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Re: Weblogs == Personal Web Publishing Communities?

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  • Jay Allen
    ... Let s see... on the web = Online Personal = Personal Published = Pubishing Communities = Group Yeah, I love it, Dave...
    Message 1 of 18 , Nov 17, 2001
      --- In webloggerusergroup@y..., "Dave Winer" <dave@u...> wrote:
      > Here's my latest contribution to the "What are Weblogs?" debate..
      >
      > http://newhome.weblogs.com/personalWebPublishingCommunities
      >
      > Hope you enjoy it!

      Let's see...

      "on the web" = Online
      Personal = Personal
      Published = Pubishing
      Communities = Group

      Yeah, I love it, Dave... http://groups.yahoo.com/group/webloggerusergroup/message/472

      -j-
      http://www.openwire.com
    • Dave Winer
      I had a domain for a while that we just let go: unclesclub.com. I wonder how many people in the Weblog World think of themselves as Uncles, wicked or
      Message 2 of 18 , Nov 17, 2001
        I had a domain for a while that we just let go: unclesclub.com.
         
        I wonder how many people in the Weblog World think of themselves as Uncles, wicked or otherwise.
         
        Dave
         
        ----- Original Message -----
        Sent: Saturday, November 17, 2001 12:29 AM
        Subject: Re: [webloggerusergroup] Weblogs == Personal Web Publishing Communities?

        In article <0ad301c16eef$6ff8a5d0$33a1dc40@murphy>, Dave Winer
        <dave@...> writes
        >how about uncle? I think that's my lot
        >in life.

        I always wanted to be the "Wicked Uncle". The one who appeared out of
        the blue after several years in the heart of Africa and encouraged the
        nephews to break the rules and upset their straight parents. But then
        I'm also quite looking forward to being the old curmudgeon who sits by
        the fire in the pub, nursing a half of Guinness and growling at anyone
        who comes near while occasionally boring a captive audience to tears
        with stories about "What I did in the Sudan"...

        Any suggestion that you could substitute "Early PC Software industry"
        for "Sudan" and have all that refer to Dave, would be scurrilous
        character defamation and should definitely be avoided. That was about
        me, not him.

        Heh!

        --
        Julian Bond    email: julian_bond@...
        CV/Resume:         http://www.voidstar.com/cv/
        WebLog:               http://www.voidstar.com/
        M: +44 (0)77 5907 2173  T: +44 (0)192 0412 433
        ICQ:33679568 tag:So many words, so little time


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      • Mahesh Shantaram
        ... From: Dave Winer [mailto:dave@userland.com] Sent: Sunday, November 18, 2001 12:16 AM To: webloggerusergroup@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re:
        Message 3 of 18 , Nov 17, 2001
          -----Original Message-----
          From: Dave Winer [mailto:dave@...]
          Sent: Sunday, November 18, 2001 12:16 AM
          To: webloggerusergroup@yahoogroups.com
          Subject: Re: [webloggerusergroup] Weblogs == Personal Web Publishing
          Communities?

          > I had a domain for a while that we just
          > let go: unclesclub.com.
          > I wonder how many people in the Weblog
          > World think of themselves as Uncles,
          > wicked or otherwise.

          Now I'm confused. Does "uncle" mean anything other than "parent's brother"?

          Cross-cultural Did You Know of the day:
          In India, children often address elderly people (who are not related to
          them) as Uncle. This stems from the pledge (
          http://www.tamilnadueducation.com/pledge.htm ) that we used to recite in
          school every Friday: "All Indians are my brothers and sisters". By this
          philosophy, even strangers are looked upon as being a brother or sister to
          one's father or mother.

          Remember this on your next visit to India when the little ones call you
          "Uncle!" :-)

          And I'm sure www.unclesclub.co.in is not taken yet.


          ---
          Mahesh Shantaram
          http://www.techrose.org/
        • Dan Lyke
          ... Strictly, no. Culturally, male friends close to the family will sometimes be referred to as uncle , cause they do lots of the same things uncles do: Be
          Message 4 of 18 , Nov 17, 2001
            Mahesh Shantaram writes:
            > Now I'm confused. Does "uncle" mean anything other than "parent's brother"?

            Strictly, no. Culturally, male friends close to the family will
            sometimes be referred to as "uncle", 'cause they do lots of the same
            things uncles do: Be someone who cares about the family, and
            participates, but because he's not a parent, doesn't have the same
            economic constraints or need to maintain authority, can have a
            completely different relationship to the kids.

            For instance: I've got a friend who's got two adolescent boys. She's a
            70s feminist who's coming up against the harsh reality of male
            puberty, but also a single mom who's run fairly ragged.

            So I'm willing to be much more patient when I help with homework
            ('cause I only see them once a week or so). And I don't have kids (and
            don't plan on having kids), so I don't have to pretend that I find
            kids cute or lovable, which means that we have a relationship dynamic
            that ends up being more between equals. I can give them gifts that are
            expensive, or perhaps things they really wanted rather than things
            they should have.

            When she's doing her 70s feminist "pornography is evil" thing I can't
            exactly give 'em porn, but I can say "here, read some Nadine Strossen
            or some Carol Queen, see what other people think about how that
            influences culture", or "Hey, have you seen cleansheets.com?" to point
            out that there are more variations to sex than just the image that
            their mother hates so strongly.

            And whene their mom is talking about the importance of studying hard
            and applying themselves to education, and promulgating all those lies
            about their own academic career that parents have to lay on, I'm
            saying "yeah, I graduated in the top 60% of my high school class and
            dropped out of college" and "my years as a professional whitewater
            guide were a lot of fun".

            And where parents can't have conversations with their kids about sex,
            or push the "you're too young" line (which may be true, but won't stop
            them), I can say "it's none of my business, but I had a few terrifying
            experiences before I figured out that water based lube is a necessity
            with condoms". Let's face it: Nobody wants to hear that from their
            mom. Probably not even their dad.

            Everyone I know refers to this as "playing uncle".

            > Cross-cultural Did You Know of the day:
            > In India, children often address elderly people (who are not related
            > to them) as Uncle.

            Probably a similar thing.

            Dan
          • jm
            Hi, I was wondering what was your policy about linking to articles that are not free (e.g. on WSJ, The Economist or Salon Premium) or that requires a cookie
            Message 5 of 18 , Nov 19, 2001
              Hi,

              I was wondering what was your 'policy' about linking to articles that are
              not free (e.g. on WSJ, The Economist or Salon Premium) or that requires a
              cookie / free registration (NYTimes) ?

              Also, do you think that the "End of Free" will have an influence on the
              collection of web links and therefore on the content of your online
              publishing?


              Cheers,
              --
              jm
              Weblogue: (from english Web: network and latin logos:talk) opinion wishing
              to be heard and amplified.
            • Mahesh Shantaram
              ... From: jm [mailto:giem@free.fr] Sent: Monday, November 19, 2001 4:54 PM To: webloggerusergroup@yahoogroups.com Subject: [webloggerusergroup] Public
              Message 6 of 18 , Nov 19, 2001
                -----Original Message-----
                From: jm [mailto:giem@...]
                Sent: Monday, November 19, 2001 4:54 PM
                To: webloggerusergroup@yahoogroups.com
                Subject: [webloggerusergroup] Public Accessible link policy

                Hi jm,

                > I was wondering what was your 'policy' about linking
                > to articles that are not free (e.g. on WSJ, The
                > Economist or Salon Premium) or that requires a cookie
                > / free registration (NYTimes) ?

                From a weblogging/journalists point of view, I like what Rebecca Blood does.
                She mentions the the username (rebeccas_pocket) and password (I think it's
                "blood") of a dummy account beside an NYT link. That was very helpful,
                because earlier on, I wouldn't click on NYT links. The thought of a sign-up
                process would deter me.

                > Also, do you think that the "End of Free" will have an
                > influence on the collection of web links and therefore
                > on the content of your online publishing?

                It's a coincidence that you should ask this today. India's most respected
                news media group (in the class of Time Magazine) decided to open their
                online publication to subscribers only. That's bad news for me as I've
                linked heavily to TheNewspaperToday.com from my journal.

                I believe that as the Web goes form free to paid, user experience will take
                a kick due to widespread linkrot. I've written on this topic before:
                http://msram.livejournal.com/day/2001/04/04


                ---
                Mahesh Shantaram
                http://www.techrose.org/
              • Madhu Menon
                ... All well and good, till the day NYTimes.com decides that it will restict a user name to only one session or IP. For NY Times articles, simply change the
                Message 7 of 18 , Nov 19, 2001
                  At 10:07 PM 11/19/2001, Mahesh Shantaram opined:
                  > From a weblogging/journalists point of view, I like what Rebecca Blood does.
                  >She mentions the the username (rebeccas_pocket) and password (I think it's
                  >"blood") of a dummy account beside an NYT link. That was very helpful,
                  >because earlier on, I wouldn't click on NYT links. The thought of a sign-up
                  >process would deter me.

                  All well and good, till the day NYTimes.com decides that it will restict a
                  user name to only one session or IP.

                  For NY Times articles, simply change the "www" in the URL to "partners" and
                  you'll get in without any login process. For example:
                  http://www.nytimes.com/2001/11/19/international/asia/19MILI.html

                  This may not be the place for it, but I've always given false information
                  for any such registration process. I was born in 1970 in the Falkland
                  Islands, I'm in the lowest income group, I have absolutely no hobbies,
                  never buy online, and my ZIP code is 90210.

                  All false, of course.
                  But they probably don't have any targeted advertising for Falkland Islands :)

                  Do many of you do that too?


                  >I believe that as the Web goes form free to paid, user experience will take
                  >a kick due to widespread linkrot. I've written on this topic before:

                  We'll always have Google cache :P

                  Madhu

                  <<< * >>>
                  Madhu Menon
                  User Experience Consultant
                  e-mail: webguru@...

                  Weblog: http://madman.weblogs.com
                • Dan Lyke
                  ... I link to things I find interesting. If my readers can t figure out how to fill out a free registration box, or don t want to pay for the same publications
                  Message 8 of 18 , Nov 19, 2001
                    jm writes:
                    > I was wondering what was your 'policy' about linking to articles
                    > that are not free (e.g. on WSJ, The Economist or Salon Premium) or
                    > that requires a cookie / free registration (NYTimes) ?

                    I link to things I find interesting. If my readers can't figure out
                    how to fill out a free registration box, or don't want to pay for the
                    same publications I pay for, that's their call.

                    If there's not a teaser at the site for non-paying members, I'll
                    probably go out of my way to describe why I think a particular
                    document is worthwhile, but so far Salon provides most of the meat of
                    the article, in fact enough that if you care you can go find the rest
                    of the facts in the article with Google, that it hasn't bothered me.

                    I should probably subscribe to the Economist, but I'm trying to cut
                    back on my mandatory reading.

                    Dan
                  • Brian Sobolak
                    Hello Madhu, Monday, November 19, 2001, 9:04:03 AM, you wrote: MM This may not be the place for it, but I ve always given false information MM for any such
                    Message 9 of 18 , Nov 20, 2001
                      Hello Madhu,

                      Monday, November 19, 2001, 9:04:03 AM, you wrote:

                      MM> This may not be the place for it, but I've always given false information
                      MM> for any such registration process. I was born in 1970 in the Falkland
                      MM> Islands, I'm in the lowest income group, I have absolutely no hobbies,
                      MM> never buy online, and my ZIP code is 90210.

                      MM> All false, of course.
                      MM> But they probably don't have any targeted advertising for Falkland Islands :)

                      MM> Do many of you do that too?

                      Indeed. But I don't discriminate against just websites. I also do
                      this on grocery store frequent buyer clubs, ordering pizza, and
                      magazine subscriptions. billg has received a few Safeway Club Cards
                      from me, and most people still give you a funny look when you give a
                      very assumed name when ordering a sandwich (tuna on rye
                      for...Batman?)

                      It can be a useful technique for more than just identity hiding. I
                      would give a fake title at most of the technical conferences I've
                      attended, and then proceeded to see how they sell my name based upon
                      the mail I receive with the fake title.

                      brian

                      --
                      Got work? http://www.planetshwoop.com/resume/
                      This is how I think: http://www.planetshwoop.com/blog/
                      Brian Sobolak sobolak@...
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