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Re: [wpmac] Re: Two quick sheepshaver questions (re install download)

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  • Bart Borghuis
    John, from your **excellent** SS installer package, is it possible to upgrade to an OS greater than 7.5? Also, i have trouble sharing files - when i copy a
    Message 1 of 16 , Oct 30 7:18 AM
      John,

      from your **excellent** SS installer package, is it
      possible to upgrade to an OS greater than 7.5?
      Also, i have trouble sharing files - when i copy a
      file into my Documents folder in OSX, sometimes it
      shows up on the Unix drive in Classic, sometimes it
      appears on the Classic desktop, but often i don't see
      it in Classic at all. Same for CDroms, when entered,
      once it mounted in Classic, the rest of the time it
      didn't - even the same disk, under apparently same
      conditions.
      Any hints would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!

      bart


      --- John Rethorst <jrethorst@...> wrote:

      > --- In wordperfectmac@yahoogroups.com, "ted_m_p_lee"
      > <tmplee@...> wrote:
      >
      > > 1. Several have noted that it runs on PPC's, just
      > not very well. What
      > > does "not very well" mean? (I guess someone also
      > wrote "not as smooth")
      >
      > When you first start up SS on PPC, a dialog says
      > it's crashed. Click Close,
      > and it loads fine. No other issues TIKO.
      >
      > John R.
      >
      >


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    • Mike Robbins
      Once the package is installed, with the included MacOS 7.5, what is the latest version of the MacOS which can be installed on top of it? (2 GHz Intel Core Duo,
      Message 2 of 16 , Oct 30 7:45 AM
        Once the package is installed, with the included MacOS 7.5, what is
        the latest version of the MacOS which can be installed on top of it?

        (2 GHz Intel Core Duo, 1 GB memory, OS 10.4.10)

        Mike Robbins
        Los Angeles


        On Oct 29, 2007, at 6:57 PM, ted_m_p_lee wrote:

        > --- In wordperfectmac@yahoogroups.com, "ted_m_p_lee" <tmplee@...>
        > wrote:
        > >
        > > I'm not at any of my Macs at the moment, or I'd be able to answer
        > one
        > > of these questions by myself, but it still might be useful to
        > have the
        > > answers here.
        > >
        > > 1. Several have noted that it runs on PPC's, just not very well.
        > What
        > > does "not very well" mean? (I guess someone also wrote "not as
        > smooth")
        > >
        > > 2. I gather that sheepshaver volume.dmg contains a complete
        > version of
        > > MacOS -- out of curiosity, what version?
        > >
        >
        > OK, got one of my questions answered -- I downloaded the
        > installation package and see that
        > it's 7.5. Too busy right now to try to install it though. Probably
        > tomorrow.
        >
        > Ted Lee
        > Minnetonka, MN
        >
      • ted_m_p_lee
        ... well. What ... smooth ) ... Click Close, ... (I deleted my first reply to this because it was badly formatted, but not before it made it out on the email
        Message 3 of 16 , Oct 30 8:00 AM
          --- In wordperfectmac@yahoogroups.com, "John Rethorst"
          <jrethorst@...> wrote:
          >
          > --- In wordperfectmac@yahoogroups.com, "ted_m_p_lee" <tmplee@>
          wrote:
          >
          > > 1. Several have noted that it runs on PPC's, just not very
          well. What
          > > does "not very well" mean? (I guess someone also wrote "not as
          smooth")
          >
          > When you first start up SS on PPC, a dialog says it's crashed.
          Click Close,
          > and it loads fine. No other issues TIKO.
          >
          > John R.
          >

          (I deleted my first reply to this because it was badly formatted, but
          not before it made it out on the email distribution.)

          I'm impressed -- it installed easily and seems to work fine. I had
          one minor problem and one possibly major one. Acrobat Reader (to
          read the postscript files in the distribution) requires Carbonlib and
          that particular "extension" isn't enabled as installed -- an easy
          fix. The more major problem is that figures (drawings) don't always
          seem to show up. If you look at the "regular expression search doc"
          (If I'm remembering the name right) using WP under SheepShaver the
          figures come up blank -- there is space for them and if you click on
          them the drawing tools come up, but there's nothing there. The same
          file when opened with WP under Classic looks fine. On the other hand,
          figures in some other WP documents seem to look OK under SheepShaver.

          The "JIT Compiler" screen doesn't look exactly like the one described
          in the instructions -- there is no "JIT Compiler" checkbox, but there
          is a checkbox with something like "68K emulator (experimental)" next
          to it.

          This is on my PowerBook G4 under 10.4.7., using the distribution
          found on the Links page. (Naturally I'm contemplating getting Leopard
          and I don't like the idea of having to be able to boot back into
          Tiger just to run classic.)

          Ted Lee
          Minnetonka, MN
        • Bob Stern
          ... Same with my G4. To get the JIT Compiler checkbox, go to the WordPerfect Yahoo group Files download page, open the SheepShaver folder, and download the
          Message 4 of 16 , Oct 30 8:30 AM
            >ted_m_p_lee wrote:
            >
            >The "JIT Compiler" screen doesn't look exactly like the one
            >described in the instructions -- there is no "JIT Compiler"
            >checkbox, but there is a checkbox with something like "68K emulator
            >(experimental)" next to it.

            Same with my G4.

            To get the "JIT Compiler" checkbox, go to the WordPerfect Yahoo group
            Files download page, open the SheepShaver folder, and download the
            file "SheepShaverPrefs.zip". The rightmost tab has the checkbox.
            Warning: I found that setting the location of "SheepShaver
            volume.dmg" with the latter utility does not work. You have to use
            the original SS GUI utility for that.
            --

            Bob Stern
          • ted_m_p_lee
            ... emulator ... group ... Can you see the figures in the file I mentioned if you open them with WP under sheepshaver? Ted Lee Minnetonka, MN
            Message 5 of 16 , Oct 30 8:53 AM
              --- In wordperfectmac@yahoogroups.com, Bob Stern <bob_stern@...>
              wrote:
              >
              > >ted_m_p_lee wrote:
              > >
              > >The "JIT Compiler" screen doesn't look exactly like the one
              > >described in the instructions -- there is no "JIT Compiler"
              > >checkbox, but there is a checkbox with something like "68K
              emulator
              > >(experimental)" next to it.
              >
              > Same with my G4.
              >
              > To get the "JIT Compiler" checkbox, go to the WordPerfect Yahoo
              group
              > Files download page, open the SheepShaver folder, and download the
              > file "SheepShaverPrefs.zip". The rightmost tab has the checkbox.
              > Warning: I found that setting the location of "SheepShaver
              > volume.dmg" with the latter utility does not work. You have to use
              > the original SS GUI utility for that.
              > --
              >

              Can you see the figures in the file I mentioned if you open them with
              WP under sheepshaver?

              Ted Lee
              Minnetonka, MN
            • ted_m_p_lee
              ... emulator ... group ... I took a look at some of the SheepShaver references and understand why the JIT Compiler check box doesn t show up on a G4 -- it
              Message 6 of 16 , Oct 30 9:26 AM
                --- In wordperfectmac@yahoogroups.com, Bob Stern <bob_stern@...>
                wrote:
                >
                > >ted_m_p_lee wrote:
                > >
                > >The "JIT Compiler" screen doesn't look exactly like the one
                > >described in the instructions -- there is no "JIT Compiler"
                > >checkbox, but there is a checkbox with something like "68K
                emulator
                > >(experimental)" next to it.
                >
                > Same with my G4.
                >
                > To get the "JIT Compiler" checkbox, go to the WordPerfect Yahoo
                group
                > Files download page, open the SheepShaver folder, and download the
                > file "SheepShaverPrefs.zip". The rightmost tab has the checkbox.
                > Warning: I found that setting the location of "SheepShaver
                > volume.dmg" with the latter utility does not work. You have to use
                > the original SS GUI utility for that.

                I took a look at some of the SheepShaver references and understand
                why the JIT Compiler check box doesn't show up on a G4 -- it doesn't
                need to. The JIT Compiler helps emulate a PPC when running on other
                platforms -- when running on a G4 code runs natively and doesn't need
                it. So my comment about coals to newcastle somewhere needs to be
                withdrawn: on a PPC you aren't emulating a PPC -- you're using it.
                So except for whatever it takes to do the display stuff I suspect WP
                will run just as fast under SheepShaver on a PPC as it does under
                Classic, although the documentation hints there is optimization for
                some display operations too.

                Ted Lee
                Minnetonka, MN
              • John Rethorst
                ... Sure. SS supports up to 9.0.4. Future development may support later versions. ... The file should show up on the unix drive within several seconds. I don t
                Message 7 of 16 , Oct 30 6:16 PM
                  --- In wordperfectmac@yahoogroups.com, Bart Borghuis <bartborghuis@...> wrote:

                  > from your **excellent** SS installer package, is it
                  > possible to upgrade to an OS greater than 7.5?

                  Sure. SS supports up to 9.0.4. Future development may
                  support later versions.

                  > Also, i have trouble sharing files - when i copy a
                  > file into my Documents folder in OSX, sometimes it
                  > shows up on the Unix drive in Classic, sometimes it
                  > appears on the Classic desktop, but often i don't see
                  > it in Classic at all.

                  The file should show up on the unix drive within several
                  seconds. I don't know how often SS polls the transfer
                  folder. After copying the file into your OSX Documents
                  folder, wait five seconds, then close and open the unix
                  disk in SS.

                  > Same for CDroms, when entered,
                  > once it mounted in Classic, the rest of the time it
                  > didn't - even the same disk, under apparently same
                  > conditions.

                  I'm clueless there, not having worked with CDs in SS.
                  Restarting SS, though tedious, should work. I'll look
                  around for discussion of this.

                  John R.
                • John Rethorst
                  ... Thanks for pointing that out. It will be enabled in the updated install. ... I know about this, and haven t been able to troubleshoot it yet. I think that
                  Message 8 of 16 , Oct 30 6:40 PM
                    --- In wordperfectmac@yahoogroups.com, "ted_m_p_lee" <tmplee@...> wrote:

                    > I'm impressed -- it installed easily and seems to work fine. I had
                    > one minor problem and one possibly major one. Acrobat Reader (to
                    > read the postscript files in the distribution) requires Carbonlib and
                    > that particular "extension" isn't enabled as installed -- an easy
                    > fix.

                    Thanks for pointing that out. It will be enabled in the updated install.

                    > The more major problem is that figures (drawings) don't always
                    > seem to show up. If you look at the "regular expression search doc"
                    > (If I'm remembering the name right) using WP under SheepShaver the
                    > figures come up blank -- there is space for them and if you click on
                    > them the drawing tools come up, but there's nothing there. The same
                    > file when opened with WP under Classic looks fine. On the other hand,
                    > figures in some other WP documents seem to look OK under SheepShaver.

                    I know about this, and haven't been able to troubleshoot it yet. I think
                    that documents I made using OSX and Classic have screenshots made
                    with the OSX default PNG (Portable Network Graphic) format, which I'm
                    guessing came along later than OS 7.5. Earlier documents have
                    screenshots in PICT format. The PNG screenshots will be fixed.

                    John R.
                  • ted_m_p_lee
                    ... OK, makes sense. I wouldn t necessarily say it s a problem with the documents, but with having bits and pieces of the system from so many different
                    Message 9 of 16 , Oct 30 7:02 PM
                      --- In wordperfectmac@yahoogroups.com, "John Rethorst" <jrethorst@...>
                      wrote:
                      >
                      > --- In wordperfectmac@yahoogroups.com, "ted_m_p_lee" <tmplee@> wrote:
                      >
                      >
                      > > The more major problem is that figures (drawings) don't always
                      > > seem to show up. If you look at the "regular expression search doc"
                      > > (If I'm remembering the name right) using WP under SheepShaver the
                      > > figures come up blank -- there is space for them and if you click on
                      > > them the drawing tools come up, but there's nothing there. The same
                      > > file when opened with WP under Classic looks fine. On the other hand,
                      > > figures in some other WP documents seem to look OK under SheepShaver.
                      >
                      > I know about this, and haven't been able to troubleshoot it yet. I think
                      > that documents I made using OSX and Classic have screenshots made
                      > with the OSX default PNG (Portable Network Graphic) format, which I'm
                      > guessing came along later than OS 7.5. Earlier documents have
                      > screenshots in PICT format. The PNG screenshots will be fixed.
                      >
                      > John R.
                      >

                      OK, makes sense. I wouldn't necessarily say it's a problem with the
                      documents, but with having bits and pieces of the system from so many
                      different versions around! (I noticed that most if not all of the
                      extensions in the distribution come from 8.x)

                      Thanks for all your hard work.

                      Ted Lee
                      Minnetonka, MN
                    • Bob Stern
                      ... There are quite a few extensions and control panels that can be moved to a Disabled folder, which should speed up OS 7.5 somewhat. (Delete all files
                      Message 10 of 16 , Oct 30 11:03 PM
                        >ted_m_p_lee wrote:
                        >
                        >I wouldn't necessarily say it's a problem with the documents, but
                        >with having bits and pieces of the system from so many different
                        >versions around! (I noticed that most if not all of the extensions
                        >in the distribution come from 8.x)

                        There are quite a few extensions and control panels that can be moved
                        to a Disabled folder, which should speed up OS 7.5 somewhat. (Delete
                        all files beginning with these words.)

                        Extensions:
                        Apple Guide
                        Apple QD3D
                        Color Sync
                        Control Strip
                        Default Calibrator
                        Fax
                        MacOS Tutorial
                        MacinTalk
                        Macintosh Guide
                        Printer Share
                        QuickDraw
                        QuickTime
                        Speech

                        Control Panels:
                        Apple Menu Options
                        Control Strip
                        General Controls
                        PrintChoice
                        QuickTime
                        + any of the third-party control panels you don't want
                        --

                        Bob Stern
                      • ted_m_p_lee
                        ... I actually don t have any complaints about the speed (not that I tried anything terribly compute bound.) In fact, it seemed to me that
                        Message 11 of 16 , Oct 31 7:34 AM
                          --- In wordperfectmac@yahoogroups.com, Bob Stern <bob_stern@...> wrote:
                          >
                          > >ted_m_p_lee wrote:
                          > >
                          > >I wouldn't necessarily say it's a problem with the documents, but
                          > >with having bits and pieces of the system from so many different
                          > >versions around! (I noticed that most if not all of the extensions
                          > >in the distribution come from 8.x)
                          >
                          > There are quite a few extensions and control panels that can be moved
                          > to a Disabled folder, which should speed up OS 7.5 somewhat. (Delete
                          > all files beginning with these words.)
                          >
                          <snip>

                          I actually don't have any complaints about the speed (not that I tried
                          anything terribly compute bound.) In fact, it seemed to me that
                          sheepshaver/OS 7.5 loaded faster than Classic does.

                          Note to John on the pictures problem: I was digging around the help
                          files (under the help menu) in your installation package to remind me
                          how to go about rebuilding the desktop and discovered that the
                          pictures in those files don't show either -- presumably there are
                          pictures showing what what the key combinations are but the space where
                          they should be is blank. I didn't take the time to look, but I'm
                          guessing those help files came from a later version than 7.5 too.

                          But that does raise the question: how do you force 7.5 (or whatever)
                          to rebuild the desktop under SheepShaver? It tried various key
                          combinations that I vaguely remembered while it was booting and they
                          didn't seem to make any difference.

                          Ted Lee
                          Minnetonka, MN
                        • John Rethorst
                          ... My two machines are a 1.25 ghz G4 iMac (PPC) and MacBook Pro with Intel Core Duo (not Core Duo 2). I ran a spellcheck on a 48,000 word document with
                          Message 12 of 16 , Nov 1, 2007
                            --- In wordperfectmac@yahoogroups.com, "ted_m_p_lee" <tmplee@...>
                            wrote:

                            > I actually don't have any complaints about the speed
                            > (not that I tried anything terribly compute bound.)
                            > In fact, it seemed to me that sheepshaver/OS 7.5 loaded
                            > faster than Classic does.

                            My two machines are a 1.25 ghz G4 iMac (PPC) and
                            MacBook Pro with Intel Core Duo (not Core Duo 2). I
                            ran a spellcheck on a 48,000 word document with footnotes
                            that had no misspellings, so WP went through the
                            document without stopping for user input. The check
                            took 16 seconds on PPC and 20 seconds on Intel, but
                            all Macintoshes for sale now have the next generation
                            Intel chip, the Core Duo 2, so I'd imagine that WP
                            is generally faster with that chip and SheepShaver than
                            in Classic.

                            > But that does raise the question: how do you force
                            > 7.5 (or whatever) to rebuild the desktop under
                            > SheepShaver? It tried various key combinations
                            > that I vaguely remembered while it was booting and they
                            > didn't seem to make any difference.

                            I included an Applescript applet named something like
                            (I'm not at home now) "Desktop Reset" for this purpose.
                            It's in the Utilities folder.

                            John R.
                          • ted_m_p_lee
                            ... Thanks for pointing that out John. There sure is an embarrassment of riches in what you ve packaged up! Ted Lee Minnetonka, MN
                            Message 13 of 16 , Nov 2, 2007
                              --- In wordperfectmac@yahoogroups.com, "John Rethorst" <jrethorst@...>
                              wrote:
                              >
                              >>
                              > I included an Applescript applet named something like
                              > (I'm not at home now) "Desktop Reset" for this purpose.
                              > It's in the Utilities folder.
                              >

                              Thanks for pointing that out John. There sure is an embarrassment of
                              riches in what you've packaged up!

                              Ted Lee
                              Minnetonka, MN
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