Re: [wpmac] Printing in SheepShaver
- This just appeared as I worked to send some 'perspective' insight which might help. Brief, to augment:
1. What does the Adobe driver provide in terms of function / productivity gains over LW 8? Only the 'auto' step in Adobe driver? None should know better than you, but no option for a scripted 'one-step' for the entirety? Is the LW 8 driver amenable to a small hack such as re-ordering the driver script to effect 'Print to File' as the default action?
2. My comments focused on two ABSOLUTE issues with the Adobe driver:
- an unknown ppd encoding error from the Adobe driver can obstruct on the OS X side + prove to be frustratingly variable with diff printers midst a group such as this. (Believe..... it is NOT one problem. Worked on and off for a year ++ to solve analogous gremlins during the analogous 'Classic' phase of OS X evolution. Begrudgingly solved with LW 8 even though Adobe was "King' of postscript during that era. A foregone certainty: while you might solve for your specific needs, the Adobe drivers will trip other participants.) You and others earned accolades for this effort with SS to return WP to a modern setting. My experience (plus that of many others) suggests a need to avoid the Adobe driver and package with a flowpath advantageous with the best of current OS X drivers. Current is a MOVING TARGET if WP is to continue 'Off to the Future'. LW 8 may be an inelegant 'stone' by today's standards, but it is a rock of proven reliability.
- not clear to me exactly where your 'hang' occurs, but accent my general advice to eliminate some problems on the output end with CUPS in the context of: 'We should try to learn from the mistakes of others. Few live long enough to make them all by ourselves.'
On Jul 4, 2010, at 2:59 PM, jrethorst wrote:
> N.B. the Laserwriter 8 and Adobe PS drivers are very similar, but the L8 requires you to choose Print to File each time you print, so the Adobe is one step more convenient.
> I should be able to figure out what's wrong with the Adobe setup, although curious that this didn't seem to start having trouble until the most recent version of SS-WP.
> IIRC Geoff Gilbert switched to the L8 driver sometime earlier because of trouble with the Adobe. Geoff, have you ever figured out the cause for that?
> John R.
> --- In email@example.com, jrethorst <no_reply@...> wrote:
> > > I happen to have a copy of LaserWriter 8.7.3 so I put it in the
> > > Extensions folder.
> > There's also a copy, as "LaserWriter_8.6.1.smi.bin", in the Files section here.
> > John R.
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- Steve Kane wrote:
>I installed the Chooser you uploaded into the Apple Menu Items folder.The LaserWriter 8 driver was not in the Extensions folder, but I
happen to have a copy of LaserWriter 8.7.3 so I put it in the
> . . .Let me know, as it will help troubleshooting the Adobe driver.
>I'll bet it will work now.
Bill Hunter wrote;
>1. What does the Adobe driver provide in terms of function / productivitygains over LW 8? Only the 'auto' step in Adobe driver? None should know better
than you, but no option for a scripted 'one-step' for the entirety? Is the LW 8
driver amenable to a small hack such as re-ordering the driver script to effect
'Print to File' as the default action?
I don't see a way to script the driver. I'll look for the hack. Thanks for the idea. BTW Bill good to see you back.
- John -
Don't see an easy way to respond personally, so the 'party line' is free to listen in....... (Grew up in VERY rural environs, thus know all about 8 people listening into every call I made to a girlfriend.)
Thanks for the 'welcome back' note albeit that in various ways, I never left.
#1. I was mentally fatigued from all the talking-heads pontificating minus any semblance of wisdom. The List began to threaten the peaceful sleep of even Sir Francis...... As we know, a plethora of SUPERB word processing software and ancillary apps integrated for PRODUCTIVITY suddenly presented constructive and creative alternatives for WP Mac. Whence, the question evolved more to what type of hammer is optimum for a given 'nail' rather than some rant or opine re the 'Best' and endless arguments over the silly.
#2. Even a Ferrari fails to offer a ride when the tires are flat, i.e. Jobs has been a force with vision re 'Where do you REALLY want to go' rather than an endless email / public debate rant. Those still stuck with the 20th Century concept of the all-in-all word processor have 'flat tires'.
Re these two points:
1. Thinking linked with communicating: I lauded your intended therein a post of the recent NYT article re Apple. Then.......... almost crawled back into the shadows as the rant ensued rather than building upon wisdom. Each to their own, but perceive a pontification re burning rubber with their old 'Blue and White' Mac to generate only a black mark on the pavement of WP for a productive environment. The ARROW OF TIME is uni-dimensional...... FORWARD. Need I say more??? Despite your distributiona of the excellent journalism. I can not be the only one who 'crouches in the corner' when the INBOX fills with trivial responses to your efforts. Refer members whom thus lust to Twitter.
"Wise men talk because they have something to say; fools, because they have to say something." (Believe thus was from Plato.)
2. WP is NOT.....: WP is NOT to become a reincarnated tour de force. AMEN. Nothing 'half-bakes' a goose quicker than self-marketing which fails to deliver the tender meat of it all. Complete with the 'Apple in the kitchen', the modern Mac odor is resplendent with Apple-X. OTOH, objective assessment certifies WP to be a PRODUCTIVITY tool if the advocates offer facts and function. Nothing from the OS 9 era is better than the OS serving as the foundation, ipso facto. That you and others invested to provide a 'functional' OS emulator via SS deserves kudos from those experienced with WP, especially those burdened with a vast legacy of OS 9 files generated in WP - - - e.g. me. Plain and simple: I credit and appreciate your efforts to energize WP Mac within the context of the modern OS 10.6 Mac, versatility in a tool bag rather than only a 'best' word processor. Your collective efforts have enriched many.
Now, how can the collective efforts continue to enhance this 'market position' for WP? First, maintain a realistic perspective on what WP can and, better yet, can not do, midst this entirely different era of options for communication (not just 'typing'). Reflecting on such, I strongly suggest a focus on software / OS issues which restrain the current use of WP Mac as a synergistic and specialized tool rather than the 'best' via a bullhorn. In this context, I sent a couple of emails today (which have yet to appear) focused on 'How to first ask the question re the printing issues.' You will note that I avoided any knee-jerk tithe of 'THE' solution. Funny that I took this approach when the thread was gelling for 'THE ANSWER'. Geoff restoreth my soul........ l had no more than posted an overview emphasizing: ONE SOLUTION DOES NOT EXIST FOR THIS PRINTING ISSUE, dba 'Adobe driver', etc. I did offer several factors and practical solutions - - - starting with CUPS - - whence the individual can tailor their creative solution. Geoff cited the formatting issue in an older document which is intractably linked to the root / ppd for your issue(s). Each to their own, but NOTHING is more of a time waste than trying to deal with a distorted format while trying to print an older document. This was one of the major issues I tried to address which evolved into an assessment that LW 8 is the Gold Standard for OS 9 printing. Cited problems are like genetics, "variable penetrance". Don't waste time on finding an 'ideal' solution. (Perhaps you can recall the specifics, but remember that ~ LW v. 8.6 was a benchmark in polishing that print driver, especially for format preservation issues. At least for Geoff, suggest using the 'newest' LW 8 driver available - - - 8.7 ??. I have a complete set of the OS 9 software and will search if a desired.) It amazes me how poorly even the local Apple gurus - - many of whom are UNIX Geeks - - understand the importance of the end printer hardware driver in this conundrum and the priceless value of CUPS - - which Apple now owns and supports as open source. Believe...... you can drive the document out of OS 9 with the smoothest B & J milkshake, but unless coupled with the driver for the specific printer being used, WP will get 'blamed' for the distortions or non-print. For OS 10.5 or later, first install the latest version of CUPS. Finally, I am, amazed at the lack of anyone mentioning the SIMPLE for old documents which perplex. Copy and Paste into one of many OS X applications including PDF Pen is cheaper than aspirin and quicker than a search for the bottle. BELIEVE...... Despite unreserved respect for your talents and HARD WORK, not even John Rethorst will solve all these printing goobers. Offer yourself, Geoff and the entire group a 'reference list', pathways for going around the brick printer wall rather than head crashing - - - WP will thrive, but printing is essential.
You are unlikely to hear other than silence from me re the 'cookbook' solutions. The power of the WWW. to MacIntiouch, etc., etc. negates any value of time required to re-type. OTOH, your unique value is in continued LEADERSHIP and CREATIVITY for customized solutions using a paradigm tool employed intelligently rather than as the once and former 'Ultimate Monkey Wrench'. . Shall be pleased to offer where I can help. For the nth time...... Kudos.
ADDENDUM: Have not done 'open chest surgery' on an OS 9 file in years so I'm not the one to ask. OTOH, I do this type of thing with OS X on a routine basis. In this case would be optimistic that the optional code for printing to a virtual file can be moved / substituted for the 'default' Print command. Loss of many productive hours says that for 'off to the future', avoid the Adobe driver.
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I haven't been able to get Adobe PS to work with SheepShaver for months - crashes every time. LaserWriter8 works, and the virtual printer can be set by hand to default to sending the output file to the correct folder in OS X. Unfortunately, the user has to set the default folder by hand, at least on the 7.5.5-based system that I've been working with.
I wish it were possible to get the Adobe PS driver to work, but I don't see any way to do it. Like you, I can't imagine why it's stopped working.
--- In firstname.lastname@example.org, jrethorst <no_reply@...> wrote:
> Let me know, as it will help troubleshooting the Adobe driver.
- Let me eat my words. I found a SheepShaver setup on my disk based on OS 8.6, in which Adobe PS successfully sends printer output to a file on OS X. I don't have WordPerfect on that setup, however, so I don't know if WordPerfect itself is getting in the way.
--- In email@example.com, "em315" <em315@...> wrote:
> I haven't been able to get Adobe PS to work with SheepShaver for months - crashes every time. LaserWriter8 works, and the virtual printer can be set by hand to default to sending the output file to the correct folder in OS X. Unfortunately, the user has to set the default folder by hand, at least on the 7.5.5-based system that I've been working with.
> I wish it were possible to get the Adobe PS driver to work, but I don't see any way to do it. Like you, I can't imagine why it's stopped working.
> --- In firstname.lastname@example.org, jrethorst <no_reply@> wrote:
> > Let me know, as it will help troubleshooting the Adobe driver.