Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.
 

Re: [wwbc] Matteo Richi, anyone?

Expand Messages
  • elliott@bignell.demon.co.uk
    I tried to build a Room when I first joined the group, but found it even less successful than my attempts at peg systems. I remember using an image to note
    Message 1 of 12 , Jul 5 10:45 PM
      I tried to build a Room when I first joined the group, but found it even
      less successful than my attempts at peg systems. I remember using an image
      to note Howards Marks' prison number as an exercise, using Major System
      coding for the digits, and noticed after creating it that I'd used a wrong
      letter. I corrected the phrase and image to match the correct information.
      About three years on, I can remember both examples perfectly, but I CAN'T
      TELL WHICH WAS WRONG. I probably should have tagged it with cobwebs, or
      something.

      I do know where I can get some fava beans and a nice chianti, mind. Got to
      have your priorities straight...

      Cheers...
      Elliott


      ----- Original Message -----

      > Does anyone use - as Hannibal Lector does - a memory palace on this
      > scale to remember encyclopaedically?
      >
      > Myself, I keep adding to the SEM cubed thing.
      >
      > J
    • aldolilly8
      I also had problems with the Roman room or memory palace idea. I found it a little too dark. And I think most people struggle with peg systems. I still
      Message 2 of 12 , Jul 6 10:29 AM
        I also had problems with the Roman room or memory palace idea. I
        found it a little too dark. And I think most people struggle with peg
        systems. I still think the best way is to use pleasant outdoor
        routes. Simple linear walks with distinctive loci.

        If I were Hannibal, stuck inside all day, any indoor place- even a
        palace- would do my head in.


        Aldo





        --- In wwbc@yahoogroups.com, elliott@b... wrote:
        > I tried to build a Room when I first joined the group, but found it even
        > less successful than my attempts at peg systems. I remember using an
        image
        > to note Howards Marks' prison number as an exercise, using Major System
        > coding for the digits, and noticed after creating it that I'd used a
        wrong
        > letter. I corrected the phrase and image to match the correct
        information.
        > About three years on, I can remember both examples perfectly, but I
        CAN'T
        > TELL WHICH WAS WRONG. I probably should have tagged it with cobwebs, or
        > something.
        >
        > I do know where I can get some fava beans and a nice chianti, mind.
        Got to
        > have your priorities straight...
        >
        > Cheers...
        > Elliott
        >
        >
        > ----- Original Message -----
        >
        > > Does anyone use - as Hannibal Lector does - a memory palace on this
        > > scale to remember encyclopaedically?
        > >
        > > Myself, I keep adding to the SEM cubed thing.
        > >
        > > J
      • Peter
        ... Out of interest, did you create an imaginary room or based it on a room in your house? Peter
        Message 3 of 12 , Jul 6 12:04 PM
          >I also had problems with the Roman room or memory palace idea. I
          > found it a little too dark. And I think most people struggle with peg
          > systems. I still think the best way is to use pleasant outdoor
          > routes. Simple linear walks with distinctive loci.

          Out of interest, did you create an imaginary room or based it on a room in
          your house?

          Peter
        • aldolilly8
          Hi Peter In the beginning I tried all methods- Imaginary, real, and a combination of the two. I still found indoor places less effective than an outdoor
          Message 4 of 12 , Jul 6 8:06 PM
            Hi Peter

            In the beginning I tried all methods- Imaginary, real, and a
            combination of the two. I still found indoor places less effective
            than an outdoor routes or places. I think it is partly because it is
            easier to imagine bright images outside in context, and also outdoor
            features tend to be more distinct and show more contrast. I also
            found it easier to use a simple link system (with improvised subloci)
            in outside contexts.

            I'm way past that early training stage now, and I find it fairly easy
            to use pegs, indoor places, and of course the enormously flexible link
            system. (still find SEM3 and mindmops frustrating though).

            I believe the optimal method for beginners is an outdoor route, with
            paired images on each locus. Eg, Place the Sun interacting with a
            thermometer(mercury) on the first locus, a goddess(Venus) interacting
            with a pile of Earth on the second etc.

            The paired image method promotes conceptual linking (still quite
            memorable even after the route is reused, and focuses on linking
            within the subject rather than just linking to a route), and
            emphasises the location principle while providing a powerful and user
            friendly method.

            Cheers
            Aldo







            >
            > Out of interest, did you create an imaginary room or based it on a
            room in
            > your house?
            >
            > Peter
          • elliott@bignell.demon.co.uk
            Aldo, have you tried combining routes with Mind Mapping? A Mind Map is just a branching set of routes from a central locus, after all. You could have a memory
            Message 5 of 12 , Jul 6 9:11 PM
              Aldo, have you tried combining routes with Mind Mapping? A Mind Map is just
              a branching set of routes from a central locus, after all. You could have a
              memory city, rather than a memory room.

              Elliott
            • aldolilly8
              Hi Elliott I thoroughly tried cognitive and mind maps and found tham a too abstract and tangential. But then again, I never use maps to explore, prefering
              Message 6 of 12 , Jul 7 1:28 AM
                Hi Elliott

                I thoroughly tried cognitive and mind maps and found tham a too
                abstract and tangential. But then again, I never use maps to explore,
                prefering more experiential and interactive methods of covering an area.

                I think they are ok for free association though, and I am impressed
                with the various IT versions.

                Cheers
                Aldo





                -- In wwbc@yahoogroups.com, elliott@b... wrote:
                > Aldo, have you tried combining routes with Mind Mapping? A Mind Map
                is just
                > a branching set of routes from a central locus, after all. You could
                have a
                > memory city, rather than a memory room.
                >
                > Elliott
              • Peter
                Hi Aldo, ... What do you mean by improvised subloci? Imaginary journey s along an known journey? ... I ve not gotten to SEM3 stuff yet, I just got a Tony
                Message 7 of 12 , Jul 7 6:45 AM
                  Hi Aldo,

                  > features tend to be more distinct and show more contrast. I also
                  > found it easier to use a simple link system (with improvised subloci)
                  > in outside contexts.

                  What do you mean by improvised subloci? Imaginary journey's along an known
                  journey?

                  > I'm way past that early training stage now, and I find it fairly easy
                  > to use pegs, indoor places, and of course the enormously flexible link
                  > system. (still find SEM3 and mindmops frustrating though).

                  I've not gotten to SEM3 stuff yet, I just got a Tony Buzan book (Use Your
                  Head) book out of the library yesterday, I like it so far. What good books
                  are worth checking out for memory techniques, mnemonics etc.? So far I read
                  a few Dominic O'Brien books and an old Harry Lorayne one. What other stuff
                  should I be checking out in the future? I'm really hooked on this stuff.

                  > I believe the optimal method for beginners is an outdoor route, with
                  > paired images on each locus. Eg, Place the Sun interacting with a
                  > thermometer(mercury) on the first locus, a goddess(Venus) interacting
                  > with a pile of Earth on the second etc.

                  Yes, there's an excellent article on happychild.org.uk demonstrating that
                  method using the solar-system for those [beginners] interested.

                  > The paired image method promotes conceptual linking (still quite

                  Yes, I found they re-inforce each other, a lot harder to forget.

                  Cheers,
                  Peter.
                • aldolilly8
                  Hello Peter Subloci When you work with improvised mnemonics you tend to start with a place. For example if you are learning about Paris, you might have an
                  Message 8 of 12 , Jul 7 8:09 AM
                    Hello Peter

                    Subloci
                    When you work with improvised mnemonics you tend to start with a
                    place. For example if you are learning about Paris, you might have an
                    image of the Eifel tower. That is a kind of locus. You may not be so
                    sure of the surroundings, but your imagination can kind of elaborate
                    further subloci that can be used to link further things in the same
                    scene.

                    I think the Buzan books are kind of initially inspiring because he
                    explicitly shows how mnemonics can be extensible. However, I don't
                    know anyone who can use the SEM3 technique. I found it disappointing
                    Looks nice and technical, but it was not worth the investment for me.
                    Similarly with the mindmap. Looks pretty fancy but I could not "get
                    into" or really experience it in the same way as mnemonics, or similar
                    learning enhancers such as stories or computer adventure games. In
                    fact, I have seen more interactive graphic representations even shown
                    in monochrome. For example, the Concept Plan. (intuitively arranging
                    ideas in space represented by buildings and landmarks).

                    For me, the most inspiring thing is the wonder of the imagination and
                    the mental image. And I like simple "systems" that are closer to
                    natural communication (stories or descriptions of scenes).

                    It is not really the technique that amazes me, but how I can make
                    great images in the mind and on paper to enhance my learning.

                    ATB
                    Aldo



                    -- In wwbc@yahoogroups.com, "Peter" <sulphur@b...> wrote:
                    > Hi Aldo,
                    >
                    > > features tend to be more distinct and show more contrast. I also
                    > > found it easier to use a simple link system (with improvised subloci)
                    > > in outside contexts.
                    >
                    > What do you mean by improvised subloci? Imaginary journey's along
                    an known
                    > journey?
                    >
                    > > I'm way past that early training stage now, and I find it fairly easy
                    > > to use pegs, indoor places, and of course the enormously flexible link
                    > > system. (still find SEM3 and mindmops frustrating though).
                    >
                    > I've not gotten to SEM3 stuff yet, I just got a Tony Buzan book (Use
                    Your
                    > Head) book out of the library yesterday, I like it so far. What
                    good books
                    > are worth checking out for memory techniques, mnemonics etc.? So
                    far I read
                    > a few Dominic O'Brien books and an old Harry Lorayne one. What
                    other stuff
                    > should I be checking out in the future? I'm really hooked on this stuff.
                    >
                    > > I believe the optimal method for beginners is an outdoor route, with
                    > > paired images on each locus. Eg, Place the Sun interacting with a
                    > > thermometer(mercury) on the first locus, a goddess(Venus) interacting
                    > > with a pile of Earth on the second etc.
                    >
                    > Yes, there's an excellent article on happychild.org.uk demonstrating
                    that
                    > method using the solar-system for those [beginners] interested.
                    >
                    > > The paired image method promotes conceptual linking (still quite
                    >
                    > Yes, I found they re-inforce each other, a lot harder to forget.
                    >
                    > Cheers,
                    > Peter.
                  • elliott@bignell.demon.co.uk
                    Hi, Aldo, If HeadCase proves a going proposition, the long-term vision is to do much more than paper-style Mind Mapping. It is already possible, as a small
                    Message 9 of 12 , Jul 7 9:20 AM
                      Hi, Aldo,

                      If HeadCase proves a going proposition, the long-term vision is to do much
                      more than paper-style Mind Mapping. It is already possible, as a small
                      indication of what can be done, to attach textual notes to branches which
                      pop up as you mouse over them. This allows you to combine standard
                      single-word Mind Mapping technique with more verbose note-making.

                      I have already prototyped methods to add ActiveX controls and Office
                      documents to branches, and I have plans to introduce components over time
                      that will enable you to make non-Mind Map visual notes, such as cluster
                      diagrams, UML documents and so on.

                      Further on, OpenGL, scripting and a bunch of other proven technologies will
                      enable HeadCase to create truly interactive entities that will be a far
                      descendant of the paper Mind Map. "Motion" will not just be a set of lines
                      providing a hint - it will be possible create and script Mind Mapping
                      applications that actually move and change in response to interaction. 3D
                      objects will rotate as you drag them about.

                      In effect, I have determined - if I survive as a company - to pick up the
                      baton for Tony Buzan and create a new Mind Mapping concept for the
                      information age. Support me!

                      Cheers...
                      Elliott


                      ----- Original Message -----

                      > I think the Buzan books are kind of initially inspiring because he
                      > explicitly shows how mnemonics can be extensible. However, I don't
                      > know anyone who can use the SEM3 technique. I found it disappointing
                      > Looks nice and technical, but it was not worth the investment for me.
                      > Similarly with the mindmap. Looks pretty fancy but I could not "get
                      > into" or really experience it in the same way as mnemonics, or similar
                      > learning enhancers such as stories or computer adventure games. In
                      > fact, I have seen more interactive graphic representations even shown
                      > in monochrome. For example, the Concept Plan. (intuitively arranging
                      > ideas in space represented by buildings and landmarks).
                    • aldolilly8
                      Sounds spot on, Elliott Perhaps the map will eventually evolve into a different metaphor entirely. Something more engaging and universally appealing! Another
                      Message 10 of 12 , Jul 7 9:49 AM
                        Sounds spot on, Elliott

                        Perhaps the map will eventually evolve into a different metaphor
                        entirely. Something more engaging and universally appealing!

                        Another view?

                        Good prospects!
                        Aldo



                        -- In wwbc@yahoogroups.com, elliott@b... wrote:
                        > Hi, Aldo,
                        >
                        > If HeadCase proves a going proposition, the long-term vision is to
                        do much
                        > more than paper-style Mind Mapping. It is already possible, as a small
                        > indication of what can be done, to attach textual notes to branches
                        which
                        > pop up as you mouse over them. This allows you to combine standard
                        > single-word Mind Mapping technique with more verbose note-making.
                        >
                        > I have already prototyped methods to add ActiveX controls and Office
                        > documents to branches, and I have plans to introduce components over
                        time
                        > that will enable you to make non-Mind Map visual notes, such as cluster
                        > diagrams, UML documents and so on.
                        >
                        > Further on, OpenGL, scripting and a bunch of other proven
                        technologies will
                        > enable HeadCase to create truly interactive entities that will be a far
                        > descendant of the paper Mind Map. "Motion" will not just be a set of
                        lines
                        > providing a hint - it will be possible create and script Mind Mapping
                        > applications that actually move and change in response to
                        interaction. 3D
                        > objects will rotate as you drag them about.
                        >
                        > In effect, I have determined - if I survive as a company - to pick
                        up the
                        > baton for Tony Buzan and create a new Mind Mapping concept for the
                        > information age. Support me!
                        >
                        > Cheers...
                        > Elliott
                        >
                        >
                        > ----- Original Message -----
                        >
                        > > I think the Buzan books are kind of initially inspiring because he
                        > > explicitly shows how mnemonics can be extensible. However, I don't
                        > > know anyone who can use the SEM3 technique. I found it disappointing
                        > > Looks nice and technical, but it was not worth the investment for me.
                        > > Similarly with the mindmap. Looks pretty fancy but I could not "get
                        > > into" or really experience it in the same way as mnemonics, or similar
                        > > learning enhancers such as stories or computer adventure games. In
                        > > fact, I have seen more interactive graphic representations even shown
                        > > in monochrome. For example, the Concept Plan. (intuitively arranging
                        > > ideas in space represented by buildings and landmarks).
                      • elliott@bignell.demon.co.uk
                        Grazie, Aldo. Frankly, I m astonished that I got this far. The basic framework has taken about 18 months longer to stabilise and debug than I had planned for.
                        Message 11 of 12 , Jul 7 10:16 AM
                          Grazie, Aldo. Frankly, I'm astonished that I got this far. The basic
                          framework has taken about 18 months longer to stabilise and debug than I had
                          planned for. I'm bitterly lonely, often depressed and if they try to cremate
                          me after this I'll take a month to settle.

                          HOWEVER, the vision remains. I've made some effort to make sure that others
                          can contribute to the project - so far, in vain, but we'll get there. The
                          vision is for the app to grow beyond my control and acquire a life of its
                          own. Eventually, I'll be able to document and publish an increasing number
                          of ways to extend and modify HeadCase, and eventually, I hope, the project
                          will slip its leash.

                          The next step is a capacity to create and share artwork and custom styles.
                          Hopefully that'll make an impact.

                          Cheers...
                          Elliott


                          ----- Original Message -----

                          > Sounds spot on, Elliott
                          >
                          > Perhaps the map will eventually evolve into a different metaphor
                          > entirely. Something more engaging and universally appealing!
                          >
                          > Another view?
                          >
                          > Good prospects!
                          > Aldo
                          >
                        Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.