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Re: [xml-doc] Re: Lack of XML authoring tools?

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  • ed nixon
    ... Please search the docbook list archives for two or three very useful posts -- from Mike (if memory serves) and, particularly, from Bob Stayton. In sum, I
    Message 1 of 34 , Sep 1, 2002
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      Mike Stivers wrote:
      >>-----Original Message-----
      >><snip/>
      > I'd welcome a discussion about using Frame 7 to do XML (e.g., DocBook)
      > authoring. Any
      > comments, suggestions for getting started, etc. would be most appreciated.

      Please search the docbook list archives for two or three very useful
      posts -- from Mike (if memory serves) and, particularly, from Bob
      Stayton. In sum, I think the conclusion was that the potential is there
      for very thorough Docbook functionality but the customization provided
      out of the box by Adobe is incomplete and problematic.

      There may be one or two more fundamental issues of functionality that I
      don't recall off the top of my head.

      ...edN
    • Stan Devitt
      I was somehow expecting an example that showed that a specific presentation was important. (probably my error ...) Instead, the two run-on paragraphs in the
      Message 34 of 34 , Sep 5, 2002
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        I was somehow expecting an example that showed that a
        specific presentation was important. (probably my error ...)
        Instead, the two run-on paragraphs in the attached message
        simply make it clear that without the meta structure, crucial
        information has been lost. This should not be a surprise.

        Do not confuse a requirement for meta-structure
        with a requirement that it be provided in a particular
        form or notation.

        Traditionally, the structure has been provided implicitly
        through use of stylistic conventions in their presentation.
        and later deduced by readers (machine and human) through
        heuristics (essentially error prone reverse engineering.)
        Often it is never formalized but it is always there.
        These days we tend to ask the authors to be explicit
        so as to avoid this.

        Rather than viewing this as separation of content from
        presentation, we should be recognizing that
        identifying the meta-structure (whether
        it be explicitly or implicitly provided by the author)
        is an essential step to the meaniningful re-use
        (or alternative-display) of some or all of the content.

        Even the tools, notations, and mechanisms we use to
        do this are not fixed in stone, but good choices
        greatly facilitate the process. (It's hard to talk
        about a structure if there is no language to describe it...)

        Stan Devitt
        ----- Original Message -----
        From: "Mike Sangrey" <msangrey@...>
        To: <xml-doc@yahoogroups.com>
        Sent: Wednesday, September 04, 2002 4:25 PM
        Subject: Re: [xml-doc] Separation of content and presentation


        <deletions/>
        > Anyway, the first paragraph is from Diane Blakemore, "Understanding
        > Utterances". The second, a better example, I think, is from Dooley and
        > Levinsohn, "Analyzing Discourse: A manual of Basic Concepts". I'm not
        > sure how Diane "built" her paragraph, but I'll hold off sharing how
        > Dooley and Levinsohn did theirs until AFTER you read it.
        >
        > Think about what goes on inside your head as you read them.
        >
        > John was late. The eight o'clock news was virtually over. The
        > situation in the Gulf had not changed. The threat of war had an
        > enormous effect on petrol prices. Susan could no longer afford to
        > drive to work. At least all that walking was making her fit. She
        > would now be able to go on the expedition to the Swiss Alps. It was
        > being organized by the university. The university cannot afford to
        > run many trips of this kind. The education cuts have necessitated a
        > big cut in spending. The Arts Faculty has no money for new computer
        > this year.
        >
        > And now the second (perhaps you should take a breath to get you head
        > back together):
        >
        > The baying of the hounds and the screaming of the chickens echoed
        > below me, as i quickly scanned the tracks leading towards the
        > hole--this was going to be a hectic breakfast. I thought I'd better
        > eat a full meal because of the task ahead and the difficulties I
        > might encounter. But it was only when I had cooked myself a steak,
        > and that piece of shark meat that had been ignored by everyone, that
        > I discovered that I could only pick at these tidbits, having, as I
        > now recalled, breakfasted, lunched and dined to repletion already.
        > Rather than throw the food away, I rang up my husband at work and
        > asked him to bring home some colleagues to dine with us.
        >
        > Make sense? What did you try to do as you read them?

        <deletions/>
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