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Re: Stove suggestions

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  • silloh2003
    Thanks for the education. I hadn t realized the downsides, and figured a wood stove would require much more air. That will make the installation easier too!
    Message 1 of 11 , Jul 30, 2004
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      Thanks for the education. I hadn't realized the downsides, and
      figured a wood stove would require much more air. That will make the
      installation easier too!

      --- In woodheat@yahoogroups.com, "John Gulland" <john@g...> wrote:
      > silloh2003 wrote:
      > > John, let me ask you this - is there a downside to outside air?
      >
      > Sure. Passive supplies leak constantly in cold weather, causing
      cold air to pool at floor level. Direct-to-combustion chamber
      > supplies can reverse due to wind effects around the house, which I
      have seen evidence of. See:
      > http://www.woodheat.org/outdoorair/outdoorairmyth.htm
      >
      > > I thought that by using outside air, the differences
      > > would equalize somewhat in the intake and draft, hopefully getting
      > > more even burning
      >
      > Nope. All you achieve by bringing in outdoor air is to subject your
      basement directly to the pressure fluctuations due to wind.
      > Without outdoor air the building envelope tends to damper these out
      to some extent.
      >
      > > The basement itself is sealed up pretty tight now
      >
      > A stove draws air from every leak in the house envelope, not just
      those in the room it is installed in. It is virtually impossible
      > to seal an existing house to the extent that a wood stove would
      depressurize it. A wood stove takes a tiny, tiny amount of air, in
      > the range of 10 to 25 cubic feet per minute. This is less than a
      cheap bathroom fan, far less than an oil furnace or vertically
      > vented gas furnace.
      >
      > > you always hear that you should crack a window in the
      > > room where the stove is
      >
      > There are two reasons for this type of advice and I don't think
      either apply to you. One is that open fireplaces need a lot of air
      > and until they develop some draft, a window may need to be opened,
      even in leaky houses. Second, opening a nearby window is how you
      > correct the flow in a backdrafting chimney, by neutralizing the
      negative pressure due to stack effect. But chimneys backdraft
      > usually because they run up the outside of the house. Inside
      chimneys don't need this treatment. See:
      > http://www.woodheat.org/chimneys/trichim.htm
      >
      > To summarize, you don't need outdoor air.
      > John
      >
      > > -----Original Message-----
      > > From: silloh2003 [mailto:hollis.bartlett@n...]
      > > Sent: July 29, 2004 7:01 AM
      > > To: woodheat@yahoogroups.com
      > > Subject: [woodheat] Re: Stove suggestions
      > >
      > >
      > > John, let me ask you this - is there a downside to outside air?
      > >
      > > There are two other reasons I wanted to also hook up this way; 1)
      > > Where I live there can be dramatic changes in outside pressure,
      winds
      > > and so forth, so I thought that by using outside air, the
      differences
      > > would equalize somewhat in the intake and draft, hopefully getting
      > > more even burning, and 2) since I am going in the basement with
      this
      > > for convection heating as opposed to radiant, an intake there
      would
      > > somewhat defeat the purpose and lessen the convection effect. The
      > > basement itself is sealed up pretty tight now, 30 bags of cement
      > > later. There are no windows.
      > >
      > > I guess I am not sure just how much air a stove will actually take
      > > for combustion, you always hear that you should crack a window in
      the
      > > room where the stove is. I know that mobile homes are required to
      > > hook up to outside air, presumably because of the amount of
      > > combustion air needed.
      > >
      > > --- In woodheat@yahoogroups.com, "John Gulland" <john@g...> wrote:
      > > > silloh2003 wrote:
      > > > > I was a little concerned about the combustion air, as the
      > > basement is
      > > > > now sealed up pretty tight. I was hoping to find a stove that
      > > could
      > > > > be hooked to outside air for combustion. Otherwise, there
      could be
      > > > > negative pressure in the house, which ultimately leads to
      drafts.
      > > >
      > > > There is no technical basis for this concern, except in the very
      > > few houses that have been fanatically sealed at the time of
      > > > construction. No study has ever demonstrated a beneficial
      effect of
      > > outdoor combustion air. The outdoor air craze was started
      > > > because it seemed, intuitively at least, to make sense back in
      the
      > > 1980s before anyone attempted to test the effect. When tests were
      > > > done, little or no effect was found. I know about this because I
      > > was one of those who went public promoting outdoor air as a
      > > > solution back then. I had to eat my words. See:
      > > > http://www.woodheat.org/outdoorair/outdoorair.htm
      > > >
      > > > John
      > > >
      > > > > -----Original Message-----
      > > > > From: silloh2003 [mailto:hollis.bartlett@n...]
      > > > > Sent: July 28, 2004 8:06 AM
      > > > > To: woodheat@yahoogroups.com
      > > > > Subject: [woodheat] Re: Stove suggestions
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > > Good suggestion about the wood, I do that anyway - I usually
      jam 4
      > > > > cords in the basement!
      > > > >
      > > > > I was a little concerned about the combustion air, as the
      > > basement is
      > > > > now sealed up pretty tight. I was hoping to find a stove that
      > > could
      > > > > be hooked to outside air for combustion. Otherwise, there
      could be
      > > > > negative pressure in the house, which ultimately leads to
      drafts.
      > > I
      > > > > was also thinking about a fan for the return, probably a
      bathroom
      > > fan
      > > > > or something, but I am hoping to try this first without any
      fans,
      > > and
      > > > > just by pure design and convection.
      > > > >
      > > > > --- In woodheat@yahoogroups.com, "Greg Zukowski"
      <gzukowski@f...>
      > > > > wrote:
      > > > > > I used convection heat in my house- woodstove in the
      basement-
      > > > > >
      > > > > > Here's two tricks an old timer told me, and what I learned.
      > > > > >
      > > > > > First- Have two or three weeks rotating supply of wood
      stored in
      > > > > > your basement. The wood will get incredibly dry, and also
      > > provide
      > > > > > humidity for your house.
      > > > > >
      > > > > >
      > > > > > Second- Have an air supply to your stove area- I think the
      > > > > > engineers call it "positive pressure"
      > > > > >
      > > > > > For example, in my woodstove room,I have a 150 cfm fan
      blowing
      > > air
      > > > > > into my return air duct. In our back room of the house- the
      > > > > coldest
      > > > > > room, I have a 250 cfm fan blowing air into the basement
      room.
      > > > > >
      > > > > > So I never ahve draft problems with the stove, and it burns
      so
      > > > > well,
      > > > > > and have a gentle heat throughout the house.
      > > > > >
      > > > > > This winter I'm gong to modify the supply air to pull some
      air
      > > > > from
      > > > > > outside, and also upstairs, with a three way connector and
      some
      > > > > > simple dampers. But that supply air is very important.
      > > > > >
      > > > > > In your house, I would find the coldest room, the farthest
      from
      > > > > that
      > > > > > grate you have in the floor, and just buy a quiet fan, and
      suck
      > > air
      > > > > > from that room into the basement. Then you'll lbe assured
      of
      > > > > plenty
      > > > > > of air for the sotve, and also help the convection process.
      > > > > >
      > > > > > I think every woodstove sold should come with a 100 cfm
      fan, and
      > > > > > instructions to supply air to the room where you have the
      stove.
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > > Check THE woodheat web site at http://www.woodheat.org
      > > > > To receive no more messages email: woodheat-
      > > unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
      > > > >
      > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > > Check THE woodheat web site at http://www.woodheat.org
      > > To receive no more messages email: woodheat-
      unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
      > >
      > > Yahoo! Groups Links
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
    • greggballou
      Hi all. We currently have a oil boiler and a wood boiler in the basement, and a waterford 104 mark II on the first floor. Problem is in the fall/spring it
      Message 2 of 11 , Oct 30, 2005
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        Hi all.
        We currently have a oil boiler and a wood boiler in the basement, and a waterford 104
        mark II on the first floor. Problem is in the fall/spring it isn't cold enough to use the
        wood boiler but the waterford is not quite sufficient to take the sting out of the
        house(1,500 sq. ft.) and we end using more oil than we would like. Additionally the
        waterford takes 'twig' sized wood compared to the wood boiler so sorting out little stuff or
        cutting splitting isn't really worth the effort/heat result.
        Any suggestions for a smallish first floor stove that takes larger wood (16-18") for fall/
        spring use. We are currently considering an intrepid II.
        Thanks,
        Gregg
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