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Re: [worldlanglist] Re: Worldlang unification

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  • Stephen Rice
    ... It is an illusion. C. S. Lewis wrote of a man trying to get a conclusion in the imperative mood out of premisses in the indicative mood: and though he
    Message 1 of 11 , Apr 11, 2012
      On 4/11/12, lingwadeplaneta <lingwadeplaneta@...> wrote:

      > --- In worldlanglist@yahoogroups.com, risto@... wrote:

      > Looks like you have an idea that via a certain thorough research one can dig
      > out a certain "objective" worldlang, not dependent on personal whims, and
      > that such an objective, "scientific" approach will persuade more people to
      > use the resulting language, and that generally this is the only serious way
      > to go and to achieve something great.
      > You may be right, but it may also be an illusion.

      It is an illusion. C. S. Lewis wrote of a man "trying to get a
      conclusion in the imperative mood out of premisses in the indicative
      mood: and though he continues trying to all eternity he cannot
      succeed, for the thing is impossible."
      http://www.columbia.edu/cu/augustine/arch/lewis/abolition2.htm

      Science yields answers in the indicative: mere statements of fact. The
      axioms and goals that make such statements meaningful and useful are
      not among its findings.

      Even slightly differing
      > approaches may give very different results. Perhaps there may be many
      > "well-founded and indisputable" worldlangs.

      The last time I looked, the lot of you couldn't even agree what
      "neutrality" was. How, then, can you agree on methods to achieve it,
      even if you begin with the same data? Further, Risto believes in
      lexical quotas; the rest of you really don't. How can you possibly
      generate similar lexicons with such dissimilar starting points?

      Further, Pandunia is still in its early stages, so even a major
      lexical overhaul wouldn't hurt it. LdP has the beginnings of a corpus
      and some users. It's a bit late to make core changes, and it would be
      worse by the time the potential changes were identified, because even
      if people were as keen for the job as Risto thinks, it would still
      take considerable time.

      There is a tide in the affairs of men.
      Which, taken at the flood, leads on to fortune;
      Omitted, all the voyage of their life
      Is bound in shallows and in miseries.
      On such a full sea are we now afloat,
      And we must take the current when it serves,
      Or lose our ventures.
      Julius Caesar Act 4, scene 3, 218–224

      LdP wouldn't have to wait long to lose the tide. So while it would be
      nice to have the kind of lexical agreement typical of westlangs,
      worldlangs will have to get along without it--which unfortunately does
      somewhat diminish their appeal.

      Steve
    • risto@kupsala.net
      Okay, seems like this idea is not getting any wind. Let s continue with the same old we are divided but willing to conquer tactics then. -- Risto
      Message 2 of 11 , Apr 12, 2012
        Okay, seems like this idea is not getting any wind. Let's continue with
        the same old "we are divided but willing to conquer" tactics then.
        -- Risto
      • Jens Wilkinson
        I m writing from my phone so I won t make this very long. I don t mind doing some more work on the language we were working on, but who else do you hope to
        Message 3 of 11 , Apr 12, 2012
          I'm writing from my phone so I won't make this very long. I don't mind doing some more work on the language we were working on, but who else do you hope to involve?

          Incidentally, I don't personally feel that the engineering aspects are so key. I think it's more an issue of: what does this language offer that is special and fun? No engineering brilliance is likely to convince people to go away from Enlish and other big natural languages.

          Sent from my iPhone

          On 2012/04/12, at 18:23, risto@... wrote:

          > Okay, seems like this idea is not getting any wind. Let's continue with
          > the same old "we are divided but willing to conquer" tactics then.
          > -- Risto
          >
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