Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.

newbie question - what rod thickness?

Expand Messages
  • rpellicer
    Hi everyone. I m an absolute beginner at welding. I m planning to get my first stick welder this week. I ve done as much reading as I could before starting
    Message 1 of 15 , Jul 15, 2012
    • 0 Attachment
      Hi everyone. I'm an absolute beginner at welding. I'm planning to get my first stick welder this week. I've done as much reading as I could before starting off.

      I've seen many references to amp settings for given rod sizes, but have not found info on what size rods to use for given material thickness. Is there any rule of thumb? I recognize that adjustments will have to be made while actually welding, but I just would like to know how to get to ballpark to start with.

      My first planned project is going to be a boat trailer using 1/8 c-channel.

      Thanks :)
    • Cindy and James
      First things first. You need to learn how to weld before you start on a project like a boat trailer. Boats are heavy and you pull them down the highway. You
      Message 2 of 15 , Jul 17, 2012
      • 0 Attachment
        First things first.  You need to learn how to weld before you start on a project like a boat trailer.  Boats are heavy and you pull them down the highway.  You don't want a failure that could endanger someone.  I've seen trailers get lost going down the highway.  It isn't pretty.

        Practice first, buy some of the metal you will use on the trailer, cut into sections and weld.  See what works, what doesn't, try to figure out why and improve.  Learn how to make good joints that fit-up good, they are easier to weld than joints that fit poorly. 

        Welding isn't rocket science, but for most people (myself included) you need to learn or acquire the skill.  Some can't weld. Period.  Many can, but it still takes practice and some knowledge.

        I was taught that the decimal equivalent of the diameter of the metal part of the electrode is a place to start for amperage settings.  Much depends on your machine and the electricity you have at your location.  That is only a STARTING POINT.  You will have to adjust settings on the machine to get them right.  All machines are a bit different.  My Miller Dynasty 200 will run a 1/8" 6010 at 65-90 amps.  A bit hotter for a 1/8" 7018 is required.

        Look on the box the electrodes came in.  That will give you a range to start with also.

        I don't stick weld much anymore, mostly MIG and TIG, and all my machines  are industrial rated by either Miller or Lincoln.  Buy the best you can afford, quality costs but pays off in the long run.

        JA

        On 7/15/2012 11:50 AM, rpellicer wrote:
         

        Hi everyone. I'm an absolute beginner at welding. I'm planning to get my first stick welder this week. I've done as much reading as I could before starting off.

        I've seen many references to amp settings for given rod sizes, but have not found info on what size rods to use for given material thickness. Is there any rule of thumb? I recognize that adjustments will have to be made while actually welding, but I just would like to know how to get to ballpark to start with.

        My first planned project is going to be a boat trailer using 1/8 c-channel.

        Thanks :)



      • Thomas Quimby
        Go to your local community college and take some classes ________________________________ From: Cindy and James To:
        Message 3 of 15 , Jul 17, 2012
        • 0 Attachment
          Go to your local community college and take some classes


          From: Cindy and James <jallcorn@...>
          To: welding_group@yahoogroups.com
          Cc: rpellicer <rpellicer@...>
          Sent: Tuesday, July 17, 2012 6:50 PM
          Subject: Re: [welding_group] newbie question - what rod thickness?

           
          First things first.  You need to learn how to weld before you start on a project like a boat trailer.  Boats are heavy and you pull them down the highway.  You don't want a failure that could endanger someone.  I've seen trailers get lost going down the highway.  It isn't pretty.

          Practice first, buy some of the metal you will use on the trailer, cut into sections and weld.  See what works, what doesn't, try to figure out why and improve.  Learn how to make good joints that fit-up good, they are easier to weld than joints that fit poorly. 

          Welding isn't rocket science, but for most people (myself included) you need to learn or acquire the skill.  Some can't weld. Period.  Many can, but it still takes practice and some knowledge.

          I was taught that the decimal equivalent of the diameter of the metal part of the electrode is a place to start for amperage settings.  Much depends on your machine and the electricity you have at your location.  That is only a STARTING POINT.  You will have to adjust settings on the machine to get them right.  All machines are a bit different.  My Miller Dynasty 200 will run a 1/8" 6010 at 65-90 amps.  A bit hotter for a 1/8" 7018 is required.

          Look on the box the electrodes came in.  That will give you a range to start with also.

          I don't stick weld much anymore, mostly MIG and TIG, and all my machines  are industrial rated by either Miller or Lincoln.  Buy the best you can afford, quality costs but pays off in the long run.

          JA

          On 7/15/2012 11:50 AM, rpellicer wrote:
           
          Hi everyone. I'm an absolute beginner at welding. I'm planning to get my first stick welder this week. I've done as much reading as I could before starting off.

          I've seen many references to amp settings for given rod sizes, but have not found info on what size rods to use for given material thickness. Is there any rule of thumb? I recognize that adjustments will have to be made while actually welding, but I just would like to know how to get to ballpark to start with.

          My first planned project is going to be a boat trailer using 1/8 c-channel.

          Thanks :)





        • Jallcorn
          I glossed over the decimal stuff... 1/8 = .125 so start with a 125 amp setting. Your mileage WILL vary! PRACTICE! Cindy or James
          Message 4 of 15 , Jul 17, 2012
          • 0 Attachment
            I glossed over the decimal stuff... 1/8" = .125 so start with a 125 amp setting. Your mileage WILL vary!  PRACTICE!

            Cindy or James 

            On Jul 17, 2012, at 6:50 PM, Cindy and James <jallcorn@...> wrote:

             

            First things first.  You need to learn how to weld before you start on a project like a boat trailer.  Boats are heavy and you pull them down the highway.  You don't want a failure that could endanger someone.  I've seen trailers get lost going down the highway.  It isn't pretty.

            Practice first, buy some of the metal you will use on the trailer, cut into sections and weld.  See what works, what doesn't, try to figure out why and improve.  Learn how to make good joints that fit-up good, they are easier to weld than joints that fit poorly. 

            Welding isn't rocket science, but for most people (myself included) you need to learn or acquire the skill.  Some can't weld. Period.  Many can, but it still takes practice and some knowledge.

            I was taught that the decimal equivalent of the diameter of the metal part of the electrode is a place to start for amperage settings.  Much depends on your machine and the electricity you have at your location.  That is only a STARTING POINT.  You will have to adjust settings on the machine to get them right.  All machines are a bit different.  My Miller Dynasty 200 will run a 1/8" 6010 at 65-90 amps.  A bit hotter for a 1/8" 7018 is required.

            Look on the box the electrodes came in.  That will give you a range to start with also.

            I don't stick weld much anymore, mostly MIG and TIG, and all my machines  are industrial rated by either Miller or Lincoln.  Buy the best you can afford, quality costs but pays off in the long run.

            JA

            On 7/15/2012 11:50 AM, rpellicer wrote:
             

            Hi everyone. I'm an absolute beginner at welding. I'm planning to get my first stick welder this week. I've done as much reading as I could before starting off.

            I've seen many references to amp settings for given rod sizes, but have not found info on what size rods to use for given material thickness. Is there any rule of thumb? I recognize that adjustments will have to be made while actually welding, but I just would like to know how to get to ballpark to start with.

            My first planned project is going to be a boat trailer using 1/8 c-channel.

            Thanks :)



          • David G. LeVine
            ... Just to amplify, quality costs, but poor quality keeps on costing. Once you get beyond a really simple, low powered buzz box, component quality and
            Message 5 of 15 , Jul 18, 2012
            • 0 Attachment
              On 07/17/2012 07:50 PM, Cindy and James wrote:
              Buy the best you can afford, quality costs but pays off in the long run.

              Just to amplify, quality costs, but poor quality keeps on costing.

              Once you get beyond a really simple, low powered buzz box, component quality and workmanship matter.

              If you have a cheap Chinese (yes I am being specific here) MIG welder and it needs repair parts and it is more than 6 months old, good luck.  If you bought a Miller, Lincoln, etc. you probably can get them from the vendor.

              If a weld is poor and fails killing someone, who is liable?  Hint, your weld, your piece of equipment, etc.  If it was a cheap welder that caused the problem, do you think the manufacturer will pay for it?

              Each issue is a small risk, but there are so many that it starts to add up quickly. 

              Would you pay a man to weld for you if his work was below par?  Would you like your work to be viewed that way?

              Dave  8{)

              --
              "The first method for estimating the intelligence of a ruler is to look at the men he has around him."
              Niccolo Machiavelli

              NOTE TO ALL:

              When forwarding emails, please use only "Blind Carbon Copy" or "Bcc" for all recipients. Please "delete" or "highlight & cut" any forwarding history which includes my email address! It is a courtesy to me and others who may not wish to have their email addresses sent all over the world! Erasing the history helps prevent Spammers from mining addresses and viruses from being propagated.


              THANK YOU!
            • dennisthornton1952
              I ve been welding for decades and still wouldn t call myself a welder. I ll reserve that designation for someone who does it full-time or a least a lot more
              Message 6 of 15 , Jul 18, 2012
              • 0 Attachment
                I've been welding for decades and still wouldn't call myself a welder. I'll reserve that designation for someone who does it full-time or a least a lot more than I do on a regular basis. However, I do know one thing! No one should learn on a trailer! And probably not on ANYTHING that is actually going to be used! Buy Lincoln's "Arc Welding" manual. Spend some time reading not only about filler rods but also metals. Burn up a few pounds of rod! Learn on a piece of scrap! Bend and break your attempts until you develop some understanding of penetration and what a weld actually is.

                Long after I knew how to weld and what to look for in a weld I bought a used trailer. The weld on the tongue almost broke loose! Looked ok, but it wasn't! No harm done! It got fixed! But that story could have been a whole lot worse!

                Burn up a few rods and then bring back some more questions. Odds are you won't be asking what size rods to use! <grin> You'll know and you'll be asking more in depth questions.

                I don't mean to throw a wrench into your plans and I admire folks trying to make stuff, but I just don't sense that a homemade trailer used on the road should be one of your immediate projects if you are going to be the welder.

                Don't give up! Just gather enough info to do it properly. Get some help if you can! I learned a lot from a kid when I first started welding! Kid was good! I paid attention even though I was a lot older than he was! You'll develop both your skills and confidence if someone qualified will spend just an hour or so with you. You still won't be ready for the trailer <grin!> but you'll be a lot closer!

                Or if you think you might be doing a lot of welding in the future, consider a course!

                Good luck! And don't be in a big hurry!

                Dennis Thornton

                --- In welding_group@yahoogroups.com, "rpellicer" <rpellicer@...> wrote:
                >
                > Hi everyone. I'm an absolute beginner at welding. I'm planning to get my first stick welder this week. I've done as much reading as I could before starting off.
                >
                > I've seen many references to amp settings for given rod sizes, but have not found info on what size rods to use for given material thickness. Is there any rule of thumb? I recognize that adjustments will have to be made while actually welding, but I just would like to know how to get to ballpark to start with.
                >
                > My first planned project is going to be a boat trailer using 1/8 c-channel.
                >
                > Thanks :)
                >
              • jbrookes40
                hmmm. It depends. If the learner can weld for a few hours and has a sense of adequately melting the steel on both pieces to be joined - then OK. I ve seen
                Message 7 of 15 , Jul 18, 2012
                • 0 Attachment
                  hmmm. It depends. If the learner can weld for a few hours and has a sense of adequately melting the steel on both pieces to be joined - then OK. I've seen farmers weld stock cars for raceways with ugly welds. Yes, I would practice on pieces of metal for an afternoon. And use a chip hammer to see adequate penetration both sides. If inadequate, then more metal can be added where necessary. X-ray quality not necessary for strong welds.
                  If I were unsure about my weld quality, I would just weld long welds after tack welding. Then chip off slag with chip hammer to see if metal bridged across well. Grinding through to confirm.Add some.
                  The reason you can get away with such behavior is welds are very strong, up to a ton an inch.
                  OTOH, if you don't know what I'm talking about, then get an experienced welder to show you the basics. (or look at a video.)
                  In World War Two many navy welders patched their ship quickly to rejoin the battle.
                  Say, what is your license plate number? I'd like tp be careful! :)
                  j


                  --- In welding_group@yahoogroups.com, "dennisthornton1952" <dennisthornton@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > I've been welding for decades and still wouldn't call myself a welder. I'll reserve that designation for someone who does it full-time or a least a lot more than I do on a regular basis. However, I do know one thing! No one should learn on a trailer! And probably not on ANYTHING that is actually going to be used! Buy Lincoln's "Arc Welding" manual. Spend some time reading not only about filler rods but also metals. Burn up a few pounds of rod! Learn on a piece of scrap! Bend and break your attempts until you develop some understanding of penetration and what a weld actually is.
                  >
                  > Long after I knew how to weld and what to look for in a weld I bought a used trailer. The weld on the tongue almost broke loose! Looked ok, but it wasn't! No harm done! It got fixed! But that story could have been a whole lot worse!
                  >
                  > Burn up a few rods and then bring back some more questions. Odds are you won't be asking what size rods to use! <grin> You'll know and you'll be asking more in depth questions.
                  >
                  > I don't mean to throw a wrench into your plans and I admire folks trying to make stuff, but I just don't sense that a homemade trailer used on the road should be one of your immediate projects if you are going to be the welder.
                  >
                  > Don't give up! Just gather enough info to do it properly. Get some help if you can! I learned a lot from a kid when I first started welding! Kid was good! I paid attention even though I was a lot older than he was! You'll develop both your skills and confidence if someone qualified will spend just an hour or so with you. You still won't be ready for the trailer <grin!> but you'll be a lot closer!
                  >
                  > Or if you think you might be doing a lot of welding in the future, consider a course!
                  >
                  > Good luck! And don't be in a big hurry!
                  >
                  > Dennis Thornton
                  >
                  > --- In welding_group@yahoogroups.com, "rpellicer" <rpellicer@> wrote:
                  > >
                  > > Hi everyone. I'm an absolute beginner at welding. I'm planning to get my first stick welder this week. I've done as much reading as I could before starting off.
                  > >
                  > > I've seen many references to amp settings for given rod sizes, but have not found info on what size rods to use for given material thickness. Is there any rule of thumb? I recognize that adjustments will have to be made while actually welding, but I just would like to know how to get to ballpark to start with.
                  > >
                  > > My first planned project is going to be a boat trailer using 1/8 c-channel.
                  > >
                  > > Thanks :)
                  > >
                  >
                • Scott Williams
                  Good advice. Remember that most welders who use MIG and TIG have an old stick welder in the corner, try to buy a quality used machine if possible. You can get
                  Message 8 of 15 , Jul 25, 2012
                  • 0 Attachment

                    Good advice.  Remember that most welders who use MIG and TIG have an old stick welder in the corner, try to buy a quality used machine if possible.  You can get a great deal on an AC machine, but you might want to try to get an AC/DC machine if you’re planning on doing a lot of welding.  I have read that the DC machine can give a smoother arc.

                     

                    I’ve got a Lincoln AC225S that I found on the side of the road (the guy there said it worked when he last tried it many years ago) and I’ve see AC/DC machines by Lincoln and Miller for as low as $100 used.  Watch craigslist and wait for a bargain to come along, and you might get rods, gloves, and a helmet included if you’re lucky.

                     

                    Scott in Penfield NY

                     

                    From: welding_group@yahoogroups.com [mailto:welding_group@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Cindy and James
                    Sent: Tuesday, July 17, 2012 7:50 PM
                    To: welding_group@yahoogroups.com
                    Cc: rpellicer
                    Subject: Re: [welding_group] newbie question - what rod thickness?

                     



                    First things first.  You need to learn how to weld before you start on a project like a boat trailer.  Boats are heavy and you pull them down the highway.  You don't want a failure that could endanger someone.  I've seen trailers get lost going down the highway.  It isn't pretty.

                    Practice first, buy some of the metal you will use on the trailer, cut into sections and weld.  See what works, what doesn't, try to figure out why and improve.  Learn how to make good joints that fit-up good, they are easier to weld than joints that fit poorly. 

                    Welding isn't rocket science, but for most people (myself included) you need to learn or acquire the skill.  Some can't weld. Period.  Many can, but it still takes practice and some knowledge.

                    I was taught that the decimal equivalent of the diameter of the metal part of the electrode is a place to start for amperage settings.  Much depends on your machine and the electricity you have at your location.  That is only a STARTING POINT.  You will have to adjust settings on the machine to get them right.  All machines are a bit different.  My Miller Dynasty 200 will run a 1/8" 6010 at 65-90 amps.  A bit hotter for a 1/8" 7018 is required.

                    Look on the box the electrodes came in.  That will give you a range to start with also.

                    I don't stick weld much anymore, mostly MIG and TIG, and all my machines  are industrial rated by either Miller or Lincoln.  Buy the best you can afford, quality costs but pays off in the long run.

                    JA

                    On 7/15/2012 11:50 AM, rpellicer wrote:

                     

                    Hi everyone. I'm an absolute beginner at welding. I'm planning to get my first stick welder this week. I've done as much reading as I could before starting off.

                    I've seen many references to amp settings for given rod sizes, but have not found info on what size rods to use for given material thickness. Is there any rule of thumb? I recognize that adjustments will have to be made while actually welding, but I just would like to know how to get to ballpark to start with.

                    My first planned project is going to be a boat trailer using 1/8 c-channel.

                    Thanks :)






                  • pupdieselluv
                    Welcome to the board! Welding is fun and exciting as you get to MAKE somethign right away. Your questionon rod size and AMP is good and the other folks have
                    Message 9 of 15 , Jul 27, 2012
                    • 0 Attachment
                      Welcome to the board! Welding is fun and exciting as you get to MAKE somethign right away.
                      Your questionon rod size and AMP is good and the other folks have answered it. A boat trailer is a VERY SERIOUS project. You will need fixtures to hold various components in the proper orientation, be aable to accurately grind the areas to be joined for correct penetration and match up.
                      Make somethign simple firest. A chair, a rack for fire wood, pull up bar on angle brackets or even a welding bench, or cabinet for your welding supplies.
                      The liability issues with a trailer are way beyond the beginner. Be safe and ejnoy.
                      Regards,
                      Eric
                      --- In welding_group@yahoogroups.com, "jbrookes40" <haiticare2011@...> wrote:
                      >
                      > hmmm. It depends. If the learner can weld for a few hours and has a sense of adequately melting the steel on both pieces to be joined - then OK. I've seen farmers weld stock cars for raceways with ugly welds. Yes, I would practice on pieces of metal for an afternoon. And use a chip hammer to see adequate penetration both sides. If inadequate, then more metal can be added where necessary. X-ray quality not necessary for strong welds.
                      > If I were unsure about my weld quality, I would just weld long welds after tack welding. Then chip off slag with chip hammer to see if metal bridged across well. Grinding through to confirm.Add some.
                      > The reason you can get away with such behavior is welds are very strong, up to a ton an inch.
                      > OTOH, if you don't know what I'm talking about, then get an experienced welder to show you the basics. (or look at a video.)
                      > In World War Two many navy welders patched their ship quickly to rejoin the battle.
                      > Say, what is your license plate number? I'd like tp be careful! :)
                      > j
                      >
                      >
                      > --- In welding_group@yahoogroups.com, "dennisthornton1952" <dennisthornton@> wrote:
                      > >
                      > > I've been welding for decades and still wouldn't call myself a welder. I'll reserve that designation for someone who does it full-time or a least a lot more than I do on a regular basis. However, I do know one thing! No one should learn on a trailer! And probably not on ANYTHING that is actually going to be used! Buy Lincoln's "Arc Welding" manual. Spend some time reading not only about filler rods but also metals. Burn up a few pounds of rod! Learn on a piece of scrap! Bend and break your attempts until you develop some understanding of penetration and what a weld actually is.
                      > >
                      > > Long after I knew how to weld and what to look for in a weld I bought a used trailer. The weld on the tongue almost broke loose! Looked ok, but it wasn't! No harm done! It got fixed! But that story could have been a whole lot worse!
                      > >
                      > > Burn up a few rods and then bring back some more questions. Odds are you won't be asking what size rods to use! <grin> You'll know and you'll be asking more in depth questions.
                      > >
                      > > I don't mean to throw a wrench into your plans and I admire folks trying to make stuff, but I just don't sense that a homemade trailer used on the road should be one of your immediate projects if you are going to be the welder.
                      > >
                      > > Don't give up! Just gather enough info to do it properly. Get some help if you can! I learned a lot from a kid when I first started welding! Kid was good! I paid attention even though I was a lot older than he was! You'll develop both your skills and confidence if someone qualified will spend just an hour or so with you. You still won't be ready for the trailer <grin!> but you'll be a lot closer!
                      > >
                      > > Or if you think you might be doing a lot of welding in the future, consider a course!
                      > >
                      > > Good luck! And don't be in a big hurry!
                      > >
                      > > Dennis Thornton
                      > >
                      > > --- In welding_group@yahoogroups.com, "rpellicer" <rpellicer@> wrote:
                      > > >
                      > > > Hi everyone. I'm an absolute beginner at welding. I'm planning to get my first stick welder this week. I've done as much reading as I could before starting off.
                      > > >
                      > > > I've seen many references to amp settings for given rod sizes, but have not found info on what size rods to use for given material thickness. Is there any rule of thumb? I recognize that adjustments will have to be made while actually welding, but I just would like to know how to get to ballpark to start with.
                      > > >
                      > > > My first planned project is going to be a boat trailer using 1/8 c-channel.
                      > > >
                      > > > Thanks :)
                      > > >
                      > >
                      >
                    • jbrookes40
                      Dennis, Do the trailer and have an experienced welder look at it. Always be adventurous and learn to believe in yourself. That s the spirit of individuality in
                      Message 10 of 15 , Jul 27, 2012
                      • 0 Attachment
                        Dennis,
                        Do the trailer and have an experienced welder look at it. Always be adventurous and learn to believe in yourself. That's the spirit of individuality in America that is being lost. That intangible issue will be more important to you than being a rule follower. Ive come up against this issue in machining, the value of "going for it." Just drive your trailer to a welding shop and have a welder look at it. He will tell you if its totally unsafe, and he may be able to add a few welds to correct that. As I have stated, welds are ridiculously strong, so can be corrected pretty easily. "Go West, young man!"

                        --- In welding_group@yahoogroups.com, "pupdieselluv" <hmshop@...> wrote:
                        >
                        >
                        > Welcome to the board! Welding is fun and exciting as you get to MAKE somethign right away.
                        > Your questionon rod size and AMP is good and the other folks have answered it. A boat trailer is a VERY SERIOUS project. You will need fixtures to hold various components in the proper orientation, be aable to accurately grind the areas to be joined for correct penetration and match up.
                        > Make somethign simple firest. A chair, a rack for fire wood, pull up bar on angle brackets or even a welding bench, or cabinet for your welding supplies.
                        > The liability issues with a trailer are way beyond the beginner. Be safe and ejnoy.
                        > Regards,
                        > Eric
                        > --- In welding_group@yahoogroups.com, "jbrookes40" <haiticare2011@> wrote:
                        > >
                        > > hmmm. It depends. If the learner can weld for a few hours and has a sense of adequately melting the steel on both pieces to be joined - then OK. I've seen farmers weld stock cars for raceways with ugly welds. Yes, I would practice on pieces of metal for an afternoon. And use a chip hammer to see adequate penetration both sides. If inadequate, then more metal can be added where necessary. X-ray quality not necessary for strong welds.
                        > > If I were unsure about my weld quality, I would just weld long welds after tack welding. Then chip off slag with chip hammer to see if metal bridged across well. Grinding through to confirm.Add some.
                        > > The reason you can get away with such behavior is welds are very strong, up to a ton an inch.
                        > > OTOH, if you don't know what I'm talking about, then get an experienced welder to show you the basics. (or look at a video.)
                        > > In World War Two many navy welders patched their ship quickly to rejoin the battle.
                        > > Say, what is your license plate number? I'd like tp be careful! :)
                        > > j
                        > >
                        > >
                        > > --- In welding_group@yahoogroups.com, "dennisthornton1952" <dennisthornton@> wrote:
                        > > >
                        > > > I've been welding for decades and still wouldn't call myself a welder. I'll reserve that designation for someone who does it full-time or a least a lot more than I do on a regular basis. However, I do know one thing! No one should learn on a trailer! And probably not on ANYTHING that is actually going to be used! Buy Lincoln's "Arc Welding" manual. Spend some time reading not only about filler rods but also metals. Burn up a few pounds of rod! Learn on a piece of scrap! Bend and break your attempts until you develop some understanding of penetration and what a weld actually is.
                        > > >
                        > > > Long after I knew how to weld and what to look for in a weld I bought a used trailer. The weld on the tongue almost broke loose! Looked ok, but it wasn't! No harm done! It got fixed! But that story could have been a whole lot worse!
                        > > >
                        > > > Burn up a few rods and then bring back some more questions. Odds are you won't be asking what size rods to use! <grin> You'll know and you'll be asking more in depth questions.
                        > > >
                        > > > I don't mean to throw a wrench into your plans and I admire folks trying to make stuff, but I just don't sense that a homemade trailer used on the road should be one of your immediate projects if you are going to be the welder.
                        > > >
                        > > > Don't give up! Just gather enough info to do it properly. Get some help if you can! I learned a lot from a kid when I first started welding! Kid was good! I paid attention even though I was a lot older than he was! You'll develop both your skills and confidence if someone qualified will spend just an hour or so with you. You still won't be ready for the trailer <grin!> but you'll be a lot closer!
                        > > >
                        > > > Or if you think you might be doing a lot of welding in the future, consider a course!
                        > > >
                        > > > Good luck! And don't be in a big hurry!
                        > > >
                        > > > Dennis Thornton
                        > > >
                        > > > --- In welding_group@yahoogroups.com, "rpellicer" <rpellicer@> wrote:
                        > > > >
                        > > > > Hi everyone. I'm an absolute beginner at welding. I'm planning to get my first stick welder this week. I've done as much reading as I could before starting off.
                        > > > >
                        > > > > I've seen many references to amp settings for given rod sizes, but have not found info on what size rods to use for given material thickness. Is there any rule of thumb? I recognize that adjustments will have to be made while actually welding, but I just would like to know how to get to ballpark to start with.
                        > > > >
                        > > > > My first planned project is going to be a boat trailer using 1/8 c-channel.
                        > > > >
                        > > > > Thanks :)
                        > > > >
                        > > >
                        > >
                        >
                      • David E. Shelton
                        OK, I think you should have your first project as something small that you will have to use and look at often, toolbox or shop tool or maybe even yard art. My
                        Message 11 of 15 , Jul 27, 2012
                        • 0 Attachment
                          OK, I think you should have your first project as something small that you will have to use and look at often, toolbox or shop tool or maybe even yard art. My suggestion is this because you will look at it often and see those welds and if you can live with that then you will build your confidence for bigger projects. That's what I did when I started welding, I also started with a MIG machine which make good welding easier. I now routinely use MIG, TIG and rarely Stick for something dirty/thick/difficult to prep usually tractor implement repairs. Take your time and learn from welder in your community, every community has good ones. Good Luck, if you go straight to a big project like a trailer use will probably have joint that inconsistent (structurally unsound) and waste a lot of money fixing your mistakes or worse not fixing them and find them out later.

                          On Friday, July 27, 2012, jbrookes40 wrote:
                          Dennis,
                          Do the trailer and have an experienced welder look at it. Always be adventurous and learn to believe in yourself. That's the spirit of individuality in America that is being lost. That intangible issue will be more important to you than being a rule follower. Ive come up against this issue in machining, the value of "going for it." Just drive your trailer to a welding shop and have a welder look at it. He will tell you if its totally unsafe, and he may be able to add a few welds to correct that. As I have stated, welds are ridiculously strong, so can be corrected pretty easily. "Go West, young man!"

                          --- In welding_group@yahoogroups.com, "pupdieselluv" <hmshop@...> wrote:
                          >
                          >
                          > Welcome to the board! Welding is fun and exciting as you get to MAKE somethign right away.
                          > Your questionon rod size and AMP is good and the other folks have answered it. A boat trailer is a VERY SERIOUS project. You will need fixtures to hold various components in the proper orientation, be aable to accurately grind the areas to be joined for correct penetration and match up.
                          > Make somethign simple firest. A chair, a rack for fire wood, pull up bar on angle brackets or even a welding bench, or cabinet for your welding supplies.
                          > The liability issues with a trailer are way beyond the beginner. Be safe and ejnoy.
                          > Regards,
                          > Eric
                          > --- In welding_group@yahoogroups.com, "jbrookes40" <haiticare2011@> wrote:
                          > >
                          > > hmmm. It depends. If the learner can weld for a few hours and has a sense of adequately melting the steel on both pieces to be joined - then OK. I've seen farmers weld stock cars for raceways with ugly welds. Yes, I would practice on pieces of metal for an afternoon. And use a chip hammer to see adequate penetration both sides. If inadequate, then more metal can be added where necessary. X-ray quality not necessary for strong welds.
                          > > If I were unsure about my weld quality, I would just weld long welds after tack welding. Then chip off slag with chip hammer to see if metal bridged across well. Grinding through to confirm.Add some.
                          > > The reason you can get away with such behavior is welds are very strong, up to a ton an inch.
                          > > OTOH, if you don't know what I'm talking about, then get an experienced welder to show you the basics. (or look at a video.)
                          > > In World War Two many navy welders patched their ship quickly to rejoin the battle.
                          > > Say, what is your license plate number? I'd like tp be careful! :)
                          > > j
                          > >
                          > >
                          > > --- In welding_group@yahoogroups.com, "dennisthornton1952" <dennisthornton@> wrote:
                          > > >
                          > > > I've been welding for decades and still wouldn't call myself a welder.  I'll reserve that designation for someone who does it full-time or a least a lot more than I do on a regular basis.  However, I do know one thing!  No one should learn on a trailer!  And probably not on ANYTHING that is actually going to be used! Buy Lincoln's "Arc Welding" manual.  Spend some time reading not only about filler rods but also metals.  Burn up a few pounds of rod!  Learn on a piece of scrap!  Bend and break your attempts until you develop some understanding of penetration and what a weld actually is.
                          > > >
                          > > > Long after I knew how to weld and what to look for in a weld I bought a used trailer.  The weld on the tongue almost broke loose!  Looked ok, but it wasn't!  No harm done!  It got fixed!  But that story could have been a whole lot worse!
                          > > >
                          > > > Burn up a few rods and then bring back some more questions.  Odds are you won't be asking what size rods to use!  <grin>  You'll know and you'll be asking more in depth questions.
                          > > >
                          > > > I don't mean to throw a wrench into your plans and I admire folks trying to make stuff, but I just don't sense that a homemade trailer used on the road should be one of your immediate projects if you are going to be the welder.
                          > > >
                          > > > Don't give up!  Just gather enough info to do it properly.  Get some help if you can!  I learned a lot from a kid when I first started welding!  Kid was good!  I paid attention even though I was a lot older than he was!  You'll develop both your skills and confidence if someone qualified will spend just an hour or so with you. You still won't be ready for the trailer <grin!> but you'll be a lot closer!
                          > > >
                          > > > Or if you think you might be doing a lot of welding in the future, consider a course!
                          > > >
                          > > > Good luck!  And don't be in a big hurry!
                          > > >
                          > > > Dennis Thornton
                          > > >
                          > > > --- In welding_group@yahoogroups.com, "rpellicer" <rpellicer@> wrote:
                          > > > >
                          > > > > Hi everyone. I'm an absolute beginner at welding. I'm planning to get my first stick welder this week. I've done as much reading as I could before starting off.
                          > > > >
                          > > > > I've seen many references to amp settings for given rod sizes, but have not found info on what size rods to use for given material thickness. Is there any rule of thumb? I recognize that adjustments will have to be made while actually welding, but I just would like to know how to get to ballpark to start with.
                          > > > >
                          > > > > My first planned project is going to be a boat trailer using 1/8 c-channel.
                          > > > >
                          > > > > Thanks :)
                          > > > >
                          > > >
                          > >
                          >




                          ------------------------------------

                          Yahoo! Groups Links

                          <*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
                             
                        • Don
                          I agree about the safety issues mentioned above but if you are still determined, Make sure to slightly oscillate from the one pc to the other. meaning
                          Message 12 of 15 , Jul 28, 2012
                          • 0 Attachment
                            I agree about the safety issues mentioned above but if you are still determined, Make sure to slightly oscillate from the one pc to the other. meaning concentrate the rod on one pc for a second then move to concentrate to the other for a second. The total width of weld should be around 1/4 to 3/8 on an inch. Count in your head to help you to stay even. And most important, try on two similar pcs of scrap first for a couple of inches then clean up take a look and see what and how to make it look like it should. I would use 3/32 6011 for down hill
                            Or 7018 for uphill.
                            Good luck.           Your not going to be towing in ca are you?!!

                            --- On Fri, 7/27/12, pupdieselluv <hmshop@...> wrote:

                            From: pupdieselluv <hmshop@...>
                            Subject: [welding_group] Re: newbie question - what rod thickness?
                            To: welding_group@yahoogroups.com
                            Date: Friday, July 27, 2012, 7:26 AM

                             


                            Welcome to the board! Welding is fun and exciting as you get to MAKE somethign right away.
                            Your questionon rod size and AMP is good and the other folks have answered it. A boat trailer is a VERY SERIOUS project. You will need fixtures to hold various components in the proper orientation, be aable to accurately grind the areas to be joined for correct penetration and match up.
                            Make somethign simple firest. A chair, a rack for fire wood, pull up bar on angle brackets or even a welding bench, or cabinet for your welding supplies.
                            The liability issues with a trailer are way beyond the beginner. Be safe and ejnoy.
                            Regards,
                            Eric
                            --- In welding_group@yahoogroups.com, "jbrookes40" <haiticare2011@...> wrote:
                            >
                            > hmmm. It depends. If the learner can weld for a few hours and has a sense of adequately melting the steel on both pieces to be joined - then OK. I've seen farmers weld stock cars for raceways with ugly welds. Yes, I would practice on pieces of metal for an afternoon. And use a chip hammer to see adequate penetration both sides. If inadequate, then more metal can be added where necessary. X-ray quality not necessary for strong welds.
                            > If I were unsure about my weld quality, I would just weld long welds after tack welding. Then chip off slag with chip hammer to see if metal bridged across well. Grinding through to confirm.Add some.
                            > The reason you can get away with such behavior is welds are very strong, up to a ton an inch.
                            > OTOH, if you don't know what I'm talking about, then get an experienced welder to show you the basics. (or look at a video.)
                            > In World War Two many navy welders patched their ship quickly to rejoin the battle.
                            > Say, what is your license plate number? I'd like tp be careful! :)
                            > j
                            >
                            >
                            > --- In welding_group@yahoogroups.com, "dennisthornton1952" <dennisthornton@> wrote:
                            > >
                            > > I've been welding for decades and still wouldn't call myself a welder. I'll reserve that designation for someone who does it full-time or a least a lot more than I do on a regular basis. However, I do know one thing! No one should learn on a trailer! And probably not on ANYTHING that is actually going to be used! Buy Lincoln's "Arc Welding" manual. Spend some time reading not only about filler rods but also metals. Burn up a few pounds of rod! Learn on a piece of scrap! Bend and break your attempts until you develop some understanding of penetration and what a weld actually is.
                            > >
                            > > Long after I knew how to weld and what to look for in a weld I bought a used trailer. The weld on the tongue almost broke loose! Looked ok, but it wasn't! No harm done! It got fixed! But that story could have been a whole lot worse!
                            > >
                            > > Burn up a few rods and then bring back some more questions. Odds are you won't be asking what size rods to use! <grin> You'll know and you'll be asking more in depth questions.
                            > >
                            > > I don't mean to throw a wrench into your plans and I admire folks trying to make stuff, but I just don't sense that a homemade trailer used on the road should be one of your immediate projects if you are going to be the welder.
                            > >
                            > > Don't give up! Just gather enough info to do it properly. Get some help if you can! I learned a lot from a kid when I first started welding! Kid was good! I paid attention even though I was a lot older than he was! You'll develop both your skills and confidence if someone qualified will spend just an hour or so with you. You still won't be ready for the trailer <grin!> but you'll be a lot closer!
                            > >
                            > > Or if you think you might be doing a lot of welding in the future, consider a course!
                            > >
                            > > Good luck! And don't be in a big hurry!
                            > >
                            > > Dennis Thornton
                            > >
                            > > --- In welding_group@yahoogroups.com, "rpellicer" <rpellicer@> wrote:
                            > > >
                            > > > Hi everyone. I'm an absolute beginner at welding. I'm planning to get my first stick welder this week. I've done as much reading as I could before starting off.
                            > > >
                            > > > I've seen many references to amp settings for given rod sizes, but have not found info on what size rods to use for given material thickness. Is there any rule of thumb? I recognize that adjustments will have to be made while actually welding, but I just would like to know how to get to ballpark to start with.
                            > > >
                            > > > My first planned project is going to be a boat trailer using 1/8 c-channel.
                            > > >
                            > > > Thanks :)
                            > > >
                            > >
                            >

                          • magician
                            get the series, Trailers, How to Design and Build by M.M. Smith, 3 volume set. Very informative. ________________________________ From: Don
                            Message 13 of 15 , Jul 29, 2012
                            • 0 Attachment
                              get the series, 'Trailers, How to Design and Build' by M.M. Smith, 3 volume set. Very informative.


                              From: Don <hoistin2000@...>
                              To: welding_group@yahoogroups.com
                              Sent: Saturday, July 28, 2012 10:39 AM
                              Subject: Re: [welding_group] Re: newbie question - what rod thickness?
                              I agree about the safety issues mentioned above but if you are still determined, Make sure to slightly oscillate from the one pc to the other. meaning concentrate the rod on one pc for a second then move to concentrate to the other for a second. The total width of weld should be around 1/4 to 3/8 on an inch. Count in your head to help you to stay even. And most important, try on two similar pcs of scrap first for a couple of inches then clean up take a look and see what and how to make it look like it should. I would use 3/32 6011 for down hill
                              Or 7018 for uphill.
                              Good luck.           Your not going to be towing in ca are you?!! --- On Fri, 7/27/12, pupdieselluv <hmshop@...> wrote:

                              From: pupdieselluv <hmshop@...>
                              Subject: [welding_group] Re: newbie question - what rod thickness?
                              To: welding_group@yahoogroups.com
                              Date: Friday, July 27, 2012, 7:26 AM

                               

                              Welcome to the board! Welding is fun and exciting as you get to MAKE somethign right away.
                              Your questionon rod size and AMP is good and the other folks have answered it. A boat trailer is a VERY SERIOUS project. You will need fixtures to hold various components in the proper orientation, be aable to accurately grind the areas to be joined for correct penetration and match up.
                              Make somethign simple firest. A chair, a rack for fire wood, pull up bar on angle brackets or even a welding bench, or cabinet for your welding supplies.
                              The liability issues with a trailer are way beyond the beginner. Be safe and ejnoy.
                              Regards,
                              Eric
                              --- In welding_group@yahoogroups.com, "jbrookes40" <haiticare2011@...> wrote:
                              >
                              > hmmm. It depends. If the learner can weld for a few hours and has a sense of adequately melting the steel on both pieces to be joined - then OK. I've seen farmers weld stock cars for raceways with ugly welds. Yes, I would practice on pieces of metal for an afternoon. And use a chip hammer to see adequate penetration both sides. If inadequate, then more metal can be added where necessary. X-ray quality not necessary for strong welds.
                              > If I were unsure about my weld quality, I would just weld long welds after tack welding. Then chip off slag with chip hammer to see if metal bridged across well. Grinding through to confirm.Add some.
                              > The reason you can get away with such behavior is welds are very strong, up to a ton an inch.
                              > OTOH, if you don't know what I'm talking about, then get an experienced welder to show you the basics. (or look at a video.)
                              > In World War Two many navy welders patched their ship quickly to rejoin the battle.
                              > Say, what is your license plate number? I'd like tp be careful! :)
                              > j
                              >
                              >
                              > --- In welding_group@yahoogroups.com, "dennisthornton1952" <dennisthornton@> wrote:
                              > >
                              > > I've been welding for decades and still wouldn't call myself a welder. I'll reserve that designation for someone who does it full-time or a least a lot more than I do on a regular basis. However, I do know one thing! No one should learn on a trailer! And probably not on ANYTHING that is actually going to be used! Buy Lincoln's "Arc Welding" manual. Spend some time reading not only about filler rods but also metals. Burn up a few pounds of rod! Learn on a piece of scrap! Bend and break your attempts until you develop some understanding of penetration and what a weld actually is.
                              > >
                              > > Long after I knew how to weld and what to look for in a weld I bought a used trailer. The weld on the tongue almost broke loose! Looked ok, but it wasn't! No harm done! It got fixed! But that story could have been a whole lot worse!
                              > >
                              > > Burn up a few rods and then bring back some more questions. Odds are you won't be asking what size rods to use! <grin> You'll know and you'll be asking more in depth questions.
                              > >
                              > > I don't mean to throw a wrench into your plans and I admire folks trying to make stuff, but I just don't sense that a homemade trailer used on the road should be one of your immediate projects if you are going to be the welder.
                              > >
                              > > Don't give up! Just gather enough info to do it properly. Get some help if you can! I learned a lot from a kid when I first started welding! Kid was good! I paid attention even though I was a lot older than he was! You'll develop both your skills and confidence if someone qualified will spend just an hour or so with you. You still won't be ready for the trailer <grin!> but you'll be a lot closer!
                              > >
                              > > Or if you think you might be doing a lot of welding in the future, consider a course!
                              > >
                              > > Good luck! And don't be in a big hurry!
                              > >
                              > > Dennis Thornton
                              > >
                              > > --- In welding_group@yahoogroups.com, "rpellicer" <rpellicer@> wrote:
                              > > >
                              > > > Hi everyone. I'm an absolute beginner at welding. I'm planning to get my first stick welder this week. I've done as much reading as I could before starting off.
                              > > >
                              > > > I've seen many references to amp settings for given rod sizes, but have not found info on what size rods to use for given material thickness. Is there any rule of thumb? I recognize that adjustments will have to be made while actually welding, but I just would like to know how to get to ballpark to start with.
                              > > >
                              > > > My first planned project is going to be a boat trailer using 1/8 c-channel.
                              > > >
                              > > > Thanks :)
                              > > >
                              > >
                              >

                            • jbrookes40
                              I learned welding from a union iron worker. He used 1/8 dia rod for nearly everything. 6011 and 6013 as I remember. The big thing to remember is to allow the
                              Message 14 of 15 , Aug 4, 2012
                              • 0 Attachment
                                I learned welding from a union iron worker. He used 1/8 dia rod for nearly everything. 6011 and 6013 as I remember. The big thing to remember is to allow the arc to melt the metal on both sides of the weld. Then you can grind off and chip hammer to see what you have got. My iron worker friend spend a lot of time grind ing off welds and filling in where he had missed.
                                I need to emphasize that, if you have decent penetration (good melting of metal on both sides), then welds are very strong, even if they don't look good. Said iron worker said welds are a ton per inch strength.

                                --- In welding_group@yahoogroups.com, "rpellicer" <rpellicer@...> wrote:
                                >
                                > Hi everyone. I'm an absolute beginner at welding. I'm planning to get my first stick welder this week. I've done as much reading as I could before starting off.
                                >
                                > I've seen many references to amp settings for given rod sizes, but have not found info on what size rods to use for given material thickness. Is there any rule of thumb? I recognize that adjustments will have to be made while actually welding, but I just would like to know how to get to ballpark to start with.
                                >
                                > My first planned project is going to be a boat trailer using 1/8 c-channel.
                                >
                                > Thanks :)
                                >
                              • ertugrul bulut
                                to the welder says, a good welded joint, * good penetration * well become visible welding seam ________________________________ From: jbrookes40
                                Message 15 of 15 , Aug 6, 2012
                                • 0 Attachment
                                  to the welder says, a good welded joint,
                                  * good penetration
                                  * well become visible welding seam


                                  From: jbrookes40 <haiticare2011@...>
                                  To: welding_group@yahoogroups.com
                                  Sent: Saturday, 4 August 2012, 17:20
                                  Subject: [welding_group] Rod thickness not a big issue

                                   
                                  I learned welding from a union iron worker. He used 1/8 dia rod for nearly everything. 6011 and 6013 as I remember. The big thing to remember is to allow the arc to melt the metal on both sides of the weld. Then you can grind off and chip hammer to see what you have got. My iron worker friend spend a lot of time grind ing off welds and filling in where he had missed.
                                  I need to emphasize that, if you have decent penetration (good melting of metal on both sides), then welds are very strong, even if they don't look good. Said iron worker said welds are a ton per inch strength.

                                  --- In welding_group@yahoogroups.com, "rpellicer" <rpellicer@...> wrote:
                                  >
                                  > Hi everyone. I'm an absolute beginner at welding. I'm planning to get my first stick welder this week. I've done as much reading as I could before starting off.
                                  >
                                  > I've seen many references to amp settings for given rod sizes, but have not found info on what size rods to use for given material thickness. Is there any rule of thumb? I recognize that adjustments will have to be made while actually welding, but I just would like to know how to get to ballpark to start with.
                                  >
                                  > My first planned project is going to be a boat trailer using 1/8 c-channel.
                                  >
                                  > Thanks :)
                                  >



                                Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.