Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.

Any thoughts on how I should respond to Wired?

Expand Messages
  • Andy Carvin
    Hi everyone, I m in a bit of a quandary. Late last week, there was a flurry of activity on the social network site I set up, Stop Cyberbullying
    Message 1 of 26 , Aug 29, 2007
    • 0 Attachment
      Hi everyone,

      I'm in a bit of a quandary. Late last week, there was
      a flurry of activity on the social network site I set
      up, Stop Cyberbullying
      (http://stopcyberbullying.ning.com), which I created
      to give teachers a place to share best practices on
      bullying education. In a matter of hours we were
      flooded with a number of new users who were
      vandalizing the community in extremely obnoxious ways.


      The reason for the vandalism? Well, it turns out the
      latest issue of Wired Magazine decided to name the
      Stop Cyberbullying community as "one of the six lamest
      social networks" on the Internet.

      http://www.wired.com/techbiz/people/magazine/15-09/st_socialnetworks

      Here's what they had to say about us:

      Stop Cyberbullying (stopcyberbullying.ning.com)
      What it is: A safe place for frank discussions on the
      topic of Internet bullying
      Who you'll meet: Pussies
      What's annoying: Dare to call them pussies, and
      they'll gang up on you mercilessly.

      Now I know this was intended as a joke, but the
      consequences have been very serious. We had no choice
      but to lock down the community, making it private and
      invite-only, and work with the site host, ning.com, to
      expel all the vandals. So needless to say, I'm pretty
      annoyed, but I don't want to make the situation worse.
      My gut is telling me to call them out and write an
      open letter to Wired on my blog, telling them that
      they're a part of the problem - eg, "Wired mocks
      educators for combating cyberbullying" - but I fear
      that doing so will lead to more vandals and bullies
      attacking the site, and Wired basically saying "we
      told you so."

      Any thoughts on what should I do?

      thanks,
      andy


      ------------------------
      Andy Carvin
      andycarvin at yahoo com
      www.andycarvin.com
      www.pbs.org/learningnow
      ------------------------
    • Patsy Wang-Iverson
      Dear Andy, Who wrote the piece in Wired? How about starting a private conversation with that individual to understand the rationale for what was written? Patsy
      Message 2 of 26 , Aug 29, 2007
      • 0 Attachment
        Dear Andy,

        Who wrote the piece in Wired? How about starting a private conversation with
        that individual to understand the rationale for what was written?

        Patsy

        On 8/29/07, Andy Carvin <andycarvin@...> wrote:
        >
        > Hi everyone,
        >
        > I'm in a bit of a quandary. Late last week, there was
        > a flurry of activity on the social network site I set
        > up, Stop Cyberbullying
        > (http://stopcyberbullying.ning.com), which I created
        > to give teachers a place to share best practices on
        > bullying education. In a matter of hours we were
        > flooded with a number of new users who were
        > vandalizing the community in extremely obnoxious ways.
        >
        > The reason for the vandalism? Well, it turns out the
        > latest issue of Wired Magazine decided to name the
        > Stop Cyberbullying community as "one of the six lamest
        > social networks" on the Internet.
        >
        > http://www.wired.com/techbiz/people/magazine/15-09/st_socialnetworks
        >
        > Here's what they had to say about us:
        >
        > Stop Cyberbullying (stopcyberbullying.ning.com)
        > What it is: A safe place for frank discussions on the
        > topic of Internet bullying
        > Who you'll meet: Pussies
        > What's annoying: Dare to call them pussies, and
        > they'll gang up on you mercilessly.
        >
        > Now I know this was intended as a joke, but the
        > consequences have been very serious. We had no choice
        > but to lock down the community, making it private and
        > invite-only, and work with the site host, ning.com, to
        > expel all the vandals. So needless to say, I'm pretty
        > annoyed, but I don't want to make the situation worse.
        > My gut is telling me to call them out and write an
        > open letter to Wired on my blog, telling them that
        > they're a part of the problem - eg, "Wired mocks
        > educators for combating cyberbullying" - but I fear
        > that doing so will lead to more vandals and bullies
        > attacking the site, and Wired basically saying "we
        > told you so."
        >
        > Any thoughts on what should I do?
        >
        > thanks,
        > andy
        >
        > ------------------------
        > Andy Carvin
        > andycarvin at yahoo com
        > www.andycarvin.com
        > www.pbs.org/learningnow
        > ------------------------
        > Messages in this topic
        > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/wwwedu/message/9836;_ylc=X3oDMTM0bmVjZTJhBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzQxMTM1MjgEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDgyMTc4BG1zZ0lkAzk4MzYEc2VjA2Z0cgRzbGsDdnRwYwRzdGltZQMxMTg4NDE3NzIzBHRwY0lkAzk4MzY->(
        > 1) Reply (via web post)
        > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/wwwedu/post;_ylc=X3oDMTJwMmU0c3ZzBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzQxMTM1MjgEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDgyMTc4BG1zZ0lkAzk4MzYEc2VjA2Z0cgRzbGsDcnBseQRzdGltZQMxMTg4NDE3NzIz?act=reply&messageNum=9836>| Start
        > a new topic
        > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/wwwedu/post;_ylc=X3oDMTJlcTZxdDBlBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzQxMTM1MjgEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDgyMTc4BHNlYwNmdHIEc2xrA250cGMEc3RpbWUDMTE4ODQxNzcyMw-->
        > Messages<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/wwwedu/messages;_ylc=X3oDMTJlMjlmNWM2BF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzQxMTM1MjgEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDgyMTc4BHNlYwNmdHIEc2xrA21zZ3MEc3RpbWUDMTE4ODQxNzcyMw-->|
        > Members<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/wwwedu/members;_ylc=X3oDMTJlbXRwMTkyBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzQxMTM1MjgEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDgyMTc4BHNlYwNmdHIEc2xrA21icnMEc3RpbWUDMTE4ODQxNzcyMw-->
        > WWWEDU, The Web and Education Discussion Group
        > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/wwwedu
        > http://www.edwebproject.org/wwwedu.html
        > [image: Yahoo! Groups]<http://groups.yahoo.com/;_ylc=X3oDMTJkcGIydms3BF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzQxMTM1MjgEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDgyMTc4BHNlYwNmdHIEc2xrA2dmcARzdGltZQMxMTg4NDE3NzIz>
        > Change settings via the Web<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/wwwedu/join;_ylc=X3oDMTJmaHFiZHJjBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzQxMTM1MjgEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDgyMTc4BHNlYwNmdHIEc2xrA3N0bmdzBHN0aW1lAzExODg0MTc3MjM->(Yahoo! ID required)
        > Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest<wwwedu-digest@yahoogroups.com?subject=Email+Delivery:+Digest>| Switch
        > format to Traditional<wwwedu-traditional@yahoogroups.com?subject=Change+Delivery+Format:+Traditional>
        > Visit Your Group
        > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/wwwedu;_ylc=X3oDMTJkbGNjMmg2BF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzQxMTM1MjgEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDgyMTc4BHNlYwNmdHIEc2xrA2hwZgRzdGltZQMxMTg4NDE3NzIz>| Yahoo!
        > Groups Terms of Use <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> | Unsubscribe
        > <wwwedu-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=>
        > Recent Activity
        >
        > - 4
        > New Members<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/wwwedu/members;_ylc=X3oDMTJmazhhMGthBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzQxMTM1MjgEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDgyMTc4BHNlYwN2dGwEc2xrA3ZtYnJzBHN0aW1lAzExODg0MTc3MjM->
        >
        > Visit Your Group
        > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/wwwedu;_ylc=X3oDMTJlYTJuNjM3BF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzQxMTM1MjgEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDgyMTc4BHNlYwN2dGwEc2xrA3ZnaHAEc3RpbWUDMTE4ODQxNzcyMw-->
        > Search Ads
        >
        > Get new customers.<http://us.ard.yahoo.com/SIG=12jre3avj/M=493064.10729656.11333347.8674578/D=groups/S=1705082178:NC/Y=YAHOO/EXP=1188424923/A=3848641/R=0/SIG=1312g85fq/*http://searchmarketing.yahoo.com/arp/srchv2.php?o=US2003&cmp=Yahoo&ctv=Groups2&s=Y&s2=&s3=&b=50>
        >
        > List your web site
        >
        > in Yahoo! Search.
        > Yahoo! Groups
        >
        > Moderator Central<http://us.ard.yahoo.com/SIG=12j75tge3/M=493064.10729651.11333342.8674578/D=groups/S=1705082178:NC/Y=YAHOO/EXP=1188424923/A=4617365/R=0/SIG=115gt68pf/*http://moderators.groups.yahoo.com/>
        >
        > Connecting a world
        >
        > of moderators
        > Yahoo! Groups
        >
        > Beauty & Fashion<http://us.ard.yahoo.com/SIG=12jmla58c/M=493064.11135489.11710475.8674578/D=groups/S=1705082178:NC/Y=YAHOO/EXP=1188424923/A=4776343/R=0/SIG=11neles1v/*http://advision.webevents.yahoo.com/beautyandfashion/>
        >
        > Connect & share
        >
        > tips and advice.
        > .
        >
        >
        **********************************************
        Patsy Wang-Iverson
        cell: 609.532.0292
        net: pwangiverson@...


        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • Bob Hirshon
        Hi: First off, definitely write a guilt-inducing letter to the editor. They re good about printing those. If you can strike the right tone (sarcastic, with a
        Message 3 of 26 , Aug 29, 2007
        • 0 Attachment
          Hi:

          First off, definitely write a guilt-inducing letter to the editor.
          They're good about printing those. If you can strike the right tone
          (sarcastic, with a little humor, but some serious-as-a-heart-attack
          statistics on the effects of bullying) you will win points.

          But, of course, it won't appear for months, and many of the original
          people who saw the original story won't see your letter. You could put
          your response, and a don't you have something better to do than
          vandalize my site? note on your site, and also post your response on
          your blog.

          Again I think the key is to get the tone right, and not sound too
          scolding or whiney about it. That would be a real red flag to them, and
          just bring on more vandalism.

          Bob Hirshon
          AAAS

          >>>andycarvin@... 08/29 3:04 pm >>>
          Hi everyone,

          I'm in a bit of a quandary. Late last week, there was
          a flurry of activity on the social network site I set
          up, Stop Cyberbullying
          (http://stopcyberbullying.ning.com), which I created
          to give teachers a place to share best practices on
          bullying education. In a matter of hours we were
          flooded with a number of new users who were
          vandalizing the community in extremely obnoxious ways.


          The reason for the vandalism? Well, it turns out the
          latest issue of Wired Magazine decided to name the
          Stop Cyberbullying community as one of the six lamest
          social networks on the Internet.

          http://www.wired.com/techbiz/people/magazine/15-09/st_socialnetworks

          Here's what they had to say about us:

          Stop Cyberbullying (stopcyberbullying.ning.com)
          What it is: A safe place for frank discussions on the
          topic of Internet bullying
          Who you'll meet: Pussies
          What's annoying: Dare to call them pussies, and
          they'll gang up on you mercilessly.

          Now I know this was intended as a joke, but the
          consequences have been very serious. We had no choice
          but to lock down the community, making it private and
          invite-only, and work with the site host, ning.com, to
          expel all the vandals. So needless to say, I'm pretty
          annoyed, but I don't want to make the situation worse.
          My gut is telling me to call them out and write an
          open letter to Wired on my blog, telling them that
          they're a part of the problem - eg, Wired mocks
          educators for combating cyberbullying - but I fear
          that doing so will lead to more vandals and bullies
          attacking the site, and Wired basically saying we
          told you so.

          Any thoughts on what should I do?

          thanks,
          andy


          ------------------------
          Andy Carvin
          andycarvin at yahoo com
          www.andycarvin.com
          www.pbs.org/learningnow
          ------------------------


          WWWEDU, The Web and Education Discussion Group
          http://groups.yahoo.com/group/wwwedu
          http://www.edwebproject.org/wwwedu.html

          Yahoo! Groups Links

          <>To visit your group on the web, go to:
          http://groups.yahoo.com/group/wwwedu/

          <>Your email settings:
          Individual Email | Traditional

          <>To change settings online go to:
          http://groups.yahoo.com/group/wwwedu/join
          (Yahoo! ID required)

          <>To change settings via email:
          mailto:wwwedu-digest@yahoogroups.com
          mailto:wwwedu-fullfeatured@yahoogroups.com

          <>To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
          wwwedu-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

          <>Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
          http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/




          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • Carla Beard
          Andy, Educators are often accused of having no sense of humor. But you do -- you understood right away what Wired was up to. It was Wired s readership,
          Message 4 of 26 , Aug 29, 2007
          • 0 Attachment
            Andy,



            Educators are often accused of having no sense of humor. But you do -- you
            understood right away what Wired was up to. It was Wired's readership,
            supposedly a sophisticated group, that didn't get the intended humor.



            If you "call them out," you live up to the educator stereotype and put
            yourself on the same level as the vandals. What is needed - and I'm not
            quite sure how to do it - is to point out how much you appreciate Wired's
            attempt at humor, comment on the seriousness of the problem in general
            terms, and find a way to laugh at those who didn't get it, couching the
            consequences in the most humorous manner possible, perhaps by publishing
            some of the more moronic offerings, presenting the material in such a way
            that the point becomes obvious: it's not funny.



            Easier said than done, I know. Any creative people out there?



            Carla

            (whose creativity quotient is low at the moment)



            _____

            From: wwwedu@yahoogroups.com [mailto:wwwedu@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
            Andy Carvin
            Sent: Wednesday, August 29, 2007 3:04 PM
            To: WWWEDU List
            Subject: [WWWEDU] Any thoughts on how I should respond to Wired?



            Hi everyone,

            I'm in a bit of a quandary. Late last week, there was
            a flurry of activity on the social network site I set
            up, Stop Cyberbullying
            (http://stopcyberbul <http://stopcyberbullying.ning.com> lying.ning.com),
            which I created
            to give teachers a place to share best practices on
            bullying education. In a matter of hours we were
            flooded with a number of new users who were
            vandalizing the community in extremely obnoxious ways.

            The reason for the vandalism? Well, it turns out the
            latest issue of Wired Magazine decided to name the
            Stop Cyberbullying community as "one of the six lamest
            social networks" on the Internet.

            http://www.wired.
            <http://www.wired.com/techbiz/people/magazine/15-09/st_socialnetworks>
            com/techbiz/people/magazine/15-09/st_socialnetworks

            Here's what they had to say about us:

            Stop Cyberbullying (stopcyberbullying.ning.com)
            What it is: A safe place for frank discussions on the
            topic of Internet bullying
            Who you'll meet: Pussies
            What's annoying: Dare to call them pussies, and
            they'll gang up on you mercilessly.

            Now I know this was intended as a joke, but the
            consequences have been very serious. We had no choice
            but to lock down the community, making it private and
            invite-only, and work with the site host, ning.com, to
            expel all the vandals. So needless to say, I'm pretty
            annoyed, but I don't want to make the situation worse.
            My gut is telling me to call them out and write an
            open letter to Wired on my blog, telling them that
            they're a part of the problem - eg, "Wired mocks
            educators for combating cyberbullying" - but I fear
            that doing so will lead to more vandals and bullies
            attacking the site, and Wired basically saying "we
            told you so."

            Any thoughts on what should I do?

            thanks,
            andy

            ------------------------
            Andy Carvin
            andycarvin at yahoo com
            www.andycarvin.com
            www.pbs.org/learningnow
            ------------------------





            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • Nancy Willard
            Hmm. Heaven forbid you challenge the philosophy that people ought to have the right to post anything they want online ­ regardless of the harm caused to
            Message 5 of 26 , Aug 29, 2007
            • 0 Attachment
              Hmm. Heaven forbid you challenge the philosophy that people ought to have
              the right to post anything they want online ­ regardless of the harm caused
              to another.

              Not sure who is worse ­ Wired or the ACLU.

              This year, in Oregon and Washington, the state ACLUs told the state
              legislators that the courts have ruled that school officials have no
              authority to impose formal discipline on a student for any material posted
              off-campus. The actual court rulings have uniformly been that school
              officials can only respond if the off-campus speech has caused or threatens
              to cause a substantial disruption or interference with the rights of
              students to be secure. In the cases cited by the ACLU, the decisions went
              against the school official because the principal imposed discipline when
              the standard had not been met.

              Maybe I ought to add school administrators to the list ­ because their
              organizations went along with the ACLU because they did not want
              administrators to have to face the possibility of litigation and would
              rather simply tell parents there is nothing they can do.

              Hmm, maybe EFF ought to also be added. In their legal guide for student
              bloggers, they recommend that if students want to diss a teacher or student,
              they should do so anonymously ­ and they then link to instructions on how to
              achieve anonymity (which students are actually very bad at doing).

              In my guide for students for cyberbullying, which your ning group was ­ I
              recommend that the first two steps are to either calmly tell the bullies to
              stop or to simply ignore/block the communications. The problem with trying
              to engage in teachable moments with some folks is that they are simply not
              ³teachable.²

              Maybe a long talk with the folks at Wired to determine whether this magazine
              wants to be part of the problem or part of the solution.

              Nancy

              >
              > Hi everyone,
              >
              > I'm in a bit of a quandary. Late last week, there was
              > a flurry of activity on the social network site I set
              > up, Stop Cyberbullying
              > (http://stopcyberbullying.ning.com), which I created
              > to give teachers a place to share best practices on
              > bullying education. In a matter of hours we were
              > flooded with a number of new users who were
              > vandalizing the community in extremely obnoxious ways.
              >
              > The reason for the vandalism? Well, it turns out the
              > latest issue of Wired Magazine decided to name the
              > Stop Cyberbullying community as "one of the six lamest
              > social networks" on the Internet.
              >
              > http://www.wired.com/techbiz/people/magazine/15-09/st_socialnetworks
              >
              > Here's what they had to say about us:
              >
              > Stop Cyberbullying (stopcyberbullying.ning.com)
              > What it is: A safe place for frank discussions on the
              > topic of Internet bullying
              > Who you'll meet: Pussies
              > What's annoying: Dare to call them pussies, and
              > they'll gang up on you mercilessly.
              >
              > Now I know this was intended as a joke, but the
              > consequences have been very serious. We had no choice
              > but to lock down the community, making it private and
              > invite-only, and work with the site host, ning.com, to
              > expel all the vandals. So needless to say, I'm pretty
              > annoyed, but I don't want to make the situation worse.
              > My gut is telling me to call them out and write an
              > open letter to Wired on my blog, telling them that
              > they're a part of the problem - eg, "Wired mocks
              > educators for combating cyberbullying" - but I fear
              > that doing so will lead to more vandals and bullies
              > attacking the site, and Wired basically saying "we
              > told you so."
              >
              > Any thoughts on what should I do?
              >
              > thanks,
              > andy
              >
              > ------------------------
              > Andy Carvin
              > andycarvin at yahoo com
              > www.andycarvin.com
              > www.pbs.org/learningnow
              > ------------------------
              >


              --
              Nancy Willard, M.S., J.D.
              Center for Safe and Responsible Internet Use
              http://csriu.org
              http://cyberbully.org
              http://cyber-safe-kids.com
              nwillard@...

              Cyberbullying and Cyberthreats: Responding to the Challenge of Online Social
              Aggression, Threats, and Distress (Research Press)

              Cyber-Safe Kids, Cyber-Savvy Teens: Helping Young People Learn to Use the
              Internet Safely and Responsibly (Jossey-Bass)




              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • Gloria Bobbie
              Hi Andy, I hope you and yours are well. I haven t chatted with you since the last NECC conference, but I value the work that you do and believe that it is
              Message 6 of 26 , Aug 29, 2007
              • 0 Attachment
                Hi Andy,

                I hope you and yours are well. I haven't chatted with you since the last
                NECC conference, but I value the work that you do and believe that it is
                making a difference. The eGov4All meetings and conference made a number
                leaders take note.



                Re: this issue. As an educator who deals with touchy things such as this I
                have found that the best way to handle them is in a strictly professional
                manner. I find that responding with retaliatory comments, etc., usually
                only flames the issue.



                I would respond with:



                "I'm sorry that you find this issue "lame", but it is a very real and
                serious issue that has caused the deaths of a number of young people. I
                hope that none of your readers ever has to deal with a child being bullied
                in this way because it is at least an attack on the self esteem of the child
                and it is emotionally devastating. At worst it can lead to the death of a
                child through suicide or murder. The issue is so serious that not only have
                we, but others such as Unicel
                (http://www.unicel.com/standup/index.html?gclid=CNmwp4rHm44CFRO-hgodCCNLSw),
                the province of Ontario
                (http://www.cbc.ca/canada/ottawa/story/2007/04/17/safeschools.html),
                counseling centers such as that at UKans
                (http://www.hqcc.lawrence.ks.us/parents/safety/internet_safety_facts.html
                and CBS
                http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2005/03/21/earlyshow/living/caught/main681867
                .shtml) to name just a few found it important enough to address. I would
                hope that a respected organization such as yourself would join us in
                recognizing the dangers of cyberbullying and join those who wish to inform
                and/or defeat this practice. I invite you to do so. Thank you for bringing
                attention to this egregious act."



                Gloria Bobbie



                _____

                From: wwwedu@yahoogroups.com [mailto:wwwedu@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
                Andy Carvin
                Sent: Wednesday, August 29, 2007 3:04 PM
                To: WWWEDU List
                Subject: [WWWEDU] Any thoughts on how I should respond to Wired?



                Hi everyone,

                I'm in a bit of a quandary. Late last week, there was
                a flurry of activity on the social network site I set
                up, Stop Cyberbullying
                (http://stopcyberbul <http://stopcyberbullying.ning.com> lying.ning.com),
                which I created
                to give teachers a place to share best practices on
                bullying education. In a matter of hours we were
                flooded with a number of new users who were
                vandalizing the community in extremely obnoxious ways.

                The reason for the vandalism? Well, it turns out the
                latest issue of Wired Magazine decided to name the
                Stop Cyberbullying community as "one of the six lamest
                social networks" on the Internet.

                http://www.wired.
                <http://www.wired.com/techbiz/people/magazine/15-09/st_socialnetworks>
                com/techbiz/people/magazine/15-09/st_socialnetworks

                Here's what they had to say about us:

                Stop Cyberbullying (stopcyberbullying.ning.com)
                What it is: A safe place for frank discussions on the
                topic of Internet bullying
                Who you'll meet: Pussies
                What's annoying: Dare to call them pussies, and
                they'll gang up on you mercilessly.

                Now I know this was intended as a joke, but the
                consequences have been very serious. We had no choice
                but to lock down the community, making it private and
                invite-only, and work with the site host, ning.com, to
                expel all the vandals. So needless to say, I'm pretty
                annoyed, but I don't want to make the situation worse.
                My gut is telling me to call them out and write an
                open letter to Wired on my blog, telling them that
                they're a part of the problem - eg, "Wired mocks
                educators for combating cyberbullying" - but I fear
                that doing so will lead to more vandals and bullies
                attacking the site, and Wired basically saying "we
                told you so."

                Any thoughts on what should I do?

                thanks,
                andy

                ------------------------
                Andy Carvin
                andycarvin at yahoo com
                www.andycarvin.com
                www.pbs.org/learningnow
                ------------------------





                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              • Art Wolinsky
                ... The article is sad and irresponsible, but taking it to the street will just escalate the situation. We are dealing here with an inadvertent cyberbully. I
                Message 7 of 26 , Aug 29, 2007
                • 0 Attachment
                  At 03:04 PM 8/29/2007, you wrote:

                  >Hi everyone,
                  >
                  >I'm in a bit of a quandary. Late last week, there was
                  >a flurry of activity on the social network site I set
                  >up, Stop Cyberbullying

                  The article is sad and irresponsible, but taking it to the street
                  will just escalate the situation. We are dealing here with an
                  inadvertent cyberbully. I would offer the same advice I would offer
                  an individual in this case. Don't respond publicly. Take it off
                  line. Talk to the person face to face and make them understand the
                  damage they are doing. I would try to contact Wired directly and talk
                  to them about it and ask them if they have any ideas on how they can
                  help undo the damage they have done.

                  Art

                  Art Wolinsky
                  OEO 3DWriting.com
                  Technology Director - Online Internet Institute
                  Educational Technology Director - WiredSafety.org
                  awolinsky@...
                  (609) 698-8223 (Home Office)
                  (609) 618-4433 (Cell)

                  I am perfectly capable of learning from my mistakes.
                  I will surely learn a great deal today.
                • BBracey@aol.com
                  ... People who don t teach don t understand our caution. In a meeting about the same thing yesterday a parent said to me so, the children should not cross the
                  Message 8 of 26 , Aug 29, 2007
                  • 0 Attachment
                    In a message dated 8/29/07 6:11:56 PM, nwillard@... writes:


                    >
                    > Hmm. Heaven forbid you challenge the philosophy that people ought to have
                    > the right to post anything they want online ‐ regardless of the harm caused
                    > to another.
                    >
                    > Not sure who is worse ‐ Wired or the ACLU.
                    >
                    People who don't teach don't understand our caution. In a meeting about the
                    same thing yesterday
                    a parent said to me so, the children should not cross the street because they
                    might get hit..
                    and then it was well what about the people who live in danger in the real
                    world , forget about the internet We kind of need the ACLU for when things get
                    really crazy.

                    I don't know how we create understanding in tech circles because what makes
                    them feel priviledged in their right to say pretty much what they want on the
                    Internet. It has changed the world in many ways.

                    As a child I never went to the movies that the Pope put on the black list
                    that is the list that we Catholic school girls were not supposed to see. It never
                    occured to me that , that list was what many people chose as the way to find
                    a fairly interesting movie. So I grew up naive , stupid and needing more
                    knowledge about the real world without the interference of a human deity.

                    Perhaps we want to use Internet literacy as a focus for schools , reply that
                    there are so many school boards, and that the group sanctions NSBA sanctions
                    social networking.
                    We can lean on the National Academies.. and change the subject by talking
                    about literacy, and responsibility?

                    http://www.nap.edu/catalog.php?record_id=10250

                    Cell phones . . . airbags . . . genetically modified food . . . the
                    Internet. These are all emblems of modern life. You might ask what we would do without
                    them. But an even more interesting question might be what would we do if we
                    had to actually explain how they worked?
                    The United States is riding a whirlwind of technological change. To be sure,
                    there have been periods, such as the late 1800s, when new inventions appeared
                    in society at a comparable rate. But the pace of change today, and its
                    social, economic, and other impacts, are as significant and far reaching as at any
                    other time in history. And it seems that the faster we embrace new
                    technologies, the less we re able to understand them. What is the long-term effect of this
                    galloping technological revolution? In today s new world, it is nothing less
                    than a matter of responsible citizenship to grasp the nature and implications
                    of technology.
                    Technically Speaking provides a blueprint for bringing us all up to speed on
                    the role of technology in our society, including understanding such
                    distinctions as technology versus science and technological literacy versus technical
                    competence. It clearly and decisively explains what it means to be a
                    technologically-literate citizen. The book goes on to explore the context of
                    technological literacy the social, historical, political, and educational environments.

                    This readable overview highlights specific issues of concern: the state of
                    technological studies in K-12 schools, the reach of the Internet into our homes
                    and lives, and the crucial role of technology in today s economy and
                    workforce. Three case studies of current issues car airbags, genetically modified
                    foods, and the California energy crisis illustrate why ordinary citizens need to
                    understand technology to make responsible decisions. This fascinating book from
                    the National Academy of Engineering is enjoyable to read and filled with
                    contemporary examples. It will be important to anyone interested in understanding
                    how the world around them works.
                    Just a thought.


                    **************************************
                    Get a sneak peek of
                    the all-new AOL at http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour


                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  • Taran Rampersad
                    Send them a cease and desist. ... -- Taran Rampersad Presently in: San Fernando, Trinidad and Tobago cnd@knowprose.com http://www.knowprose.com Making Your
                    Message 9 of 26 , Aug 29, 2007
                    • 0 Attachment
                      Send them a cease and desist.

                      Andy Carvin wrote:
                      >
                      > Hi everyone,
                      >
                      > I'm in a bit of a quandary. Late last week, there was
                      > a flurry of activity on the social network site I set
                      > up, Stop Cyberbullying
                      > (http://stopcyberbullying.ning.com
                      > <http://stopcyberbullying.ning.com>), which I created
                      > to give teachers a place to share best practices on
                      > bullying education. In a matter of hours we were
                      > flooded with a number of new users who were
                      > vandalizing the community in extremely obnoxious ways.
                      >
                      > The reason for the vandalism? Well, it turns out the
                      > latest issue of Wired Magazine decided to name the
                      > Stop Cyberbullying community as "one of the six lamest
                      > social networks" on the Internet.
                      >
                      > http://www.wired.com/techbiz/people/magazine/15-09/st_socialnetworks
                      > <http://www.wired.com/techbiz/people/magazine/15-09/st_socialnetworks>
                      >
                      > Here's what they had to say about us:
                      >
                      > Stop Cyberbullying (stopcyberbullying.ning.com)
                      > What it is: A safe place for frank discussions on the
                      > topic of Internet bullying
                      > Who you'll meet: Pussies
                      > What's annoying: Dare to call them pussies, and
                      > they'll gang up on you mercilessly.
                      >
                      > Now I know this was intended as a joke, but the
                      > consequences have been very serious. We had no choice
                      > but to lock down the community, making it private and
                      > invite-only, and work with the site host, ning.com, to
                      > expel all the vandals. So needless to say, I'm pretty
                      > annoyed, but I don't want to make the situation worse.
                      > My gut is telling me to call them out and write an
                      > open letter to Wired on my blog, telling them that
                      > they're a part of the problem - eg, "Wired mocks
                      > educators for combating cyberbullying" - but I fear
                      > that doing so will lead to more vandals and bullies
                      > attacking the site, and Wired basically saying "we
                      > told you so."
                      >
                      > Any thoughts on what should I do?
                      >
                      > thanks,
                      > andy
                      >
                      > ------------------------
                      > Andy Carvin
                      > andycarvin at yahoo com
                      > www.andycarvin.com
                      > www.pbs.org/learningnow
                      > ------------------------
                      >
                      >


                      --
                      Taran Rampersad
                      Presently in: San Fernando, Trinidad and Tobago
                      cnd@...
                      http://www.knowprose.com

                      'Making Your Mark in Second Life: Business, Land, and Money'
                      http://www.oreilly.com/catalog/9780596514174/

                      Pictures: http://www.flickr.com/photos/knowprose/

                      "Criticize by creating." — Michelangelo
                      "The present is theirs; the future, for which I really worked, is mine." - Nikola Tesla
                    • Mark Ahlness
                      Andy, Gotta let it go. I m more in line with Art than anybody else responding here so far. You re not going to change any minds by responding publicly in that
                      Message 10 of 26 , Aug 29, 2007
                      • 0 Attachment
                        Andy,

                        Gotta let it go. I'm more in line with Art than anybody else responding here
                        so far. You're not going to change any minds by responding publicly in that
                        forum. A short note to the editor/author is about all you can do. I wouldn't
                        spend a lot of time on it. Move on, open up the ning site again in a week or
                        two when the much ado is about nothing because they're on to something else,
                        and spend your time on things you CAN change. You have a lot of influence. I
                        wouldn't waste it on this battle. Good luck - Mark



                        Mark Ahlness

                        mahlness@...
                        http://ahlness.com
                        http://roomtwelve.com
                        http://arborheights.com





                        _____

                        From: wwwedu@yahoogroups.com [mailto:wwwedu@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
                        Andy Carvin
                        Sent: Wednesday, August 29, 2007 12:04 PM
                        To: WWWEDU List
                        Subject: [WWWEDU] Any thoughts on how I should respond to Wired?



                        Hi everyone,

                        I'm in a bit of a quandary. Late last week, there was
                        a flurry of activity on the social network site I set
                        up, Stop Cyberbullying
                        (http://stopcyberbul <http://stopcyberbullying.ning.com> lying.ning.com),
                        which I created
                        to give teachers a place to share best practices on
                        bullying education. In a matter of hours we were
                        flooded with a number of new users who were
                        vandalizing the community in extremely obnoxious ways.

                        The reason for the vandalism? Well, it turns out the
                        latest issue of Wired Magazine decided to name the
                        Stop Cyberbullying community as "one of the six lamest
                        social networks" on the Internet.

                        http://www.wired.
                        <http://www.wired.com/techbiz/people/magazine/15-09/st_socialnetworks>
                        com/techbiz/people/magazine/15-09/st_socialnetworks

                        Here's what they had to say about us:

                        Stop Cyberbullying (stopcyberbullying.ning.com)
                        What it is: A safe place for frank discussions on the
                        topic of Internet bullying
                        Who you'll meet: Pussies
                        What's annoying: Dare to call them pussies, and
                        they'll gang up on you mercilessly.

                        Now I know this was intended as a joke, but the
                        consequences have been very serious. We had no choice
                        but to lock down the community, making it private and
                        invite-only, and work with the site host, ning.com, to
                        expel all the vandals. So needless to say, I'm pretty
                        annoyed, but I don't want to make the situation worse.
                        My gut is telling me to call them out and write an
                        open letter to Wired on my blog, telling them that
                        they're a part of the problem - eg, "Wired mocks
                        educators for combating cyberbullying" - but I fear
                        that doing so will lead to more vandals and bullies
                        attacking the site, and Wired basically saying "we
                        told you so."

                        Any thoughts on what should I do?

                        thanks,
                        andy

                        ------------------------
                        Andy Carvin
                        andycarvin at yahoo com
                        www.andycarvin.com
                        www.pbs.org/learningnow
                        ------------------------





                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      • Taran Rampersad
                        I ve read the responses, and I must reiterate what I have learned in a lifetime of bullies, from elementary school to dealing with drunk Marines. Never back
                        Message 11 of 26 , Aug 29, 2007
                        • 0 Attachment
                          I've read the responses, and I must reiterate what I have learned in a
                          lifetime of bullies, from elementary school to dealing with drunk Marines.

                          Never back down. Ever. When they swing, swing back. When they hit you,
                          hit them back. When they knock you down, get back up. Never be beaten -
                          maybe wounded, but never beaten.

                          The Wired article and its effects demonstrate the very same thing that
                          your site is about. It really is. They picked the fight, they KNEW that
                          it would have an effect (don't tell me that they didn't - if they don't
                          know their readership, then they are incompetent.) They KNEW it would
                          put you in this quandary, or they are incompetent.

                          In my eyes, there can be no middle path on this.

                          People wrote of the educators not having a sense of humor. That isn't
                          true. What people think of academics is that they always kowtow to
                          bullies - the nerdy kid in the back that accumulates wedgies, the skinny
                          kid who has his lunch money taken, the slight girl who is easily
                          victimized by those more popular than her. 'Oh dear', these children
                          say, 'if I do more it will only get worse...' - and when they do
                          nothing, nothing changes.

                          If there is a signal to be sent, send it. If there is no signal, if
                          cyberbullying is only an academic discussion and nothing to be acted
                          upon... do nothing. Say nothing. Or ride the fence and backchannel it
                          and know that it will go nowhere. Or dare to backchannel it with an
                          authoritative tone, slightly reproachful, and (heaven forbid) take a
                          stance... and if that doesn't work, fight with all that you have.

                          Whatever you do, don't discuss it to death. Bullies thrive on that sort
                          of thing.

                          I do know that if you stand up against it, I'll be at your shoulder. If
                          you don't, well - it will just pass by, and various academics can write
                          about it in studies as they have done before. One works against bullies.
                          The other doesn't. Take your pick.

                          --
                          Taran Rampersad
                          Presently in: San Fernando, Trinidad and Tobago
                          cnd@...
                          http://www.knowprose.com

                          'Making Your Mark in Second Life: Business, Land, and Money'
                          http://www.oreilly.com/catalog/9780596514174/

                          Pictures: http://www.flickr.com/photos/knowprose/

                          "Criticize by creating." — Michelangelo
                          "The present is theirs; the future, for which I really worked, is mine." - Nikola Tesla
                        • Bob Hirshon
                          How s this? Dear Wired: I m one of the pussies you describe in your article on lame social networks. I try to stop cases of cyberbullying, such as (insert
                          Message 12 of 26 , Aug 30, 2007
                          • 0 Attachment
                            How's this?

                            Dear Wired:

                            I'm one of the pussies you describe in your article on lame social
                            networks. I try to stop cases of cyberbullying, such as (insert example
                            here) and (insert second example here). I can't believe you actually
                            believe these incidents are humorous or that efforts to prevent them are
                            lame.

                            Though who knows?

                            I prefer to think that a writer who didn't know or care much about the
                            problem was trying to come up with something funny on deadline.

                            If you would like to know more about the serious problem of
                            cyberbullying-- an issue that would seem to hold interest for your
                            readers-- please contact me at (contact info).

                            Sincerely,

                            Andy Carvin
                            etc.

                            P.S.- On a humorous note, your army of vigilante readers has succeeded
                            in maliciously destroying my site. Thanks.

                            Bob Hirshon
                            AAAS



                            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                          • Bob Hirshon
                            Hi, Andy: You don t need to post this to the group if you don t want, but I disagree with Mark. I think this is a blessing in disguise. Most readers of Wired,
                            Message 13 of 26 , Aug 30, 2007
                            • 0 Attachment
                              Hi, Andy:

                              You don't need to post this to the group if you don't want, but I
                              disagree with Mark. I think this is a blessing in disguise. Most readers
                              of Wired, I believe, are liberal and enlightened. I think this could
                              easily lead to, at least, a positive discussion of the problem of
                              cyberbullying with them and their readers and, at best, a feature
                              article on cyberbullying.

                              I see this as a huge opportunity to reach a large audience. You may
                              eventually want to send the article's author a thank you note.

                              Bob

                              >>>mahlness@... 08/29 9:53 pm >>>
                              Andy,

                              Gotta let it go. I'm more in line with Art than anybody else responding
                              here
                              so far. You're not going to change any minds by responding publicly in
                              that
                              forum. A short note to the editor/author is about all you can do. I
                              wouldn't
                              spend a lot of time on it. Move on, open up the ning site again in a
                              week or
                              two when the much ado is about nothing because they're on to something
                              else,
                              and spend your time on things you CAN change. You have a lot of
                              influence. I
                              wouldn't waste it on this battle. Good luck - Mark



                              Mark Ahlness

                              mahlness@...
                              http://ahlness.com
                              http://roomtwelve.com
                              http://arborheights.com





                              _____

                              From: wwwedu@yahoogroups.com [mailto:wwwedu@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
                              Of
                              Andy Carvin
                              Sent: Wednesday, August 29, 2007 12:04 PM
                              To: WWWEDU List
                              Subject: [WWWEDU] Any thoughts on how I should respond to Wired?



                              Hi everyone,

                              I'm in a bit of a quandary. Late last week, there was
                              a flurry of activity on the social network site I set
                              up, Stop Cyberbullying
                              (http://stopcyberbul <http://stopcyberbullying.ning.com>
                              lying.ning.com),
                              which I created
                              to give teachers a place to share best practices on
                              bullying education. In a matter of hours we were
                              flooded with a number of new users who were
                              vandalizing the community in extremely obnoxious ways.

                              The reason for the vandalism? Well, it turns out the
                              latest issue of Wired Magazine decided to name the
                              Stop Cyberbullying community as one of the six lamest
                              social networks on the Internet.

                              http://www.wired.
                              <http://www.wired.com/techbiz/people/magazine/15-09/st_socialnetworks>
                              com/techbiz/people/magazine/15-09/st_socialnetworks

                              Here's what they had to say about us:

                              Stop Cyberbullying (stopcyberbullying.ning.com)
                              What it is: A safe place for frank discussions on the
                              topic of Internet bullying
                              Who you'll meet: Pussies
                              What's annoying: Dare to call them pussies, and
                              they'll gang up on you mercilessly.

                              Now I know this was intended as a joke, but the
                              consequences have been very serious. We had no choice
                              but to lock down the community, making it private and
                              invite-only, and work with the site host, ning.com, to
                              expel all the vandals. So needless to say, I'm pretty
                              annoyed, but I don't want to make the situation worse.
                              My gut is telling me to call them out and write an
                              open letter to Wired on my blog, telling them that
                              they're a part of the problem - eg, Wired mocks
                              educators for combating cyberbullying - but I fear
                              that doing so will lead to more vandals and bullies
                              attacking the site, and Wired basically saying we
                              told you so.

                              Any thoughts on what should I do?

                              thanks,
                              andy

                              ------------------------
                              Andy Carvin
                              andycarvin at yahoo com
                              www.andycarvin.com
                              www.pbs.org/learningnow
                              ------------------------





                              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



                              WWWEDU, The Web and Education Discussion Group
                              http://groups.yahoo.com/group/wwwedu
                              http://www.edwebproject.org/wwwedu.html

                              Yahoo! Groups Links

                              <>To visit your group on the web, go to:
                              http://groups.yahoo.com/group/wwwedu/

                              <>Your email settings:
                              Individual Email | Traditional

                              <>To change settings online go to:
                              http://groups.yahoo.com/group/wwwedu/join
                              (Yahoo! ID required)

                              <>To change settings via email:
                              mailto:wwwedu-digest@yahoogroups.com
                              mailto:wwwedu-fullfeatured@yahoogroups.com

                              <>To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
                              wwwedu-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

                              <>Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
                              http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/




                              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                            • Art Wolinsky
                              Kids (and magazines) do and say stupid and/or cruel things Sometime they are done maliciously and other times they are done simply because they are kids being
                              Message 14 of 26 , Aug 30, 2007
                              • 0 Attachment
                                Kids (and magazines) do and say stupid and/or cruel things Sometime
                                they are done maliciously and other times they are done simply
                                because they are kids being kids. If we simply react to the outcome
                                of the action rather than investigate the cause and act
                                appropriately, we can do damage or escalate the problem. I think a
                                combination of the advice given so far is in order.

                                I still stand by my suggestion to take it off line first. If that
                                avenue reveals that we are dealing with and intentional bullying
                                incident then further steps would be in order. Whatever action you
                                take, rest assured that you have the support of this community member
                                and I suspect the entire community.

                                Art

                                Art Wolinsky
                                OEO 3DWriting.com
                                Technology Director - Online Internet Institute
                                Educational Technology Director - WiredSafety.org
                                awolinsky@...
                                (609) 698-8223 (Home Office)
                                (609) 618-4433 (Cell)

                                I am perfectly capable of learning from my mistakes.
                                I will surely learn a great deal today.
                              • BBracey@aol.com
                                ... detractors. In Washington at events, if you say you are a teacher, sometimes people turn their backs and walk away. It is that we are misrepresented.
                                Message 15 of 26 , Aug 30, 2007
                                • 0 Attachment
                                  In a message dated 8/30/07 11:00:08 AM, awolinsky@... writes:


                                  >
                                  > Kids (and magazines) do and say stupid and/or cruel things Sometime
                                  > they are done maliciously and other times they are done simply
                                  > because they are kids being kids. If we simply react to the outcome
                                  > of the action rather than investigate the cause and act
                                  > appropriately, we can do damage or escalate the problem. I think a
                                  > combination of the advice given so far is in order.
                                  >
                                  > I still stand by my suggestion to take it off line first. If that
                                  > avenue reveals that we are dealing with and intentional bullying
                                  > incident then further steps would be in order. Whatever action you
                                  > take, rest assured that you have the support of this community member
                                  > and I suspect the entire community.
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  > To be a teacher or a technology advocate is to walk a road that has many
                                  detractors. In Washington at events, if you say you are a teacher, sometimes
                                  people turn their backs and walk away. It is that we are misrepresented. Sometimes
                                  it is the fault? of history, however it was that people were treated or felt
                                  to be treated in school. You never know what the public has in mind.

                                  I think an off line discussion is in order. This is a tough time to be a
                                  teacher or a technologist and they should know that, but it is much more
                                  sensational to affix blame.

                                  We get a lot of blame that is wrong. On some of the big committees, the
                                  answer to everything wrong is K-12 teachers. They never think of why we do what we
                                  do. Or what permission we have, and the people we have to answer to.

                                  In talking about STEM on the big committees they blamed us. There were not
                                  many teachers around and so I bravely raised my hand and mentioned NCLB, and the
                                  fact that lots of states have restricted the time to teach science to about
                                  20 minutes a week... if people even honor that 20 minutes.

                                  I was at a teragrid conference where people were also wringing their hands
                                  about the lack of teachers teaching science and real problem solving math. I
                                  again inquired if they knew about NCLB and that the technology resources had not
                                  been funded and that many had been destroyed or changed into customer base.
                                  Blank stares.

                                  Well so now Digital Divide is called Broadening Participation.. same thing.
                                  Of course according to the public policy the digital divide no longer exists..
                                  Well really?

                                  So we can't get upset. We have to teach, share, and use data to prove our
                                  points.

                                  It takes a very long, very long time to establish credibility and our
                                  credibility has been savaged.

                                  Bonnie Bracey Sutton

                                  bbracey at aol com




                                  **************************************
                                  Get a sneak peek of the all-new AOL at
                                  http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour


                                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                • P G
                                  Andy, I would reiterate the advice to just keep the site closed for a week or so, and then open it up. The bad guys will have lost interest by then. My view is
                                  Message 16 of 26 , Aug 30, 2007
                                  • 0 Attachment
                                    Andy,
                                    I would reiterate the advice to just keep the site closed for a week
                                    or so, and then open it up. The bad guys will have lost interest by then.

                                    My view is that this is an opportunity to present more information
                                    about cyberbulling to the WIRED community. Write a piece that describes The
                                    law at this point. The national community including the legal community
                                    doesn't seem to get it as yet. I thank Nancy for her quotes. It seems to me
                                    that students doing irreverent things outside of school should be protected
                                    by the individual rights laws. But the "Bong Hits for Jesus" kid lost his
                                    Supreme Court battle.

                                    WIRED readers should know, also, what happens to websites that get
                                    dissed by WIRED Magazine weirdoes also.

                                    Patrick Greene
                                    FGCU

                                    _________________________________________________________________
                                    A new home for Mom, no cleanup required. All starts here.
                                    http://www.reallivemoms.com?ocid=TXT_TAGHM&loc=us
                                  • Nancy Willard
                                    I had been contacted by an independent writer who was planning to pitch a story to Wired and some other magazines about cyberbullying. I provided him with a
                                    Message 17 of 26 , Aug 30, 2007
                                    • 0 Attachment
                                      I had been contacted by an independent writer who was planning to pitch a
                                      story to Wired and some other magazines about cyberbullying. I provided him
                                      with a bunch of material. After this, I did recontact him. The last thing I
                                      wanted was for my stuff to be misused in this community. He had seen the
                                      article that slammed the network, but did not know about the consequences.
                                      He had already decided that Wired likely would not be the best audience for
                                      the story he wants to write.

                                      Given the article they published, I would be very worried about asking Wired
                                      to write anything on cyberbullying. They would probably give equal voice and
                                      credence to those who think they should have a free speech right to destroy
                                      people online. Weak kids. Too wimpy to take the heat.

                                      I was working on a law review article on this issue and then dropped this to
                                      work on a couple of other projects. It is not totally written yet. But I am
                                      quite sure that courts will support school officials in responding to
                                      off-campus online speech in if the speech has caused a substantial
                                      disruption at school ­ or a reasonable person looking at the situation would
                                      anticipate this could occur. There appear to be three kinds of situations
                                      where imposition of formal discipline would be supported.

                                      Causes or threatens:

                                      * Significant interference with instructional activities or school
                                      operations.

                                      * An environment for any student that is abusive, intimidating, threatening,
                                      or hostile and impairs that student¹s ability to participate in educational
                                      activities.

                                      * Physically or verbally violent altercations between students.

                                      Basically in these situations, there is both a school nexus and a
                                      ³substantial² disruption ­ not just people are upset about controversial
                                      political speech. What is being balanced is free speech versus student¹s
                                      rights to be safe and secure at school and not have their education
                                      inappropriately interrupted. There is a point where students ³doing
                                      irreverent things outside of school² crosses the line and it is at this
                                      point where school officials should have the right to impose formal
                                      discipline. But I also advise them that simply imposing formal discipline
                                      could make matters worse. They have to get to the root and stop the harm.
                                      And if the harmful material has not reached the point where they think they
                                      can respond, they can proceed informally.

                                      The Bong Hits 4 Jesus case was a weird decision and has no relevance to
                                      off-campus cyberbullying because the court considered this to be on-campus
                                      speech because it was an official school activity. When students are in
                                      school, school officials do have some authority to impose discipline that is
                                      lewd and profane and now if it advocates drug use ­ but only if it is not
                                      political speech (say what?) I suppose Bong 4 Hits for Chief Justice Roberts
                                      would be considered political speech.

                                      Where schools have gotten into legal trouble is when the principal has
                                      imposed excessive and damaging punishment on a student who has targeted a
                                      staff member. Reread the above. It is rare that material targeting a staff
                                      member will reach this level of disruption. And I have seen some pretty bad
                                      cases of overreaction.

                                      There was one case where the honor student created a parody of the
                                      principal. Must have been a pretty hot parody ­ because all of the students
                                      were bypassing the filter to get to MySpace to look at it. Based on what I
                                      read, it was likely very insulting ­ but not all that harmful. The school
                                      officials totally overreacted ­ expelled the student and forced him to go to
                                      an alternative school. Ridiculous! The school district won at the lower
                                      court level. The judge decided that the student who created the parody was
                                      responsible for the fact that the other students were bypassing the filter.
                                      I did not agree with this decision. In fact, I was quoted in an article
                                      published by the First Amendment Forum saying that I thought the decision
                                      was wrong.
                                      http://www.firstamendmentcenter.org/PDF/student.internet.speech.pdf The
                                      decision was overturned on appeal. This is the first case where I have seen
                                      a judge take notice that despite the fact that MySpace was blocked, students
                                      could find ways to get to it. You can find more information here and the
                                      actual case here:
                                      http://www.nsba.org/site/doc_cosa.asp?TRACKID=&CID=487&DID=41161

                                      I think there are many communities that need to be educated. I do not hold
                                      out much hope, if at all, that the Wired community would ³get it.² At this
                                      point in time, their thinking appears to be part of the problem.

                                      Nancy


                                      > Andy,
                                      > I would reiterate the advice to just keep the site closed for a week
                                      > or so, and then open it up. The bad guys will have lost interest by then.
                                      >
                                      > My view is that this is an opportunity to present more information
                                      > about cyberbulling to the WIRED community. Write a piece that describes The
                                      > law at this point. The national community including the legal community
                                      > doesn't seem to get it as yet. I thank Nancy for her quotes. It seems to me
                                      > that students doing irreverent things outside of school should be protected
                                      > by the individual rights laws. But the "Bong Hits for Jesus" kid lost his
                                      > Supreme Court battle.
                                      >
                                      > WIRED readers should know, also, what happens to websites that get
                                      > dissed by WIRED Magazine weirdoes also.
                                      >
                                      > Patrick Greene
                                      > FGCU
                                      >
                                      > __________________________________________________________
                                      > A new home for Mom, no cleanup required. All starts here.
                                      > http://www.reallivemoms.com?ocid=TXT_TAGHM&loc=us
                                      > <http://www.reallivemoms.com?ocid=TXT_TAGHM&loc=us>
                                      >
                                      >


                                      --
                                      Nancy Willard, M.S., J.D.
                                      Center for Safe and Responsible Internet Use
                                      http://csriu.org
                                      http://cyberbully.org
                                      http://cyber-safe-kids.com
                                      nwillard@...

                                      Cyberbullying and Cyberthreats: Responding to the Challenge of Online Social
                                      Aggression, Threats, and Distress (Research Press)

                                      Cyber-Safe Kids, Cyber-Savvy Teens: Helping Young People Learn to Use the
                                      Internet Safely and Responsibly (Jossey-Bass)




                                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                    • Andy Carvin
                                      Hi everyone, Thanks again for all of the thoughtful suggestions you passed along regarding how I should handle the story from Wired. I ve decided to take a
                                      Message 18 of 26 , Sep 4, 2007
                                      • 0 Attachment
                                        Hi everyone,

                                        Thanks again for all of the thoughtful suggestions you passed along
                                        regarding how I should handle the story from Wired. I've decided to
                                        take a middle-of-the-road approach, writing an open letter to the
                                        author on my PBS blog, but not firing back with snark of my own. The
                                        more I learned about the author, the more I concluded he was actually
                                        a decent guy who just made a joke without thinking about the
                                        consequences, so I approached my response from that perspective.

                                        Here's a shortcut to the letter on my blog:

                                        http://urltea.com/1e7z

                                        And for your convenience, here's the text. -andy

                                        --------------

                                        To: Mathew Honan, Wired Magazine
                                        From: Andy Carvin

                                        Dear Matthew,

                                        You don't know me, but I was hoping I could take up a few minutes of
                                        your time today. I see we've got a lot in common; we're both writers,
                                        Mac users, photographers; we've even both backpacked around Laos and
                                        written travelogues about it. You seem like the kind of guy I'd
                                        probably want to hang out with at SXSW or something, perhaps to grab a
                                        beer and swap travel stories. And that's why I feel I can be straight
                                        up with you about something you wrote recently that really hurt a lot
                                        of educators across the country.

                                        You see, in my free time I volunteer as the coordinator of an online
                                        community called Stop Cyberbullying. I founded it earlier this year as
                                        a way to give educators and parents a place where they could share
                                        strategies to deal with the issue of cyberbullying. Don't get me
                                        wrong; it's not intended as a place for primadonna bloggers with glass
                                        jaws to complain about how they're being dissed by their peers, nor is
                                        it a community for humorless schoolmarms to demand that all un-PC
                                        online behavior should be banned forthwith by Congress. Instead, it's
                                        just a group of well-meaning, concerned people who in some cases are
                                        trying to save the lives of their children or students.

                                        I'm not trying to be melodramatic and overstate the situation here, so
                                        I won't waste your time throwing out dubious statistics as to what
                                        percentage of kids get bullied via the Internet, text messaging and
                                        the like. Depending on whom you ask, it's either a widespread problem
                                        or small minority of kids. No matter how you slice it, though, the
                                        fact of the matter is that there are hundreds of thousands of kids who
                                        are harassed by their peers on a regular basis. For some of these
                                        kids, the bullying is so bad it basically paralyzes them, making them
                                        fearful of attending school, going online or turning on their phone.
                                        And for a small minority of kids, it's led to suicide attempts. Some
                                        of them have even been successful.

                                        I'm sure you had none of this in mind when you wrote a short article
                                        for the latest issue of Wired Magazine entitled Beware These Six
                                        Lamest Social Networks. As both a Star Trek fan and a cat owner, I had
                                        to laugh when you cited social networks targeting those particular
                                        demographic groups; you definitely nailed those two, and rightly so.
                                        But you also included the Stop Cyberbullying community in your list,
                                        describing it as a place populated by "pussies" who will "gang up on
                                        you mercilessly" if you call them that.

                                        Now, I know you intended this as a joke. And like I said, if this
                                        community were a place where whining bloggers or self-righteous
                                        luddites came to commiserate among themselves, I think it'd be fair
                                        game for some snark. Instead, though, you decided to go after a group
                                        of concerned educators and parents who are just trying to help out
                                        kids who are living in their own private hell. And by calling us out,
                                        it led to the unintended consequence of having countless vandals and
                                        trolls descend upon the site, for the sole purpose of - yes - bullying
                                        us. It left us with no choice but to put the community in lockdown,
                                        removing it from public view and preventing new members from joining
                                        unless they could prove they weren't there to cause harm. We now must
                                        treat every prospective member with suspicion, rather than greet them
                                        with open arms.

                                        I know what you wrote was intended to be funny - and in any other
                                        context, it would have been. But it wasn't, and it's demoralized a lot
                                        of people who are already fighting an uphill battle against a problem
                                        that all too often just isn't taken seriously. And I know writing this
                                        letter will probably cause us more problems - not from you personally,
                                        but from a small minority of people who will read this letter and use
                                        it as an excuse to harass me and my colleagues, as usually happens
                                        whenever I write about cyberbullying in a public space. That's the
                                        cost of trying to help these kids, I guess.

                                        Anyway, that's all I wanted to say. If you're ever in the DC area,
                                        drop me and note and we can find somewhere to grab a bottle or two of
                                        BeerLao and swap stories about tropical diseases and other backpacking
                                        disasters. Thanks again for taking the time to read this.

                                        Take care,
                                        Andy Carvin
                                      • Jenka Guevara
                                        Congratulations, Andy, for such a wonderful reply. (I envy your skill with the pen/computer) ********************************************* Jenka Guevara, Ph.D.
                                        Message 19 of 26 , Sep 4, 2007
                                        • 0 Attachment
                                          Congratulations, Andy, for such a wonderful reply.
                                          (I envy your skill with the pen/computer)

                                          *********************************************
                                          Jenka Guevara, Ph.D.
                                          http://www.webip.com.mx/guevaraj
                                          The American School Foundation, Mexico City
                                          http://www.asf.edu.mx

                                          ----- Original Message -----
                                          From: Andy Carvin <andycarvin@...>
                                          Date: Tuesday, September 4, 2007 8:57 am
                                          Subject: [WWWEDU] Re: Any thoughts on how I should respond to Wired?

                                          > Hi everyone,
                                          >
                                          > Thanks again for all of the thoughtful suggestions you passed along
                                          > regarding how I should handle the story from Wired. I've decided to
                                          > take a middle-of-the-road approach, writing an open letter to the
                                          > author on my PBS blog, but not firing back with snark of my own. The
                                          > more I learned about the author, the more I concluded he was actually
                                          > a decent guy who just made a joke without thinking about the
                                          > consequences, so I approached my response from that perspective.
                                          >
                                          > Here's a shortcut to the letter on my blog:
                                          >
                                          > http://urltea.com/1e7z
                                          >
                                          > And for your convenience, here's the text. -andy
                                          >
                                          > --------------
                                          >
                                          > To: Mathew Honan, Wired Magazine
                                          > From: Andy Carvin
                                          >
                                          > Dear Matthew,
                                          >
                                          > You don't know me, but I was hoping I could take up a few minutes of
                                          > your time today. I see we've got a lot in common; we're both writers,
                                          > Mac users, photographers; we've even both backpacked around Laos and
                                          > written travelogues about it. You seem like the kind of guy I'd
                                          > probably want to hang out with at SXSW or something, perhaps to
                                          > grab a
                                          > beer and swap travel stories. And that's why I feel I can be straight
                                          > up with you about something you wrote recently that really hurt a lot
                                          > of educators across the country.
                                          >
                                          > You see, in my free time I volunteer as the coordinator of an online
                                          > community called Stop Cyberbullying. I founded it earlier this
                                          > year as
                                          > a way to give educators and parents a place where they could share
                                          > strategies to deal with the issue of cyberbullying. Don't get me
                                          > wrong; it's not intended as a place for primadonna bloggers with
                                          glass
                                          > jaws to complain about how they're being dissed by their peers,
                                          > nor is
                                          > it a community for humorless schoolmarms to demand that all un-PC
                                          > online behavior should be banned forthwith by Congress. Instead, it's
                                          > just a group of well-meaning, concerned people who in some cases are
                                          > trying to save the lives of their children or students.
                                          >
                                          > I'm not trying to be melodramatic and overstate the situation
                                          > here, so
                                          > I won't waste your time throwing out dubious statistics as to what
                                          > percentage of kids get bullied via the Internet, text messaging and
                                          > the like. Depending on whom you ask, it's either a widespread problem
                                          > or small minority of kids. No matter how you slice it, though, the
                                          > fact of the matter is that there are hundreds of thousands of kids
                                          who
                                          > are harassed by their peers on a regular basis. For some of these
                                          > kids, the bullying is so bad it basically paralyzes them, making them
                                          > fearful of attending school, going online or turning on their phone.
                                          > And for a small minority of kids, it's led to suicide attempts. Some
                                          > of them have even been successful.
                                          >
                                          > I'm sure you had none of this in mind when you wrote a short article
                                          > for the latest issue of Wired Magazine entitled Beware These Six
                                          > Lamest Social Networks. As both a Star Trek fan and a cat owner, I
                                          had
                                          > to laugh when you cited social networks targeting those particular
                                          > demographic groups; you definitely nailed those two, and rightly so.
                                          > But you also included the Stop Cyberbullying community in your list,
                                          > describing it as a place populated by "pussies" who will "gang up on
                                          > you mercilessly" if you call them that.
                                          >
                                          > Now, I know you intended this as a joke. And like I said, if this
                                          > community were a place where whining bloggers or self-righteous
                                          > luddites came to commiserate among themselves, I think it'd be fair
                                          > game for some snark. Instead, though, you decided to go after a group
                                          > of concerned educators and parents who are just trying to help out
                                          > kids who are living in their own private hell. And by calling us out,
                                          > it led to the unintended consequence of having countless vandals and
                                          > trolls descend upon the site, for the sole purpose of - yes -
                                          bullying
                                          > us. It left us with no choice but to put the community in lockdown,
                                          > removing it from public view and preventing new members from joining
                                          > unless they could prove they weren't there to cause harm. We now must
                                          > treat every prospective member with suspicion, rather than greet them
                                          > with open arms.
                                          >
                                          > I know what you wrote was intended to be funny - and in any other
                                          > context, it would have been. But it wasn't, and it's demoralized a
                                          lot
                                          > of people who are already fighting an uphill battle against a problem
                                          > that all too often just isn't taken seriously. And I know writing
                                          this
                                          > letter will probably cause us more problems - not from you
                                          personally,
                                          > but from a small minority of people who will read this letter and use
                                          > it as an excuse to harass me and my colleagues, as usually happens
                                          > whenever I write about cyberbullying in a public space. That's the
                                          > cost of trying to help these kids, I guess.
                                          >
                                          > Anyway, that's all I wanted to say. If you're ever in the DC area,
                                          > drop me and note and we can find somewhere to grab a bottle or two of
                                          > BeerLao and swap stories about tropical diseases and other
                                          backpacking
                                          > disasters. Thanks again for taking the time to read this.
                                          >
                                          > Take care,
                                          > Andy Carvin
                                          >
                                          >
                                          >
                                          >
                                        • Bob Hirshon
                                          Andy: You definitely win this year s Gandhi Prize! Bob Hirshon AAAS ... Hi everyone, Thanks again for all of the thoughtful suggestions you passed along
                                          Message 20 of 26 , Sep 4, 2007
                                          • 0 Attachment
                                            Andy:

                                            You definitely win this year's Gandhi Prize!

                                            Bob Hirshon
                                            AAAS

                                            >>>andycarvin@... 09/04 9:57 am >>>
                                            Hi everyone,

                                            Thanks again for all of the thoughtful suggestions you passed along
                                            regarding how I should handle the story from Wired. I've decided to
                                            take a middle-of-the-road approach, writing an open letter to the
                                            author on my PBS blog, but not firing back with snark of my own. The
                                            more I learned about the author, the more I concluded he was actually
                                            a decent guy who just made a joke without thinking about the
                                            consequences, so I approached my response from that perspective.

                                            Here's a shortcut to the letter on my blog:

                                            http://urltea.com/1e7z

                                            And for your convenience, here's the text. -andy

                                            --------------

                                            To: Mathew Honan, Wired Magazine
                                            From: Andy Carvin

                                            Dear Matthew,

                                            You don't know me, but I was hoping I could take up a few minutes of
                                            your time today. I see we've got a lot in common; we're both writers,
                                            Mac users, photographers; we've even both backpacked around Laos and
                                            written travelogues about it. You seem like the kind of guy I'd
                                            probably want to hang out with at SXSW or something, perhaps to grab a
                                            beer and swap travel stories. And that's why I feel I can be straight
                                            up with you about something you wrote recently that really hurt a lot
                                            of educators across the country.

                                            You see, in my free time I volunteer as the coordinator of an online
                                            community called Stop Cyberbullying. I founded it earlier this year as
                                            a way to give educators and parents a place where they could share
                                            strategies to deal with the issue of cyberbullying. Don't get me
                                            wrong; it's not intended as a place for primadonna bloggers with glass
                                            jaws to complain about how they're being dissed by their peers, nor is
                                            it a community for humorless schoolmarms to demand that all un-PC
                                            online behavior should be banned forthwith by Congress. Instead, it's
                                            just a group of well-meaning, concerned people who in some cases are
                                            trying to save the lives of their children or students.

                                            I'm not trying to be melodramatic and overstate the situation here, so
                                            I won't waste your time throwing out dubious statistics as to what
                                            percentage of kids get bullied via the Internet, text messaging and
                                            the like. Depending on whom you ask, it's either a widespread problem
                                            or small minority of kids. No matter how you slice it, though, the
                                            fact of the matter is that there are hundreds of thousands of kids who
                                            are harassed by their peers on a regular basis. For some of these
                                            kids, the bullying is so bad it basically paralyzes them, making them
                                            fearful of attending school, going online or turning on their phone.
                                            And for a small minority of kids, it's led to suicide attempts. Some
                                            of them have even been successful.

                                            I'm sure you had none of this in mind when you wrote a short article
                                            for the latest issue of Wired Magazine entitled Beware These Six
                                            Lamest Social Networks. As both a Star Trek fan and a cat owner, I had
                                            to laugh when you cited social networks targeting those particular
                                            demographic groups; you definitely nailed those two, and rightly so.
                                            But you also included the Stop Cyberbullying community in your list,
                                            describing it as a place populated by pussies who will gang up on
                                            you mercilessly if you call them that.

                                            Now, I know you intended this as a joke. And like I said, if this
                                            community were a place where whining bloggers or self-righteous
                                            luddites came to commiserate among themselves, I think it'd be fair
                                            game for some snark. Instead, though, you decided to go after a group
                                            of concerned educators and parents who are just trying to help out
                                            kids who are living in their own private hell. And by calling us out,
                                            it led to the unintended consequence of having countless vandals and
                                            trolls descend upon the site, for the sole purpose of - yes - bullying
                                            us. It left us with no choice but to put the community in lockdown,
                                            removing it from public view and preventing new members from joining
                                            unless they could prove they weren't there to cause harm. We now must
                                            treat every prospective member with suspicion, rather than greet them
                                            with open arms.

                                            I know what you wrote was intended to be funny - and in any other
                                            context, it would have been. But it wasn't, and it's demoralized a lot
                                            of people who are already fighting an uphill battle against a problem
                                            that all too often just isn't taken seriously. And I know writing this
                                            letter will probably cause us more problems - not from you personally,
                                            but from a small minority of people who will read this letter and use
                                            it as an excuse to harass me and my colleagues, as usually happens
                                            whenever I write about cyberbullying in a public space. That's the
                                            cost of trying to help these kids, I guess.

                                            Anyway, that's all I wanted to say. If you're ever in the DC area,
                                            drop me and note and we can find somewhere to grab a bottle or two of
                                            BeerLao and swap stories about tropical diseases and other backpacking
                                            disasters. Thanks again for taking the time to read this.

                                            Take care,
                                            Andy Carvin





                                            WWWEDU, The Web and Education Discussion Group
                                            http://groups.yahoo.com/group/wwwedu
                                            http://www.edwebproject.org/wwwedu.html

                                            Yahoo! Groups Links

                                            <>To visit your group on the web, go to:
                                            http://groups.yahoo.com/group/wwwedu/

                                            <>Your email settings:
                                            Individual Email | Traditional

                                            <>To change settings online go to:
                                            http://groups.yahoo.com/group/wwwedu/join
                                            (Yahoo! ID required)

                                            <>To change settings via email:
                                            mailto:wwwedu-digest@yahoogroups.com
                                            mailto:wwwedu-fullfeatured@yahoogroups.com

                                            <>To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
                                            wwwedu-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

                                            <>Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
                                            http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/




                                            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                          • Nancy Willard
                                            ... There are times that the ACLU does good work. But I am very concerned about some of their work in the area of the Internet. The ACLU legislative directors
                                            Message 21 of 26 , Sep 4, 2007
                                            • 0 Attachment
                                              >
                                              > In a message dated 8/29/07 6:11:56 PM, nwillard@...
                                              > <mailto:nwillard%40csriu.org> writes:
                                              >
                                              > People who don't teach don't understand our caution. In a meeting about the
                                              > same thing yesterday
                                              > a parent said to me so, the children should not cross the street because they
                                              > might get hit..
                                              > and then it was well what about the people who live in danger in the real
                                              > world , forget about the internet We kind of need the ACLU for when things get
                                              > really crazy.

                                              There are times that the ACLU does good work. But I am very concerned about
                                              some of their work in the area of the Internet. The ACLU legislative
                                              directors in Washington and Oregon told the state legislature that the
                                              courts have ruled that school officials cannot respond to off-campus speech
                                              by students. This is NOT the legal standard implemented by the court. The
                                              other major problem in these 2 states was that the school board and
                                              administrator associations went along with the ACLU and did not know enough
                                              about what the law was ­ so they chose ³we want to avoid litigation² over
                                              ³we need to be able to respond if school or school safety is at risk.²

                                              But the ACLU placed the value of free speech over the value of keeping kids
                                              safe.

                                              The ACLU and other civil rights organizations are the reason we have such
                                              heavy reliance on Internet filtering. Back in the late 90¹s after CDA was
                                              ruled unconstitutional, there was an Internet Summit about concerns of
                                              children online and the conclusion of this summit was to promote parental
                                              empowerment technologies. Then when COPA was enacted the ACLU challenged
                                              this law with the argument that filtering software was a less restrictive
                                              alternative to a criminal law requiring sites with adult material to have
                                              age verification. The law would not work either because the Internet is
                                              international ­ Congress seems to frequently forget that we are not in
                                              charge of the entire world/Internet.

                                              So when CIPA came along, the ACLU and other civil rights organizations were
                                              already talking up parental empowerment tools at the ³solution.² And when
                                              the ACLU challenged CIPA in court, they did not introduce any evidence about
                                              the inadequacies of filtering software other than over-blocking, which could
                                              be addressed by overriding the filter. They promoted the presumption of
                                              adequacy of filtering to block pornography ­ and filtering is not adequate.

                                              There is one major filtering company that has close corporate relations with
                                              the American Family Association ­ an arch conservative religious
                                              organization. Others block based on clear bias. The two areas of biased
                                              blocking that are most notable are sites for LGBTQ teens and non-traditional
                                              religion. And in the vast majority of schools librarians do not have the
                                              authority to override the filter. But the ACLU will not bring these cases
                                              because the COPA case is still alive.

                                              The perspective I bring on cyberbullying ­ which is a balance between
                                              protecting free speech and protecting safety ­ will prevail because all of
                                              the case law supports this, not to mention common sense.

                                              Nancy
                                              --
                                              Nancy Willard, M.S., J.D.
                                              Center for Safe and Responsible Internet Use
                                              http://csriu.org
                                              http://cyberbully.org
                                              http://cyber-safe-kids.com
                                              nwillard@...

                                              Cyberbullying and Cyberthreats: Responding to the Challenge of Online Social
                                              Aggression, Threats, and Distress (Research Press)

                                              Cyber-Safe Kids, Cyber-Savvy Teens: Helping Young People Learn to Use the
                                              Internet Safely and Responsibly (Jossey-Bass)




                                              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                            • Carla Beard
                                              Very diplomatically done, Andy. A post to be proud of. Carla Beard ________________________________ From: wwwedu@yahoogroups.com
                                              Message 22 of 26 , Sep 4, 2007
                                              • 0 Attachment
                                                Very diplomatically done, Andy. A post to be proud of.





                                                Carla Beard



                                                ________________________________

                                                From: wwwedu@yahoogroups.com [mailto:wwwedu@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
                                                Of Andy Carvin
                                                Sent: Tuesday, September 04, 2007 9:57 AM
                                                To: wwwedu@yahoogroups.com
                                                Subject: [WWWEDU] Re: Any thoughts on how I should respond to Wired?



                                                Hi everyone,

                                                Thanks again for all of the thoughtful suggestions you passed along
                                                regarding how I should handle the story from Wired. I've decided to
                                                take a middle-of-the-road approach, writing an open letter to the
                                                author on my PBS blog, but not firing back with snark of my own. The
                                                more I learned about the author, the more I concluded he was actually
                                                a decent guy who just made a joke without thinking about the
                                                consequences, so I approached my response from that perspective.

                                                Here's a shortcut to the letter on my blog:

                                                http://urltea.com/1e7z <http://urltea.com/1e7z>

                                                And for your convenience, here's the text. -andy

                                                --------------

                                                To: Mathew Honan, Wired Magazine
                                                From: Andy Carvin

                                                Dear Matthew,

                                                You don't know me, but I was hoping I could take up a few minutes of
                                                your time today. I see we've got a lot in common; we're both writers,
                                                Mac users, photographers; we've even both backpacked around Laos and
                                                written travelogues about it. You seem like the kind of guy I'd
                                                probably want to hang out with at SXSW or something, perhaps to grab a
                                                beer and swap travel stories. And that's why I feel I can be straight
                                                up with you about something you wrote recently that really hurt a lot
                                                of educators across the country.

                                                You see, in my free time I volunteer as the coordinator of an online
                                                community called Stop Cyberbullying. I founded it earlier this year as
                                                a way to give educators and parents a place where they could share
                                                strategies to deal with the issue of cyberbullying. Don't get me
                                                wrong; it's not intended as a place for primadonna bloggers with glass
                                                jaws to complain about how they're being dissed by their peers, nor is
                                                it a community for humorless schoolmarms to demand that all un-PC
                                                online behavior should be banned forthwith by Congress. Instead, it's
                                                just a group of well-meaning, concerned people who in some cases are
                                                trying to save the lives of their children or students.

                                                I'm not trying to be melodramatic and overstate the situation here, so
                                                I won't waste your time throwing out dubious statistics as to what
                                                percentage of kids get bullied via the Internet, text messaging and
                                                the like. Depending on whom you ask, it's either a widespread problem
                                                or small minority of kids. No matter how you slice it, though, the
                                                fact of the matter is that there are hundreds of thousands of kids who
                                                are harassed by their peers on a regular basis. For some of these
                                                kids, the bullying is so bad it basically paralyzes them, making them
                                                fearful of attending school, going online or turning on their phone.
                                                And for a small minority of kids, it's led to suicide attempts. Some
                                                of them have even been successful.

                                                I'm sure you had none of this in mind when you wrote a short article
                                                for the latest issue of Wired Magazine entitled Beware These Six
                                                Lamest Social Networks. As both a Star Trek fan and a cat owner, I had
                                                to laugh when you cited social networks targeting those particular
                                                demographic groups; you definitely nailed those two, and rightly so.
                                                But you also included the Stop Cyberbullying community in your list,
                                                describing it as a place populated by "pussies" who will "gang up on
                                                you mercilessly" if you call them that.

                                                Now, I know you intended this as a joke. And like I said, if this
                                                community were a place where whining bloggers or self-righteous
                                                luddites came to commiserate among themselves, I think it'd be fair
                                                game for some snark. Instead, though, you decided to go after a group
                                                of concerned educators and parents who are just trying to help out
                                                kids who are living in their own private hell. And by calling us out,
                                                it led to the unintended consequence of having countless vandals and
                                                trolls descend upon the site, for the sole purpose of - yes - bullying
                                                us. It left us with no choice but to put the community in lockdown,
                                                removing it from public view and preventing new members from joining
                                                unless they could prove they weren't there to cause harm. We now must
                                                treat every prospective member with suspicion, rather than greet them
                                                with open arms.

                                                I know what you wrote was intended to be funny - and in any other
                                                context, it would have been. But it wasn't, and it's demoralized a lot
                                                of people who are already fighting an uphill battle against a problem
                                                that all too often just isn't taken seriously. And I know writing this
                                                letter will probably cause us more problems - not from you personally,
                                                but from a small minority of people who will read this letter and use
                                                it as an excuse to harass me and my colleagues, as usually happens
                                                whenever I write about cyberbullying in a public space. That's the
                                                cost of trying to help these kids, I guess.

                                                Anyway, that's all I wanted to say. If you're ever in the DC area,
                                                drop me and note and we can find somewhere to grab a bottle or two of
                                                BeerLao and swap stories about tropical diseases and other backpacking
                                                disasters. Thanks again for taking the time to read this.

                                                Take care,
                                                Andy Carvin





                                                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                              • Janet Salmons
                                                One more thanks for walking the talk-instead of fighting this bully with more of the same. Unintended or not, his remarks were irresponsible and I am glad you
                                                Message 23 of 26 , Sep 4, 2007
                                                • 0 Attachment
                                                  One more thanks for walking the talk-instead of fighting this bully with
                                                  more of the same. Unintended or not, his remarks were irresponsible and I am
                                                  glad you described why in clear terms.



                                                  Bravo. Janet



                                                  From: wwwedu@yahoogroups.com [mailto:wwwedu@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
                                                  Andy Carvin
                                                  Sent: Tuesday, September 04, 2007 7:57 AM
                                                  To: wwwedu@yahoogroups.com
                                                  Subject: [WWWEDU] Re: Any thoughts on how I should respond to Wired?



                                                  Hi everyone,

                                                  Thanks again for all of the thoughtful suggestions you passed along
                                                  regarding how I should handle the story from Wired. I've decided to
                                                  take a middle-of-the-road approach, writing an open letter to the
                                                  author on my PBS blog, but not firing back with snark of my own. The
                                                  more I learned about the author, the more I concluded he was actually
                                                  a decent guy who just made a joke without thinking about the
                                                  consequences, so I approached my response from that perspective.

                                                  Here's a shortcut to the letter on my blog:

                                                  http://urltea.com/1e7z

                                                  And for your convenience, here's the text. -andy

                                                  --------------

                                                  To: Mathew Honan, Wired Magazine
                                                  From: Andy Carvin

                                                  Dear Matthew,

                                                  You don't know me, but I was hoping I could take up a few minutes of
                                                  your time today. I see we've got a lot in common; we're both writers,
                                                  Mac users, photographers; we've even both backpacked around Laos and
                                                  written travelogues about it. You seem like the kind of guy I'd
                                                  probably want to hang out with at SXSW or something, perhaps to grab a
                                                  beer and swap travel stories. And that's why I feel I can be straight
                                                  up with you about something you wrote recently that really hurt a lot
                                                  of educators across the country.

                                                  You see, in my free time I volunteer as the coordinator of an online
                                                  community called Stop Cyberbullying. I founded it earlier this year as
                                                  a way to give educators and parents a place where they could share
                                                  strategies to deal with the issue of cyberbullying. Don't get me
                                                  wrong; it's not intended as a place for primadonna bloggers with glass
                                                  jaws to complain about how they're being dissed by their peers, nor is
                                                  it a community for humorless schoolmarms to demand that all un-PC
                                                  online behavior should be banned forthwith by Congress. Instead, it's
                                                  just a group of well-meaning, concerned people who in some cases are
                                                  trying to save the lives of their children or students.

                                                  I'm not trying to be melodramatic and overstate the situation here, so
                                                  I won't waste your time throwing out dubious statistics as to what
                                                  percentage of kids get bullied via the Internet, text messaging and
                                                  the like. Depending on whom you ask, it's either a widespread problem
                                                  or small minority of kids. No matter how you slice it, though, the
                                                  fact of the matter is that there are hundreds of thousands of kids who
                                                  are harassed by their peers on a regular basis. For some of these
                                                  kids, the bullying is so bad it basically paralyzes them, making them
                                                  fearful of attending school, going online or turning on their phone.
                                                  And for a small minority of kids, it's led to suicide attempts. Some
                                                  of them have even been successful.

                                                  I'm sure you had none of this in mind when you wrote a short article
                                                  for the latest issue of Wired Magazine entitled Beware These Six
                                                  Lamest Social Networks. As both a Star Trek fan and a cat owner, I had
                                                  to laugh when you cited social networks targeting those particular
                                                  demographic groups; you definitely nailed those two, and rightly so.
                                                  But you also included the Stop Cyberbullying community in your list,
                                                  describing it as a place populated by "pussies" who will "gang up on
                                                  you mercilessly" if you call them that.

                                                  Now, I know you intended this as a joke. And like I said, if this
                                                  community were a place where whining bloggers or self-righteous
                                                  luddites came to commiserate among themselves, I think it'd be fair
                                                  game for some snark. Instead, though, you decided to go after a group
                                                  of concerned educators and parents who are just trying to help out
                                                  kids who are living in their own private hell. And by calling us out,
                                                  it led to the unintended consequence of having countless vandals and
                                                  trolls descend upon the site, for the sole purpose of - yes - bullying
                                                  us. It left us with no choice but to put the community in lockdown,
                                                  removing it from public view and preventing new members from joining
                                                  unless they could prove they weren't there to cause harm. We now must
                                                  treat every prospective member with suspicion, rather than greet them
                                                  with open arms.

                                                  I know what you wrote was intended to be funny - and in any other
                                                  context, it would have been. But it wasn't, and it's demoralized a lot
                                                  of people who are already fighting an uphill battle against a problem
                                                  that all too often just isn't taken seriously. And I know writing this
                                                  letter will probably cause us more problems - not from you personally,
                                                  but from a small minority of people who will read this letter and use
                                                  it as an excuse to harass me and my colleagues, as usually happens
                                                  whenever I write about cyberbullying in a public space. That's the
                                                  cost of trying to help these kids, I guess.

                                                  Anyway, that's all I wanted to say. If you're ever in the DC area,
                                                  drop me and note and we can find somewhere to grab a bottle or two of
                                                  BeerLao and swap stories about tropical diseases and other backpacking
                                                  disasters. Thanks again for taking the time to read this.

                                                  Take care,
                                                  Andy Carvin





                                                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                                • Clarence
                                                  A well thought out reply. If I may, I would like to use this situation as an example to my AP English class later this year. Clarance From:
                                                  Message 24 of 26 , Sep 4, 2007
                                                  • 0 Attachment
                                                    A well thought out reply. If I may, I would like to use this situation as
                                                    an example to my AP English class later this year.



                                                    Clarance



                                                    From: wwwedu@yahoogroups.com [mailto:wwwedu@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
                                                    Andy Carvin
                                                    Sent: Tuesday, September 04, 2007 6:57 AM
                                                    To: wwwedu@yahoogroups.com
                                                    Subject: [WWWEDU] Re: Any thoughts on how I should respond to Wired?



                                                    Hi everyone,

                                                    Thanks again for all of the thoughtful suggestions you passed along
                                                    regarding how I should handle the story from Wired. I've decided to
                                                    take a middle-of-the-road approach, writing an open letter to the
                                                    author on my PBS blog, but not firing back with snark of my own. The
                                                    more I learned about the author, the more I concluded he was actually
                                                    a decent guy who just made a joke without thinking about the
                                                    consequences, so I approached my response from that perspective.

                                                    Here's a shortcut to the letter on my blog:

                                                    http://urltea.com/1e7z

                                                    And for your convenience, here's the text. -andy

                                                    --------------

                                                    To: Mathew Honan, Wired Magazine
                                                    From: Andy Carvin

                                                    Dear Matthew,

                                                    You don't know me, but I was hoping I could take up a few minutes of
                                                    your time today. I see we've got a lot in common; we're both writers,
                                                    Mac users, photographers; we've even both backpacked around Laos and
                                                    written travelogues about it. You seem like the kind of guy I'd
                                                    probably want to hang out with at SXSW or something, perhaps to grab a
                                                    beer and swap travel stories. And that's why I feel I can be straight
                                                    up with you about something you wrote recently that really hurt a lot
                                                    of educators across the country.

                                                    You see, in my free time I volunteer as the coordinator of an online
                                                    community called Stop Cyberbullying. I founded it earlier this year as
                                                    a way to give educators and parents a place where they could share
                                                    strategies to deal with the issue of cyberbullying. Don't get me
                                                    wrong; it's not intended as a place for primadonna bloggers with glass
                                                    jaws to complain about how they're being dissed by their peers, nor is
                                                    it a community for humorless schoolmarms to demand that all un-PC
                                                    online behavior should be banned forthwith by Congress. Instead, it's
                                                    just a group of well-meaning, concerned people who in some cases are
                                                    trying to save the lives of their children or students.

                                                    I'm not trying to be melodramatic and overstate the situation here, so
                                                    I won't waste your time throwing out dubious statistics as to what
                                                    percentage of kids get bullied via the Internet, text messaging and
                                                    the like. Depending on whom you ask, it's either a widespread problem
                                                    or small minority of kids. No matter how you slice it, though, the
                                                    fact of the matter is that there are hundreds of thousands of kids who
                                                    are harassed by their peers on a regular basis. For some of these
                                                    kids, the bullying is so bad it basically paralyzes them, making them
                                                    fearful of attending school, going online or turning on their phone.
                                                    And for a small minority of kids, it's led to suicide attempts. Some
                                                    of them have even been successful.

                                                    I'm sure you had none of this in mind when you wrote a short article
                                                    for the latest issue of Wired Magazine entitled Beware These Six
                                                    Lamest Social Networks. As both a Star Trek fan and a cat owner, I had
                                                    to laugh when you cited social networks targeting those particular
                                                    demographic groups; you definitely nailed those two, and rightly so.
                                                    But you also included the Stop Cyberbullying community in your list,
                                                    describing it as a place populated by "pussies" who will "gang up on
                                                    you mercilessly" if you call them that.

                                                    Now, I know you intended this as a joke. And like I said, if this
                                                    community were a place where whining bloggers or self-righteous
                                                    luddites came to commiserate among themselves, I think it'd be fair
                                                    game for some snark. Instead, though, you decided to go after a group
                                                    of concerned educators and parents who are just trying to help out
                                                    kids who are living in their own private hell. And by calling us out,
                                                    it led to the unintended consequence of having countless vandals and
                                                    trolls descend upon the site, for the sole purpose of - yes - bullying
                                                    us. It left us with no choice but to put the community in lockdown,
                                                    removing it from public view and preventing new members from joining
                                                    unless they could prove they weren't there to cause harm. We now must
                                                    treat every prospective member with suspicion, rather than greet them
                                                    with open arms.

                                                    I know what you wrote was intended to be funny - and in any other
                                                    context, it would have been. But it wasn't, and it's demoralized a lot
                                                    of people who are already fighting an uphill battle against a problem
                                                    that all too often just isn't taken seriously. And I know writing this
                                                    letter will probably cause us more problems - not from you personally,
                                                    but from a small minority of people who will read this letter and use
                                                    it as an excuse to harass me and my colleagues, as usually happens
                                                    whenever I write about cyberbullying in a public space. That's the
                                                    cost of trying to help these kids, I guess.

                                                    Anyway, that's all I wanted to say. If you're ever in the DC area,
                                                    drop me and note and we can find somewhere to grab a bottle or two of
                                                    BeerLao and swap stories about tropical diseases and other backpacking
                                                    disasters. Thanks again for taking the time to read this.

                                                    Take care,
                                                    Andy Carvin





                                                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                                  • Mark Ahlness
                                                    Fantastic response Andy. There is a nice blog post from Wes Fryer on this at http://www.speedofcreativity.org/?p=2171 - worth a read. - Mark _____ From:
                                                    Message 25 of 26 , Sep 4, 2007
                                                    • 0 Attachment
                                                      Fantastic response Andy.

                                                      There is a nice blog post from Wes Fryer on this at
                                                      http://www.speedofcreativity.org/?p=2171 - worth a read. - Mark



                                                      _____

                                                      From: wwwedu@yahoogroups.com [mailto:wwwedu@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
                                                      Andy Carvin
                                                      Sent: Tuesday, September 04, 2007 6:57 AM
                                                      To: wwwedu@yahoogroups.com
                                                      Subject: [WWWEDU] Re: Any thoughts on how I should respond to Wired?



                                                      Hi everyone,

                                                      Thanks again for all of the thoughtful suggestions you passed along
                                                      regarding how I should handle the story from Wired. I've decided to
                                                      take a middle-of-the-road approach, writing an open letter to the
                                                      author on my PBS blog, but not firing back with snark of my own. The
                                                      more I learned about the author, the more I concluded he was actually
                                                      a decent guy who just made a joke without thinking about the
                                                      consequences, so I approached my response from that perspective.

                                                      Here's a shortcut to the letter on my blog:

                                                      http://urltea. <http://urltea.com/1e7z> com/1e7z






                                                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                                    • uuterri
                                                      ... I ve been following along on this, and wanted to add a note of congratulations and appreciation for your thoughtful approach to handling all of this, and
                                                      Message 26 of 26 , Sep 5, 2007
                                                      • 0 Attachment
                                                        > Very diplomatically done, Andy. A post to be proud of.

                                                        I've been following along on this, and wanted to add a note of
                                                        congratulations and appreciation for your thoughtful approach to
                                                        handling all of this, and for your well-reasoned and articulate
                                                        response. It gives Wired (and many others) nothing to push against,
                                                        and everything to think about.

                                                        Yay for civility!

                                                        Terri Willingham
                                                        www.learningis4everyone.org
                                                      Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.