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turnouts

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  • Dale Halterman
    A couple of weeks ago I posted a message inquiring about using turnouts on a 2 1/2 % grade. No one responded to it. I really would like to have some feedback
    Message 1 of 20 , Jun 17, 2001
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      A couple of weeks ago I posted a message inquiring about using turnouts
      on a 2 1/2 % grade. No one responded to it. I really would like to have
      some feedback on the idea. I have a double track mainline going up the
      grade and would like to put in crossovers so a n express could pass a
      slow frieght going up the grade. I wonder if anyone has had experience
      with a simular situation or has any assumption of what might be the
      result. Given the track record of Marklin turnouts should I press my
      luck? Dale
    • stamperdream@yahoo.ca
      Hi Dale, You really haven t been lucky in getting answers to your questions! Honestly, I wasn t sure if you were asking a question the first time around or if
      Message 2 of 20 , Jun 17, 2001
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        Hi Dale,

        You really haven't been lucky in getting answers to your
        questions! Honestly, I wasn't sure if you were asking a question
        the first time around or if you were expressing an opinion.

        Anyway, I have 1 turnout installed on a slight grade (1%) on the
        VEC. I don't see any reason why your turnout would not work on
        a 2.5% grade. Go for it but run trains and test the installation
        thoroughly before you ballast the track and make everything
        more or less permanent. Better be safe than sorry, right?

        Cheers,
        Jeffrey MacHan

        --- In z_scale@y..., Dale Halterman <dnhalt@m...> wrote:
        > A couple of weeks ago I posted a message inquiring about
        using turnouts
        > on a 2 1/2 % grade. No one responded to it. I really would like
        to have
        > some feedback on the idea. I have a double track mainline
        going up the
        > grade and would like to put in crossovers so a n express could
        pass a
        > slow frieght going up the grade. I wonder if anyone has had
        experience
        > with a simular situation or has any assumption of what might
        be the
        > result. Given the track record of Marklin turnouts should I press
        my
        > luck? Dale
      • dgsteve@altavista.com
        Hi Dale, I m in the planning stage now as well. I have started elevation tests and have a pair of turnouts planned for halfway up the grade. I think that I
        Message 3 of 20 , Jun 18, 2001
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          Hi Dale, I'm in the planning stage now as well. I have started
          elevation tests and have a pair of turnouts planned for halfway up
          the grade. I think that I will level out 4-5" before and aft of the
          switches and perhaps use the clearing for a service shack and some
          rail workers. I have found that an uneven grade on the actual turout
          can shift the wieght of the train and slow it a bit. I also have a
          circular turnout that I fear is warped slightly but that a whole
          different topic. Steve :)
          --- In z_scale@y..., Dale Halterman <dnhalt@m...> wrote:
          > A couple of weeks ago I posted a message inquiring about using
          turnouts
          > on a 2 1/2 % grade. No one responded to it. I really would like to
          have
          > some feedback on the idea. I have a double track mainline going up
          the
          > grade and would like to put in crossovers so a n express could pass
          a
          > slow frieght going up the grade. I wonder if anyone has had
          experience
          > with a simular situation or has any assumption of what might be the
          > result. Given the track record of Marklin turnouts should I press my
          > luck? Dale
        • M. Gottschalch
          ... Oh go ahead press it! Set up the switch and track the way you want it on a piece of plywood and then prop the wood up at the right slope and see if it
          Message 4 of 20 , Jun 18, 2001
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            Dale Halterman wrote:
            >
            > A couple of weeks ago I posted a message inquiring about using turnouts
            > on a 2 1/2 % grade. No one responded to it. I really would like to have
            > some feedback on the idea. I have a double track mainline going up the
            > grade and would like to put in crossovers so a n express could pass a
            > slow frieght going up the grade. I wonder if anyone has had experience
            > with a simular situation or has any assumption of what might be the
            > result. Given the track record of Marklin turnouts should I press my
            > luck? Dale
            >
            Oh go ahead press it! Set up the switch and track the way you want it
            on a piece of plywood and then prop the wood up at the right slope and
            see if it works.

            Now I've done the hard part and I expect a full report as to if it works
            or not. ;-)))
            --
            Manfred
          • Bill Hoshiko
            ... I have never done this in any scale but I have a few cautions for you. After your locomotive passes the vertical curve, traversing from level track to
            Message 5 of 20 , Jun 18, 2001
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              Dale Halterman wrote:
              >
              > A couple of weeks ago I posted a message inquiring about using
              > turnouts
              > on a 2 1/2 % grade.

              I have never done this in any scale but I have a few cautions for you.

              After your locomotive passes the vertical curve, traversing from level
              track to grade, you need a minimum of a locomotive's length before any
              turnout begins.

              There can be no grade change under your turnouts.

              If you are building a double crossover (using four switches and a
              crossing) build it on level ground first to test it. After you find
              that it works smoothly then raise it to your grade and test some more.

              If you are operating steam locomotives with pilot wheels, the shifting
              of the weight of the locomotive as it moves from going straight up hill
              to traveling in a diagonal manner may make some difference in how it
              tracks through the switches and the crossing. Sometimes the locomotive
              will track through with no problems but if you attach a train, it
              operates differently.

              Operating with diesels should mitigate any problems but you should test
              all your locomotives and test complete trains through this maze of
              tracks before you permanently tack everything down.

              A 2 1/2 % grade is pretty steep. A crossover between a two track
              mainline using Marklins sharp radius turnouts will make a fairly sharp
              "S" curve. This will place a limit on the length of your trains.

              If this crossover is a main component of your layout plan, you should
              try it out before you commit yourself to building it.

              Solving problems like this is what makes Z scale special.

              Bill
              El Toro
            • dgsteve@altavista.com
              Thanks folks for all the great posts on turnouts. I had one left hand turnout I was using for a siding and whenever the 4-6-0 went from siding to mainline it
              Message 6 of 20 , Jun 18, 2001
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                Thanks folks for all the great posts on turnouts. I had one left hand
                turnout I was using for a siding and whenever the 4-6-0 went from
                siding to mainline it "banged in scale" against the inside switch
                rail, I adjusted the table with a level and found the masonite I'm
                using for planning curved a bit to one corner. I shimmed the corner
                in question and the locomotive now sails through smoothly. It was so
                slight I would not have thought it would effect the train. Learn
                something new everyday...
                Steve
                --- In z_scale@y..., Bill Hoshiko <billhko@h...> wrote:
                >
                > Dale Halterman wrote:
                > >
                > > A couple of weeks ago I posted a message inquiring about using
                > > turnouts
                > > on a 2 1/2 % grade.
                >
                > I have never done this in any scale but I have a few cautions for
                you.
                >
                > After your locomotive passes the vertical curve, traversing from
                level
                > track to grade, you need a minimum of a locomotive's length before
                any
                > turnout begins.
                >
                > There can be no grade change under your turnouts.
                >
                > If you are building a double crossover (using four switches and a
                > crossing) build it on level ground first to test it. After you find
                > that it works smoothly then raise it to your grade and test some
                more.
                >
                > If you are operating steam locomotives with pilot wheels, the
                shifting
                > of the weight of the locomotive as it moves from going straight up
                hill
                > to traveling in a diagonal manner may make some difference in how it
                > tracks through the switches and the crossing. Sometimes the
                locomotive
                > will track through with no problems but if you attach a train, it
                > operates differently.
                >
                > Operating with diesels should mitigate any problems but you should
                test
                > all your locomotives and test complete trains through this maze of
                > tracks before you permanently tack everything down.
                >
                > A 2 1/2 % grade is pretty steep. A crossover between a two track
                > mainline using Marklins sharp radius turnouts will make a fairly
                sharp
                > "S" curve. This will place a limit on the length of your trains.
                >
                > If this crossover is a main component of your layout plan, you
                should
                > try it out before you commit yourself to building it.
                >
                > Solving problems like this is what makes Z scale special.
                >
                > Bill
                > El Toro
              • Dale Halterman
                I have three places on my double track mainline that I need to cross the inside track to get to the yard or sidings. In studying the traffic pattern I have
                Message 7 of 20 , Aug 1, 2001
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                  I have three places on my double track mainline that I need to cross the
                  inside track to get to the yard or sidings.
                  In studying the traffic pattern I have noticed that since the trains
                  will always be running the same direction on the mainline if the run
                  through feature on the Marklin turnouts will work properly I would never
                  need to move the points.
                  Since I am working at getting rid of the black boxes I am thinking that
                  I could remove the box on a manual turnout and cut off the control wire
                  at the end of the slide , put a slight bend in it and glue it to the
                  ties next to the track. I would have to experiment with the bend to find
                  the proper angle to put the right amount of tention on the points.
                  I would like some opinions as to whether you think this is a feasible
                  idea or am I just plain crazy. Dale
                • ktanskan@ruuvi.me.tut.fi
                  I also have three points in my plan with similar situation. So I m interested about results of your experiment. See
                  Message 8 of 20 , Aug 2, 2001
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                    I also have three points in my plan with similar situation.
                    So I'm interested about results of your experiment.
                    See http://tappi.me.tut.fi/~ktanskan/photo/z2/phase4a.jpg
                    for the layout plan. "Northern" tracks are supposed to head
                    "west" and "southern" tracks to "east". I am a bit concerned
                    though, whether I will change my mind with the operating pattern
                    some day. By the way, how often real trains run on track to wrong
                    direction? Only when the other track is closed for maintenance?

                    (I asked for comments on this plan in June, with no response.)

                    Regards,
                    ======================================================================
                    Kari Tanskanen ktanskan@...
                    http://tappi.me.tut.fi/~ktanskan/photo/z/
                    Tampere University of Technology Machine Design Laboratory
                    ======================================================================

                    --- In z_scale@y..., Dale Halterman <dnhalt@m...> wrote:
                    > I have three places on my double track mainline that I need to cross
                    the
                    > inside track to get to the yard or sidings.
                    > In studying the traffic pattern I have noticed that since the trains
                    > will always be running the same direction on the mainline if the run
                    > through feature on the Marklin turnouts will work properly I would
                    never
                    > need to move the points.
                  • jmac_han@hotmail.com
                    Hi Kari, Do not become frustrated with my slow response to your request for feedback on the trackplan. June and July were very busy months for me, as you
                    Message 9 of 20 , Aug 2, 2001
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                      Hi Kari,

                      Do not become frustrated with my slow response to your request for
                      feedback on the trackplan. June and July were very busy months for
                      me, as you know. I remember trying to download the plan the first
                      time that you posted the link and I had some problems with a slow
                      server and gave up. I tried yesterday and it worked a little better.

                      I will download and print out your plan to study it in more detail.
                      I will certainly share my thoughts with you.

                      On the subject of running through the points of the turnouts, my
                      experience leads me to believe that it is best to throw the points
                      for all train movements through turnouts. On the Val Ease Central,
                      trains will run through these points a couple of times then one
                      wheelset on one car will derail and chaos erupts, usually some
                      distance away from the turnout. When I look for the cause of the
                      derailment, I almost always find that the train had been running
                      through a closed sprung turnout point.

                      I'll get back to you soon.

                      Cheers,
                      Jeffrey MacHan



                      --- In z_scale@y..., ktanskan@r... wrote:
                      >
                      > I also have three points in my plan with similar situation.
                      > So I'm interested about results of your experiment.
                      > See http://tappi.me.tut.fi/~ktanskan/photo/z2/phase4a.jpg
                      > for the layout plan. "Northern" tracks are supposed to head
                      > "west" and "southern" tracks to "east". I am a bit concerned
                      > though, whether I will change my mind with the operating pattern
                      > some day. By the way, how often real trains run on track to wrong
                      > direction? Only when the other track is closed for maintenance?
                      >
                      > (I asked for comments on this plan in June, with no response.)
                      >
                      > Regards,
                      >
                      ======================================================================
                      > Kari Tanskanen ktanskan@m...
                      > http://tappi.me.tut.fi/~ktanskan/photo/z/
                      > Tampere University of Technology Machine Design Laboratory
                      >
                      ======================================================================
                      >
                      > --- In z_scale@y..., Dale Halterman <dnhalt@m...> wrote:
                      > > I have three places on my double track mainline that I need to
                      cross
                      > the
                      > > inside track to get to the yard or sidings.
                      > > In studying the traffic pattern I have noticed that since the
                      trains
                      > > will always be running the same direction on the mainline if the
                      run
                      > > through feature on the Marklin turnouts will work properly I would
                      > never
                      > > need to move the points.
                    • Daniel Baechtold
                      Hi z-heads, I think that the Halwa turnout Code 40 is the best I ve ever seen in z scale!! You can solder the feeder wires without melting any plastic, because
                      Message 10 of 20 , Aug 15, 2001
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                        Hi z-heads,

                        I think that the Halwa turnout Code 40 is the best I've ever seen in z
                        scale!!
                        You can solder the feeder wires without melting any plastic, because the
                        ties are made from wood. It has the realistic height, profile and looks
                        absolutely marvellous!!

                        have a look yourself at: http://www.halwa.de/gleise.htm

                        I just put in another 0.02$! Best wishes, Daniel

                        --
                        Daniel Baechtold
                        Jurastrasse 37
                        CH-4242 Laufen
                        Switzerland

                        http://dbaechtold.gmxhome.de
                        d.baechtold@...
                        daniel.baechtold@...
                      • CECIL EDWARDS
                        Hi Manfred. I read your contribution to the subject. I am still very much in favour of using Vero board. We are dealing here with small trains and by using
                        Message 11 of 20 , Jul 14, 2003
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                          Hi Manfred.
                          I read your contribution to the subject. I am still very much in favour of using Vero board. We are dealing here with small trains and by using VERO things can be much much smaller.No drilling just press the pins in, well maybe you will need to open the holes very slightly. Pins come in packs of 100 I believe and very cheap.Solder joints are much more reliable than wire wrapped around screws. Compare the price of pins to screws washers and nuts.Must confess that having been in the wiring business for almost 40 years I'm prejudiced. If soldering is the problem just give me a shout I,ve had plenty of experience and will pass on to anyone who needs it..

                          Regards Cecil


                          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                        • M. Gottschalch
                          Hi Cecil, Don t get me wrong I like the idea of those proto boards and pins a lot. Its just that I would need a rather large one or need to set several
                          Message 12 of 20 , Jul 15, 2003
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                            Hi Cecil,

                            Don't get me wrong I like the idea of those proto boards and pins a lot.
                            Its just that I would need a rather large one or need to set several
                            together in order to cover my layout. That would probably not present
                            too much of a problem. However I have a tendency to lean on things when
                            I reach over them and the thought of those pins in my hand just isn't
                            very pleasant. There is also the problem that the proto boards are not
                            really the most sturdy thing in the world and any weight on them would
                            not be conducive to their longevity.

                            Now for a small layout I can see that having a handy carry around sized
                            control like what are talking about would be OK. You could even
                            incorporate the track position lights and all into it with small LEDs.
                            But you would still have the problem with the pins sticking up. I think
                            it would be too easy to hit the wrong pin with the probe especially in a
                            situation where there are a lot of pins in a small area. It is easier
                            for me to aim for a slightly larger screw head and hit it without
                            accidentally hitting another one at the same time. So while your idea is
                            a very good one for a small carry around controller, for me a big solid
                            board with everything integrated on it is better. I'll probably even use
                            switches on it that flip in the correct direction to show the switch
                            position with a momentary contact at the end of the travel. That way I
                            don't have to use lights to show turnout position. Though I do like
                            lights a lot. :-)

                            --
                            Manfred G
                          • Ralph Scott
                            Have you thought about using the Peco stud system on 2.5 mm (0.1inch) acrylic sheet ? The acrylic sheet comes covered in protecting paper which you peel off
                            Message 13 of 20 , Jul 15, 2003
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                              Have you thought about using the Peco stud system on 2.5 mm (0.1inch) acrylic sheet ?
                              The acrylic sheet comes covered in protecting paper which you peel off .You can draw your track plan (or parts of your track plan) on the paper cut out the track plan with a sharp knife then spray modelling paint over the whole thing and peel off the paper when the paint is almost dry leaving you with a very profrssional looking track plan . You then drill holes for your studs , switches and occupancy lights.
                              Its all very easy even for beginners!
                              Ralph
                              ----- Original Message -----
                              From: M. Gottschalch
                              To: z_scale@yahoogroups.com
                              Sent: Tuesday, July 15, 2003 11:40 PM
                              Subject: Re: [z_scale] turnouts


                              Hi Cecil,

                              Don't get me wrong I like the idea of those proto boards and pins a lot.
                              Its just that I would need a rather large one or need to set several
                              together in order to cover my layout. That would probably not present
                              too much of a problem. However I have a tendency to lean on things when
                              I reach over them and the thought of those pins in my hand just isn't
                              very pleasant. There is also the problem that the proto boards are not
                              really the most sturdy thing in the world and any weight on them would
                              not be conducive to their longevity.

                              Now for a small layout I can see that having a handy carry around sized
                              control like what are talking about would be OK. You could even
                              incorporate the track position lights and all into it with small LEDs.
                              But you would still have the problem with the pins sticking up. I think
                              it would be too easy to hit the wrong pin with the probe especially in a
                              situation where there are a lot of pins in a small area. It is easier
                              for me to aim for a slightly larger screw head and hit it without
                              accidentally hitting another one at the same time. So while your idea is
                              a very good one for a small carry around controller, for me a big solid
                              board with everything integrated on it is better. I'll probably even use
                              switches on it that flip in the correct direction to show the switch
                              position with a momentary contact at the end of the travel. That way I
                              don't have to use lights to show turnout position. Though I do like
                              lights a lot. :-)

                              --
                              Manfred G



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                              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                            • M. Gottschalch
                              ... I ll have to look into that. -- Manfred G
                              Message 14 of 20 , Jul 16, 2003
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                                Ralph Scott wrote:
                                >
                                > Have you thought about using the Peco stud system on 2.5 mm (0.1inch) acrylic sheet ?
                                > The acrylic sheet comes covered in protecting paper which you peel off .You can draw your track plan (or parts of your track plan) on the paper cut out the track plan with a sharp knife then spray modelling paint over the whole thing and peel off the paper when the paint is almost dry leaving you with a very profrssional looking track plan . You then drill holes for your studs , switches and occupancy lights.
                                > Its all very easy even for beginners!
                                > Ralph

                                I'll have to look into that.
                                --
                                Manfred G
                              • Thomas P. Scheuzger
                                I tried uploading the second pdf version of Jeremy s files but yahoo isn t responding. I ll try again in the AM. Tom
                                Message 15 of 20 , Jul 16, 2003
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                                  I tried uploading the second pdf version of Jeremy's files but yahoo isn't responding. I'll try again in the AM.

                                  Tom
                                • mark_l_45503
                                  Does anyone make turnouts besides Marklin and Aspen? I want to start buying track for my layout and these are the only two manufacturers that I have found.
                                  Message 16 of 20 , Jan 5, 2005
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                                    Does anyone make turnouts besides Marklin and Aspen? I want to
                                    start buying track for my layout and these are the only two
                                    manufacturers that I have found.

                                    Thanks!
                                    Mark Lewis
                                  • miked_r@yahoo.com
                                    Hi Mark, Although I have not yet tried them, many on this list swear by Peter Wright s turnouts with live frogs. http://www.wrightturnouts.com/ You ll have to
                                    Message 17 of 20 , Jan 5, 2005
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                                      Hi Mark,

                                      Although I have not yet tried them, many on this list swear by Peter
                                      Wright's turnouts with live frogs.

                                      http://www.wrightturnouts.com/

                                      You'll have to add a switch machine like a Tortoise or Atlas.

                                      Check here for even more:

                                      http://www.zscale.org/articles/turnoutstalling.html#alternatives

                                      All of this can be found through a little searching in the "Z_Scale
                                      enZyclopedia" on the home page of this group :-)

                                      Of course you can always hand lay your tracks and turnouts!

                                      Best of luck,

                                      Michael


                                      --- In z_scale@yahoogroups.com, "mark_l_45503" <mark_l_45503@y...> wrote:
                                      >
                                      > Does anyone make turnouts besides Marklin and Aspen? I want to
                                      > start buying track for my layout and these are the only two
                                      > manufacturers that I have found.
                                      >
                                      > Thanks!
                                      > Mark Lewis
                                    • de Champeaux Dominique
                                      ... Contact Peter Wright: obin69@hotmailcom Découvrez le nouveau Yahoo! Mail : 250 Mo d espace de stockage pour vos mails ! Créez votre Yahoo! Mail sur
                                      Message 18 of 20 , Jan 6, 2005
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                                        --- mark_l_45503 <mark_l_45503@...> a écrit :
                                        >
                                        >
                                        > Does anyone make turnouts besides Marklin and Aspen?
                                        > I want to
                                        > start buying track for my layout and these are the
                                        > only two
                                        > manufacturers that I have found.
                                        >
                                        > Thanks!
                                        > Mark Lewis

                                        Contact Peter Wright: obin69@hotmailcom






                                        Découvrez le nouveau Yahoo! Mail : 250 Mo d'espace de stockage pour vos mails !
                                        Créez votre Yahoo! Mail sur http://fr.mail.yahoo.com/
                                      • Cliff Darrow
                                        Mark, Please see my website for info on Z scale turnout options. Thanks! Cliff www.smallscalelogistics.com
                                        Message 19 of 20 , Jan 6, 2005
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                                          Mark,

                                          Please see my website for info on Z scale turnout options. Thanks!

                                          Cliff
                                          www.smallscalelogistics.com
                                        • Bill Powers
                                          JOE. Where O where are the turnouts? Price? Etc. Bill [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                          Message 20 of 20 , Jul 23, 2006
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                                            JOE. Where O where are the turnouts? Price? Etc. Bill

                                            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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