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30168Re: Tag Management Solution

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  • joebull714
    May 3, 2013
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      I work at a fortune 250 Financial Services company that deployed a TMS about 2 years ago. It was relatively easy to get IT Security on board as well as Legal. However the IT Dev teams have been skeptical as the TMS tool allows a "business" person to inject code into our websites and mobile applications. Now that we have the TMS in place it has allowed us to easily introduce a VOC feedback tool pretty easily onto our sites. We still had to go through the legal, compliance, IT security hurdles first though.

      IMHO the TMS we have in place has made my teams life much easier and put us in greater control of our future by drastically reducing the reliance on IT to assist us with managing and configuring our tags. This is because IT at the company I work for has a very long release cycle and my requests were always prioritized very low by IT.



      --- In webanalytics@yahoogroups.com, "Stephane Hamel" <shamel67@...> wrote:
      >
      > Bill, I trust you have a very good experience of TMSs given the close historical ties between Stratigent and Ensighten. Most of the time agencies such as Stratigent or Cardinal Path come into play once the business decision has been made to go with a TMS. This is the brighter side... but I have also seen practitioners and managers of analytics who had to convince IT, legal and others of the importance of a TMS *before* a partner comes into play. I think we're essentially agreeing - your comments about resistance, dev cycles, legal, procurement are largely unrelated to technology and TMSs themselves, they are governance and best-practice related. At the end of the day, one thing is sure: nobody should deploy analytics, ad networks and other tags manually like in the "old days". A TMS is a must.
      >
      > --- In webanalytics@yahoogroups.com, Bill Bruno <bill.bruno@> wrote:
      > >
      > > I'm not seeing the same complications that you mention, and the majority of the 40+ deployments we have done have been for large clients with complex sites. Many of these clients also have an international presence as well.
      > >
      > > My team manages the entire implementation/ongoing maintenance of the TMS for our clients, including rule development for all tags, so perhaps that is why we are having different experiences? We are able to re-use a lot of prior work with slight modifications for our clients and have compiled an entire strategic framework for TMS deployments broken out by vendor type. This also takes into account the current state and desired future state for technology interaction for each client.
      > >
      > > I also wanted to touch on a few of the "roadblocks" you mentioned:
      > >
      > >
      > > * Resistance - We actually have not seen resistance once a TMS has been selected (typically via a POC). In fact, in the majority of cases, the IT teams for our clients are thrilled that they don't have to manage analytics tags anymore the old fashioned way.
      > >
      > > * Long Dev Cycles - Strategically, you can avoid this by creating a process and governance for rules and including the Dev, Stage, Prod environments on the client side.
      > >
      > > * Legal, Politics, etc. - After a POC, these all go away and we can get to work. Time to deployment should not factor in the "vendor selection" phase. That simply doesn't make sense. Procurement is procurement, and we all know how they can be. Time to deployment should be from clearance to use through completion of the work.
      > >
      > > Honestly, I think you are making it sound way more complicated than this actually is. In fact, rarely did the old-fashioned way of tagging actually give the client 100% fulfillment of their requirements because of IT shortcuts due to deadlines, etc. With a TMS, and the right team leading a strategic implementation, you can ensure that 100% of the business requirements are met. TMS requires expertise, and as such, those experts can ensure it gets done right the first time.
      > >
      > > There is nothing worse than tagging the old-fashioned way and having to wait months for changes/fixes. That all goes away with TMS.
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > > Bill Bruno
      > > CEO | Stratigent
      > > (o) 630.658.2215 (c) 773.203.6596 (f) 773.203.6596
      > > bill.bruno@<mailto:bill.bruno@>
      > >
      > > [stratigent banner]<http://www.stratigent.com/>
      > >
      > > Copyright Stratigent, LLC, all rights reserved. This email message and any attachments are for the sole use of the intended recipients, and contain confidential and proprietary information. Any unauthorized use, disclosure or distribution of this email message or its attachments is prohibited.
      > >
      > > From: webanalytics@yahoogroups.com [mailto:webanalytics@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Stephane Hamel
      > > Sent: Thursday, May 02, 2013 7:44 AM
      > > To: webanalytics@yahoogroups.com
      > > Subject: [webanalytics] Re: Tag Management Solution
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > > I wouldn't say we are in "disagreement" my friend - we're constructing on each other comments with constructive feedback :)
      > >
      > > I guess my point is we've heard "The time it takes to deploy an enterprise TMS (one line of code referencing a library) literally takes minutes" many times in the past... yet deploying the simplest of tag on every single page of a site (let alone a complex multi-site, sub-domain, 3rd party network of sites) is often a long and tedious process because of resistance, long dev cycles (especially anything transactional or hooked to back office), legal, internal policies, political struggles, etc. Oh yes, once you have overcome all of that it's takes a few minutes :)
      > >
      > > The thought process behind the business requirements is essentially the same (or should be...). The TMS won't magically uncover business needs and all the intricacies of the implementation constraints - people will. The time it takes to paste or configure in the TMS will certainly be shorter. And from that point on, any new tag you have to deploy and any tweak to your tags or configuration will be a lot faster & easier. That's a HUGE benefit of TMSs.
      > >
      > > And now we reach the point of maturity. If organizations could reach that level of discipline and maturity with or without a TMS the world would be a better place... The advent of TMSs raised the awareness of the organization and the whole cycle becomes more important, more critical, more strategic. That's the other HUGE benefit of TMSs.
      > >
      > > Keep the conversation going, curious to hear comments from other agencies, vendors and people from the client side. I would ask a simple question: "the first time you deployed the TMS - how was it?" This is a very interesting thread considering I'm working on a vendor benchmark (results will be available publicly).
      > >
      > > Stephane Hamel
      > > Director, Strategic Services
      > > CardinalPath.com
      > >
      > > --- In webanalytics@yahoogroups.com<mailto:webanalytics%40yahoogroups.com>, Bill Bruno <bill.bruno@> wrote:
      > > >
      > > > I'm going to have to respectfully disagree with Stephane here. My team has done over 40 TMS implementations for enterprise customers...primarily focused on Ensighten and GTM.
      > > >
      > > > The use of a TMS shortens the runway in two areas:
      > > >
      > > > 1. Implementation Time
      > > > 2. Maturity
      > > >
      > > > Implementation Time:
      > > >
      > > > If you're looking at a standard deployment of 3 months without a TMS for 1 analytics vendor, you're most likely looking at roughly 4-5 weeks to deploy that same vendor within a TMS. The time it takes to deploy an enterprise TMS (one line of code referencing a library) literally takes minutes. However, we all know that there will be unit testing done by your IT team to ensure this passes all tests..most likely in a DEV environment. So, you're most likely looking at 3-5 days to get the TMS code deployed. However, you don't need to have that code deployed to begin the implementation of the analytics vendor within your TMS. In fact, you can just set up a proxy to deploy that code on your browser only to begin your testing. If you're deploying the base code...that's done in an hour (I'm exaggerating this too...we've done it in minutes). The more advanced deployments (events, link tracking, etc.) take a little finesse from a strategy standpoint such that your implementation is scalable down the road. 4-5 weeks would be on the high end. My team has done full deployments in less than that for one analytics vendor. Pixel tags (DART, etc.) are literally done in minutes.
      > > >
      > > > So, in no way would you see an extended implementation with the introduction of a TMS. In fact, there has been quite a bit of research done in the space to back up what I'm saying.
      > > >
      > > > Maturity
      > > >
      > > > Because you're not spending all of your time on the implementation (and I've seen a non-TMS implementation take over a year due to IT conflicts), you can get actionable data throughout your organization much more quickly. Also, data integration becomes much simpler since you can connect client-side technologies via your TMS deployment. As a result, we've seen an incredible growth in the maturity of analytics programs for clients that have a TMS versus those that don't.
      > > >
      > > > This isn't a fad. There aren't smoke and mirrors. It works...and when done right, by the right organization, you'll reap the benefits immediately.
      > > >
      > > >
      > > > Feel free to reach out directly with any questions at all.
      > > >
      > > >
      > > > Bill Bruno
      > > > CEO | Stratigent
      > > > (o) 630.658.2215 (c) 773.203.6596 (f) 630.658.2201
      > > > bill.bruno@<mailto:bill.bruno@>
      > > >
      > > > [stratigent banner]<http://www.stratigent.com/>
      > > >
      > > > Copyright Stratigent, LLC, all rights reserved. This email message and any attachments are for the sole use of the intended recipients, and contain confidential and proprietary information. Any unauthorized use, disclosure or distribution of this email message or its attachments is prohibited.
      > > >
      > > > From: Stephane Hamel <shamel67@<mailto:shamel67@>>
      > > > Reply-To: "webanalytics@yahoogroups.com<mailto:webanalytics%40yahoogroups.com><mailto:webanalytics@yahoogroups.com<mailto:webanalytics%40yahoogroups.com>>" <webanalytics@yahoogroups.com<mailto:webanalytics%40yahoogroups.com><mailto:webanalytics@yahoogroups.com<mailto:webanalytics%40yahoogroups.com>>>
      > > > Date: Wednesday, May 1, 2013 12:34 PM
      > > > To: "webanalytics@yahoogroups.com<mailto:webanalytics%40yahoogroups.com><mailto:webanalytics@yahoogroups.com<mailto:webanalytics%40yahoogroups.com>>" <webanalytics@yahoogroups.com<mailto:webanalytics%40yahoogroups.com><mailto:webanalytics@yahoogroups.com<mailto:webanalytics%40yahoogroups.com>>>
      > > > Subject: [webanalytics] Re: Tag Management Solution
      > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > > > Short answer since you said "as soon as possible"! :)
      > > >
      > > > Q) will the use of a TMS add to implementation?
      > > > A) From a pure implementation standpoint, adding a snippet of JavaScript code for a single web analytics solution or adding the bootstrap for a TMS will take the same time. You will also have the same amount of work to do in order to configure your web analytics tool.
      > > >
      > > > Your very first implementation might take you a little longer because
      > > > a) you will need to ramp up with whichever TMS tool you choose and
      > > > b) you still have to put the snippet of web analytics tracking code in the TMS (or configure through the interface).
      > > >
      > > > But...
      > > > a) once done, maintaining the implementation will be a lot easier and you will save time
      > > > b) if you deploy multiple tags you will reap the benefits of a TMS by making it much more easy & efficient to deploy them
      > > >
      > > > Q) how long would it take for implementation?
      > > > A) if your scheme of reference is 3 months, I would add at least 20% contingency. On top of the above comment about learning the TMS, don't forget you are adding a new player in the conversation. If you had issues getting your web dev team to add those JS tags you will still have the same challenge getting the TMS tags there... Depending on the client, you might also have to validate with legal and IT for the use of cookies, compliancy and such
      > > >
      > > > Hope that helps!
      > > >
      > > > Stephane Hamel
      > > > Director, Strategic Services
      > > > CardinalPath.com
      > > >
      > > > --- In webanalytics@yahoogroups.com<mailto:webanalytics%40yahoogroups.com><mailto:webanalytics%40yahoogroups.com>, "harshil" <harshilshah_2004@> wrote:
      > > > >
      > > > > Hi All,
      > > > >
      > > > > I am engaging with some client for web analytics implementation along with tag management solution.
      > > > >
      > > > > Can you please help with the following queries for the same?
      > > > >
      > > > > - If we are using a tag management solution rather than regular javascript page tags method, does it add to the implementation timeframe or will it reduce the implementation time frame?
      > > > > - Also, how long would it take for implementation of a web analytics tool using the tag management solution? (As a reference, considering that the same implementation using a javascript page tag will take 3 months)
      > > > >
      > > > > Please help with these as soon as possible. Thanks in advance.
      > > > >
      > > > > Best Regards,
      > > > > Harshil
      > > > >
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