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validForms: hating#v -> hate#v hat#v

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  • beata_b_bk
    Hi, Jason and everybody, I wonder if the following is the intended behaviour: query with validForms(hating#v) returns hate#v hat#v Now, there happens to be a
    Message 1 of 8 , May 24, 2005
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      Hi, Jason and everybody,

      I wonder if the following is the intended behaviour:

      query with validForms(hating#v)
      returns
      hate#v hat#v

      Now, there happens to be a verb "hat" (put on or wear a hat); however,
      hating cannot be its -ing form - should be hatting, as in patting,
      hitting, etc.

      This creates a problem for me, since I am defaulting to the last
      element for the base form. This idea derives from the noun pattern:
      years#n -> years#n year#n
      where the first member is the actual full form, and not the best guess
      for the base form.

      WordNet online produces the page for "hate" when queried on "hating".
      It could be that the "hate" version just happens to be first in line...

      Similar problems surface up for:
      dotes#v -> dote#v dot#v
      tapes#v -> tape#v tap#v
      dines#v -> dine#v din#v


      Any ideas as to how to go handle this?

      Thank you,

      Beata
    • Jason Rennie
      So, as far as I understand the morphy man page: http://wordnet.princeton.edu/man/morphy.7WN QueryData is doing the right thing. There are no entries in
      Message 2 of 8 , May 24, 2005
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        So, as far as I understand the morphy man page:

        http://wordnet.princeton.edu/man/morphy.7WN

        QueryData is doing the "right" thing. There are no entries in
        verb.exc for hates, dotes, tapes, dines, so QueryData should return
        hat, dot, tap, din as valid forms of the verbs.

        Of course, some of the behavior of WordNet may not be completely
        documented, or it may be that the "rules of detachment" are
        prioritiezed---only the first match is valid. I don't know what the
        truth is. If you or anyone else knows or can find out what is going
        on, I'd be happy to update the QueryData code.

        Jason
      • Ben Haskell
        Yes, the rules of detachment are prioritized. First match with a corresponding word in WordNet gets returned. (Array definitions below are from morph.c in
        Message 3 of 8 , May 24, 2005
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          Yes, the "rules of detachment" are prioritized. First match with a
          corresponding word in WordNet gets returned.

          (Array definitions below are from morph.c in the WordNet C library)

          Outline of morphstring:

          Return entry from exception list if it exists.

          Return nothing for adverbs. (only check exception list)

          if (NOUN) {
          if (string ends with "ful") { strip the "ful" and remember to add it
          later }
          elsif (string ends with "ss" or is <= 2 characters long) {
          return nothing
          }

          Then the endings that are tested are in the sufx array:

          static char *sufx[] ={
          /* Noun suffixes */
          "s", "ses", "xes", "zes", "ches", "shes", "men", "ies",
          /* Verb suffixes */
          "s", "ies", "es", "es", "ed", "ed", "ing", "ing",
          /* Adjective suffixes */
          "er", "est", "er", "est"
          };


          If a word ends with such an ending, that ending is stripped and
          replaced with the corresponding entry in the addr array:

          static char *addr[] ={
          /* Noun endings */
          "", "s", "x", "z", "ch", "sh", "man", "y",
          /* Verb endings */
          "", "y", "e", "", "e", "", "e", "",
          /* Adjective endings */
          "", "", "e", "e"
          };

          -- Ben Haskell
          -- WordNet Technical Support Specialist

          On Tue, 24 May 2005, Jason Rennie wrote:

          > So, as far as I understand the morphy man page:
          >
          > http://wordnet.princeton.edu/man/morphy.7WN
          >
          > QueryData is doing the "right" thing. There are no entries in
          > verb.exc for hates, dotes, tapes, dines, so QueryData should return
          > hat, dot, tap, din as valid forms of the verbs.
          >
          > Of course, some of the behavior of WordNet may not be completely
          > documented, or it may be that the "rules of detachment" are
          > prioritiezed---only the first match is valid. I don't know what the
          > truth is. If you or anyone else knows or can find out what is going
          > on, I'd be happy to update the QueryData code.
          >
          > Jason
          >
          >
          > WordNet::QueryData web page: http://people.csail.mit.edu/~jrennie/WordNet/
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > __________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________
          > Yahoo! Groups Links
          > * To visit your group on the web, go to:
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          >
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          >
          >
        • Jason Rennie
          Ben---many thanks for the info. I ll get QueryData patched up and a new version out RSN. :) Jason
          Message 4 of 8 , May 24, 2005
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            Ben---many thanks for the info. I'll get QueryData patched up and a
            new version out RSN. :)

            Jason
          • Jason Rennie
            So, the fix will require a non-trivial amount of restructuring of the QueryData. It might be a few days or weeks before I find the time to work on this. It
            Message 5 of 8 , May 25, 2005
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              So, the fix will require a non-trivial amount of restructuring of the
              QueryData. It might be a few days or weeks before I find the time to
              work on this.

              It appears that the first word returned by validForms will always be
              valid. So, as a short-term fix, I'd suggest that if you're using
              validForms, you only use the first of the words returned.

              Jason
            • beata_b_bk
              ... HI, Jason, Is there any reason for validForms to return the original, pluralized form of a noun? I.e. years#n - years#n year#n ? I am currently taking
              Message 6 of 8 , May 25, 2005
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                --- In wn-perl@yahoogroups.com, Jason Rennie <jrennie@g...> wrote:
                > So, the fix will require a non-trivial amount of restructuring of the
                > QueryData. It might be a few days or weeks before I find the time to
                > work on this.
                >
                > It appears that the first word returned by validForms will always be
                > valid. So, as a short-term fix, I'd suggest that if you're using
                > validForms, you only use the first of the words returned.
                >
                > Jason

                HI, Jason,

                Is there any reason for validForms to return the original, pluralized
                form of a noun? I.e. years#n -> years#n year#n ?

                I am currently taking last element from noun list and first element in
                verb list as my base form defaults.

                Cheers,

                Beata
              • Ben Haskell
                Some nouns appear in WordNet in the plural if that is how the sense is usually found. years == old age , years == long time in this case. Other
                Message 7 of 8 , May 25, 2005
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                  Some nouns appear in WordNet in the plural if that is how the sense is
                  usually found.
                  "years" == "old age", "years" == "long time" in this case.

                  Other examples:
                  "spirits" == alcoholic beverages
                  "dealings" == relations
                  "amends" == reparation
                  "hoops" == basketball

                  -- Ben Haskell
                  -- WordNet Technical Support Specialist

                  On Wed, 25 May 2005, beata_b_bk wrote:

                  > --- In wn-perl@yahoogroups.com, Jason Rennie <jrennie@g...> wrote:
                  > > So, the fix will require a non-trivial amount of restructuring of the
                  > > QueryData. It might be a few days or weeks before I find the time to
                  > > work on this.
                  > >
                  > > It appears that the first word returned by validForms will always be
                  > > valid. So, as a short-term fix, I'd suggest that if you're using
                  > > validForms, you only use the first of the words returned.
                  > >
                  > > Jason
                  >
                  > HI, Jason,
                  >
                  > Is there any reason for validForms to return the original, pluralized
                  > form of a noun? I.e. years#n -> years#n year#n ?
                  >
                  > I am currently taking last element from noun list and first element in
                  > verb list as my base form defaults.
                  >
                  > Cheers,
                  >
                  > Beata
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > WordNet::QueryData web page: http://people.csail.mit.edu/~jrennie/WordNet/
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > __________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________
                  > Yahoo! Groups Links
                  > * To visit your group on the web, go to:
                  > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/wn-perl/
                  >
                  > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
                  > wn-perl-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                  >
                  > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
                  >
                  >
                • beata_b_bk
                  I see. Thanks, Ben. Beata ... of the ... time to ... http://people.csail.mit.edu/~jrennie/WordNet/ ... Service.
                  Message 8 of 8 , May 26, 2005
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                    I see. Thanks, Ben.

                    Beata




                    --- In wn-perl@yahoogroups.com, Ben Haskell <ben@c...> wrote:
                    > Some nouns appear in WordNet in the plural if that is how the sense is
                    > usually found.
                    > "years" == "old age", "years" == "long time" in this case.
                    >
                    > Other examples:
                    > "spirits" == alcoholic beverages
                    > "dealings" == relations
                    > "amends" == reparation
                    > "hoops" == basketball
                    >
                    > -- Ben Haskell
                    > -- WordNet Technical Support Specialist
                    >
                    > On Wed, 25 May 2005, beata_b_bk wrote:
                    >
                    > > --- In wn-perl@yahoogroups.com, Jason Rennie <jrennie@g...> wrote:
                    > > > So, the fix will require a non-trivial amount of restructuring
                    of the
                    > > > QueryData. It might be a few days or weeks before I find the
                    time to
                    > > > work on this.
                    > > >
                    > > > It appears that the first word returned by validForms will always be
                    > > > valid. So, as a short-term fix, I'd suggest that if you're using
                    > > > validForms, you only use the first of the words returned.
                    > > >
                    > > > Jason
                    > >
                    > > HI, Jason,
                    > >
                    > > Is there any reason for validForms to return the original, pluralized
                    > > form of a noun? I.e. years#n -> years#n year#n ?
                    > >
                    > > I am currently taking last element from noun list and first element in
                    > > verb list as my base form defaults.
                    > >
                    > > Cheers,
                    > >
                    > > Beata
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > WordNet::QueryData web page:
                    http://people.csail.mit.edu/~jrennie/WordNet/
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    __________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________
                    > > Yahoo! Groups Links
                    > > * To visit your group on the web, go to:
                    > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/wn-perl/
                    > >
                    > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
                    > > wn-perl-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                    > >
                    > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
                    Service.
                    > >
                    > >
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