re: P.S.....
                                  >
                                  >
                                  > Rob,
                                  >
                                  > Can you read German? I guess I need to get a
                                  > translator.
                                  >
                                  > Best
                                  > Will
                                  > --- Robert Allbritton <robert@...> wrote:
                                  > > Jeffrey,
                                  > >
                                  > > Minor correction:
                                  > >
                                  > > Marklin claims the ICE 3 models need a minimum of
                                  > > 195 mm radius track. See:
                                  > >
                                  >
                                  http://www.marklin.de/produkte/produkte_cdrom/index.php?page=detail&nr=88712
                                  > >
                                  > > Now, if it will actually work on 145 mm is another
                                  > > question. I don't have
                                  > > any 145 mm track, so I can not confirm.
                                  > >
                                  > > Best,
                                  > > -Rob
                                  > >
                                  > > -----Original Message-----
                                  > > From: jmac_han@...
                                  > > [mailto:jmac_han@...]
                                  > > Sent: Thursday, August 02, 2001 3:10 PM
                                  > > To: z_scale@yahoogroups.com
                                  > > Subject: [z_scale] Re: P.S.....
                                  > >
                                  > >
                                  > > Hi Alan,
                                  > >
                                  > > All M�rklin equipment will negotiate the minimum
                                  > > radius curve #8510
                                  > > which has a 145mm radius (5.75"). For the
                                  > complete
                                  > > encyclopedia of
                                  > > info on set track measurments, see the file: Z
                                  > Track
                                  > > Standards.pdf at
                                  > >
                                  > >
                                  >
                                  http://groups.yahoo.com/group/z_scale/files/HandlayingZTrack/
                                  > >
                                  > > Cheers,
                                  > > Jeffrey MacHan
                                  > >
                                  > > --- In z_scale@y..., "Alan Jones" <alan@b...>
                                  > wrote:
                                  > > > Can I just ask, what is the radius of Marklin
                                  > > Setrack? I assume
                                  > > that
                                  > > > theyre class 52 2-10-0 runs around the 2nd
                                  > radius
                                  > > setrack. This is
                                  > > > the kind of loco Ive always wanted to run, but
                                  > > have never had the
                                  > > > space for a H0 layout with curves generous
                                  > enough
                                  > > to take it. Z is
                                  > > > the perfect scale for me.
                                  > >
                                  > >
                                  > >
                                  > > "Z" WARNING! HANDLE WITH CARE! Highly addictive
                                  > in
                                  > > Small DoseZ!
                                  > >
                                  > >
                                  > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
                                  > > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                                  > >
                                  > >
                                  > >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  > =====
                                  > WILLIAM BROCK
                                  >
                                  > __________________________________________________
                                  > Do You Yahoo!?
                                  > Make international calls for as low as $.04/minute
                                  > with Yahoo! Messenger
                                  > http://phonecard.yahoo.com/
                                  >
                                  >
                                  > "Z" WARNING! HANDLE WITH CARE! Highly addictive in
                                  > Small DoseZ!
                                  >
                                  >
                                  > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
                                  > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >


                                  =====
                                  WILLIAM BROCK

                                  __________________________________________________
                                  Do You Yahoo!?
                                  Make international calls for as low as $.04/minute with Yahoo! Messenger
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                                • WILLIAM AND BARBARA BROCK
                                  Helmut, You are the Best German translator . Thanks, BestZ Will ... http://www.marklin.de/produkte/produkte_cdrom/index.php?page=detail&nr=88712 ...
                                  Message 16 of 17 , Aug 5, 2001
                                  • 0 Attachment
                                    Helmut,

                                    You are the "Best German translator". Thanks,

                                    BestZ
                                    Will
                                    --- Helmut Paule <hpaule@...> wrote:
                                    >
                                    > ----- Original Message -----
                                    > From: Robert Allbritton <robert@...>
                                    > To: <z_scale@yahoogroups.com>
                                    > Sent: Saturday, August 04, 2001 9:14 AM
                                    > Subject: RE: [z_scale] Re: P.S.....
                                    >
                                    > Rob
                                    > Don't want to brag...
                                    > if I translate:
                                    > The ICE 3 is for Radi of 195 mm AND GREATER !
                                    > "Z" Greetings Helmut
                                    > >>>*<<<
                                    >
                                    >
                                    > Will,
                                    >
                                    > Nope - can't read it at all. But I can guess that
                                    > "Der ICE 3 ist f�r einen
                                    > Radius ab 195 mm" probably means "The ICE 3 is for a
                                    > Radius of 195 mm"
                                    >
                                    > <grin>
                                    > -Rob
                                    >
                                    > -----Original Message-----
                                    > From: WILLIAM AND BARBARA BROCK
                                    > [mailto:wbbrock_2000@...]
                                    > Sent: Friday, August 03, 2001 9:23 PM
                                    > To: z_scale@yahoogroups.com
                                    > Subject: RE: [z_scale] Re: P.S.....
                                    >
                                    >
                                    > Rob,
                                    >
                                    > Can you read German? I guess I need to get a
                                    > translator.
                                    >
                                    > Best
                                    > Will
                                    > --- Robert Allbritton <robert@...> wrote:
                                    > > Jeffrey,
                                    > >
                                    > > Minor correction:
                                    > >
                                    > > Marklin claims the ICE 3 models need a minimum of
                                    > > 195 mm radius track. See:
                                    > >
                                    >
                                    http://www.marklin.de/produkte/produkte_cdrom/index.php?page=detail&nr=88712
                                    > >
                                    > > Now, if it will actually work on 145 mm is another
                                    > > question. I don't have
                                    > > any 145 mm track, so I can not confirm.
                                    > >
                                    > > Best,
                                    > > -Rob
                                    > >
                                    > > -----Original Message-----
                                    > > From: jmac_han@...
                                    > > [mailto:jmac_han@...]
                                    > > Sent: Thursday, August 02, 2001 3:10 PM
                                    > > To: z_scale@yahoogroups.com
                                    > > Subject: [z_scale] Re: P.S.....
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > > Hi Alan,
                                    > >
                                    > > All M�rklin equipment will negotiate the minimum
                                    > > radius curve #8510
                                    > > which has a 145mm radius (5.75"). For the
                                    > complete
                                    > > encyclopedia of
                                    > > info on set track measurments, see the file: Z
                                    > Track
                                    > > Standards.pdf at
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    >
                                    http://groups.yahoo.com/group/z_scale/files/HandlayingZTrack/
                                    > >
                                    > > Cheers,
                                    > > Jeffrey MacHan
                                    > >
                                    > > --- In z_scale@y..., "Alan Jones" <alan@b...>
                                    > wrote:
                                    > > > Can I just ask, what is the radius of Marklin
                                    > > Setrack? I assume
                                    > > that
                                    > > > theyre class 52 2-10-0 runs around the 2nd
                                    > radius
                                    > > setrack. This is
                                    > > > the kind of loco Ive always wanted to run, but
                                    > > have never had the
                                    > > > space for a H0 layout with curves generous
                                    > enough
                                    > > to take it. Z is
                                    > > > the perfect scale for me.
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > > "Z" WARNING! HANDLE WITH CARE! Highly addictive
                                    > in
                                    > > Small DoseZ!
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
                                    > > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    > =====
                                    > WILLIAM BROCK
                                    >
                                    > __________________________________________________
                                    > Do You Yahoo!?
                                    > Make international calls for as low as $.04/minute
                                    > with Yahoo! Messenger
                                    > http://phonecard.yahoo.com/
                                    >
                                    >
                                    > "Z" WARNING! HANDLE WITH CARE! Highly addictive in
                                    > Small DoseZ!
                                    >
                                    >
                                    > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
                                    > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    > "Z" WARNING! HANDLE WITH CARE! Highly addictive in
                                    > Small DoseZ!
                                    >
                                    >
                                    > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
                                    > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >


                                    =====
                                    WILLIAM BROCK

                                    __________________________________________________
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                                    Make international calls for as low as $.04/minute with Yahoo! Messenger
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                                  • td25scorpio@ntlworld.com
                                    ... page=detail&nr=88712 ... Messenger ... Bill the class 52 runs perfectly around the 2nd radius ,195mm track, with no problems regards simon
                                    Message 17 of 17 , Aug 6, 2001
                                    • 0 Attachment
                                      --- In z_scale@y..., WILLIAM AND BARBARA BROCK <wbbrock_2000@y...>
                                      wrote:
                                      > Rob,
                                      >
                                      > That is a very good deduction based on that small
                                      > piece of information. I guess I did not "try to read
                                      > it" when the whole thing came up, and decifer the
                                      > individual pieces. It still would be nice to know
                                      > some German though.
                                      >
                                      > Best,
                                      > Will
                                      > --- Robert Allbritton <robert@p...> wrote:
                                      > > Will,
                                      > >
                                      > > Nope - can't read it at all. But I can guess that
                                      > > "Der ICE 3 ist für einen
                                      > > Radius ab 195 mm" probably means "The ICE 3 is for a
                                      > > Radius of 195 mm"
                                      > >
                                      > > <grin>
                                      > > -Rob
                                      > >
                                      > > -----Original Message-----
                                      > > From: WILLIAM AND BARBARA BROCK
                                      > > [mailto:wbbrock_2000@y...]
                                      > > Sent: Friday, August 03, 2001 9:23 PM
                                      > > To: z_scale@y...
                                      > > Subject: RE: [z_scale] Re: P.S.....
                                      > >
                                      > >
                                      > > Rob,
                                      > >
                                      > > Can you read German? I guess I need to get a
                                      > > translator.
                                      > >
                                      > > Best
                                      > > Will
                                      > > --- Robert Allbritton <robert@p...> wrote:
                                      > > > Jeffrey,
                                      > > >
                                      > > > Minor correction:
                                      > > >
                                      > > > Marklin claims the ICE 3 models need a minimum of
                                      > > > 195 mm radius track. See:
                                      > > >
                                      > >
                                      > http://www.marklin.de/produkte/produkte_cdrom/index.php?
                                      page=detail&nr=88712
                                      > > >
                                      > > > Now, if it will actually work on 145 mm is another
                                      > > > question. I don't have
                                      > > > any 145 mm track, so I can not confirm.
                                      > > >
                                      > > > Best,
                                      > > > -Rob
                                      > > >
                                      > > > -----Original Message-----
                                      > > > From: jmac_han@h...
                                      > > > [mailto:jmac_han@h...]
                                      > > > Sent: Thursday, August 02, 2001 3:10 PM
                                      > > > To: z_scale@y...
                                      > > > Subject: [z_scale] Re: P.S.....
                                      > > >
                                      > > >
                                      > > > Hi Alan,
                                      > > >
                                      > > > All Märklin equipment will negotiate the minimum
                                      > > > radius curve #8510
                                      > > > which has a 145mm radius (5.75"). For the
                                      > > complete
                                      > > > encyclopedia of
                                      > > > info on set track measurments, see the file: Z
                                      > > Track
                                      > > > Standards.pdf at
                                      > > >
                                      > > >
                                      > >
                                      > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/z_scale/files/HandlayingZTrack/
                                      > > >
                                      > > > Cheers,
                                      > > > Jeffrey MacHan
                                      > > >
                                      > > > --- In z_scale@y..., "Alan Jones" <alan@b...>
                                      > > wrote:
                                      > > > > Can I just ask, what is the radius of Marklin
                                      > > > Setrack? I assume
                                      > > > that
                                      > > > > theyre class 52 2-10-0 runs around the 2nd
                                      > > radius
                                      > > > setrack. This is
                                      > > > > the kind of loco Ive always wanted to run, but
                                      > > > have never had the
                                      > > > > space for a H0 layout with curves generous
                                      > > enough
                                      > > > to take it. Z is
                                      > > > > the perfect scale for me.
                                      > > >
                                      > > >
                                      > > >
                                      > > > "Z" WARNING! HANDLE WITH CARE! Highly addictive
                                      > > in
                                      > > > Small DoseZ!
                                      > > >
                                      > > >
                                      > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
                                      > > > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                                      > > >
                                      > > >
                                      > > >
                                      > >
                                      > >
                                      > > =====
                                      > > WILLIAM BROCK
                                      > >
                                      > > __________________________________________________
                                      > > Do You Yahoo!?
                                      > > Make international calls for as low as $.04/minute
                                      > > with Yahoo! Messenger
                                      > > http://phonecard.yahoo.com/
                                      > >
                                      > >
                                      > > "Z" WARNING! HANDLE WITH CARE! Highly addictive in
                                      > > Small DoseZ!
                                      > >
                                      > >
                                      > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
                                      > > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                                      > >
                                      > >
                                      > >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      > =====
                                      > WILLIAM BROCK
                                      >
                                      > __________________________________________________
                                      > Do You Yahoo!?
                                      > Make international calls for as low as $.04/minute with Yahoo!
                                      Messenger
                                      > http://phonecard.yahoo.com/

                                      Bill
                                      the class 52 runs perfectly around the 2nd radius ,195mm track, with
                                      no problems
                                      regards
                                      simon
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