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  • John Rethorst
    ... Now, IMHO, we re very respectable here. But I couldn t sleep last night, wondering what we re doing wrong. John R.
    Message 1 of 23 , Jul 6, 2006
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      I received this post yesterday:

      > Okay, What is this?! I was just looking for a way to get
      > wordperfect for mac on my laptop since it has that useless
      > text program as an excuse for decency. I joined this
      > "group" thinkn' that I would be able to hear something
      > about downloading mac wordperfect, but apparently not. I
      > have no idea what anyone is talkn' aboutor what the point
      > of this group really is. So can someone please send me a
      > working link that can send me to the approprate program so
      > I can get out of this mess? If not, maybe you could refer
      > me to a respectable group.

      > Email me about it because I don't know how to navigate
      > myself through this site either.

      Now, IMHO, we're very respectable here. But I couldn't sleep
      last night, wondering what we're doing wrong.

      John R.
    • John Sandel
      Well, just speaking for myself AND THE REST OF THE SANE WORLD, I d say your principal fault lies in not buying into this lonely person s psychodrama, for which
      Message 2 of 23 , Jul 6, 2006
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        Well, just speaking for myself AND THE REST OF THE SANE WORLD, I'd
        say your principal fault lies in not buying into this lonely person's
        psychodrama, for which you are to be commended.

        Life's too short, man.

        JS



        On Jul 6, 2006, at 9:49 PM, John Rethorst wrote:

        > I received this post yesterday:
        >
        >> Okay, What is this?! I was just looking for a way to get
        >> wordperfect for mac on my laptop since it has that useless
        >> text program as an excuse for decency. I joined this
        >> "group" thinkn' that I would be able to hear something
        >> about downloading mac wordperfect, but apparently not. I
        >> have no idea what anyone is talkn' aboutor what the point
        >> of this group really is. So can someone please send me a
        >> working link that can send me to the approprate program so
        >> I can get out of this mess? If not, maybe you could refer
        >> me to a respectable group.
        >
        >> Email me about it because I don't know how to navigate
        >> myself through this site either.
        >
        > Now, IMHO, we're very respectable here. But I couldn't sleep
        > last night, wondering what we're doing wrong.
        >
        > John R.
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------
        > ~-->
        > Yahoo! Groups gets a make over. See the new email design.
        > http://us.click.yahoo.com/XISQkA/lOaOAA/yQLSAA/dkFolB/TM
        > --------------------------------------------------------------------
        > ~->
        >
        >
        > Yahoo! Groups Links
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
      • Phillip Jones, C.E.T.
        If he is a new adopter of a Mac. He expects a Mac Version of WP just like on the other Computer OS s out their on other platforms. So he comes to a group so
        Message 3 of 23 , Jul 7, 2006
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          If he is a new adopter of a Mac. He expects a Mac Version of WP just
          like on the other Computer OS's out their on other platforms.

          So he comes to a group so named about WordPerfect Mac and expects
          information on WordPerfect Mac.

          Unfortunately Corel has been scared stiff by the 900 pound Gorilla named
          Microsoft. So there is none for the OSX Platform of Mac.

          So we are talking about, MS Office, OpenOffice, Nesus Writer, and
          different emulators.

          So what is he to say. I am not mad at you. I've become a Pragmatist just
          as everyone else and am resigned to not having WordPerfect on a Mac. 16
          months ago I bought a 17" PowerBook fully load with 2 Gb memory. I can't
          afford to buy another, unless I could Trade. And my next upgrade would
          be a new Desktop machine anyway as I am still using a G4-500.

          So I am stuck like everyone else. I've been a diehard mac person since
          SE/30's. WE're still shown as little respect now as then. I've been
          seriously tempted to go to the darkside because I can get any
          application I want and most of it at the local OfficeMax, or Wal_Mart.
          My mac software I have to buy online, or if I happen to go to VA Beach,
          I can get some at CompUSA.

          Its a sad commentary. MS is wining the War.


          John Sandel wrote:
          >
          >
          > Well, just speaking for myself AND THE REST OF THE SANE WORLD, I'd
          > say your principal fault lies in not buying into this lonely person's
          > psychodrama, for which you are to be commended.
          >
          > Life's too short, man.
          >
          > JS
          >
          > On Jul 6, 2006, at 9:49 PM, John Rethorst wrote:
          >
          > > I received this post yesterday:
          > >
          > >> Okay, What is this?! I was just looking for a way to get
          > >> wordperfect for mac on my laptop since it has that useless
          > >> text program as an excuse for decency. I joined this
          > >> "group" thinkn' that I would be able to hear something
          > >> about downloading mac wordperfect, but apparently not. I
          > >> have no idea what anyone is talkn' aboutor what the point
          > >> of this group really is. So can someone please send me a
          > >> working link that can send me to the approprate program so
          > >> I can get out of this mess? If not, maybe you could refer
          > >> me to a respectable group.
          > >
          > >> Email me about it because I don't know how to navigate
          > >> myself through this site either.
          > >
          > > Now, IMHO, we're very respectable here. But I couldn't sleep
          > > last night, wondering what we're doing wrong.
          > >
          > > John R.
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > > ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------
          > > ~-->
          > > Yahoo! Groups gets a make over. See the new email design.
          > > http://us.click.yahoo.com/XISQkA/lOaOAA/yQLSAA/dkFolB/TM
          > <http://us.click.yahoo.com/XISQkA/lOaOAA/yQLSAA/dkFolB/TM>
          > > ----------------------------------------------------------
          > > ~->
          > >
          > >
          > > Yahoo! Groups Links
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          >
          >

          --
          ------------------------------------------------------------------------
          Phillip M. Jones, CET |LIFE MEMBER: VPEA ETA-I, NESDA, ISCET, Sterling
          616 Liberty Street |Who's Who. PHONE:276-632-5045, FAX:276-632-0868
          Martinsville Va 24112 |pjones@..., ICQ11269732, AIM pjonescet
          ------------------------------------------------------------------------

          If it's "fixed", don't "break it"!

          mailto:pjones@...

          <http://www.kimbanet.com/~pjones/default.htm>
          <http://www.kimbanet.com/~pjones/90th_Birthday/index.htm>
          <http://www.kimbanet.com/~pjones/Fulcher/default.html>
          <http://www.kimbanet.com/~pjones/Harris/default.htm>
          <http://www.kimbanet.com/~pjones/Jones/default.htm>

          <http://www.vpea.org>
        • Ford Davis
          You are doing NOTHING wrong! I joined getting Wordperfect restored for an educator, the license numbers lost for her CDs. I did that and have been silent and
          Message 4 of 23 , Jul 7, 2006
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            You are doing NOTHING wrong! I joined getting Wordperfect restored for
            an educator, the license numbers lost for her CDs.

            I did that and have been silent and observing & listening.

            It appears you have qualified and helpful contributors ... this person
            either is new to yahoogroups and/or to how they work or is just unable
            to follow simple instructions.. A lot of traffic on this list ... seems
            to help many ... seems you are doing GREAT!

            Loose no more sleep! I run 20+ yahoogroups!

            Ford Davis
            Tech Coordinator/IT Manager

            John Rethorst wrote:
            >
            > I received this post yesterday:
            >
            > > Okay, What is this?! I was just looking for a way to get
            > > wordperfect for mac on my laptop since it has that useless
            > > text program as an excuse for decency. I joined this
            > > "group" thinkn' that I would be able to hear something
            > > about downloading mac wordperfect, but apparently not. I
            > > have no idea what anyone is talkn' aboutor what the point
            > > of this group really is. So can someone please send me a
            > > working link that can send me to the approprate program so
            > > I can get out of this mess? If not, maybe you could refer
            > > me to a respectable group.
            >
            > > Email me about it because I don't know how to navigate
            > > myself through this site either.
            >
            > Now, IMHO, we're very respectable here. But I couldn't sleep
            > last night, wondering what we're doing wrong.
            >
            > John R.
            >
            >
          • John Rethorst
            ... It was late . . . my sarcasm was subtle . . . John R.
            Message 5 of 23 , Jul 7, 2006
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              --- In wordperfectmac@yahoogroups.com, John Sandel <johnsandel@...> wrote:

              > Life's too short, man.

              It was late . . . my sarcasm was subtle . . .

              John R.
            • Douglas Bouley
              As far as I know, the only actively supported platform for WP is now Windows. Not sure what other platforms you/he would mean. While I agree that is rather
              Message 6 of 23 , Jul 10, 2006
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                As far as I know, the only actively supported platform for WP is now
                Windows. Not sure what "other platforms" you/he would mean. While I
                agree that is rather sad (I still have licensed copies of WP for UNIX,
                Linux and DOS!), it does not seem like much of an excuse for rudeness.
                This person can't even be bothered to learn how to navigate the Yahoo
                Groups software (which does not require rocket science), yet complains
                about the excellent _volunteer_ support here not being good enough???

                There is no war. Hasn't been for years. MS whomped WP way back in the
                Orem days before Corel or Novell. The original WP Corp took too long
                making the Win transition and lost too much market share. Older Mac
                heads than I correct me, but WP was not the lead player in the Mac world
                back then, either, was it?

                Anyway, my loaded PB17 runs WP35e just fine, so until I go fully
                MacTel, it's not so bad.

                Doug



                Phillip Jones, C.E.T. wrote:
                > If he is a new adopter of a Mac. He expects a Mac Version of WP just
                > like on the other Computer OS's out their on other platforms.
                >
                > So he comes to a group so named about WordPerfect Mac and expects
                > information on WordPerfect Mac.
                >
                > Unfortunately Corel has been scared stiff by the 900 pound Gorilla named
                > Microsoft. So there is none for the OSX Platform of Mac.
                >
                > So we are talking about, MS Office, OpenOffice, Nesus Writer, and
                > different emulators.
                >
                > So what is he to say. I am not mad at you. I've become a Pragmatist just
                > as everyone else and am resigned to not having WordPerfect on a Mac. 16
                > months ago I bought a 17" PowerBook fully load with 2 Gb memory. I can't
                > afford to buy another, unless I could Trade. And my next upgrade would
                > be a new Desktop machine anyway as I am still using a G4-500.
                >
                > So I am stuck like everyone else. I've been a diehard mac person since
                > SE/30's. WE're still shown as little respect now as then. I've been
                > seriously tempted to go to the darkside because I can get any
                > application I want and most of it at the local OfficeMax, or Wal_Mart.
                > My mac software I have to buy online, or if I happen to go to VA Beach,
                > I can get some at CompUSA.
                >
                > Its a sad commentary. MS is wining the War.
                >
                >
                > John Sandel wrote:
                >
                >> Well, just speaking for myself AND THE REST OF THE SANE WORLD, I'd
                >> say your principal fault lies in not buying into this lonely person's
                >> psychodrama, for which you are to be commended.
                >>
                >> Life's too short, man.
                >>
                >> JS
                >>
                >> On Jul 6, 2006, at 9:49 PM, John Rethorst wrote:
                >>
                >> > I received this post yesterday:
                >> >
                >> >> Okay, What is this?! I was just looking for a way to get
                >> >> wordperfect for mac on my laptop since it has that useless
                >> >> text program as an excuse for decency. I joined this
                >> >> "group" thinkn' that I would be able to hear something
                >> >> about downloading mac wordperfect, but apparently not. I
                >> >> have no idea what anyone is talkn' aboutor what the point
                >> >> of this group really is. So can someone please send me a
                >> >> working link that can send me to the approprate program so
                >> >> I can get out of this mess? If not, maybe you could refer
                >> >> me to a respectable group.
                >> >
                >> >> Email me about it because I don't know how to navigate
                >> >> myself through this site either.
                >> >
                >> > Now, IMHO, we're very respectable here. But I couldn't sleep
                >> > last night, wondering what we're doing wrong.
                >> >
                >> > John R.
                >> >
                >> >
                >> >
                >> >
                >> >
                >> > ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------
                >> > ~-->
                >> > Yahoo! Groups gets a make over. See the new email design.
                >> > http://us.click.yahoo.com/XISQkA/lOaOAA/yQLSAA/dkFolB/TM
                >> <http://us.click.yahoo.com/XISQkA/lOaOAA/yQLSAA/dkFolB/TM>
                >> > ----------------------------------------------------------
                >> > ~->
                >> >
                >> >
                >> > Yahoo! Groups Links
                >> >
                >> >
                >> >
                >> >
                >> >
                >> >
                >>
                >>
                >>
                >
                >
              • John Rethorst
                ... Therein lie some tales . . . I understand that WP took a long time making it to Windows because WP programmers couldn t figure out how to keep the
                Message 7 of 23 , Jul 10, 2006
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                  --- In wordperfectmac@yahoogroups.com, Douglas Bouley <djbouley@...> wrote:

                  > MS whomped WP way back in the Orem days before Corel or
                  > Novell. The original WP Corp took too long making the Win
                  > transition and lost too much market share.

                  Therein lie some tales . . . I understand that WP took a long time
                  making it to Windows because WP programmers couldn't figure
                  out how to keep the program from crashing under Windows. I
                  understand this was because Microsoft did not make the entire
                  API - the environment provided by the OS, which an application
                  uses to run - available to WordPerfect (or Lotus, whose best-selling
                  1-2-3 spreadsheet had similar troubles). I've heard that Microsoft
                  withheld critical information about Windows from its application
                  competitors. I've even heard that an unofficial design goal for
                  Windows updates was to make WordPerfect crash.

                  John R.
                • John Rethorst
                  ... I think that WP 3.0, released a few months after Word 6, briefly led the market. Mac users were very unhappy with Word 6; Macworld recommended WP 3 as the
                  Message 8 of 23 , Jul 10, 2006
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                    --- In wordperfectmac@yahoogroups.com, Douglas Bouley <djbouley@...> wrote:

                    > Older Mac heads
                    > than I correct me, but WP was not the lead player in the
                    > Mac world back then, either, was it?

                    I think that WP 3.0, released a few months after Word 6,
                    briefly led the market. Mac users were very unhappy with
                    Word 6; Macworld recommended WP 3 as the best word
                    processor to be had; sales went up, but WP's display
                    problems turned a lot of people off and a later version of
                    Word retook first place.

                    John R.
                  • Matthew Wensley
                    Since Sympatico has decided that no one needs the usenet usegroups anymore, I am not sure where to turn to for help with MS Excel for Mac. Does anyone know of
                    Message 9 of 23 , Jul 10, 2006
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                      Since Sympatico has decided that no one needs the usenet usegroups
                      anymore, I am not sure where to turn to for help with MS Excel for
                      Mac. Does anyone know of a list like this for excel?

                      TIA

                      Matt
                      -------------
                      "We are reluctant to admit that we owe our liberties
                      to men of a type that today we hate and fear -- unruly men,
                      disturbers of the peace, men who resent and denounce what Whitman
                      called 'the insolence of elected persons' -- in a word, free men."
                      -- Gerald W. Johnson
                      (1890-1980)
                      Source: American Freedom and the Press, 1958
                    • Douglas Bouley
                      I ve heard that, too. It has the ring of authenticity ... and I guess it worked. It s a shame.
                      Message 10 of 23 , Jul 10, 2006
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                        I've heard that, too. It has the "ring of authenticity"... and I guess
                        it worked. It's a shame.

                        John Rethorst wrote:
                        > --- In wordperfectmac@yahoogroups.com, Douglas Bouley <djbouley@...> wrote:
                        >
                        >
                        >> MS whomped WP way back in the Orem days before Corel or
                        >> Novell. The original WP Corp took too long making the Win
                        >> transition and lost too much market share.
                        >>
                        >
                        > Therein lie some tales . . . I understand that WP took a long time
                        > making it to Windows because WP programmers couldn't figure
                        > out how to keep the program from crashing under Windows. I
                        > understand this was because Microsoft did not make the entire
                        > API - the environment provided by the OS, which an application
                        > uses to run - available to WordPerfect (or Lotus, whose best-selling
                        > 1-2-3 spreadsheet had similar troubles). I've heard that Microsoft
                        > withheld critical information about Windows from its application
                        > competitors. I've even heard that an unofficial design goal for
                        > Windows updates was to make WordPerfect crash.
                        >
                        > John R.
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        > Yahoo! Groups Links
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                      • Douglas Bouley
                        Wasn t there some outfit called Beagle Brothers or something similar who was a player then, too? I misrecall. I was stuck on DOS back in those days...
                        Message 11 of 23 , Jul 10, 2006
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                          Wasn't there some outfit called Beagle Brothers or something similar who
                          was a player then, too? I misrecall. I was stuck on DOS back in those
                          days...

                          John Rethorst wrote:
                          > --- In wordperfectmac@yahoogroups.com, Douglas Bouley <djbouley@...> wrote:
                          >
                          >
                          >> Older Mac heads
                          >> than I correct me, but WP was not the lead player in the
                          >> Mac world back then, either, was it?
                          >>
                          >
                          > I think that WP 3.0, released a few months after Word 6,
                          > briefly led the market. Mac users were very unhappy with
                          > Word 6; Macworld recommended WP 3 as the best word
                          > processor to be had; sales went up, but WP's display
                          > problems turned a lot of people off and a later version of
                          > Word retook first place.
                          >
                          > John R.
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          > Yahoo! Groups Links
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                        • John Rethorst
                          ... You can access newsgroups from the web, at http://groups.google.com/. You can subscribe to groups, but I don t see a way to mark articles as read so they
                          Message 12 of 23 , Jul 10, 2006
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                            --- In wordperfectmac@yahoogroups.com, Matthew Wensley <mwensley@...> wrote:
                            >
                            > Since Sympatico has decided that no one needs the usenet usegroups
                            > anymore, I am not sure where to turn to for help with MS Excel for
                            > Mac. Does anyone know of a list like this for excel?

                            You can access newsgroups from the web, at http://groups.google.com/.
                            You can subscribe to groups, but I don't see a way to mark articles
                            as read so they don't appear on the next visit.

                            John R.
                          • wrak2rune
                            I seem to remember a quote in the 80s -- No doubt just another myth: Windows isn t done till Lotus won t run.
                            Message 13 of 23 , Jul 10, 2006
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                              I seem to remember a quote in the '80s -- No doubt just another myth:

                              "Windows isn't done 'till Lotus won't run."

                              --- In wordperfectmac@yahoogroups.com, Douglas Bouley <djbouley@...> wrote:
                              >
                              > I've heard that, too. It has the "ring of authenticity"... and I guess
                              > it worked. It's a shame.
                              >
                              > John Rethorst wrote:
                              > > --- In wordperfectmac@yahoogroups.com, Douglas Bouley <djbouley@> wrote:
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >> MS whomped WP way back in the Orem days before Corel or
                              > >> Novell. The original WP Corp took too long making the Win
                              > >> transition and lost too much market share.
                              > >>
                              > >
                              > > Therein lie some tales . . . I understand that WP took a long time
                              > > making it to Windows because WP programmers couldn't figure
                              > > out how to keep the program from crashing under Windows. I
                              > > understand this was because Microsoft did not make the entire
                              > > API - the environment provided by the OS, which an application
                              > > uses to run - available to WordPerfect (or Lotus, whose best-selling
                              > > 1-2-3 spreadsheet had similar troubles). I've heard that Microsoft
                              > > withheld critical information about Windows from its application
                              > > competitors. I've even heard that an unofficial design goal for
                              > > Windows updates was to make WordPerfect crash.
                              > >
                              > > John R.
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              > > Yahoo! Groups Links
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              >
                            • John Rethorst
                              ... Circa 1990 was the great age of the works programs. Microsoft had MS Works, which was lame partly because hardware of the time could barely support an
                              Message 14 of 23 , Jul 10, 2006
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                                --- In wordperfectmac@yahoogroups.com, Douglas Bouley <djbouley@...> wrote:
                                >
                                > Wasn't there some outfit called Beagle Brothers or something similar who
                                > was a player then, too? I misrecall. I was stuck on DOS back in those
                                > days...

                                Circa 1990 was the great age of the "works" programs.
                                Microsoft had MS Works, which was lame partly because
                                hardware of the time could barely support an all-in-one
                                word processor, spreadsheet, database and some graphics.

                                It put Lotus out of business in the Mac market, though.
                                Lotus had released Jazz, a works-type program whose word
                                processing documents were limited to 32k and whose
                                spreadsheet did not include macros. It did have some
                                interesting features, and no one knew how they managed to
                                get the application onto a 400k floppy.

                                For reasons beyond my technical level to appreciate, these
                                programs had to hold all open documents in RAM, a scarce
                                commodity in those days.

                                Hardware then improved to a point that supported better
                                works programs, and Beagle came along with BeagleWorks. It
                                was later bought by WordPerfect and renamed WordPerfect
                                Works. Reviewers gave its word processing module the best
                                grade, but it was buggy.

                                Symantec released GreatWorks, with an especially good
                                outliner for the program genre, and Claris released
                                ClarisWorks, with the best-reviewed spreadsheet of the lot.
                                As you know, Claris won.

                                John R.
                              • Don Zahniser
                                ... Those folks interested in the history of software development may wish to visit http://www-swiss.ai.mit.edu/~bob/clarisworks.php - a history of the
                                Message 15 of 23 , Jul 11, 2006
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                                  John Rethorst wrote:

                                  >
                                  > Hardware then improved to a point that supported better
                                  > works programs, and Beagle came along with BeagleWorks. It
                                  > was later bought by WordPerfect and renamed WordPerfect
                                  > Works. Reviewers gave its word processing module the best
                                  > grade, but it was buggy.
                                  >
                                  > Symantec released GreatWorks, with an especially good
                                  > outliner for the program genre, and Claris released
                                  > ClarisWorks, with the best-reviewed spreadsheet of the lot.
                                  > As you know, Claris won.
                                  >

                                  Those folks interested in the history of software development may wish
                                  to visit http://www-swiss.ai.mit.edu/~bob/clarisworks.php - a history of
                                  the development of ClarisWorks by one of its authors.

                                  An interesting note to me (a former Apple IIGS enthusiast), was that
                                  most of the ClarisWorks team originated from StyleWare, which had been
                                  working on GSWorks (later AppleWorks GS from Claris) and that Beagle
                                  Bros ended up with the code to StyleWare's TopDraw and MultiScribe GS
                                  (sold as BeagleDraw and BeagleWrite, respectively).

                                  - Don
                                • Doug Auwarter
                                  On Jul 11, 2006, at 4:56 AM, Don Zahniser wrote: Those folks interested in the history of software development may wish to visit
                                  Message 16 of 23 , Jul 11, 2006
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                                    On Jul 11, 2006, at 4:56 AM, Don Zahniser wrote:

                                    Those folks interested in the history of software development may wish
                                    to visit http://www-swiss.ai.mit.edu/~bob/clarisworks.php - a history of
                                    the development of ClarisWorks by one of its authors.

                                    An interesting note to me (a former Apple IIGS enthusiast), was that
                                    most of the ClarisWorks team originated from StyleWare, which had been
                                    working on GSWorks (later AppleWorks GS from Claris) and that Beagle
                                    Bros ended up with the code to StyleWare's TopDraw and MultiScribe GS
                                    (sold as BeagleDraw and BeagleWrite, respectively).

                                    Great story--thanks, Don!
                                    As one that also likes Appleworks 5 and uses it almost as much as WP
                                    (when the WP converters are acting up*) I've always wondered what
                                    happened when Appleworks 6 came out. It's a complete dog compared to
                                    5, especially the way the importation of graphics works (very
                                    badly!). Why did this happen? How can you take a program that works
                                    so well, and ruin its functionality in an upgrade? Anyone?
                                    Best,
                                    Doug

                                    *sometimes importing jpg files or copying and pasting long documents.

                                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                  • Douglas Bouley
                                    Lord forgive me, but I actually liked the old MS Works for DOS program. It was the first program to tell me not only how to use it s components, but what I
                                    Message 17 of 23 , Jul 11, 2006
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                                      Lord forgive me, but I actually liked the old MS Works for DOS program.
                                      It was the first program to tell me not only how to use it's components,
                                      but what I would want to do with a spreadsheet vs a database, etc. Great
                                      newbie stuff.
                                      I eventually "wrote" an entire personnel application in it using the
                                      baby macros and some batch files. Once I saw the power of WP DOS,
                                      though, I was hooked. Still, the power came with quite a learning curve,
                                      and I never did "write" an application in WP :-)

                                      The Claris Works line made me drool the first time I saw it on a
                                      friend's Mac.

                                      John Rethorst wrote:
                                      > --- In wordperfectmac@yahoogroups.com, Douglas Bouley <djbouley@...> wrote:
                                      >
                                      >> Wasn't there some outfit called Beagle Brothers or something similar who
                                      >> was a player then, too? I misrecall. I was stuck on DOS back in those
                                      >> days...
                                      >>
                                      >
                                      > Circa 1990 was the great age of the "works" programs.
                                      > Microsoft had MS Works, which was lame partly because
                                      > hardware of the time could barely support an all-in-one
                                      > word processor, spreadsheet, database and some graphics.
                                      >
                                      > It put Lotus out of business in the Mac market, though.
                                      > Lotus had released Jazz, a works-type program whose word
                                      > processing documents were limited to 32k and whose
                                      > spreadsheet did not include macros. It did have some
                                      > interesting features, and no one knew how they managed to
                                      > get the application onto a 400k floppy.
                                      >
                                      > For reasons beyond my technical level to appreciate, these
                                      > programs had to hold all open documents in RAM, a scarce
                                      > commodity in those days.
                                      >
                                      > Hardware then improved to a point that supported better
                                      > works programs, and Beagle came along with BeagleWorks. It
                                      > was later bought by WordPerfect and renamed WordPerfect
                                      > Works. Reviewers gave its word processing module the best
                                      > grade, but it was buggy.
                                      >
                                      > Symantec released GreatWorks, with an especially good
                                      > outliner for the program genre, and Claris released
                                      > ClarisWorks, with the best-reviewed spreadsheet of the lot.
                                      > As you know, Claris won.
                                      >
                                      > John R.
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      > Yahoo! Groups Links
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                    • Matthew Wensley
                                      Newsgroups from the Web? What will they think of next! Thanks. Amazing how you don t know something if you have never had to look for it. Matt ... Fact of the
                                      Message 18 of 23 , Jul 11, 2006
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                                        Newsgroups from the Web? What will they think of next!

                                        Thanks.

                                        Amazing how you don't know something if you have never had to look
                                        for it.

                                        Matt

                                        -----------------------
                                        "Fact of the matter is, there is no hip world, there is no straight
                                        world. There's a world, you see, which has people in it who believe
                                        in a variety of different things. Everybody believes in something and
                                        everybody, by virtue of the fact that they believe in something, use
                                        that something to support their own existence."
                                        -- Frank Zappa
                                        (1940-1993), Musician


                                        On 11-Jul-06, at 12:19 AM, John Rethorst wrote:

                                        > You can access newsgroups from the web, at http://groups.google.com/
                                      • Wynne Brown
                                        Hi all, I m a (generally polite :)) new member and a longtime Apple/Mac user. I ve never used WordPerfect myself but have volunteered to help a writer friend
                                        Message 19 of 23 , Jul 11, 2006
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                                          Hi all,

                                          I'm a (generally polite :)) new member and a longtime
                                          Apple/Mac user. I've never used WordPerfect myself but have
                                          volunteered to help a writer friend who's recently come to Macs from
                                          the Dark Side. All her old files are in Word Perfect on a CD, and all
                                          she wants to do is move them to her new (but still PowerPC) iBook.
                                          Once they're moved, she'll be using Appleworks to work on them.
                                          Does she need to install WPmac, run it in Classic mode, then
                                          open and save the files as RTF? Or is there an easier way?
                                          She's not particularly computer-savvy, so if any of you have
                                          suggestions for the simplest solution I can give her, I'd be really
                                          appreciative! (I sent her to the FAQ, and she was overwhelmed ...)

                                          cheers,

                                          Wynne Brown
                                        • Doug Auwarter
                                          Wynne, You didn t say which version of WP/win nor Appleworks she uses, but I would think the built in Maclink extention in Appleworks will allow them to be
                                          Message 20 of 23 , Jul 11, 2006
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                                            Wynne,
                                            You didn't say which version of WP/win nor Appleworks she uses, but I
                                            would think the built in Maclink extention in Appleworks will allow
                                            them to be opened directly into Appleworks. If not, maybe it's worth
                                            the investment to get a full version of Maclink and convert them that
                                            way. It's very easy to use.
                                            Best,
                                            Doug

                                            On Jul 11, 2006, at 1:27 PM, Wynne Brown wrote:

                                            I'm a (generally polite :)) new member and a longtime
                                            Apple/Mac user. I've never used WordPerfect myself but have
                                            volunteered to help a writer friend who's recently come to Macs from
                                            the Dark Side. All her old files are in Word Perfect on a CD, and all
                                            she wants to do is move them to her new (but still PowerPC) iBook.
                                            Once they're moved, she'll be using Appleworks to work on them.
                                            Does she need to install WPmac, run it in Classic mode, then
                                            open and save the files as RTF? Or is there an easier way?
                                            She's not particularly computer-savvy, so if any of you have
                                            suggestions for the simplest solution I can give her, I'd be really
                                            appreciative! (I sent her to the FAQ, and she was overwhelmed ...)



                                            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                          • Wynne Brown
                                            Many thanks, Doug! You provided the vital clue: The built-in version of MacLink didn t mention WordPerfect, which implies she d need to buy the full program.
                                            Message 21 of 23 , Jul 11, 2006
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                                              Many thanks, Doug! You provided the vital clue: The built-in version
                                              of MacLink didn't mention WordPerfect, which implies she'd need to
                                              buy the full program. To be sure, I Googled "maclink wordperfect,"
                                              and it pulled up an Apple user discussion that mentioned an Open
                                              Source app called AbiWord (from the Spanish "abierto," according to
                                              Wikipedia -- very cute).
                                              My friend was able to download it and is now happily opening and
                                              saving all the WP files from her pre-Mac life -- and she thinks I'm
                                              even more of an Apple genius than the ones at the store who pointed
                                              her in the direction of this group.

                                              Thanks again!

                                              cheers,

                                              Wynne



                                              >Wynne,
                                              >You didn't say which version of WP/win nor Appleworks she uses, but I
                                              >would think the built in Maclink extention in Appleworks will allow
                                              >them to be opened directly into Appleworks. If not, maybe it's worth
                                              >the investment to get a full version of Maclink and convert them that
                                              >way. It's very easy to use.
                                              >Best,
                                              >Doug
                                              >
                                              >On Jul 11, 2006, at 1:27 PM, Wynne Brown wrote:
                                              >
                                              >I'm a (generally polite :)) new member and a longtime
                                              >Apple/Mac user. I've never used WordPerfect myself but have
                                              >volunteered to help a writer friend who's recently come to Macs from
                                              >the Dark Side. All her old files are in Word Perfect on a CD, and all
                                              >she wants to do is move them to her new (but still PowerPC) iBook.
                                              >Once they're moved, she'll be using Appleworks to work on them.
                                              >Does she need to install WPmac, run it in Classic mode, then
                                              >open and save the files as RTF? Or is there an easier way?
                                              >She's not particularly computer-savvy, so if any of you have
                                              >suggestions for the simplest solution I can give her, I'd be really
                                              >appreciative! (I sent her to the FAQ, and she was overwhelmed ...)
                                              >
                                            • Rick Albright
                                              ... What I remember most about Beagle Brothers was the series of add-on programs for Appleworks (the original Appleworks that ran on the Apple ][ and Apple
                                              Message 22 of 23 , Jul 12, 2006
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                                                > On Jul 11, 2006, at 4:56 AM, Don Zahniser wrote:
                                                >
                                                > An interesting note to me (a former Apple IIGS enthusiast), was that
                                                > most of the ClarisWorks team originated from StyleWare, which had been
                                                > working on GSWorks (later AppleWorks GS from Claris) and that Beagle
                                                > Bros ended up with the code to StyleWare's TopDraw and MultiScribe GS
                                                > (sold as BeagleDraw and BeagleWrite, respectively).
                                                >
                                                What I remember most about Beagle Brothers was the series of add-on
                                                programs for Appleworks (the original Appleworks that ran on the
                                                Apple ][ and Apple IIGS). These were some really nifty and creative
                                                patches that extended the functionality of the original program--
                                                report writers, macros, and a whole host of enhancements, some of
                                                which were quite powerful. I think it says a lot about how much the
                                                environment has changed--Appleworks was designed to be easy to patch
                                                to add functionality, as opposed to Microsoft's refusal to release
                                                the Windows APIs and possibly even to sabotage other programs. In the
                                                early 90s, I recall working on a project involving a contractor
                                                designing a system for storage and retrieval of engineering drawings--
                                                one of the first big forays into that area, just about when Windows
                                                3.1 came out--and even though it was a very large defense contractor,
                                                they had enormous problems getting Microsoft to give them the APIs to
                                                make their system work--and that was for a system that wasn't in
                                                competition with any Microsoft products (unlike Lotus or WordPerfect)!

                                                Thanks for awakening fond memories of the fun I had with Beagle's
                                                enhancements. I still have some of their decals around here
                                                somewhere . . .
                                                =========================================================
                                                "No nation could preserve its freedom in the midst of continual
                                                warfare."
                                                --James Madison, 1793

                                                Rick Albright
                                                logres@...
                                              • Rick Albright
                                                Privacy advocates may want to keep in mind the fact that Google stores all queries to its search engine (the IP address of the computer and the search terms).
                                                Message 23 of 23 , Jul 12, 2006
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                                                  Privacy advocates may want to keep in mind the fact that Google
                                                  stores all queries to its search engine (the IP address of the
                                                  computer and the search terms). I don't know if they keep track of
                                                  usage of usenet groups or not. So far they apparently do not release
                                                  detailed information (such as who asked for what information) to
                                                  outside groups, but it is stored on their servers, and a few months
                                                  ago the federal government attempted to obtain some of this
                                                  information. (Google gave them a much more scaled down data extract
                                                  instead.)

                                                  Rick Albright

                                                  On Jul 11, 2006, at 11:25 AM, Matthew Wensley wrote:

                                                  > Newsgroups from the Web? What will they think of next!
                                                  >
                                                  > Thanks.
                                                  >
                                                  > Amazing how you don't know something if you have never had to look
                                                  > for it.
                                                  >
                                                  > Matt
                                                  >
                                                  > -----------------------
                                                  > "Fact of the matter is, there is no hip world, there is no straight
                                                  > world. There's a world, you see, which has people in it who believe
                                                  > in a variety of different things. Everybody believes in something and
                                                  > everybody, by virtue of the fact that they believe in something, use
                                                  > that something to support their own existence."
                                                  > -- Frank Zappa
                                                  > (1940-1993), Musician
                                                  >
                                                  > On 11-Jul-06, at 12:19 AM, John Rethorst wrote:
                                                  >
                                                  > > You can access newsgroups from the web, at http://groups.google.com/
                                                  >
                                                  >

                                                  =========================================================
                                                  "No nation could preserve its freedom in the midst of continual
                                                  warfare."
                                                  --James Madison, 1793

                                                  Rick Albright
                                                  logres@...
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