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Jews or Zionists? A Discussion

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    Jews or Zionists? A discussion from http://www.israelshamir.net Should we speak against Zionist atrocities (limited position) or against Jewish privilege that
    Message 1 of 1 , Aug 8, 2004
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      Jews or Zionists?
      A discussion from http://www.israelshamir.net

      Should we speak against Zionist atrocities
      (limited position) or against Jewish privilege
      that allows for Zionist atrocities (broad
      position)? Here are three items representing three

      The anti-Zionist Israeli journalist Shraga Elam
      represents the Limited position. He attempts to
      convince Jews in Diaspora to drop their support of
      Israel in their own interests. It is a good
      example of divergence between our view and that of
      good anti-Zionist Jews. In our view, Shraga's [and
      other Limited positionists] effort is doomed to
      fail; while the correct and plausible direction is
      to minimise Jewish influence altogether by dealing
      with Jewish privilege. As long as only Zionism is
      attacked, and Jews are applauded, the Jewish
      privilege survives; and our cause is reduced to
      useless attempts to persuade Jews to drop Israel.
      Second item is a German nationalist perspective,
      who is not so much interested in Palestine but is
      annoyed by Jewish positions in German discourse.
      The third and the best is a honed letter by our
      friend Joh Domingo from South Africa/Australia,
      more or less representing our view.

      Israel Shamir

      1. Judaeophobia in the service of Israel
      A Lecture at the anti-imperialist Camp in
      Assisi/Italy, August 2, 2004

      Shraga Elam*

      There is an obvious growth of anti-Jewish
      sentiments worldwide. One cannot disregard anymore
      the rise in Judaeophobia and consider it always as
      just propaganda and manipulation. By the way, I
      prefer the use of the term Judaeophobia to the
      more common, and in itself racist term "anti

      Judaeophobia has to be confronted and rejected as
      every other form of racism, and for that purpose
      we have to understand its present reasons and
      causes and not just stop at the isolated
      "treatment" of superficial symptoms as propagated
      by many Zionist organizations and Israel.

      In order not to exploit your patience
      unnecessarily I'll tell you in advance that I'm
      deeply convinced that the main reasons for the
      increase in Judaeophobia are basically the Israeli
      criminal policy against the Palestinians and the
      wrongdoings of the pro-Israel lobbies. These two
      serious problems are then combined with the
      existing anti-Jewish prejudices that are rather
      harmless as such, at least in most cases. It is
      the mixture of these Jewish offenses with existing
      prejudices that Jews are something special that
      might create a very explosive cocktail.

      If it was in the past wrong and racist to look for
      the reasons for aggressions against Jews by Jews
      themselves, it is now right and necessary to do so!

      One of the best methods at the moment to fight
      Judaeophobia is to stop the Israeli crimes!
      It is as simple as that.

      I shall extrapolate now on this statement and try
      to make it clear what brings me to this

      It was no one less than a very renowned Israeli
      expert on Judaeophobia, Professor Dinah Porat who
      observed on the Israel state radio that there is a
      correlation between Israeli actions (we can say
      atrocities) and outbursts of Judaeophobia. This
      was for example the case in the early '80s
      following the Lebanon invasion or in the late 80's
      during the first Palestinian uprising, the

      We can see that all Jews, notwithstanding their
      individual positions, were then held responsible
      for the Israeli atrocities. This follows not only
      because of anti-Jewish prejudices, but partly also
      because of Israel's false claim that it represents
      all Jews, that it is the state of THE Jews. The
      widespread and ostensive public support for
      Israeli crimes led by many Jews all over the world
      strengthens the impression that all Jews stand
      behind Israel.

      Another example of Jewish activity that caused a
      rise in Judaeophobia, according to my own
      observations, is the restitution campaign in the
      mid '90s that the World Jewish Congress (WJC) and
      the Jewish Agency (JA) led against the Swiss banks
      on the issue of the so called heirless Jewish
      assets held in Switzerland since the Nazi era.

      These two Jewish organizations, a leading factor
      of the Holocaust Industry, abused a just issue
      without showing too many considerations for the
      truth or for the interests of the victims of the
      Nazis and their successors. The obviously greedy
      Jewish organizations were perceived as confirming,
      through their behavior, the existing judaeophobic
      prejudices and thus triggered a rise in
      anti-Jewish feelings in Switzerland. Some of the
      leading Swiss Jews were not very happy about this
      development but the JA and WJC could not have
      cared less, as they were successful in using also
      this increase in Judaeophobia against the Swiss.
      This win-win situation by swinging what can be
      called the "Anti-Semitism bludgeon or club" (in
      1991 the German-Israeli historian Professor
      Michael Wolffsohn spoke of the "Auschwitz
      bludgeon" - "Auschwitz-Keule") can be observed in
      action in silencing Israel's critics, that is, if
      they are not careful and mix legitimate and
      necessary condemnations of Israeli policies with
      anti-Jewish prejudices. But even if there are no
      real Judaeophobic manifestations, critique of
      Israel, even if true and correct, may be labelled
      simply because it is unbearable for Israel and its

      An example of this mechanism can be found in the
      case of the German politician of Syrian origin,
      Jamal Karsli. Karsli, who was a Green Party
      legislator in the assembly of Germany's most
      populous state, North Rhine-Westphalia, protested
      in March 2002 against the Israeli war crimes. He
      dared to say something that is usually only
      accepted if expressed by Zionist hardliners and
      their supporters, namely he compared the Nazi
      atrocities with a present event.

      After seeing on TV that Israeli soldiers had
      marked the arms of Palestinian captives with
      numbers, Karsli released a press declaration
      bearing the title: "Israel uses Nazi methods!"
      This German-Syrian politician was actually not
      alone in having such associations. The former MK
      and now minister Joseph 'Tommy' Lapid, who
      survived the Judeocide in Hungary, protested
      against the unbearable similarity between the Nazi
      marking Jews with numbers in Auschwitz and the
      action of the Israeli soldiers.

      The Israeli national singer, the so called "war
      singer", Yaffa Yarkoni, asked then in an interview
      on Israel's military Radio: "didn't they (meaning
      the Germans) do similar things to us?" Yarkoni got
      murder threats from right wing radicals after she
      had asked this question along with her appeal to
      soldiers to refuse to serve. In the beginning
      Karsli was luckier than Yarkoni. He received only
      mild private criticism from his Green colleagues.
      Some weeks later, at the end of April 2002, he
      decided to leave the Green party in a protest
      against its pro-Israel politics (the head of the
      party, the German foreign minister Joschka
      Fischer, had sabotaged proposed sanctions of the
      European Union against Israel). The next day
      Karsli joined the Free Democratic Party (FDP),
      whose deputy leader and a former minister, Juergen
      Moellemann, known for his criticism of Israeli
      policy, propagated a position on the Middle East
      conflict closer to Karsli's.

      In early May, Karsli, in an interview, broke
      another taboo by criticizing the strong influence
      of the Zionist lobby. A ferocious attack was
      launched against him, as his statements were
      considered to be anti Jewish. Juergen Moellemann
      tried to help Karsli and declared that Israel and
      Jewish officials are responsible, through their
      politics, for the rise of Judeophobia (he used the
      word "anti-Semitism").

      This was of course like pouring fuel on an open
      fire. The fierce attacks against Karsli, within
      the context of the ongoing German election
      campaign, were really aimed against the more
      important politician, Moellemann. Karsli himself
      was not interesting enough to have garnered such a
      huge scandal which engaged the German media for

      Through the Karsli affair, Moellemann was ruined.
      He was accused of fishing for votes in brown dark
      waters, meaning votes from fascists. He apologized
      for his statements and refrained from contacts
      with Karsli, but it did not help much. On the
      contrary, he lost the support of many Germans, who
      had seen in him some hope for more honesty within
      the political system, but were anew disappointed
      through his inconsistency and opportunism. Far
      from being right wing radicals, they are fed up
      with the widespread hypocritical Judaeophilia,
      unacceptable and unjustified privileges for Jews
      in Germany and not least the lack of honest and
      significant criticism of Israeli war crimes.
      In a desperate act, Moellemann distributed a flyer
      criticizing Sharon and an important Jewish-German
      representative, Michel Friedman, but stated at the
      same tiime his support for Israel's right to
      exist. This rather moderate leaflet, which could
      have been formulated by Zionists like "Peace Now"
      or Uri Avnery, was first called "anti-Semitic" by
      the German media and then defined "anti Israeli".

      None of the journalists and other persons who
      expressed themselves publicly with negative
      commentary on Moellemann's flyer seemed to have
      read it or to care about its real content. It
      seemed to be forbidden to express another opinion.
      Moellemann's career and life came to an end after
      it was claimed that he financed the flyer with
      dubious money. He parachuted to death and while
      the official version is that it was a suicide,
      there are some who still believe that Moellemann
      was murdered, which in a way he was.

      Following the Karsli and Moelleman affair, the
      frustration in Germany has been growing and many
      people have the feeling that once again, as in the
      Nazi era, one is not allowed to say in public
      obvious and apparent facts. This censorship is
      dangerous in many ways. There is a growing tension
      between private and public opinion. As right wing
      radicals seem almost the only one not to be very
      impressed by the taboos, they stand a better
      chance to profit from the situation and to be able
      to channel the growing frustration. Arabs or
      Muslims who also refuse to obey these taboos are
      in danger of being marginalized like Jamal Karsli
      or even face the possibility of being persecuted.
      In order to help us fight against these very
      dangerous taboos and develop courageous approaches
      based on emancipation, we should try to analyse
      Karsli's two controversial statements:

      1.The Israeli army deploys Nazi methods
      2.The Zionist lobby possesses enormous influence.

      Nazi methods

      There is a strong prohibition on comparing the
      Nazi crimes to almost anything else besides
      another real or imaginary aggression against Jews.
      Any other comparison is considered as playing down
      the Nazi Judeocide and therefore racist.
      This tabooization is a modern version of the old
      judaeocentric concept of "chosenness": Jewish
      suffering is special, and cannot ever be compared
      with other miseries.

      This ban is racist and prevents normal historical
      analysis, as one of the common and important
      principles of scientific method is the use of
      comparison. The comparison as such must not be
      automatically categorized as racist. It might be
      wrong or correct, but should not be forbidden.
      It has to be realized that the Nazi crimes were
      not really unique for Germans as the eternal
      victimizers, or for Jews as the eternal victims.
      There is nothing in the "German" or "Jewish" genes
      that make these people victims or victimizers.
      For example, more than 60 years ago militarism was
      very central in Germany, while today, in this
      society there is a very widespread aversion to
      military conflicts. Conversely, over 100 years ago
      it was rather rare to find a Jewish militarist,
      but today Israel is a modern Sparta, with one of
      the world's most militaristic society.

      In present day Israel, actually more than in many
      other countries including Germany, we can find
      many influential people who would have fit
      perfectly into the Nazi system both in terms of
      ideology and practice. Unique to the Israeli Nazis
      (some of them are victims of the German-Nazis) is
      the desire that the world believe them to be THE
      real anti-Nazis; that they have the right, because
      of past sufferings. to inflict similar or
      dissimilar suffering on other people; that they
      are, by virtue of the suffering of their
      ancestors, beyond reproach.

      There is a common mistake of identifying the Nazi
      crimes only with the industrial extermination of
      Jews as in Auschwitz, disregarding the fact that
      the Nazis acted in many other criminal ways and
      that the plan to build Auschwitz was developed
      only in 1941, while the Nazis came to power in
      1933 and were criminals from the beginning and of
      course acted not only against Jews.

      We should not overlook and play down the
      escalatory character of the Nazi brutality. Till
      1938, for example, they worked towards a so called
      voluntary "transfer" (mass deportation) of the
      Jews out of Germany and employed much less
      violence than Israel today does while pursuing
      similar goals against the Palestinians. The
      Israeli army and the right wing radical gangs
      escalate continuously their violent acts and have
      plans, like the Nazis after 1938, for forced

      Historically, despite all the differences between
      the two situations - Nazi Germany and present
      Israel - there are too many worrisome and obvious
      structural similarities. The fact that there are
      still some democratic traits in Israel today while
      in the 1930s Germany was a dictatorship makes no
      real difference to the victims, for whom the type
      of political system that oppresses and abuses them
      is of no consequence. In fact, the Israeli Jewish
      citizens bear an even greater responsibility than
      did the people of Nazi Germany precisely because
      of these democratic traits. They don't yet have to
      fear the same repercussions as the Germans did
      under the Nazi regime.

      If we consider very strictly Jamal Karsli's
      accusation that the Israeli soldiers used Nazi
      methods by putting numbers on the Palestinian
      captives, we have to admit that there are
      different circumstances involved in the two
      situations and for the Palestinians it was
      actually, in comparison with other Israeli crimes,
      a rather harmless action, which has mainly a
      symbolical value. The numbers were not tattooed in
      the hands of the Palestinians and the captive were
      not (yet) in an extermination camp like Auschwitz.

      On the other hand, many Palestinians currently
      live in Ghettos and concentration camps and as the
      former Israeli education minister, Shulamit Aloni
      pointed out, we don't have to wait till there are
      gas chambers for the Palestinians in order to draw
      such comparisons. We experience already an
      escalating ethnic cleansing of the Palestinians
      and there are no exact figures of casualties due
      to malnutrition, lack of adequate medical care
      etc. Nor are there exact figures on how many
      Palestinians have left their homeland "voluntarily".

      I consider the comparison between the Nazi
      atrocities and the Israeli crimes, despite the
      many differences, not only historically justified,
      but mainly politically necessary, as this is one
      of the important tools to prevent Israel from
      misusing the Nazi Judeocide as a free licence to
      kill, to abuse, to dispossess and to expel the
      Palestinians. This is one of the means to show
      that Israel has no moral right, and actually never
      had, to induce guilt feelings, for example in
      Europe -- guilt feelings among non-Jews that are
      the result of the long history of persecutions
      suffered by the Jews and that Israel and its
      affiliates know perfectly how to play upon and

      Zionist Lobby

      There can be no doubt that the pro-Israel lobbies
      belong to the mightiest in the world. E.g one of
      them, AIPAC (American-Israel Public Affairs
      Committee), is proud of the fact that according to
      Fortune magazine it is for years one of most
      influential power groups in the US. One can read
      it on AIPAC's website and not just in some obscure
      publication of Jew haters.

      In order to find ways to neutralize the
      pro-Zionist lobbies, we are not allowed to
      demonize them. We have to try to understand how
      they function and what are their weaknesses and
      soft points. The tendency to attribute some
      magical powers to them is not only racist, but is
      also self-defeating. It is an additional
      justification for the powerlessness of the people
      who propagate it. You cannot really be successful
      against such an omnipotent and supernatural

      One of the greatest weaknesses of the pro-Israel
      lobbies is that they are usually just groups of
      officials with a very narrow base. There has not
      been a really effective opposition to them because
      too many people, Jews and non-Jews as well,
      believe that Israel defends the Jewish interests
      and can serve as a refuge in case of a second
      Judeocide. This myth, this illusion has to be

      It can be proven how Israel endangers not only the
      Palestinians but also Jews and not only in the
      Middle East. It has to be made widely understood
      that this illusion of life insurance for Jews is
      paid by the sufferings and blood of the
      Palestinians and is in itself a source of danger
      for Jews themselves.

      Israel and its affiliated organizations have been
      pushing very strongly towards the present so
      called anti-terror campaign in general and
      especially towards the US aggression against Iraq;
      activities which have created more dangers rather
      than neutralising or preventing them.

      In the case of Iraq there is no serious evidence
      that Saddam Hussein's regime was, in recent years,
      dangerous to anybody besides the Iraqis
      themselves. Israel was for sure not endangered by
      Iraq and Saddam Hussein signalled several times
      his earnest intentions to achieve an agreement
      with the Zionist state. According to various
      reports in the early '90s he was even ready to
      absorb some of the Palestinian refugees in Iraq in
      order to help to pacify the Palestinian-Israeli

      Just the same, many supporters as well as
      opponents of the Iraq war were, and some still
      are, convinced that this aggression was made in
      order to avert dangers to Israel.

      There were for sure Israeli interests in this war,
      and this expressed itself by the active role that
      the Israeli ruling classes and the affiliated
      Jewish US neocons played in pushing towards this
      military action.

      The name of the game is not more security but more
      instability and thus higher military budgets and
      more income for the US and Israeli military
      industrial complexes (MIC), who are supposed to be
      once again locomotives for their respective
      economies. This unholy alliance might one day come
      to an end and there are even today instances of
      conflict of interest between these partners and
      the Israelis have had to live with some painful
      defeats. For example many jobs in the Israeli
      military industries are in danger, because it is
      cheaper for the Israeli army to get weapons from
      the US for free rather than to buy them locally.
      US military aid to Israel is to a large part a
      subvention to the US military industries, as most
      of the money cannot be expended anywhere else.
      Some Israeli companies try to bypass these
      restrictions through joint ventures with US firms,
      but this does not mean that the production will
      stay in Israel.

      The strong alliance forged between the US and the
      Israeli MICs in 1967 is the main reason for the
      strong influence of the pro-Israel lobbies. Once
      this alliance comes to an end, or the US MIC loses
      substantial political and economical importance,
      this will be the end of the bubble called the
      strong Jewish lobbies and not only in the US.
      * Shraga Elam is an Israeli journalist based in

      2. Fighting Jewish influence in Germany - from a
      rightist mail-serve

      This reminds me of a scene I saw in a movie once,
      where two boxers were fighting it out...one
      fighter was getting badly pounded but a man in the
      audience kept screaming at him 'GO GET HIM'.

      Finally the badly beaten boxer staggered to the
      ringside and said to this one screamer 'YOU GO GET

      That's the answer I get when I talk to my friends
      here in Germany about the subject of fighting
      Jewish influence.

      Younger Germans are really only interested in the
      latest ringing sounds for their mobilephones.

      The older Germans don't want to lose what pension
      they still get...

      We had THREE TV stations showing Holocaust films
      last night and one other TV station showing how
      Prof Haber developed Gas in WW1, and the local
      newspapers are running Anne Frank's book in
      instalments ... Die Welt Newspaper runs at least
      two full pages on Jewish Culture in each edition
      ... Polish TV has KLEZMER music on almost every
      night, it's carpet bombardment of the senses.

      On one local TV programme, a Miss Tina Mendelssohn
      runs a show called KULTUR where EVERY NIGHT she
      manages to get this sentence ...

      HABEN' -when the Germans murdered the European
      Jews - into the show at least once a night, if not

      Who owns most of Germany's TV stations now?

      CHAIM SABAN, a Jewish-American' billionaire ... I
      think Germany is more judaised now than Tel Aviv.


      3. Letter of Joh Domingo to his pro-Palestinian
      friend who was worried by 'anti-Jewish remarks' on
      our list:

      Do you really believe that activists can live on a
      diet of regurgitated statistics of Palestinian
      dead, on wall stories and tales of Israeli
      oppression? We need variety to supplement the
      staple diet.

      There is no danger that genuine Jewish friends of
      Palestine will abandon the Palestinians on account
      of me, although these same Jews seem to be
      implying that there is. So let us look at this
      rationally. If, as has been suggested, Jews are
      repelled by 'anti-Semitic' imagery, why do they
      then hive to repel any suggestion of

      Clearly, anti-Semitism attracts Jews if only to
      rush to the breach. To attract bees, nectar; to
      attract Jews, anti-Semitism.

      What a disappointment it must be to then find a
      group sitting around laughing at the ridiculous
      spectacle of a hive rushing to defend Jews
      from...what? Nobody is dropping bombs on Jews from
      60,000 ft. Nobody is imprisoning them in ghettos.
      I know that you are well aware of these things,
      and you also know how hard I have tried to hate
      Jews; but it is impossible, it is like trying to
      hate stuckinsamsara's baby Harp seals - all cute
      and cuddly. So, I can only assume that you are
      concerned that my reputation will alienate Jews
      from listening to what I might say, but the
      opposite is the case. I find that more and more
      Jews are in the circle; to the point where I don't
      concern myself about who is a Jew or not.

      Ridicule is the essence of my kind of Nationalism
      and is the key IMV to alienating Jews from their
      leaders - the wrong kind. That is why Jewish
      leaders desperately manufacture real incidents of
      'anti-Semitism'. The burning of crosses on Jewish
      homes and the self-inflicted knife wounds of

      To analyze 'anti-Semitism', one would be struck at
      the absurdity of likening an act of ethnocentric
      ridicule to the worst excesses of Hitler; but it
      is done constantly. It is not permitted compare
      Israel to the Nazi regime, but it is permitted to
      call me a Nazi.

      I search in vain for real acts of anti-Semitism,
      but it almost does not exist outside acts of
      political terror. Carlos the Jackal tries to kill
      a Jew in London; an act of political terror. Black
      September kills nine Israeli Olympians; an act of
      political terror. A wheelchair bound Jew is cast
      into the sea; an act of political terror. Do you
      see the pattern? Never enraged mobs destroying a
      Jewish neighbourhood, or the KKK lynching a Jew,
      just because he is a Jew. No Jew is ever attacked
      because of holocaust denial. It would be more
      relevant if anti-Semitism were colour-coded.

      An absence of anti-Semitism is philo-Semitism. We
      are being placed in the absurd position of
      agitating for Palestinian rights by preaching love
      for the Jews. This is supposed to cause people to
      identify with the cause, and demand what is right?
      Did Britain not preach that the Kaiser was
      bayoneting Belgium children; in order to agitate
      for American intervention in WWI? Was not the Hun
      painted as a beast in order to gain solidarity
      against the Nazis? Did Saddam not empty the
      incubators of premature children? Yet, we are
      expected to mobilize opinion against saints. No,
      people must know that Sharon drinks the blood of
      Palestinian children, and Jews better know that
      they support the drinking of the blood of
      Palestinian children. It is true, what does it
      matter that they don't really feast, but merely

      This kind of rhetoric is supposed to be beyond the
      pale; beyond civilized discourse, but that is only
      an assertion. I can assure you that it is the
      daily fare in Washington and Tel Aviv. Only the
      subject is not Jews, but Muslims and anti-Semites
      It is not a question of being a bridge between
      Jews and non-Jews; It is a question of being
      stalwart, a rampart, over which Jews must scale,
      in order to be on the right side. Many Jews have
      done so already, why not you?




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