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Removing toe rail.

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  • wdemeter
    I want to remove the toe rails on my Y 30. The boat has a fiberglass ceiling liner, and access to the bolts on the underside in a few spots seems almost
    Message 1 of 11 , May 13 1:44 PM
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      I want to remove the toe rails on my Y 30. The boat has a fiberglass
      ceiling liner, and access to the bolts on the underside in a few spots
      seems almost impossible without completely removing the liner. Has
      anyone else dealt with this? Did you have to bite the bullet and cut
      out the liner?
    • white_cloud36
      I am about to do this very thing. I have however tightened all hull to deck bolts. Yes, access in some places is impossible for all but small children. My
      Message 2 of 11 , May 13 2:16 PM
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        I am about to do this very thing. I have however tightened all hull
        to deck bolts. Yes, access in some places is impossible for all but
        small children. My boat is a sailor and not slip queen, so I finally
        cut out part of the liner, about 4" X 3". I'll snap a picture in the
        next day or two and send it to you if you'd like. By cutting this
        access it opens up nearly all of the really difficult Hull to deck
        joint bolts. I cut straight enough to frame the 'tabs' with teak and
        then put screw them back. Haven't done it yet, it's on the list
        though.
        You didn't say what MK you've got, but in my MKII I have to crawl into
        the sea lockers to access some and one I just gave up on because it
        was such a squeeze.
        Are you replacing the teak toe rail, going to aluminum?



        --- In yankee30@yahoogroups.com, "wdemeter" <WDemeter@...> wrote:
        >
        > I want to remove the toe rails on my Y 30. The boat has a fiberglass
        > ceiling liner, and access to the bolts on the underside in a few spots
        > seems almost impossible without completely removing the liner. Has
        > anyone else dealt with this? Did you have to bite the bullet and cut
        > out the liner?
        >
      • Thomas Hughes
        I would like to hear you plans also.  I need to replace my toerails and am thinking of going to an aluminum one.  Any previous experience out there to share?
        Message 3 of 11 , May 15 10:45 AM
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          I would like to hear you plans also.  I need to replace my toerails and am thinking of going to an aluminum one.  Any previous experience out there to share?
           
          Thanks,
          Tom Hughes
          Frolic, Hull #92

          ----- Original Message ----
          From: white_cloud36 <jbfisher@...>
          To: yankee30@yahoogroups.com
          Sent: Tuesday, May 13, 2008 2:16:31 PM
          Subject: [yankee30] Re: Removing toe rail.

          I am about to do this very thing. I have however tightened all hull
          to deck bolts. Yes, access in some places is impossible for all but
          small children. My boat is a sailor and not slip queen, so I finally
          cut out part of the liner, about 4" X 3". I'll snap a picture in the
          next day or two and send it to you if you'd like. By cutting this
          access it opens up nearly all of the really difficult Hull to deck
          joint bolts. I cut straight enough to frame the 'tabs' with teak and
          then put screw them back. Haven't done it yet, it's on the list
          though.
          You didn't say what MK you've got, but in my MKII I have to crawl into
          the sea lockers to access some and one I just gave up on because it
          was such a squeeze.
          Are you replacing the teak toe rail, going to aluminum?

          --- In yankee30@yahoogroup s.com, "wdemeter" <WDemeter@.. .> wrote:

          >
          > I want to remove the toe rails on my Y 30. The boat has a fiberglass
          > ceiling liner, and access to the bolts on the underside in a few spots
          > seems almost impossible without completely removing the liner. Has
          > anyone else dealt with this? Did you have to bite the bullet and cut
          > out the liner?
          >

        • Jerry Thompson
          I have asked the group the same question and didn t get much response. I will be replacing my teak toe rail(with topside track and cars) with an aluminum
          Message 4 of 11 , May 15 5:36 PM
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            I have asked the group the same question and didn't get much
            response. I will be replacing my teak toe rail(with topside track
            and cars) with an aluminum rail. The lack of hard points on the
            foredeck drives me nuts and as designed it is a weak link on a pretty
            good little boat.

            I plan to use Chrest Aluminum #2807. It should fit with little
            modification and comes in 30.5 foot sections. I'll be getting into
            this next month and let you know how it all went. Will take some
            extra time to dig out a little wet core and re-glass. I will try to
            bond the deck to the hull in a seamless finish using one of
            the 'flexible' polyesters. That way the only possible leak will be
            the bolts. Will know more when the old wood comes off...

            Jericho, the last Mark III has vinyl headliner and removeable
            sections of marine ply covered with vinyl that cap most of the deck
            hull joint on the inside. A nuisance to get to but not what you are
            describing.

            The big project will be getting it on in all one process as a stem to
            stern bolt up is nearly 90 bolts per side and 3M 5300 waits for no
            man.

            Anybody like to help for the learning experience let me know.

            Jerry

            Jericho, Hull # 132





            --- In yankee30@yahoogroups.com, Thomas Hughes <twhughes@...> wrote:
            >
            > I would like to hear you plans also.  I need to replace my toerails
            and am thinking of going to an aluminum one.  Any previous experience
            out there to share?
            > Thanks,
            > Tom Hughes
            > Frolic, Hull #92
            >
            >
            >
          • Dane Keehn
            Jerry, I m pretty sure you are jesting with your request... but where are you located. I d actually consider it. And, to the two or three of you who are
            Message 5 of 11 , May 16 8:11 AM
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              Jerry,
              I'm pretty sure you are jesting with your request... but where are you located.  I'd actually consider it. And, to the two or three of you who are considering replacing your toe rail, might I ask why you are doing this?
              Dane

              >>> "Jerry Thompson" <um_saudade@...> 5/15/2008 5:36 PM >>>

              I have asked the group the same question and didn't get much
              response. I will be replacing my teak toe rail(with topside track
              and cars) with an aluminum rail. The lack of hard points on the
              foredeck drives me nuts and as designed it is a weak link on a pretty
              good little boat.

              I plan to use Chrest Aluminum #2807. It should fit with little
              modification and comes in 30.5 foot sections. I'll be getting into
              this next month and let you know how it all went. Will take some
              extra time to dig out a little wet core and re-glass. I will try to
              bond the deck to the hull in a seamless finish using one of
              the 'flexible' polyesters. That way the only possible leak will be
              the bolts. Will know more when the old wood comes off...

              Jericho, the last Mark III has vinyl headliner and removeable
              sections of marine ply covered with vinyl that cap most of the deck
              hull joint on the inside. A nuisance to get to but not what you are
              describing.

              The big project will be getting it on in all one process as a stem to
              stern bolt up is nearly 90 bolts per side and 3M 5300 waits for no
              man.

              Anybody like to help for the learning experience let me know.

              Jerry

              Jericho, Hull # 132

              --- In yankee30@yahoogroup s.com, Thomas Hughes <twhughes@.. .> wrote:
              >
              > I would like to hear you plans also. I need to replace my toerails
              and am thinking of going to an aluminum one. Any previous experience
              out there to share?
              > Thanks,
              > Tom Hughes
              > Frolic, Hull #92
              >
              >
              >

            • white_cloud36
              In my case there are spots of significant rot in the toe rail. I m replacing it with aluminum toe rail from a Cascade 36 that I scored for $100. The rail
              Message 6 of 11 , May 16 8:34 AM
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                In my case there are spots of significant rot in the toe rail. I'm
                replacing it with aluminum toe rail from a Cascade 36 that I scored
                for $100. The rail will have to be modified a bit to work.

                --- In yankee30@yahoogroups.com, "Dane Keehn" <dane.keehn@...> wrote:
                >
                > Jerry,
                > I'm pretty sure you are jesting with your request... but where are
                you located. I'd actually consider it. And, to the two or three of
                you who are considering replacing your toe rail, might I ask why you
                are doing this?
                > Dane
                >
                > >>> "Jerry Thompson" <um_saudade@...> 5/15/2008 5:36 PM >>>
                >
                > I have asked the group the same question and didn't get much
                > response. I will be replacing my teak toe rail(with topside track
                > and cars) with an aluminum rail. The lack of hard points on the
                > foredeck drives me nuts and as designed it is a weak link on a pretty
                > good little boat.
                >
                > I plan to use Chrest Aluminum #2807. It should fit with little
                > modification and comes in 30.5 foot sections. I'll be getting into
                > this next month and let you know how it all went. Will take some
                > extra time to dig out a little wet core and re-glass. I will try to
                > bond the deck to the hull in a seamless finish using one of
                > the 'flexible' polyesters. That way the only possible leak will be
                > the bolts. Will know more when the old wood comes off...
                >
                > Jericho, the last Mark III has vinyl headliner and removeable
                > sections of marine ply covered with vinyl that cap most of the deck
                > hull joint on the inside. A nuisance to get to but not what you are
                > describing.
                >
                > The big project will be getting it on in all one process as a stem to
                > stern bolt up is nearly 90 bolts per side and 3M 5300 waits for no
                > man.
                >
                > Anybody like to help for the learning experience let me know.
                >
                > Jerry
                >
                > Jericho, Hull # 132
                >
                > --- In yankee30@yahoogroups.com, Thomas Hughes <twhughes@> wrote:
                > >
                > > I would like to hear you plans also. I need to replace my toerails
                > and am thinking of going to an aluminum one. Any previous experience
                > out there to share?
                > > Thanks,
                > > Tom Hughes
                > > Frolic, Hull #92
                > >
                > >
                > >
                >
              • wdemeter
                Why would we replace the rail? Mine has been sanded down by prevous owners to the point where it no longer accepts teak bung plugs. I m removing it becuase I
                Message 7 of 11 , May 16 12:39 PM
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                  Why would we replace the rail? Mine has been sanded down by prevous
                  owners to the point where it no longer accepts teak bung plugs. I'm
                  removing it becuase I need to inspect (and probably repair) the deck.
                  While I have it off, I will most likely replace it as it seems a
                  waste of time to reinstall it. By the way, I got a price from a
                  marine carpenter and he guestimated $4500 installed! --- In
                  yankee30@yahoogroups.com, "Dane Keehn" <dane.keehn@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > Jerry,
                  > I'm pretty sure you are jesting with your request... but where are
                  you located. I'd actually consider it. And, to the two or three of
                  you who are considering replacing your toe rail, might I ask why you
                  are doing this?
                  > Dane
                  >
                  > >>> "Jerry Thompson" <um_saudade@...> 5/15/2008 5:36 PM >>>
                  >
                  > I have asked the group the same question and didn't get much
                  > response. I will be replacing my teak toe rail(with topside track
                  > and cars) with an aluminum rail. The lack of hard points on the
                  > foredeck drives me nuts and as designed it is a weak link on a
                  pretty
                  > good little boat.
                  >
                  > I plan to use Chrest Aluminum #2807. It should fit with little
                  > modification and comes in 30.5 foot sections. I'll be getting into
                  > this next month and let you know how it all went. Will take some
                  > extra time to dig out a little wet core and re-glass. I will try to
                  > bond the deck to the hull in a seamless finish using one of
                  > the 'flexible' polyesters. That way the only possible leak will be
                  > the bolts. Will know more when the old wood comes off...
                  >
                  > Jericho, the last Mark III has vinyl headliner and removeable
                  > sections of marine ply covered with vinyl that cap most of the deck
                  > hull joint on the inside. A nuisance to get to but not what you are
                  > describing.
                  >
                  > The big project will be getting it on in all one process as a stem
                  to
                  > stern bolt up is nearly 90 bolts per side and 3M 5300 waits for no
                  > man.
                  >
                  > Anybody like to help for the learning experience let me know.
                  >
                  > Jerry
                  >
                  > Jericho, Hull # 132
                  >
                  > --- In yankee30@yahoogroups.com, Thomas Hughes <twhughes@> wrote:
                  > >
                  > > I would like to hear you plans also. I need to replace my
                  toerails
                  > and am thinking of going to an aluminum one. Any previous
                  experience
                  > out there to share?
                  > > Thanks,
                  > > Tom Hughes
                  > > Frolic, Hull #92
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  >
                • Dane Keehn
                  What? and you don t think that pretty piece of wood is worth $4500? :) Just joking. Thanks for the info. Dane ... Why would we replace the rail? Mine has
                  Message 8 of 11 , May 16 12:45 PM
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                    What?  and you don't think that pretty piece of wood is worth $4500?  :) Just joking.  Thanks for the info.
                    Dane
                    >>> "wdemeter" <WDemeter@...> 5/16/2008 12:39 PM >>>

                    Why would we replace the rail? Mine has been sanded down by prevous
                    owners to the point where it no longer accepts teak bung plugs. I'm
                    removing it becuase I need to inspect (and probably repair) the deck.
                    While I have it off, I will most likely replace it as it seems a
                    waste of time to reinstall it. By the way, I got a price from a
                    marine carpenter and he guestimated $4500 installed! --- In
                    yankee30@yahoogroup s.com, "Dane Keehn" <dane.keehn@ ...> wrote:

                    >
                    > Jerry,
                    > I'm pretty sure you are jesting with your request... but where are
                    you located. I'd actually consider it. And, to the two or three of
                    you who are considering replacing your toe rail, might I ask why you
                    are doing this?
                    > Dane
                    >
                    > >>> "Jerry Thompson" <um_saudade@ ...> 5/15/2008 5:36 PM >>>
                    >
                    > I have asked the group the same question and didn't get much
                    > response. I will be replacing my teak toe rail(with topside track
                    > and cars) with an aluminum rail. The lack of hard points on the
                    > foredeck drives me nuts and as designed it is a weak link on a
                    pretty
                    > good little boat.
                    >
                    > I plan to use Chrest Aluminum #2807. It should fit with little
                    > modification and comes in 30.5 foot sections. I'll be getting into
                    > this next month and let you know how it all went. Will take some
                    > extra time to dig out a little wet core and re-glass. I will try to
                    > bond the deck to the hull in a seamless finish using one of
                    > the 'flexible' polyesters. That way the only possible leak will be
                    > the bolts. Will know more when the old wood comes off...
                    >
                    > Jericho, the last Mark III has vinyl headliner and removeable
                    > sections of marine ply covered with vinyl that cap most of the deck
                    > hull joint on the inside. A nuisance to get to but not what you are
                    > describing.
                    >
                    > The big project will be getting it on in all one process as a stem
                    to
                    > stern bolt up is nearly 90 bolts per side and 3M 5300 waits for no
                    > man.
                    >
                    > Anybody like to help for the learning experience let me know.
                    >
                    > Jerry
                    >
                    > Jericho, Hull # 132
                    >
                    > --- In yankee30@yahoogroup s.com, Thomas Hughes <twhughes@> wrote:
                    > >
                    > > I would like to hear you plans also. I need to replace my
                    toerails
                    > and am thinking of going to an aluminum one. Any previous
                    experience
                    > out there to share?
                    > > Thanks,
                    > > Tom Hughes
                    > > Frolic, Hull #92
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    >

                  • Jerry Thompson
                    Just got back from a few days working on Jericho, my Yankee 30 Mark III. After looking at the toe rail issue again I am not now totally convinced the aluminum
                    Message 9 of 11 , May 22 6:35 PM
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                      Just got back from a few days working on Jericho, my Yankee 30 Mark
                      III. After looking at the toe rail issue again I am not now totally
                      convinced the aluminum rail is the way to go. Better yes, easier no -
                      not by a long shot.

                      I will get into the old stuff next month and wait until I have the
                      other issues addressed before I do the final measuring and decide
                      then. Right now, I am leaning to a heavier version of the teak,
                      heavier so that I can run 1 inch t-track the length of the rail.
                      Jericho now runs as a cutter and the running rigging can get pretty
                      busy so I like the idea of t-track from stem to stern and about 5
                      cars on each side.

                      Rough cut teak is available in San Diego for about $40 a board foot
                      so the lumber cost will be over a thousand dollars. I will do all
                      the work myself so there will be no labor. I am not so sure the
                      $4500 figure is very far from the mark. Sounds resonable to me when
                      you consider the labor and the job done right.

                      As to the question of why replace it? The longer you wait the bigger
                      the mess you will clean up. I would guess that if you haven't yet
                      done it, it needs it. Jericho may be worse because of the t-track on
                      top of the skinny teak rail and that stressed it even more.

                      I also have lots of stress cracks on the coamings around the
                      winches. Not enough glass reinforcment in and under the coamings.
                      Not too expensive to repair but again, lots of labor. I plan to add
                      cleats and reposition the rear winches. I wouldn't call winch
                      positioning on the y-30 a weak link but it is one of the most
                      unfriendly set-ups I have seen for a boat that was supposed to race.

                      Jerry


                      --- In yankee30@yahoogroups.com, "Dane Keehn" <dane.keehn@...> wrote:
                      >
                      > What? and you don't think that pretty piece of wood is worth
                      $4500? :) Just joking. Thanks for the info.
                      > Dane
                      > >>> "wdemeter" <WDemeter@...> 5/16/2008 12:39 PM >>>
                      >
                      >
                    • Trent Hightower
                      Have you considered Ipe wood? It s a Brazilian hardwood commonly used as decking material. It s very much like teak. A friend of mine just rebuilt the
                      Message 10 of 11 , May 22 8:01 PM
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                        Have you considered Ipe wood?  It's a Brazilian hardwood commonly used as decking material.  It's very much like teak.  A friend of mine just rebuilt the toerail on his Southern Cross 28 with Ipe and it looks beautiful.  99% of folks walking the marina can't tell it's not teak.  From what I've heard it has very much the same characteristics of teak but is a whole lot cheaper.  Might be worth a bit of research.




                        ----- Original Message ----
                        From: Jerry Thompson <um_saudade@...>
                        To: yankee30@yahoogroups.com
                        Sent: Thursday, May 22, 2008 6:35:37 PM
                        Subject: [yankee30] Re: Removing toe rail.

                        Just got back from a few days working on Jericho, my Yankee 30 Mark
                        III. After looking at the toe rail issue again I am not now totally
                        convinced the aluminum rail is the way to go. Better yes, easier no -
                        not by a long shot.

                        I will get into the old stuff next month and wait until I have the
                        other issues addressed before I do the final measuring and decide
                        then. Right now, I am leaning to a heavier version of the teak,
                        heavier so that I can run 1 inch t-track the length of the rail.
                        Jericho now runs as a cutter and the running rigging can get pretty
                        busy so I like the idea of t-track from stem to stern and about 5
                        cars on each side.

                        Rough cut teak is available in San Diego for about $40 a board foot
                        so the lumber cost will be over a thousand dollars. I will do all
                        the work myself so there will be no labor. I am not so sure the
                        $4500 figure is very far from the mark. Sounds resonable to me when
                        you consider the labor and the job done right.

                        As to the question of why replace it? The longer you wait the bigger
                        the mess you will clean up. I would guess that if you haven't yet
                        done it, it needs it. Jericho may be worse because of the t-track on
                        top of the skinny teak rail and that stressed it even more.

                        I also have lots of stress cracks on the coamings around the
                        winches. Not enough glass reinforcment in and under the coamings.
                        Not too expensive to repair but again, lots of labor. I plan to add
                        cleats and reposition the rear winches. I wouldn't call winch
                        positioning on the y-30 a weak link but it is one of the most
                        unfriendly set-ups I have seen for a boat that was supposed to race.

                        Jerry

                        --- In yankee30@yahoogroup s.com, "Dane Keehn" <dane.keehn@ ...> wrote:
                        >
                        > What? and you don't think that pretty piece of wood is worth
                        $4500? :) Just joking. Thanks for the info.
                        > Dane
                        > >>> "wdemeter" <WDemeter@.. .> 5/16/2008 12:39 PM >>>
                        >
                        >


                      • Jerry Thompson
                        I recieved an off-group e-mail from Andy on Avocet but Yahoo mail would not accept the sender s address as valid when I attempted a reply. So, Andy, I
                        Message 11 of 11 , Jun 6, 2008
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                          I recieved an off-group e-mail from Andy on Avocet but Yahoo mail would
                          not accept the sender's address as valid when I attempted a reply. So,
                          Andy, I recieved you message and appreciate the info. I will continue
                          to post progress on the toe-rail project here on the site.

                          Jerry
                        Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.