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Re: [woodheat] Digest Number 271

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  • Potter Shaw
    Hi; It just about has to be the wood. My real job is partly troubleshooting probs like this & altho I am no great fan of the Fisher, there is basically
    Message 1 of 1 , Mar 14, 2002
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      Hi; It just about has to be the wood. My "real" job is partly
      troubleshooting probs like this & altho I am no great fan of the Fisher,
      there is basically nothing to go wrong with it. Do not try to modify
      it.Don't buy a new stove till you straighten this out. Borrow on maybe, just
      to eliminate any possibility that Buy a couple of KD packets from the
      supermarket. I work in NH; live in VT. With this winter & your size house, 7
      cord seems real high.
      Good Luck,
      Potter
      ----- Original Message -----
      From: <woodheat@yahoogroups.com>
      To: <woodheat@yahoogroups.com>
      Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2002 3:20 AM
      Subject: [woodheat] Digest Number 271


      > Check THE woodheat web site at www.woodheat.org
      >
      > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
      >
      > There are 11 messages in this issue.
      >
      > Topics in this digest:
      >
      > 1. Help it's cold!!
      > From: "morningdovenh" <morningdovenh@...>
      > 2. Re: Help it's cold!!
      > From: Harmon Seaver <hseaver@...>
      > 3. Re: Help it's cold!!
      > From: "morningdovenh" <morningdovenh@...>
      > 4. Re: Re: Help it's cold!!
      > From: Harmon Seaver <hseaver@...>
      > 5. Re: Help it's cold!!
      > From: "morningdovenh" <morningdovenh@...>
      > 6. Re: Help it's cold!!
      > From: Thumper Lunatic <slrldr@...>
      > 7. Re: Re: Help it's cold!!
      > From: Harmon Seaver <hseaver@...>
      > 8. Re: Re: Help it's cold!!
      > From: Harmon Seaver <hseaver@...>
      > 9. Re: Re: Help it's cold!!
      > From: "Seevers" <rock-cut@...>
      > 10. Re: Re: Help it's cold!!
      > From: "Miro" <mirozieba@...>
      > 11. Re: Re: Help it's cold!!
      > From: Harmon Seaver <hseaver@...>
      >
      >
      > ________________________________________________________________________
      > ________________________________________________________________________
      >
      > Message: 1
      > Date: Wed, 13 Mar 2002 13:54:44 -0000
      > From: "morningdovenh" <morningdovenh@...>
      > Subject: Help it's cold!!
      >
      > Hi all; I'm new to this list and very glad I found you guys. I hope
      > someone might have an answer for me. I heat with a Fisher wood stove
      > in a room that is about 1000 sq. feet. and that darn stove does not
      > throw much heat at all. We have to keep door controls wide open and
      > the damper almost open to get much heat at all. It's not a small
      > stove, it takes 22" logs. NOT a glass front either, it's "airtight".
      > We have a fan to help blow the heat around otherwise you only get
      > warm if you stand within 3 feet of it! My dogs actually lay at the
      > base of it, within inches!!
      > I have been in houses with a woodstove that will knock you over with
      > heat, not mine. Here in NH we can get mighty cold winters so any
      > help/input/suggestions are greatly appreciated. I'm ready to give the
      > darn thing away!!
      > JT
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > ________________________________________________________________________
      > ________________________________________________________________________
      >
      > Message: 2
      > Date: Wed, 13 Mar 2002 09:03:11 -0600
      > From: Harmon Seaver <hseaver@...>
      > Subject: Re: Help it's cold!!
      >
      > On Wed, Mar 13, 2002 at 01:54:44PM -0000, morningdovenh wrote:
      > > Hi all; I'm new to this list and very glad I found you guys. I hope
      > > someone might have an answer for me. I heat with a Fisher wood stove
      > > in a room that is about 1000 sq. feet. and that darn stove does not
      > > throw much heat at all. We have to keep door controls wide open and
      > > the damper almost open to get much heat at all. It's not a small
      > > stove, it takes 22" logs. NOT a glass front either, it's "airtight".
      > > We have a fan to help blow the heat around otherwise you only get
      > > warm if you stand within 3 feet of it! My dogs actually lay at the
      > > base of it, within inches!!
      > > I have been in houses with a woodstove that will knock you over with
      > > heat, not mine. Here in NH we can get mighty cold winters so any
      > > help/input/suggestions are greatly appreciated. I'm ready to give the
      > > darn thing away!!
      > > JT
      >
      > What kind of wood are you burning and how dry is it? Is there a
      secondary burning chamber at
      > all? Doesn't sound like it if you've got a damper in the flue. If your
      wood hasn't been split and dried for
      > at least a year, try burning some definitely dry hardwood like cut up
      pallets and see how much heat that
      > puts out.
      >
      >
      > --
      > Harmon Seaver
      > CyberShamanix
      > http://www.cybershamanix.com
      >
      >
      > ________________________________________________________________________
      > ________________________________________________________________________
      >
      > Message: 3
      > Date: Wed, 13 Mar 2002 15:52:45 -0000
      > From: "morningdovenh" <morningdovenh@...>
      > Subject: Re: Help it's cold!!
      >
      > I started out with wood that has dried for 2 years then ran out and
      > had to get a cord of green, not much difference to speak of, the
      > green left larger "coals" and seems to burn a bit longer because of
      > it. As far as actual heat - hardly any difference at all. 8>(
      > JT
      >
      >
      >
      > ________________________________________________________________________
      > ________________________________________________________________________
      >
      > Message: 4
      > Date: Wed, 13 Mar 2002 10:24:13 -0600
      > From: Harmon Seaver <hseaver@...>
      > Subject: Re: Re: Help it's cold!!
      >
      > On Wed, Mar 13, 2002 at 03:52:45PM -0000, morningdovenh wrote:
      > > I started out with wood that has dried for 2 years then ran out and
      > > had to get a cord of green, not much difference to speak of, the
      > > green left larger "coals" and seems to burn a bit longer because of
      > > it. As far as actual heat - hardly any difference at all. 8>(
      > > JT
      >
      > Yes, but what kind of wood is it? Was the dry wood the same species as
      the green? Does the stove get red
      > hot? With good dry hardwoods and running it wide open all the time it
      should get redhot at least somewhere
      > on it.
      > The other question to be asked I guess is how is the draft? What's the
      chimney -- insulated, outside
      > masonry? This could make a difference, although I've seen plenty of stoves
      with just single wall steel
      > stovepipe for the chimney, just barely above roof level still run the
      stove redhot with good dry hardwoods.
      >
      > --
      > Harmon Seaver
      > CyberShamanix
      > http://www.cybershamanix.com
      >
      >
      >
      > ________________________________________________________________________
      > ________________________________________________________________________
      >
      > Message: 5
      > Date: Wed, 13 Mar 2002 19:23:04 -0000
      > From: "morningdovenh" <morningdovenh@...>
      > Subject: Re: Help it's cold!!
      >
      > I actually get a truck load of mixed woods: Oak, ash, maple, birch.
      > So the types would of consistantly been a mix. No it does not get red
      > hot. The only time it did get red hot was when there was to much
      > buildup inside the chimney and it almost caught on fire. (I clean it
      > out with a brush once a month) I have double wall insulated pipes up
      > on the roof and it is about 4 feet above the roof itself. Single
      > pipes inside - there is only one bend from the back of the stove to
      > the pipe itself, otherwise it is straight up the roof and out. I even
      > have the required rope along the door.
      > when we ope the door to put wood it - with the damper open - we do
      > not get smoke into the house at all.
      > I hope I am answering these questions alright. I have never heated
      > with wood until this stove and it's been 4 years now - 4 cold
      > years !! We go through about 7 cords a winter - well the whole truck
      > load!!
      > I appreciate your patience Harmon
      > JT
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > ________________________________________________________________________
      > ________________________________________________________________________
      >
      > Message: 6
      > Date: Wed, 13 Mar 2002 11:55:35 -0800 (PST)
      > From: Thumper Lunatic <slrldr@...>
      > Subject: Re: Help it's cold!!
      >
      >
      > It sounds like my Kuma when I first started useing it, how do you load
      the box? I mean what direction do you put the wood in?
      > If I put wood in mine like a fire place with the logs ends side to side it
      just doesn't get very hot, when I changed how I load it and put the wood in
      front to back, WOW ! ...what difference that made, look and see where the
      air comes in to your fire box, if your wood hasn't been in line with the air
      flow, try to stack it so that it will be. And try to get the box hot [hotter
      the better for mine] before you put size-able wood in, we now try to get the
      temp .up to 500 or 600 on the flue thermometer before we load wood to heat
      the room, we how can keep our 1800 sq ft house with out trouble.
      > Good luck, Thumper.
      >
      > morningdovenh <morningdovenh@...> wrote: Hi all; I'm new to this
      list and very glad I found you guys. I hope
      > someone might have an answer for me. I heat with a Fisher wood stove
      > in a room that is about 1000 sq. feet. and that darn stove does not
      > throw much heat at all. We have to keep door controls wide open and
      > the damper almost open to get much heat at all. It's not a small
      > stove, it takes 22" logs. NOT a glass front either, it's "airtight".
      > We have a fan to help blow the heat around otherwise you only get
      > warm if you stand within 3 feet of it! My dogs actually lay at the
      > base of it, within inches!!
      > I have been in houses with a woodstove that will knock you over with
      > heat, not mine. Here in NH we can get mighty cold winters so any
      > help/input/suggestions are greatly appreciated. I'm ready to give the
      > darn thing away!!
      > JT
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > Check THE woodheat web site at www.woodheat.org
      >
      >
      > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > ---------------------------------
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      >
      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      >
      >
      >
      > ________________________________________________________________________
      > ________________________________________________________________________
      >
      > Message: 7
      > Date: Wed, 13 Mar 2002 15:03:35 -0600
      > From: Harmon Seaver <hseaver@...>
      > Subject: Re: Re: Help it's cold!!
      >
      > Well, you've got me stumped then. Just plain bad stove design? Sounds
      like the draft is okay, so maybe
      > the design just doesn't allow for enough air to get in. You didn't say if
      it has any sort of secondary burn
      > chamber or secondary air inlet? Also, if the flue pipe comes out the back
      of the stove (horizontally) it's a
      > bad thing -- some stoves allow you to switch to upright. Try running it
      with the door open aways, if it gets
      > a lot hotter (it should) without smoking I'd say the air inlet is just too
      small. If it's a Fisher it must
      > be steel plate, right? You could drill some extra air holes, or add a
      small blower.
      >
      > You know, after heating with a variety of antique stoves, barrel
      stoves, etc., when we could finally
      > afford a Vermont Castings Defiant (excellent cast iron air-tight) back
      about 22 years ago or so, I really
      > thought that was super hi-tech wood burning. Lately I've come around more
      or less full circle. I think the
      > air-tight stoves suck, in a lot of ways. Most of the time, or maybe it's
      just most of the designs, and/or
      > the way most people use them, they just burn too cool and make a lot of
      creosote. It would be better to just
      > burn up the wood fast, capture the heat in stone or water and release it
      slowly.
      > We've turned our masonry fireplace (this is a big old solid brick (not
      just brick face) house, with a
      > large brick fireplace jutting out into the room. We used it off and on,
      but fireplaces are just a negative
      > heat loss, right? Now we put in a set of custom made heavy steel and
      ceramic glass doors and wow, does that
      > puppy put out the heat. The doors are fairly tight, but not airtight (we
      could have had them made with a
      > gasket and clamping door lock), and we keep our thermostat at 66 during
      the day, but once that fireplace is
      > burning for a few hours, it's usually around 70 in the living room. It's
      so hot it's blistered all the paint
      > off the brick for about 6" on the sides of the fireplace, and almost a
      foot at the top. The air inlets on
      > the doors are on the top, not the bottom, and with dry wood there's no
      visible smoke coming out of the
      > chimney.
      >
      >
      >
      > On Wed, Mar 13, 2002 at 07:23:04PM -0000, morningdovenh wrote:
      > > I actually get a truck load of mixed woods: Oak, ash, maple, birch.
      > > So the types would of consistantly been a mix. No it does not get red
      > > hot. The only time it did get red hot was when there was to much
      > > buildup inside the chimney and it almost caught on fire. (I clean it
      > > out with a brush once a month) I have double wall insulated pipes up
      > > on the roof and it is about 4 feet above the roof itself. Single
      > > pipes inside - there is only one bend from the back of the stove to
      > > the pipe itself, otherwise it is straight up the roof and out. I even
      > > have the required rope along the door.
      > > when we ope the door to put wood it - with the damper open - we do
      > > not get smoke into the house at all.
      > > I hope I am answering these questions alright. I have never heated
      > > with wood until this stove and it's been 4 years now - 4 cold
      > > years !! We go through about 7 cords a winter - well the whole truck
      > > load!!
      > > I appreciate your patience Harmon
      > > JT
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > > Check THE woodheat web site at www.woodheat.org
      > >
      > >
      > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
      http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
      > >
      >
      > --
      > Harmon Seaver
      > CyberShamanix
      > http://www.cybershamanix.com
      >
      >
      > ________________________________________________________________________
      > ________________________________________________________________________
      >
      > Message: 8
      > Date: Wed, 13 Mar 2002 18:01:08 -0600
      > From: Harmon Seaver <hseaver@...>
      > Subject: Re: Re: Help it's cold!!
      >
      > Another idea you might try is, if it doesn't already have a secondary
      burn chamber, adding one. Are you
      > getting really clean burns with no smoke after the stove gets going? If
      not, you really need more secondary
      > air and chamber to burn it in. You could make one out of a 15gal steel
      drum, or even a 5gal, with it's own
      > air intake, just mount it right to the pipe coming out of the stove. You
      could use one of those "double
      > barrrel" kits (about $15 locally at Menards and Fleet Farm) which has the
      two cast iron stove pipe
      > adaptors. This will also greatly increase the heat exchanger air of the
      stove. Burn the paint off the drum
      > outside first and then paint it with hi-temp paint, it might not be the
      most beautiful thing but it'll
      > definitely give you a lot more efficiency, heat, and cleaner exhaust.
      >
      >
      >
      > On Wed, Mar 13, 2002 at 07:23:04PM -0000, morningdovenh wrote:
      > > I actually get a truck load of mixed woods: Oak, ash, maple, birch.
      > > So the types would of consistantly been a mix. No it does not get red
      > > hot. The only time it did get red hot was when there was to much
      > > buildup inside the chimney and it almost caught on fire. (I clean it
      > > out with a brush once a month) I have double wall insulated pipes up
      > > on the roof and it is about 4 feet above the roof itself. Single
      > > pipes inside - there is only one bend from the back of the stove to
      > > the pipe itself, otherwise it is straight up the roof and out. I even
      > > have the required rope along the door.
      > > when we ope the door to put wood it - with the damper open - we do
      > > not get smoke into the house at all.
      > > I hope I am answering these questions alright. I have never heated
      > > with wood until this stove and it's been 4 years now - 4 cold
      > > years !! We go through about 7 cords a winter - well the whole truck
      > > load!!
      > > I appreciate your patience Harmon
      > > JT
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > > Check THE woodheat web site at www.woodheat.org
      > >
      > >
      > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
      http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
      > >
      >
      > --
      > Harmon Seaver
      > CyberShamanix
      > http://www.cybershamanix.com
      >
      >
      > ________________________________________________________________________
      > ________________________________________________________________________
      >
      > Message: 9
      > Date: Wed, 13 Mar 2002 18:30:57 -0600
      > From: "Seevers" <rock-cut@...>
      > Subject: Re: Re: Help it's cold!!
      >
      > Since I don't have a wood stove in the house anymore, outside is where its
      > located. I can't assess this old trick.
      >
      > If you burn a aluminum can in the furnace once a week it will help control
      > the cresote buildup.
      > Try this and assess the problem.
      > Still, I think green wood is more problematic than seasoned.
      >
      > DLS
      >
      > ----- Original Message -----
      > From: morningdovenh <morningdovenh@...>
      > To: <woodheat@yahoogroups.com>
      > Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2002 1:23 PM
      > Subject: [woodheat] Re: Help it's cold!!
      >
      >
      > > I actually get a truck load of mixed woods: Oak, ash, maple, birch.
      > > So the types would of consistantly been a mix. No it does not get red
      > > hot. The only time it did get red hot was when there was to much
      > > buildup inside the chimney and it almost caught on fire. (I clean it
      > > out with a brush once a month) I have double wall insulated pipes up
      > > on the roof and it is about 4 feet above the roof itself. Single
      > > pipes inside - there is only one bend from the back of the stove to
      > > the pipe itself, otherwise it is straight up the roof and out. I even
      > > have the required rope along the door.
      > > when we ope the door to put wood it - with the damper open - we do
      > > not get smoke into the house at all.
      > > I hope I am answering these questions alright. I have never heated
      > > with wood until this stove and it's been 4 years now - 4 cold
      > > years !! We go through about 7 cords a winter - well the whole truck
      > > load!!
      > > I appreciate your patience Harmon
      > > JT
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > > Check THE woodheat web site at www.woodheat.org
      > >
      > >
      > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
      http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
      > >
      > >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > ________________________________________________________________________
      > ________________________________________________________________________
      >
      > Message: 10
      > Date: Wed, 13 Mar 2002 21:45:34 -0500
      > From: "Miro" <mirozieba@...>
      > Subject: Re: Re: Help it's cold!!
      >
      > Maybe, maybe not. Just a coincidence.!?
      > I recently had a customer that indicated a similar problem.
      > The damper in the flue felt okay but when I physically
      > checked it, the damper plate had worn loose on the shaft and
      > regardless of where the shaft was turned the damper remained
      > closed. Just an possiblity if you haven't actually observed its
      > operation.
      >
      > Miro
      > Betterway Chimney Systems
      > Raymond, ME
      > ----- Original Message -----
      > From: morningdovenh <morningdovenh@...>
      > To: <woodheat@yahoogroups.com>
      > Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2002 10:52 AM
      > Subject: [woodheat] Re: Help it's cold!!
      >
      >
      > > I started out with wood that has dried for 2 years then ran out and
      > > had to get a cord of green, not much difference to speak of, the
      > > green left larger "coals" and seems to burn a bit longer because of
      > > it. As far as actual heat - hardly any difference at all. 8>(
      > > JT
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > > Check THE woodheat web site at www.woodheat.org
      > >
      > >
      > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
      http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
      > >
      > >
      > >
      >
      >
      >
      > ________________________________________________________________________
      > ________________________________________________________________________
      >
      > Message: 11
      > Date: Wed, 13 Mar 2002 21:05:12 -0600
      > From: Harmon Seaver <hseaver@...>
      > Subject: Re: Re: Help it's cold!!
      >
      > On Wed, Mar 13, 2002 at 09:45:34PM -0500, Miro wrote:
      > > Maybe, maybe not. Just a coincidence.!?
      > > I recently had a customer that indicated a similar problem.
      > > The damper in the flue felt okay but when I physically
      > > checked it, the damper plate had worn loose on the shaft and
      > > regardless of where the shaft was turned the damper remained
      > > closed. Just an possiblity if you haven't actually observed its
      > > operation.
      > >
      > Yea, I've had that happen too, but then it should smoke a lot when
      you're lighting it. Had some real
      > panics over that -- a lot of dampers come loose, they're just a friction
      fit on the shaft. I used to braze
      > them on years ago. Don't use them at all anymore.
      >
      >
      >
      > --
      > Harmon Seaver
      > CyberShamanix
      > http://www.cybershamanix.com
      >
      >
      > ________________________________________________________________________
      > ________________________________________________________________________
      >
      >
      >
      > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
      >
      >
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