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Re: [Yoshinkan] Re: Fights

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  • cjnolan
    Yes this is a typo. Sorry for all of my typos.For the record I did not go looking for a fight.
    Message 1 of 33 , Mar 1, 2005
      Yes this is a typo. Sorry for all of my typos.For the record I did not go
      looking for a fight.
    • Shumaker, Gordon
      What a memory!!!! Couldn t help myself. ... From: mick.chambers@nokia.com [mailto:mick.chambers@nokia.com] Sent: Wednesday, March 02, 2005 10:44 AM To:
      Message 33 of 33 , Mar 2, 2005
        What a memory!!!!

        Couldn't help myself.

        -----Original Message-----
        From: mick.chambers@... [mailto:mick.chambers@...]
        Sent: Wednesday, March 02, 2005 10:44 AM
        To: yoshinkan@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: RE: [Yoshinkan] Re: Aikido in a fight

        well once there was this after training meeting at the local country bar
        in Georgetown and we were all playing pool next to a table of bikers.
        One of the bikers was a girl all done up in here leathers and one of the
        guys we were with loved Harley girls and just couldn't help himself...
        ...you may know how this one finishes Gordie.

        first rule of fight club is no one talks about fight club..

        -----Original Message-----
        From: ext Shumaker, Gordon [mailto:gordon.shumaker@...]
        Sent: 02 March, 2005 10:05
        To: 'yoshinkan@yahoogroups.com'
        Subject: RE: [Yoshinkan] Re: Aikido in a fight

        Is grabbing someone's wife's behind a reason for a fight? Good to know. I
        won't do that anymore. Thanks for the information, Mick. By the way, how
        do you know that?


        -----Original Message-----
        From: mick.chambers@... [mailto:mick.chambers@...]
        Sent: Wednesday, March 02, 2005 9:21 AM
        To: yoshinkan@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: RE: [Yoshinkan] Re: Aikido in a fight

        good stories !

        I have to say that I don't see what the problem with fighting is?
        if you look at a fight as a sport then I have no problem with it.
        Just don't over dramatize it. Charles' stories are very typical.
        you get into a fight because you have accidentally offended someone
        and you need to at least defend yourself because they don't give you
        much of a choice. Or someone offends you and they did so in a manner
        that is impossible to ignore ( for example they grab your wife's behind)
        Teaching a punk a little lesson is not that big a deal usually.
        With that said, the fights that are dangerous are the ones that
        are not in bars, family reunions, weddings,(im Irish) or generally in
        public places. The ones that we train for are the mugging situations,
        Rape, and I hope that we develop awareness that helps us to avoid sucker
        punches, which are also very dangerous as Mat pointed out with his
        friend needing reconstructive surgery.
        You don't walk away from fights, you do what Charles did and you
        sort it out and get on with your beer, er.. life.

        I heard a Ki Society Sensei once say that O Sensei never needed to fight
        because he was like a Lion walking amongst the lambs, and the lambs knew

        So my opinion is that I will walk away from a fight if I want to based
        on the situation, but most likely I will just try and get it over quickly,
        win or lose. I certainly would not say that my Aikido training has taught
        to walk away from fights, it has taught me that starting a fight is
        always wrong - but ending one, that is a different story :-)

        -----Original Message-----
        From: ext charles burmeister [mailto:chuchucharlie@...]
        Sent: 01 March, 2005 18:11
        To: yoshinkan@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: [Yoshinkan] Re: Aikido in a fight

        Sorry, this post is long!

        I find this topic amusing in many respects. It seems that the majority of
        people responding to this topic have not been in an altercation since
        studying Aikido and or have never been in a altercation in their whole
        lives! I know that all the posters do not fall in this category, but there
        seems to be a lack of actual brawling experience...that is a good thing.

        I have been in two "fights" since starting Aikido (Since I have discussed
        these situations previously with my sensei I don't think that they will
        cause him any embarrassment).

        The first was when I was a lowly white belt and just started studying in
        Yokosuka, Japan. For those that don't know, Yokosuka houses a U.S. and
        Japanese Naval base. I am a former Marine from Chicago and at the time I was
        a civilian working for the Dept. of Defense. Most sailors had a certain
        amount of disdain for me for several reasons but mostly because I could come
        and go as I please, grow my hair any length, could halfway speak the
        language and..I was a former Marine. You could probably add quick wit and
        sharp tongue to that list as well ; )

        Anyway, of course I found myself in a situation out on the "honch" (the bar
        district directly adjacent to the base). A disagreement between me and a
        sailor escalated and we decided to take it outside. As soon as I stepped out
        of that bar and went off to the sacred battle ground to quell this peasant
        uprising, I stopped applying Aikido. We all say that Aikido is not the
        techniques themselves but what we learn from the techniques, right? I
        disregarded any other avenues of approach I may have had and settled on what
        should have only been "my last resort". That is..to fight.

        What started as a fight between me and one person quickly turned into me and
        3 angry sailors! Now, I'm only a lowly white belt right? I definitely don't
        have techniques to fall back on other than street fighting from growing up
        in Chicago and Marine Corps training. I did have one other thing going for
        me as well...kihon dosa and atemi. I had a strong enough foundation at the
        time to be able to keep moving and not have my balance taken from me.....for
        a while! By the time they got me off my feet, they where too tired to do any
        damage. They actually walked away looking the worst. However, I felt
        defeated...I lost control of the most important thing...me.

        Just when you think you have learned a lesson, right...My second
        altercation! Now I am a Ni dan! Same "Honch", same bar, similar scenario.
        This time the sailors are from a visiting tender ship (repair ship). In my
        experience these ships, along with aircraft carriers, are the worst when in
        port because they have both women and men aboard! Young, male sailors become
        very territorial.

        Me playing pool with a female sailor while her male consorts watch. They get
        jealous and start to chime in...me and my friend bait them with no real
        intention to fight, however, the situation escalates and I find myself
        taking that walk to the "sacred battleground"...again! This time is much
        different though. I offer the sailor a truce - a way out. He declines and
        takes a big 'ole round house swing at me.

        Aikido TRAINING helps out!

        The punch seems to take an eternity to get to me. When it does, I get off
        the line of attack and apply a nice, crisp, backhand atemi right on the tip
        of his nose. He looks bewildered and strikes again. I do exactly the same
        thing right down to thumping him on the nose just like we practice during
        shihonage. He bleeds and eyes water and I say to him, "look I really don't
        want to fight. I just want to drink my beer with my friend and play some
        pool. Lets go back in." He agrees and we went back in...to the amazement of
        everyone we where joking around and bought each other a round of drinks.

        Again...I feel defeated. I lost control of me for a split second and allowed
        for it to go too far. Either way, I still feel that once I stepped out to
        the"battlefield" I stopped doing Aikido and was only applying physical
        techniques or movements. These were not situations where I had to fight. I
        disregarded the principles that Aikido teaches us.

        These are the lasts fights I have been in since and I still learn from them


        Charles Burmeister
        Midwest Yoshinkai Aikido Association
        System Administrator

        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

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