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Re: [webloggerusergroup] Weblogs == Personal Web Publishing Communities?

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  • Julian Bond
    In article , Dave Winer writes ... I always wanted to be the Wicked Uncle . The one who appeared
    Message 1 of 18 , Nov 17, 2001
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      In article <0ad301c16eef$6ff8a5d0$33a1dc40@murphy>, Dave Winer
      <dave@...> writes
      >how about uncle? I think that's my lot
      >in life.

      I always wanted to be the "Wicked Uncle". The one who appeared out of
      the blue after several years in the heart of Africa and encouraged the
      nephews to break the rules and upset their straight parents. But then
      I'm also quite looking forward to being the old curmudgeon who sits by
      the fire in the pub, nursing a half of Guinness and growling at anyone
      who comes near while occasionally boring a captive audience to tears
      with stories about "What I did in the Sudan"...

      Any suggestion that you could substitute "Early PC Software industry"
      for "Sudan" and have all that refer to Dave, would be scurrilous
      character defamation and should definitely be avoided. That was about
      me, not him.

      Heh!

      --
      Julian Bond email: julian_bond@...
      CV/Resume: http://www.voidstar.com/cv/
      WebLog: http://www.voidstar.com/
      M: +44 (0)77 5907 2173 T: +44 (0)192 0412 433
      ICQ:33679568 tag:So many words, so little time
    • Jay Allen
      ... Let s see... on the web = Online Personal = Personal Published = Pubishing Communities = Group Yeah, I love it, Dave...
      Message 2 of 18 , Nov 17, 2001
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        --- In webloggerusergroup@y..., "Dave Winer" <dave@u...> wrote:
        > Here's my latest contribution to the "What are Weblogs?" debate..
        >
        > http://newhome.weblogs.com/personalWebPublishingCommunities
        >
        > Hope you enjoy it!

        Let's see...

        "on the web" = Online
        Personal = Personal
        Published = Pubishing
        Communities = Group

        Yeah, I love it, Dave... http://groups.yahoo.com/group/webloggerusergroup/message/472

        -j-
        http://www.openwire.com
      • Dave Winer
        I had a domain for a while that we just let go: unclesclub.com. I wonder how many people in the Weblog World think of themselves as Uncles, wicked or
        Message 3 of 18 , Nov 17, 2001
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          I had a domain for a while that we just let go: unclesclub.com.
           
          I wonder how many people in the Weblog World think of themselves as Uncles, wicked or otherwise.
           
          Dave
           
          ----- Original Message -----
          Sent: Saturday, November 17, 2001 12:29 AM
          Subject: Re: [webloggerusergroup] Weblogs == Personal Web Publishing Communities?

          In article <0ad301c16eef$6ff8a5d0$33a1dc40@murphy>, Dave Winer
          <dave@...> writes
          >how about uncle? I think that's my lot
          >in life.

          I always wanted to be the "Wicked Uncle". The one who appeared out of
          the blue after several years in the heart of Africa and encouraged the
          nephews to break the rules and upset their straight parents. But then
          I'm also quite looking forward to being the old curmudgeon who sits by
          the fire in the pub, nursing a half of Guinness and growling at anyone
          who comes near while occasionally boring a captive audience to tears
          with stories about "What I did in the Sudan"...

          Any suggestion that you could substitute "Early PC Software industry"
          for "Sudan" and have all that refer to Dave, would be scurrilous
          character defamation and should definitely be avoided. That was about
          me, not him.

          Heh!

          --
          Julian Bond    email: julian_bond@...
          CV/Resume:         http://www.voidstar.com/cv/
          WebLog:               http://www.voidstar.com/
          M: +44 (0)77 5907 2173  T: +44 (0)192 0412 433
          ICQ:33679568 tag:So many words, so little time


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        • Mahesh Shantaram
          ... From: Dave Winer [mailto:dave@userland.com] Sent: Sunday, November 18, 2001 12:16 AM To: webloggerusergroup@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re:
          Message 4 of 18 , Nov 17, 2001
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            -----Original Message-----
            From: Dave Winer [mailto:dave@...]
            Sent: Sunday, November 18, 2001 12:16 AM
            To: webloggerusergroup@yahoogroups.com
            Subject: Re: [webloggerusergroup] Weblogs == Personal Web Publishing
            Communities?

            > I had a domain for a while that we just
            > let go: unclesclub.com.
            > I wonder how many people in the Weblog
            > World think of themselves as Uncles,
            > wicked or otherwise.

            Now I'm confused. Does "uncle" mean anything other than "parent's brother"?

            Cross-cultural Did You Know of the day:
            In India, children often address elderly people (who are not related to
            them) as Uncle. This stems from the pledge (
            http://www.tamilnadueducation.com/pledge.htm ) that we used to recite in
            school every Friday: "All Indians are my brothers and sisters". By this
            philosophy, even strangers are looked upon as being a brother or sister to
            one's father or mother.

            Remember this on your next visit to India when the little ones call you
            "Uncle!" :-)

            And I'm sure www.unclesclub.co.in is not taken yet.


            ---
            Mahesh Shantaram
            http://www.techrose.org/
          • Dan Lyke
            ... Strictly, no. Culturally, male friends close to the family will sometimes be referred to as uncle , cause they do lots of the same things uncles do: Be
            Message 5 of 18 , Nov 17, 2001
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              Mahesh Shantaram writes:
              > Now I'm confused. Does "uncle" mean anything other than "parent's brother"?

              Strictly, no. Culturally, male friends close to the family will
              sometimes be referred to as "uncle", 'cause they do lots of the same
              things uncles do: Be someone who cares about the family, and
              participates, but because he's not a parent, doesn't have the same
              economic constraints or need to maintain authority, can have a
              completely different relationship to the kids.

              For instance: I've got a friend who's got two adolescent boys. She's a
              70s feminist who's coming up against the harsh reality of male
              puberty, but also a single mom who's run fairly ragged.

              So I'm willing to be much more patient when I help with homework
              ('cause I only see them once a week or so). And I don't have kids (and
              don't plan on having kids), so I don't have to pretend that I find
              kids cute or lovable, which means that we have a relationship dynamic
              that ends up being more between equals. I can give them gifts that are
              expensive, or perhaps things they really wanted rather than things
              they should have.

              When she's doing her 70s feminist "pornography is evil" thing I can't
              exactly give 'em porn, but I can say "here, read some Nadine Strossen
              or some Carol Queen, see what other people think about how that
              influences culture", or "Hey, have you seen cleansheets.com?" to point
              out that there are more variations to sex than just the image that
              their mother hates so strongly.

              And whene their mom is talking about the importance of studying hard
              and applying themselves to education, and promulgating all those lies
              about their own academic career that parents have to lay on, I'm
              saying "yeah, I graduated in the top 60% of my high school class and
              dropped out of college" and "my years as a professional whitewater
              guide were a lot of fun".

              And where parents can't have conversations with their kids about sex,
              or push the "you're too young" line (which may be true, but won't stop
              them), I can say "it's none of my business, but I had a few terrifying
              experiences before I figured out that water based lube is a necessity
              with condoms". Let's face it: Nobody wants to hear that from their
              mom. Probably not even their dad.

              Everyone I know refers to this as "playing uncle".

              > Cross-cultural Did You Know of the day:
              > In India, children often address elderly people (who are not related
              > to them) as Uncle.

              Probably a similar thing.

              Dan
            • jm
              Hi, I was wondering what was your policy about linking to articles that are not free (e.g. on WSJ, The Economist or Salon Premium) or that requires a cookie
              Message 6 of 18 , Nov 19, 2001
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                Hi,

                I was wondering what was your 'policy' about linking to articles that are
                not free (e.g. on WSJ, The Economist or Salon Premium) or that requires a
                cookie / free registration (NYTimes) ?

                Also, do you think that the "End of Free" will have an influence on the
                collection of web links and therefore on the content of your online
                publishing?


                Cheers,
                --
                jm
                Weblogue: (from english Web: network and latin logos:talk) opinion wishing
                to be heard and amplified.
              • Mahesh Shantaram
                ... From: jm [mailto:giem@free.fr] Sent: Monday, November 19, 2001 4:54 PM To: webloggerusergroup@yahoogroups.com Subject: [webloggerusergroup] Public
                Message 7 of 18 , Nov 19, 2001
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                  -----Original Message-----
                  From: jm [mailto:giem@...]
                  Sent: Monday, November 19, 2001 4:54 PM
                  To: webloggerusergroup@yahoogroups.com
                  Subject: [webloggerusergroup] Public Accessible link policy

                  Hi jm,

                  > I was wondering what was your 'policy' about linking
                  > to articles that are not free (e.g. on WSJ, The
                  > Economist or Salon Premium) or that requires a cookie
                  > / free registration (NYTimes) ?

                  From a weblogging/journalists point of view, I like what Rebecca Blood does.
                  She mentions the the username (rebeccas_pocket) and password (I think it's
                  "blood") of a dummy account beside an NYT link. That was very helpful,
                  because earlier on, I wouldn't click on NYT links. The thought of a sign-up
                  process would deter me.

                  > Also, do you think that the "End of Free" will have an
                  > influence on the collection of web links and therefore
                  > on the content of your online publishing?

                  It's a coincidence that you should ask this today. India's most respected
                  news media group (in the class of Time Magazine) decided to open their
                  online publication to subscribers only. That's bad news for me as I've
                  linked heavily to TheNewspaperToday.com from my journal.

                  I believe that as the Web goes form free to paid, user experience will take
                  a kick due to widespread linkrot. I've written on this topic before:
                  http://msram.livejournal.com/day/2001/04/04


                  ---
                  Mahesh Shantaram
                  http://www.techrose.org/
                • Madhu Menon
                  ... All well and good, till the day NYTimes.com decides that it will restict a user name to only one session or IP. For NY Times articles, simply change the
                  Message 8 of 18 , Nov 19, 2001
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                    At 10:07 PM 11/19/2001, Mahesh Shantaram opined:
                    > From a weblogging/journalists point of view, I like what Rebecca Blood does.
                    >She mentions the the username (rebeccas_pocket) and password (I think it's
                    >"blood") of a dummy account beside an NYT link. That was very helpful,
                    >because earlier on, I wouldn't click on NYT links. The thought of a sign-up
                    >process would deter me.

                    All well and good, till the day NYTimes.com decides that it will restict a
                    user name to only one session or IP.

                    For NY Times articles, simply change the "www" in the URL to "partners" and
                    you'll get in without any login process. For example:
                    http://www.nytimes.com/2001/11/19/international/asia/19MILI.html

                    This may not be the place for it, but I've always given false information
                    for any such registration process. I was born in 1970 in the Falkland
                    Islands, I'm in the lowest income group, I have absolutely no hobbies,
                    never buy online, and my ZIP code is 90210.

                    All false, of course.
                    But they probably don't have any targeted advertising for Falkland Islands :)

                    Do many of you do that too?


                    >I believe that as the Web goes form free to paid, user experience will take
                    >a kick due to widespread linkrot. I've written on this topic before:

                    We'll always have Google cache :P

                    Madhu

                    <<< * >>>
                    Madhu Menon
                    User Experience Consultant
                    e-mail: webguru@...

                    Weblog: http://madman.weblogs.com
                  • Dan Lyke
                    ... I link to things I find interesting. If my readers can t figure out how to fill out a free registration box, or don t want to pay for the same publications
                    Message 9 of 18 , Nov 19, 2001
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                      jm writes:
                      > I was wondering what was your 'policy' about linking to articles
                      > that are not free (e.g. on WSJ, The Economist or Salon Premium) or
                      > that requires a cookie / free registration (NYTimes) ?

                      I link to things I find interesting. If my readers can't figure out
                      how to fill out a free registration box, or don't want to pay for the
                      same publications I pay for, that's their call.

                      If there's not a teaser at the site for non-paying members, I'll
                      probably go out of my way to describe why I think a particular
                      document is worthwhile, but so far Salon provides most of the meat of
                      the article, in fact enough that if you care you can go find the rest
                      of the facts in the article with Google, that it hasn't bothered me.

                      I should probably subscribe to the Economist, but I'm trying to cut
                      back on my mandatory reading.

                      Dan
                    • Brian Sobolak
                      Hello Madhu, Monday, November 19, 2001, 9:04:03 AM, you wrote: MM This may not be the place for it, but I ve always given false information MM for any such
                      Message 10 of 18 , Nov 20, 2001
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                        Hello Madhu,

                        Monday, November 19, 2001, 9:04:03 AM, you wrote:

                        MM> This may not be the place for it, but I've always given false information
                        MM> for any such registration process. I was born in 1970 in the Falkland
                        MM> Islands, I'm in the lowest income group, I have absolutely no hobbies,
                        MM> never buy online, and my ZIP code is 90210.

                        MM> All false, of course.
                        MM> But they probably don't have any targeted advertising for Falkland Islands :)

                        MM> Do many of you do that too?

                        Indeed. But I don't discriminate against just websites. I also do
                        this on grocery store frequent buyer clubs, ordering pizza, and
                        magazine subscriptions. billg has received a few Safeway Club Cards
                        from me, and most people still give you a funny look when you give a
                        very assumed name when ordering a sandwich (tuna on rye
                        for...Batman?)

                        It can be a useful technique for more than just identity hiding. I
                        would give a fake title at most of the technical conferences I've
                        attended, and then proceeded to see how they sell my name based upon
                        the mail I receive with the fake title.

                        brian

                        --
                        Got work? http://www.planetshwoop.com/resume/
                        This is how I think: http://www.planetshwoop.com/blog/
                        Brian Sobolak sobolak@...
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