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Re: [z_scale] Electronic Speed Controllers

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  • David George
    I purchased a Maerklin Fun Set and think it is the neatest package. I plan to display the -see through- plastic briefcase set on my layout at train shows.I
    Message 1 of 2 , Nov 3, 2002
      I purchased a Maerklin Fun Set and think it is the neatest package.
      I plan to display the -see through- plastic briefcase set on my layout at train shows.I have not opened my set so it is still a virgin. This is an easy visual answer to " what does it take to get started in Z scale?"
      David G.
      Spring,Tx.
      Chris Sheldrake <chris@...> wrote:I have now received and installed the first version of Jeremy's electronic
      pulse speed controller and can report that I am very pleased with it. This
      is the version that fits into the Marklin fun set Battery switchbox. This
      standard Marklin unit is simplicity itself to use in that it has two
      settings, 0.0 mph and 200mph. Well, three really because the train will
      also go 200mph in reverse as well ! Even a McLaren F1 can't do that ( oops,
      sorry Jeffery ! )

      With Jeremy's pulse unit I now have full control over the loco.

      I've taken some digital photographs of the unit and the installation process
      and will post these with the promised article very soon. In the meantime I'm
      waiting patiently to receive and install the first production unit of the
      version designed to fit briefcase layouts.


      Chris Sheldrake



      -----Original Message-----
      From: z_scale@yahoogroups.com [mailto:z_scale@yahoogroups.com]
      Sent: Sunday, November 03, 2002 8:55 AM
      To: z_scale@yahoogroups.com
      Subject: [z_scale] Digest Number 1198



      "Z" WARNING! HANDLE WITH CARE! Highly addictive in Small DoseZ!

      ------------------------------------------------------------------------

      There are 9 messages in this issue.

      Topics in this digest:

      1. Re: Custom Briefcase Layout
      From: "Jeremy Brandon" <Jeremy.Brandon@...>
      2. Re: Custom Briefcase Layout
      From: "Jeremy Brandon" <Jeremy.Brandon@...>
      3. Re: Casey Jones woes
      From: Reynard Wellman <micron@...>
      4. Z for sale
      From: m383350@...
      5. Re: Z for sale
      From: Gto66777@...
      6. Track
      From: Cliff Travis <cliff@...>
      7. Re: Track
      From: "jmac_han" <jmac_han@...>
      8. Re: Z for sale
      From: m383350@...
      9. Re: Track
      From: zbendtrack@...


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      Message: 1
      Date: Sat, 02 Nov 2002 10:53:15 -0000
      From: "Jeremy Brandon" <Jeremy.Brandon@...>
      Subject: Re: Custom Briefcase Layout

      --- In z_scale@y..., "cwsanger72" <cwsanger@h...> wrote:
      > I am planning out making my own briefcase layout, but I am not sure
      > how to do the power supply that runs off the 9 volt battery.

      --- In z_scale@y..., "jmac_han" <jmac_han@y...>
      > You're in luck, CW. Jeremy Brandon, of Joerger Systems, has just
      > introduced an IC circuit that allows extraordinary slow speed
      control
      > from a 9 volt battery. The unit is designed to fit inside the
      > Marklin 9v battery pack but I'm sure that you could easily find a
      way
      > to use it for your project.
      > Perhaps Jeremy could explain how to adapt it to your needs. The 9v
      > controller is available from Ztrack Magazine. ztrack @ aol.com

      --- In z_scale@y..., John Cubbin <jcubbin@o...>
      > Here's another approach for using a 9V battery as your power supply:
      > http://www.fr-model.de/english/information_scratch_battery.htm


      When we are talking about powering a layout just from a 9 volt block
      battery, there seem to be three possibilities:

      (1) use a 50 ohm rheostat (at least 4 watt); this produces pure/flat
      DC whose level fluctuates with the load on the motor (unregulated);
      it has no short-circuit protection.
      (2) use the voltage regulator circuit described in the link given by
      John Cubbin; this produces pure/flat DC whose level is set precisely
      by the speed control (regulated); it has very good built-in short-
      circuit protection.
      (3) use the unit I produce for System Joerger; this produces full
      voltage pulses at 50 per second whose width depends on the speed
      control; it uses a current-limiting circuit for short-circuit
      protection.

      For unavoidable physical reasons, (1) and (2) do not give very good
      slow-running performance for many locos: as the speed control is
      increased, the motor will not start until a certain critical voltage
      has been reached, and then it runs fairly fast; reducing the speed
      control slows the motor until a second critical voltage is reached,
      then it stops. These two critical points are different for each
      motor. (2) gives better performance than (1).

      (3) is designed for good slow-running: as the speed control is
      increased, the motor starts to turn when a certain critical pulse
      width is reached (the minimum movement is "half-a-pole"), and then
      turns that much at every pulse - for a 5-pole motor, 1/10 turn 50
      times per second gives 5 turns per second, then through the 25:1
      reduction gear means the driving wheels take 5 seconds to turn once.
      As the speed control is further increased, the wider pulses turn the
      motor more each time until eventually a "flywheel" mode is reached
      when the momentum of the motor keeps it turning between the pulses.
      Only flywheel mode is sustainable by pure/flat DC.

      I have emphasised short-circuit protection because even 9 volt block
      batteries can generate considerable heat when short circuited,
      certainly enough to damage the plastic battery container. Fortunately
      in extreme cases the battery is quickly discharged and the danger
      passes. However, if a "stronger" power source is used - a mains
      adapter or lead-acid accumulator for example - short-circuit
      protection becomes crucial. An unprotected layout could even catch on
      fire because of a short-circuit. For this reason, I do not recommend
      (1) or (3) with any power source other than the 9 volt block battery.

      I have designed a version of my controller specifically for briefcase
      layouts and suitable for use with "stronger" power sources. It is a
      small circuit board built on a standard potentiometer. The
      potentiometer has a switch for turning the power on and off. The
      circuit has full short-circuit protection using a positive
      temperature coefficient resistor, and an appropriate capacitor for
      suppressing high frequency signals from the track. It will be
      available either from System Joerger or from Noch. A picture of the
      prototype is here:
      http://groups.yahoo.com/group/z_scale/files/Munich%
      20Zmeet/pix/Noch.jpg

      I hope this helps. Jeremy.




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      Message: 2
      Date: Sat, 02 Nov 2002 10:57:28 -0000
      From: "Jeremy Brandon" <Jeremy.Brandon@...>
      Subject: Re: Custom Briefcase Layout

      These links!!! Try this: http://tinyurl.com/2dzc
      Sorry. Jeremy.



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      Message: 3
      Date: Sat, 02 Nov 2002 09:02:47 -0600
      From: Reynard Wellman <micron@...>
      Subject: Re: Casey Jones woes

      Hello Roger,

      The only thing to do is to either file some of the
      material off the bottom of the cattle catcher and
      then touch it up with Badger-Engine Black or
      bend it up slightly which would be ugly.

      It has trouble pulling the cars because it does not
      have enough weight to hold traction. I would not
      haul more than three of the four pullmans and would
      avoid running it on grades of any kind. Some of
      this Z scale stuff works best on a flat coffee table
      with a limited amount of turnouts and that's about it.

      Good luck,
      Reynard


      Roger Shimada wrote:

      > The Casey Jones loco is a wonderfully detailed piece of work.
      >
      > Mine seems to have a problem: the cow catcher is too low. It may be
      > scraping against the track. (That probably explains why it has
      > trouble pulling all of the cars in the set.) It hits the points on
      > turnouts and gets stuck.
      >
      > Any suggestions would sure be appreciated!
      >
      >
      > "Z" WARNING! HANDLE WITH CARE! Highly addictive in Small
      > DoseZ!
      >
      >
      > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.


      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



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      Message: 4
      Date: Sat, 2 Nov 2002 12:39:26 EST
      From: m383350@...
      Subject: Z for sale

      Unfortunately I have to sell all my Z gauge stuff.

      Marklin set
      81465 Sante Fe set (like new in box, has different gondola & box cars) I
      never used it. Bought it from a very reputable source, and tested before
      purchase. This is very much like a new set including all paperwork etc, the
      power cord hasn't even been undone, or the track used, or even the wiring.

      8674 New York Central gondola boxed
      8673 New haven boxcar 8636 Santa Fe caboose (missing smoke stack)
      8816 Rail bus 2 boxed
      6727 power supply boxed (us)
      6727A power supply boxed (us)
      8858 engine boxed
      8622 gondola boxed
      8605 boxcar? boxed
      expandable container car boxed
      DB container cars 2
      Sea land container cars 2
      starter set flatcars 3
      starter set loco 0-6-0 (2 of these)
      Bananen boxcar
      Dinkel Acker beer car
      Staufen Brau beer car
      esso tank car
      green storagecar? (might be from starter set, might be a caboose?) 2
      Reading gondola




      Micro-trains
      14601-2 southern pacific bulkhead flatcar boxed micro couplers boxed
      14402 Santa Fe tanker boxed marklin couplers
      13806 New york central 40' stockcar maklin couplers boxed
      Seaboard orange blossom special boxcar micro couplers
      Clinchfield Cushion Car boxcar micro couplers



      Marklin track
      8561-8564 switch 1 left, 1 right new
      8500 straight track new 7 pieces
      8591 curve track new 2 pieces
      8521 curve track new 6 pieces
      8520 curve track new 4 pieces

      7209 6 new
      8974 rerailer 2
      7272 control box new 2


      slightly used track (like new)
      8507 straight 2 pieces
      8591 curve 2 pieces
      8500 straight 7 pieces
      8503 straight 1 piece
      8506 straight 4 pieces
      8520 curve w/ leads soldered 1 piece
      8590 terminal track straight 1 piece
      8504 straight 4 pieces



      Itty bitty lines cork
      m100-5 single track 2 3/4 packs
      m300-1 straight switch 4 packs
      m400-1 curve switch 2 packs
      m500-1 double slip switch 2 packs

      Merten people-new in the box
      2399 pedestrians
      870 track repairmen
      2343 construction workers
      2180 street pedestrians

      10 cars & 1aral truck w/trailer

      There is also some more track and some rail joiner included, there are also
      some other items like a building and a couple of non-running engines.

      I want to sell this all as one lot if possible and would sell it for $500 or
      best offer.

      Thanks,

      Mitch


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      Message: 5
      Date: Sat, 2 Nov 2002 13:26:58 EST
      From: Gto66777@...
      Subject: Re: Z for sale

      Do u have any pictures of all this?
      Dave


      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



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      Message: 6
      Date: Sat, 02 Nov 2002 14:40:42 -0500
      From: Cliff Travis <cliff@...>
      Subject: Track

      Hi,
      I need advice on laying flex track.
      Are there any tricks to getting smooth curves?----- to get a good
      transition from a flextrack curve to straight standard Marklin track?----
      best way to trim rail length?
      Regards
      Cliff


      All Seasons Camera
      Cliff Travis
      5 Harvard Lane PO Box 111
      Hastings on Hudson, NY 10706
      cliff@...

      www.allcamera.com
      914 478 0931
      FAX 914 478 7354



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      Message: 7
      Date: Sat, 02 Nov 2002 22:14:40 -0000
      From: "jmac_han" <jmac_han@...>
      Subject: Re: Track

      Yeah, Cliff, the trick is to NOT start your curve immediately at the
      end of a piece of Marklin straight track. Start your flex this length
      of straight from the curve, tack it down (I use straight pins
      through the centre of the ties) and begin to bend the flex around
      the curve, using a gradually increasing tighter radius (easement
      approach).

      There is a terrific explanation of track laying on cork in the 'files -
      FAQ - How to lay removable track' by Bill Kronenberger.

      Cheers,
      Jeffrey MacHan

      --- In z_scale@y..., Cliff Travis <cliff@a...> wrote:
      > Hi,
      > I need advice on laying flex track.
      > Are there any tricks to getting smooth curves?----- to get a good
      > transition from a flextrack curve to straight standard Marklin
      track?----
      > best way to trim rail length?
      > Regards
      > Cliff




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      Message: 8
      Date: Sat, 2 Nov 2002 18:18:20 EST
      From: m383350@...
      Subject: Re: Z for sale

      In a message dated 11/2/02 1:34:00 PM Eastern Standard Time,
      Gto66777@...
      writes:


      > Do u have any pictures of all this?
      > Dave
      >
      >
      >

      Dave,

      I have a digital camera, so I can try to take some pic's. Most everything I
      purchased from Glenn & Sandy, and if you have ever dealt with them you know
      the quality of the stuff they sell. I am selling my collection, I had some
      big plans for doing a coffee table layout under glass, but my Malibu is the
      project that I need to finish....they take so much money to do up right.
      I'll take some pic's and e-mail you a little later on tonight, I've been
      working on the 'Bu this afternoon, pulled the motor and tranny and front
      clip
      since I posted the list up for sale.

      Mitch


      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



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      Message: 9
      Date: Sat, 2 Nov 2002 19:31:58 EST
      From: zbendtrack@...
      Subject: Re: Track

      Cliff:

      > Are there any tricks to getting smooth curves?----- to get a good
      > transition from a flextrack curve to straight standard Marklin track?----

      First, thanks to Jeffrey for saying the nice things about one of my uploads
      to the group files. The method still works well for most folks' hands.

      Cliff, there are many methods of emulating the real railroad's "Transition"
      curve technology. Simply stated, its a piece of track that is absolutely
      straight at one end, and curved to the desired curve at the other...and
      in-between is some of the darnest mathematics you've ever seen....to keep
      freight cars from "lurching" from centrical force when entering the curve.

      In model RR's, some folks still use the "bent stick" mechanical method of
      getting that "special section of track" -- by bending a thin piece of wood
      which is fastened only at one end. It gives a reasonable logarithmic curve
      very close to a true Transition curve.

      I'll share a more computerized way with you. ATLAS model railroad company
      does not make Z scale anything. But they do have a nice track layout
      software package called "Right Track Software" (RTS) that is absolutely
      free.


      Since track centerlines are all I'm ever interested in (not graphic
      mountains, virtual buildings, and 3D rotations) it works fine in Z scale.
      Centerlines do not know "scale" and only concern terms like radius, length,
      straight and curved, etc.

      Many of the modules we use were laid out on RTS, to help with visualization
      to insure correct curve radius, calculate track to purchase, and make all
      layout revisions on the screen and not with power saws, glues and the
      expression of unspeakable words after committing a design to lumber. We
      print out the final drawing full size (1:1) and trace it on the plywood then
      lay track on the centerline.

      RTS does do a nice centerline calculation for you on centerlines, which can
      be printed out full size and traced to your layout very nicely.

      So, I uploaded a RTS RAL file on the Z_Scale Files sections. IT IS DATA
      FILE, not an executable file. It cannot carry a virus. It is just a text
      file meaningful only to RTS when drawing the centerlines on the screen. You
      have to get the executable part from www(dot)atlasrr(dot)com by downloading
      the freeware from their site. They also have a ton of N Scale RAL files you
      may wish to also download, for track layout ideas in Z.

      If you bother to do get the RTS software, just load and print the RAL file I
      uploaded out full size (about 6 sheets of paper). You'll see the transition
      piece quite clearly. By double clicking on the track, you can change the
      radius, etc., to any radius you care to use on your layout, without having
      to
      learn RTS in the process.

      > best way to trim rail length?

      Of the many "preferred" methods folks use, I use Xuron rail nippers (under
      $10) and cut the rail from top to bottom. No file work was ever been
      required to a cut, so far. DO NOT use the Xuron cutters for anything else
      (cutting wire, styrene, wood, paper) or they will be useless for track
      cutting afterwards.

      If that doesn't make sense, ask your wife if you can use her prized cloth
      cutting scissors to chop up some cardboard. She'll explain it to you quite
      clearly. <smile>

      Hope some of this helps.
      Bill K.
      Houston



      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



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      "Z" WARNING! HANDLE WITH CARE! Highly addictive in Small DoseZ!


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