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Re: [webanalytics] Organic vs. Paid Search

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  • ellen keri goldberg
    This is true. Your PPC and SEO listings may be clicked on by completely different people. It s a good idea to check the conversions on PPC especially as you
    Message 1 of 7 , Aug 1, 2010
      This is true. Your PPC and SEO listings may be clicked on by completely
      different people. It's a good idea to check the conversions on PPC
      especially as you don't want to pay for things that aren't working for you
      (unless your conversion is a visit, but even if that's the case I'd check
      the bounce rates on those terms to see if the visits "stick".) Additionally
      you might want to review the "assistance" each click has given the other.
      Marketing is often a group effort, with each channel contributing to your
      final desired result. If you can it would be beneficial to make sure any
      term is not contributing to overall conversions before you stop
      targeting/bidding on it.



      On Fri, Jul 30, 2010 at 10:37 AM, Steve J Racicot <SJRConsulting@...
      > wrote:

      >
      >
      > It all depends on what your goals/objectives are?
      >
      > 100,000 visitors is great! But, are they buying/converting?
      >
      > I would segment the data and is which ones are converting and make changes
      > so that you weed out traffic that is useless especially for PPC since you
      > don't want to pay for a non-converting visitor.
      >
      > Steve
      >
      > --------------------------------------------------
      > From: "Adam Berlinger" <aberlinger1@... <aberlinger1%40yahoo.com>>
      > Sent: Thursday, July 29, 2010 2:17 PM
      > To: <webanalytics@yahoogroups.com <webanalytics%40yahoogroups.com>>
      > Subject: [webanalytics] Organic vs. Paid Search
      >
      >
      > Hey Everyone,
      > If you have keywords that are driving just as much traffic organically vs.
      > paid,
      > what should you do? Stop bidding on those words? In other words, if "Shoes"
      >
      > is
      > driving 100,000 visitors per month organically and around that same amount
      > of
      > traffic via paid search campaigns: 1) Is that a problem? 2) What are the
      > questions to ask? 3) How should this change your strategy, if at all?
      > Thanks
      > everyone!
      > Thanks,
      > Adam
      > http://analyticsbyadam.blogspot.com
      >
      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      >
      > ------------------------------------
      >
      >
      > ---------------------------------------
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      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • johnnyhoosier
      Eric said, A very direct test would be to turn off your paid campaigns and see how this affects organic clickthough and overall keyword conversion. Because
      Message 2 of 7 , Aug 2, 2010
        Eric said, "A very direct test would be to turn off your paid campaigns and see how this affects organic clickthough and overall keyword conversion."

        Because of fluctuations in search volume, I agree it's best to look at click-thru rate, not just the number of clicks. If you turn off paid search for a set of keywords and the following week you get 5% more organic clicks from those keywords, is that a good thing? Maybe, maybe not. What if search volume for your targeted keywords was up 10%?

        The problem I've been having is getting the search volume. The best search volume data I can find appears to be monthly data from the Google External Keywords Tool. I know the Google Webmaster Tool is supposedly providing some insight into CTR but I have a hard time believing the data provided. For example, the Google External Keyword tool will show 150,000 local searches for a keyword where we are consistently ranked #1 and always on the first page. But the Google Webmaster tool will show only 15,000 impressions for that keyword. We know that we are coming up more than 10% of the time. So to do the analysis based on the more believable External Keyword Tool, the test would have to run for an entire calendar month. Have you come up with a better way to calculate organic click-thru rate?

        Here's an idea I've been debating internally. Does it make sense to look at a keyword's organic clicks as a % of a site's total organic clicks? For example, if Keyword A generates 100 clicks and your site gets 1,000 total organic clicks, Keyword A is 10%. If you turn off paid search for Keyword A and the percentage decreases to 8%, does that tell you anything meaningful?



        --- In webanalytics@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Fettman" <efettman@...> wrote:
        >
        > Adam, that's a very good question - why pay for anything you may be
        > getting for free?
        >
        >
        >
        > A few considerations:
        >
        >
        >
        > 1. How are organic vs. paid keyword clickthroughs comparing in
        > terms of goals and revenue tracking?
        >
        > 2. It is possible that you have a higher conversion rate from paid
        > clickthroughs just because you have control over the landing page and
        > can drive towards conversion with very targeted calls to action, etc.
        >
        > 3. It is thought that the appearance of a paid ad alongside an
        > organic listing may actually drive up the organic clickthrough rate.
        >
        >
        >
        > A very direct test would be to turn off your paid campaigns and see how
        > this affects organic clickthough and overall keyword conversion.
        >
        >
        >
        > HTH
        >
        >
        >
        > Eric Fettman
        >
        > Digital Marketing and Web Analyst
        >
        > Travel Insured International
        >
        > 800-243-3174 x155
        >
        > 860-528-7663 x155
        >
        > efettman@... <mailto:efettman@...>
        >
        > www.travelinsured.com <http://www.travelinsured.com/>
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > TRAVEL RELAXED.
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        >
        > From: webanalytics@yahoogroups.com [mailto:webanalytics@yahoogroups.com]
        > On Behalf Of Adam Berlinger
        > Sent: Thursday, July 29, 2010 2:17 PM
        > To: webanalytics@yahoogroups.com
        > Subject: [webanalytics] Organic vs. Paid Search
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > Hey Everyone,
        > If you have keywords that are driving just as much traffic organically
        > vs. paid,
        > what should you do? Stop bidding on those words? In other words, if
        > "Shoes" is
        > driving 100,000 visitors per month organically and around that same
        > amount of
        > traffic via paid search campaigns: 1) Is that a problem? 2) What are the
        >
        > questions to ask? 3) How should this change your strategy, if at all?
        > Thanks
        > everyone!
        > Thanks,
        > Adam
        > http://analyticsbyadam.blogspot.com
        >
        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        >
      • Eric Fettman
        I see a similarly large discrepancy for my target keyword phrases between Google External Keyword Tool and Google Webmaster Tools. I would go with the Keyword
        Message 3 of 7 , Aug 6, 2010
          I see a similarly large discrepancy for my target keyword phrases
          between Google External Keyword Tool and Google Webmaster Tools. I
          would go with the Keyword Tool over Webmaster Tools - the impression
          numbers in Webmaster Tools are too low to be plausible.



          I'm not sure how useful a keyword's organic clicks as a % of a site's
          total organic clicks would be as a metric. You definitely want to know
          which keyword phrases are and are not driving traffic to your site to
          help you figure out what you're doing right and wrong with SEO and also
          to align messaging on landing page for the phrases that are driving
          traffic, but I'm not sure how actionable percentages would be
          specifically.



          HTH



          Eric Fettman

          Digital Marketing and Web Analyst

          Travel Insured International

          800-243-3174 x155

          860-528-7663 x155

          efettman@... <mailto:efettman@...>

          www.travelinsured.com <http://www.travelinsured.com/>











          TRAVEL RELAXED.
          TRAVEL SECURE.
          TRAVEL INSURED.




          The information contained in this e-mail message may be privileged and
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          SAVE A TREE - PLEASE DO NOT PRINT THIS EMAIL UNLESS YOU REALLY NEED TO.



          From: webanalytics@yahoogroups.com [mailto:webanalytics@yahoogroups.com]
          On Behalf Of johnnyhoosier
          Sent: Monday, August 02, 2010 11:29 AM
          To: webanalytics@yahoogroups.com
          Subject: [webanalytics] Re: Organic vs. Paid Search





          Eric said, "A very direct test would be to turn off your paid campaigns
          and see how this affects organic clickthough and overall keyword
          conversion."

          Because of fluctuations in search volume, I agree it's best to look at
          click-thru rate, not just the number of clicks. If you turn off paid
          search for a set of keywords and the following week you get 5% more
          organic clicks from those keywords, is that a good thing? Maybe, maybe
          not. What if search volume for your targeted keywords was up 10%?

          The problem I've been having is getting the search volume. The best
          search volume data I can find appears to be monthly data from the Google
          External Keywords Tool. I know the Google Webmaster Tool is supposedly
          providing some insight into CTR but I have a hard time believing the
          data provided. For example, the Google External Keyword tool will show
          150,000 local searches for a keyword where we are consistently ranked #1
          and always on the first page. But the Google Webmaster tool will show
          only 15,000 impressions for that keyword. We know that we are coming up
          more than 10% of the time. So to do the analysis based on the more
          believable External Keyword Tool, the test would have to run for an
          entire calendar month. Have you come up with a better way to calculate
          organic click-thru rate?

          Here's an idea I've been debating internally. Does it make sense to look
          at a keyword's organic clicks as a % of a site's total organic clicks?
          For example, if Keyword A generates 100 clicks and your site gets 1,000
          total organic clicks, Keyword A is 10%. If you turn off paid search for
          Keyword A and the percentage decreases to 8%, does that tell you
          anything meaningful?

          --- In webanalytics@yahoogroups.com
          <mailto:webanalytics%40yahoogroups.com> , "Eric Fettman" <efettman@...>
          wrote:
          >
          > Adam, that's a very good question - why pay for anything you may be
          > getting for free?
          >
          >
          >
          > A few considerations:
          >
          >
          >
          > 1. How are organic vs. paid keyword clickthroughs comparing in
          > terms of goals and revenue tracking?
          >
          > 2. It is possible that you have a higher conversion rate from paid
          > clickthroughs just because you have control over the landing page and
          > can drive towards conversion with very targeted calls to action, etc.
          >
          > 3. It is thought that the appearance of a paid ad alongside an
          > organic listing may actually drive up the organic clickthrough rate.
          >
          >
          >
          > A very direct test would be to turn off your paid campaigns and see
          how
          > this affects organic clickthough and overall keyword conversion.
          >
          >
          >
          > HTH
          >
          >
          >
          > Eric Fettman
          >
          > Digital Marketing and Web Analyst
          >
          > Travel Insured International
          >
          > 800-243-3174 x155
          >
          > 860-528-7663 x155
          >
          > efettman@... <mailto:efettman@...>
          >
          > www.travelinsured.com <http://www.travelinsured.com/>
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > TRAVEL RELAXED.
          > TRAVEL SECURE.
          > TRAVEL INSURED.
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > The information contained in this e-mail message may be privileged and
          > confidential information and is intended only for the use of the
          > individual and/or entity identified in the alias address of this
          > message. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient,
          or
          > an employee or agent responsible to deliver it to the intended
          > recipient, you are hereby requested not to distribute or copy this
          > communication. If you have received this communication in error,
          please
          > notify us immediately by telephone or return e-mail and delete the
          > original message from your system.
          >
          >
          >
          > SAVE A TREE - PLEASE DO NOT PRINT THIS EMAIL UNLESS YOU REALLY NEED
          TO.
          >
          >
          >
          > From: webanalytics@yahoogroups.com
          <mailto:webanalytics%40yahoogroups.com> [mailto:
          webanalytics@yahoogroups.com <mailto:webanalytics%40yahoogroups.com> ]
          > On Behalf Of Adam Berlinger
          > Sent: Thursday, July 29, 2010 2:17 PM
          > To: webanalytics@yahoogroups.com
          <mailto:webanalytics%40yahoogroups.com>
          > Subject: [webanalytics] Organic vs. Paid Search
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > Hey Everyone,
          > If you have keywords that are driving just as much traffic organically
          > vs. paid,
          > what should you do? Stop bidding on those words? In other words, if
          > "Shoes" is
          > driving 100,000 visitors per month organically and around that same
          > amount of
          > traffic via paid search campaigns: 1) Is that a problem? 2) What are
          the
          >
          > questions to ask? 3) How should this change your strategy, if at all?
          > Thanks
          > everyone!
          > Thanks,
          > Adam
          > http://analyticsbyadam.blogspot.com
          >
          > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          >





          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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