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Re: [z_scale] Re: scale houses ?????

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  • Reynard Wellman
    Hello Jeffrey, This forced perspective thing is very interesting. True, it does not occur to me to attempt such ideas for my own work. I have customers in the
    Message 1 of 15 , Nov 5, 2002
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      Hello Jeffrey,

      This forced perspective thing is very interesting.
      True, it does not occur to me to attempt such ideas for
      my own work. I have customers in the larger scales (HO and N)
      who buy Z scale items saying that is how they are
      using them. It turns out that two of them are photographers
      and since a photograph is not a hologram, using a small scale
      object to make things look further back seems to me
      to be a very cogent method. Hollywood does it all the
      time to avoid the expense of large sets.

      Also I guess that a lot of the layouts you listed have a wall
      or reference backboard in which the background has
      distant mountains, trees, etc. that would lend themselves
      to forced perspective. So for that purpose, those tiny
      Marklin resin objects would work. But I wouldn't photo
      graph them with a locomotive next them, that might tell.
      Finally, I should say that "forced perspective" will only
      work from the viewing angle that was intended and when
      you get around to the other side of the layout it is like
      looking down the wrong end of a telescope.

      I do own some of those Marklin resin items but
      they just don't look right on the layout so I don't use
      them. Besides I have acquired quite a collection of paper
      buildings that work very well as "fillers" at a 10th of the cost.

      In fact, a sturdily built printed paper structures with brass
      windows and other details carefully merged into
      them is as charming as our full brass structures. I have been
      experimenting with designs to support such paper
      structures and am happy to announce that this concept is
      extremely successful. Using this method all I have to do
      is paint the brass parts, since the paper buildings are already
      colored, and then assemble them. It saves hours of building
      time and is remarkably photogenic! Stay tuned, there will
      be a formal list of new items at the end of November.

      Best regards,
      Reynard
      http://www.micronart.com/


      > Hello Reynard,
      > >SNIP
      >
      > This is one of the distinctive characteristics of "Z" scale and one
      > which I personally enjoy enormously. I like to stand back 10 - 15
      > (and more if possible) feet from the VECRR and enjoy the high
      > altitude or distant peak point of view. It must be a Gestalt thing.
      > Not many HO modellers can get to look at their layouts this way.
      >
      > Now that I am working on the layout at home, I am seeing it from a
      > much closer distance while adding details that won't be visible from
      > more than 3 feet away. I have to admit, I'm seeing a lot of new
      > angles I hadn't discovered before. I wish I had a camera that
      > allowed me to capture what I am seeing...hmmm...a periscope doodad
      > might work!
      >
      > >
      > > Just my personal taste.
      >
      > And rightly so. Modelling is an artistic endeavour, so personal
      > taste is everything and nobody is ever wrong.
      >
      > Just a couple of thoughts, ;-)
      > Jeffrey
      >
      >
      >
      > "Z" WARNING! HANDLE WITH CARE! Highly addictive in Small
      > DoseZ!
      >
      >
      > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.


      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • Reynard Wellman
      Hello Kari, This is a different subject. What you have done is the kind of forced perspective that artists use to create distance by using strongly angled
      Message 2 of 15 , Nov 5, 2002
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        Hello Kari,

        This is a different subject. What you have done
        is the kind of "forced perspective" that artists use
        to create distance by using strongly angled vanishing
        points. What we have been casually discussing are
        some items that are "not to scale" that can be used
        to look further away. I just don't buy it. Your method
        is much more believable and the results are excellent.

        Besides, the viaduct and the train are to scale!

        Thanks for the beautiful photograph.

        Best regards,
        Reynard

        Kari Tanskanen wrote:

        >
        > Watching from low angles helps and forced perspective works better
        > with two dimension photographs. But I have noticed that I really can
        > fool
        > my own eyes with the forced perspective.
        >
        > For example in this picture (my favourite view)
        >
        > ttp://tappi.me.tut.fi/~ktanskan/photo/z/gorge/waterfall_with_background.jpg
        >
        > distance from the waterfall to the mountain top is about two feet
        > and "forcing factor" maybe 50:1.
        >
        > Kari
        >
        > Reynard Wellman wrote:
        > >
        > > Hello Dominique,
        > >
        > > Maybe I'm too critical but I seldom see a Z scale
        > > layout that is much wider than 1 meter so a "forced
        > > perspective" wouldn't have much to do with items
        > > on some distant hill. Most of the time Z scale is
        > > seen from a bird's eye view anyway.
        > >
        > > I think that folks who are into photography can
        > > better use a "forced perspective" item in their compositions.
        > > To me, they don't look right no matter how far
        > > I get away from them.
        > >
        > > Just my personal taste.
        > >
        > > Best regards,
        > > Reynard
        > >
        >
        > "Z" WARNING! HANDLE WITH CARE! Highly addictive in Small
        > DoseZ!
        >
        >
        > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.


        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • Kari Tanskanen
        I agree. As a conclusion: To work, forced perspective requires change of elevation uphill or downhill and preferably some natural objects which don t have
        Message 3 of 15 , Nov 6, 2002
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          I agree. As a conclusion: To work, forced perspective requires
          change of elevation uphill or downhill and preferably some natural
          objects which don't have obvious scale like trees, bushes or rock
          cliffs. An empty parking lot between Z scale and forced scale objects
          doesn't do the trick.
          (For a photography session I have planned to add 1:100 scale hikers next
          to the waterfall. In reality it does not work but in a photo it might...
          and it's easier to paint bigger people.)

          Kari
          ===========================================================================
          Kari Tanskanen ktanskan@...
          http://tappi.me.tut.fi/~ktanskan/photo/z/
          Tampere University of Technology Machine Design Laboratory
          ===========================================================================

          Reynard Wellman wrote:
          >
          > Hello Kari,
          >
          > This is a different subject. What you have done
          > is the kind of "forced perspective" that artists use
          > to create distance by using strongly angled vanishing
          > points. What we have been casually discussing are
          > some items that are "not to scale" that can be used
          > to look further away. I just don't buy it. Your method
          > is much more believable and the results are excellent.
          >
          > Besides, the viaduct and the train are to scale!
          >
          > Thanks for the beautiful photograph.
          >
          > Best regards,
          > Reynard
          >
          > Kari Tanskanen wrote:
          >
          > >
          > > Watching from low angles helps and forced perspective works better
          > > with two dimension photographs. But I have noticed that I really can
          > > fool
          > > my own eyes with the forced perspective.
          > >
          > > For example in this picture (my favourite view)
          > >
          > > http://tappi.me.tut.fi/~ktanskan/photo/z/gorge/waterfall_with_background.jpg
          > >
          > > distance from the waterfall to the mountain top is about two feet
          > > and "forcing factor" maybe 50:1.
          > >
          > > Kari
          > >
        • davidamiller57@aol.com
          Anyone interested, My 4 X 8 foot layout has been finished for years. I am working on a 5 X 12 foot addition. With some warning, I d be willing to show my
          Message 4 of 15 , Nov 6, 2002
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            Anyone interested,
            My 4 X 8 foot layout has been finished for years. I am working on a 5 X 12
            foot addition. With some warning, I'd be willing to show my layout to
            whommever is in the Northwest Ohio area. West of Toledo. You can get a
            preview of my layout by looking in Great Modelrailroads 1997 issue. You can
            contact me on this forum
            (I follow it regularly) or my e-mail address (davidamiller57@....)

            Happy hunting.
            Dave


            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • Frank Daniels
            I have some: Church, house, train station. Email me at: f r a n k @ z s c a l e h o b o . c o m Regards, Frank Daniels www.zscalehobo.com ... you in
            Message 5 of 15 , Nov 20, 2002
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              I have some:
              Church, house, train station.

              Email me at:
              f r a n k @ z s c a l e h o b o . c o m

              Regards,
              Frank Daniels
              www.zscalehobo.com

              --- In z_scale@y..., "Svein-Martin Holt" <smholt@s...> wrote:
              > Or you can use them to create a forced perspective in your scene.
              >
              > If they are smaller, they will look like they are longer away from
              you in
              > the scene.
              >
              > A question: Do some of you know where to buy this resinhouses?
              >
              >
              >
              > Hilsen/Regards,
              > Svein-Martin Holt
              >
              > ============================================
              > Name: Svein-Martin Holt E-mail: smholt@s...
              > Country: Norway Mobil: +47 91 76 76 48
              > Internet: http://expo.technocad.no/personal/sho
              > ============================================
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