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Re: My welsh Y DNA??

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  • Michael Walsh
    You are Welsh because you know you are Welsh. Are your Y DNA results typical of a Welshman? Yes, R-L21* (R1b1b2a1b5) is very common among Welsh folks, but
    Message 1 of 9 , Oct 31, 2009
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      You are Welsh because you know you are Welsh.

      Are your Y DNA results typical of a Welshman? Yes, R-L21* (R1b1b2a1b5) is very common among Welsh folks, but R-L21* is not exclusive to Welsh people by a long shot.

      What were your ancestors before they became known in the historic period as Welshmen? I don't know but that is an interesting question. I would assign you to what I call the R-L21-1211 group which does include other Welshmen, but a couple of Germans as well!

      To compare yourself with other R-L21* (R1b1b2alb5) folks, please join this.
      http://www.familytreedna.com/group-join-request.aspx?group=R-L21Plus

      The spreadsheet results and assigngments of the RL21Plus group are posted at http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/RL21Project/
      You can join and turn on the "web only" membership option if you don't want the emails.

      Regards, Mike

      --- In walesdna@yahoogroups.com, David Davies <felinfoel71@...> wrote:
      >
      > Just got my Y deep clade tests back ( Kit ID 69252), not sure what it all means to be honest, but I do know that as far back as I can search ( about 1780) I am as "pure" a welshman as you can get. In fact every person in my entire heritage comes from� carmarthenshire!
      > My data shows me R1b1b2a1b5
      >
      >
      >
      > �
      >
      > L1- L21+ L23+ L49+ M126- M153- M160- M173+ M18- M207+ M222- M269+ M343+ M37- M65- M73- P25+ P310+ P311+ P312+ P66- SRY2627- U106- U152-
      > �
      > Is this typical of welsh?
      > �
      > Dave Davies
      >
    • David Davies
      Thanks Michael--that is what I thought, I will join the R-L21* list ..and  Doug--I can t sing worth a nickel...   Dave Davies ... From: Michael Walsh
      Message 2 of 9 , Nov 1, 2009
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        Thanks Michael--that is what I thought, I will join the R-L21* list
        ..and  Doug--I can't sing worth a nickel...
         
        Dave Davies

        --- On Sat, 10/31/09, Michael Walsh <mwwalsh7@...> wrote:

        From: Michael Walsh <mwwalsh7@...>
        Subject: [walesdna] Re: My welsh Y DNA??
        To: walesdna@yahoogroups.com
        Date: Saturday, October 31, 2009, 10:20 AM

         
        You are Welsh because you know you are Welsh.

        Are your Y DNA results typical of a Welshman? Yes, R-L21* (R1b1b2a1b5) is very common among Welsh folks, but R-L21* is not exclusive to Welsh people by a long shot.

        What were your ancestors before they became known in the historic period as Welshmen? I don't know but that is an interesting question. I would assign you to what I call the R-L21-1211 group which does include other Welshmen, but a couple of Germans as well!

        To compare yourself with other R-L21* (R1b1b2alb5) folks, please join this.
        http://www.familytr eedna.com/ group-join- request.aspx? group=R-L21Plus

        The spreadsheet results and assigngments of the RL21Plus group are posted at http://tech. groups.yahoo. com/group/ RL21Project/
        You can join and turn on the "web only" membership option if you don't want the emails.

        Regards, Mike

        --- In walesdna@yahoogroup s.com, David Davies <felinfoel71@ ...> wrote:
        >
        > Just got my Y deep clade tests back ( Kit ID 69252), not sure what it all means to be honest, but I do know that as far back as I can search ( about 1780) I am as "pure" a welshman as you can get. In fact every person in my entire heritage comes from� carmarthenshire!
        > My data shows me R1b1b2a1b5
        >
        >
        >
        > �
        >
        > L1- L21+ L23+ L49+ M126- M153- M160- M173+ M18- M207+ M222- M269+ M343+ M37- M65- M73- P25+ P310+ P311+ P312+ P66- SRY2627- U106- U152-
        > �
        > Is this typical of welsh?
        > �
        > Dave Davies
        >

      • harold.dicks
        Hi David--I m a member of the 17 14 10 Welsh modal hosted by Robert Hughes and we appear to have the same results. If you aren t presently a member of the
        Message 3 of 9 , Nov 7, 2009
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          Hi David--I'm a member of the 17 14 10 Welsh modal hosted by Robert Hughes and we appear to have the same results. If you aren't presently a member of the group, perhaps you's like to contact Robert and join. If you don't have his e-mail address, I do. Harold

          --- In walesdna@yahoogroups.com, David Davies <felinfoel71@...> wrote:
          >
          > Just got my Y deep clade tests back ( Kit ID 69252), not sure what it all means to be honest, but I do know that as far back as I can search ( about 1780) I am as "pure" a welshman as you can get. In fact every person in my entire heritage comes from  carmarthenshire!
          > My data shows me R1b1b2a1b5
          >
          >
          >
          >  
          >
          > L1- L21+ L23+ L49+ M126- M153- M160- M173+ M18- M207+ M222- M269+ M343+ M37- M65- M73- P25+ P310+ P311+ P312+ P66- SRY2627- U106- U152-
          >  
          > Is this typical of welsh?
          >  
          > Dave Davies
          >
        • David Davies
          Thanks Harold, no I am not a member of the Robert Hughes group, if you have his email address that would be helpful   Dave Davies ... From: harold.dicks
          Message 4 of 9 , Nov 7, 2009
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            Thanks Harold, no I am not a member of the Robert Hughes group, if you have his email address that would be helpful
             
            Dave Davies

            --- On Sat, 11/7/09, harold.dicks <haroldjdicks@...> wrote:

            From: harold.dicks <haroldjdicks@...>
            Subject: [walesdna] Re: My welsh Y DNA??
            To: walesdna@yahoogroups.com
            Date: Saturday, November 7, 2009, 8:12 AM

             
            Hi David--I'm a member of the 17 14 10 Welsh modal hosted by Robert Hughes and we appear to have the same results. If you aren't presently a member of the group, perhaps you's like to contact Robert and join. If you don't have his e-mail address, I do. Harold

            --- In walesdna@yahoogroup s.com, David Davies <felinfoel71@ ...> wrote:
            >
            > Just got my Y deep clade tests back ( Kit ID 69252), not sure what it all means to be honest, but I do know that as far back as I can search ( about 1780) I am as "pure" a welshman as you can get. In fact every person in my entire heritage comes from  carmarthenshire!
            > My data shows me R1b1b2a1b5
            >
            >
            >
            >  
            >
            > L1- L21+ L23+ L49+ M126- M153- M160- M173+ M18- M207+ M222- M269+ M343+ M37- M65- M73- P25+ P310+ P311+ P312+ P66- SRY2627- U106- U152-
            >  
            > Is this typical of welsh?
            >  
            > Dave Davies
            >

          • Susan Rosine
            David does not fit in the 17-14-10 cluster, but he is R-L21*, which so far is the most common haplogroup in our Wales project.  Susan Co-admin ... From:
            Message 5 of 9 , Nov 25, 2009
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              David does not fit in the 17-14-10 cluster, but he is R-L21*, which so far is the most common haplogroup in our Wales project. 
              Susan
              Co-admin

              --- On Sat, 11/7/09, harold.dicks <haroldjdicks@...> wrote:

              From: harold.dicks <haroldjdicks@...>
              Subject: [walesdna] Re: My welsh Y DNA??
              To: walesdna@yahoogroups.com
              Date: Saturday, November 7, 2009, 8:12 AM

               
              Hi David--I'm a member of the 17 14 10 Welsh modal hosted by Robert Hughes and we appear to have the same results. If you aren't presently a member of the group, perhaps you's like to contact Robert and join. If you don't have his e-mail address, I do. Harold

              --- In walesdna@yahoogroup s.com, David Davies <felinfoel71@ ...> wrote:
              >
              > Just got my Y deep clade tests back ( Kit ID 69252), not sure what it all means to be honest, but I do know that as far back as I can search ( about 1780) I am as "pure" a welshman as you can get. In fact every person in my entire heritage comes from  carmarthenshire!
              > My data shows me R1b1b2a1b5
              >
              >
              >
              >  
              >
              > L1- L21+ L23+ L49+ M126- M153- M160- M173+ M18- M207+ M222- M269+ M343+ M37- M65- M73- P25+ P310+ P311+ P312+ P66- SRY2627- U106- U152-
              >  
              > Is this typical of welsh?
              >  
              > Dave Davies
              >


            • haroldjdicks
              This DNA thingy and the way things can be the same yet different never ceases to amaze me. Harold ... From: Susan Rosine To: walesdna@yahoogroups.com Sent:
              Message 6 of 9 , Nov 26, 2009
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                This DNA thingy and the way things can be the same yet different never ceases to amaze me.  Harold
                ----- Original Message -----
                Sent: Wednesday, November 25, 2009 7:07 PM
                Subject: Re: [walesdna] Re: My welsh Y DNA??

                 

                David does not fit in the 17-14-10 cluster, but he is R-L21*, which so far is the most common haplogroup in our Wales project. 
                Susan
                Co-admin

                --- On Sat, 11/7/09, harold.dicks <haroldjdicks@ eastlink. ca> wrote:

                From: harold.dicks <haroldjdicks@ eastlink. ca>
                Subject: [walesdna] Re: My welsh Y DNA??
                To: walesdna@yahoogroup s.com
                Date: Saturday, November 7, 2009, 8:12 AM

                 
                Hi David--I'm a member of the 17 14 10 Welsh modal hosted by Robert Hughes and we appear to have the same results. If you aren't presently a member of the group, perhaps you's like to contact Robert and join. If you don't have his e-mail address, I do. Harold

                --- In walesdna@yahoogroup s.com, David Davies <felinfoel71@ ...> wrote:
                >
                > Just got my Y deep clade tests back ( Kit ID 69252), not sure what it all means to be honest, but I do know that as far back as I can search ( about 1780) I am as "pure" a welshman as you can get. In fact every person in my entire heritage comes from  carmarthenshire!
                > My data shows me R1b1b2a1b5
                >
                >
                >
                >  
                >
                > L1- L21+ L23+ L49+ M126- M153- M160- M173+ M18- M207+ M222- M269+ M343+ M37- M65- M73- P25+ P310+ P311+ P312+ P66- SRY2627- U106- U152-
                >  
                > Is this typical of welsh?
                >  
                > Dave Davies
                >


              • mikewww7
                Harold, I don t want to confuse things any further, but if you have a question, I ll try to answer. Here is my attempt at trying to describe the situation with
                Message 7 of 9 , Nov 26, 2009
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                  Harold,

                  I don't want to confuse things any further, but if you have a question, I'll try to answer. Here is my attempt at trying to describe the situation with L159 and 17-14-10.

                  17-14-10 is a "cluster" of people that appear to be related. There seems to be a heavy dose of these people from Wales but some can be found in England as well. The 17-14-10 pattern refers to the STR values of DYS448=17 DYS456=14 DYS450=10. At least two of the 17-14-10 people in the Wales project are SNP tested L21+ and M222- (another way to say this is R-L21*.) The other 17-14-10 folks have not been SNP tested, but since the 17-14-10 pattern is so clear, the odds are very high that all 17-14-10 people are R-L21*. 17-14-10, then, is a subset (a descendant) of R-L21*.

                  It would be great if we could find an SNP that confirms 17-14-10 people are some kind of true clan. A good way to do that is get a 17-14-10 person tested in the Walk The Y project. The Leinster people (mostly of Ireland and Scotland) pooled their money had a person tested. They did find one new SNP that they all seem to have -> L159+. Several Leinster people had already deep clade tested so we know the Leinster cluster was a subset (descendant) of R-L21*. Now the question is, does L159+ mark the just the Leinster people, or does it mark other groups within R-L21* as well.

                  Several other groups within R-L21* have tested as L159-, but we don't know about 17-14-10 because no one has been tested for it. There are a couple of off-modal STR markers in common between the Leinster and the 17-14-10 people which is why I think it is worth looking at.

                  Regards,
                  Mike

                  --- In walesdna@yahoogroups.com, haroldjdicks <haroldjdicks@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > This DNA thingy and the way things can be the same yet different never ceases to amaze me. Harold
                  > ----- Original Message -----
                  > From: Susan Rosine
                  > To: walesdna@yahoogroups.com
                  > Sent: Wednesday, November 25, 2009 7:07 PM
                  > Subject: Re: [walesdna] Re: My welsh Y DNA??
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > David does not fit in the 17-14-10 cluster, but he is R-L21*, which so far is the most common haplogroup in our Wales project.
                  > Susan
                  > Co-admin
                  >
                  > --- On Sat, 11/7/09, harold.dicks <haroldjdicks@...> wrote:
                  >
                  >
                  > From: harold.dicks <haroldjdicks@...>
                  > Subject: [walesdna] Re: My welsh Y DNA??
                  > To: walesdna@yahoogroups.com
                  > Date: Saturday, November 7, 2009, 8:12 AM
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > Hi David--I'm a member of the 17 14 10 Welsh modal hosted by Robert Hughes and we appear to have the same results. If you aren't presently a member of the group, perhaps you's like to contact Robert and join. If you don't have his e-mail address, I do. Harold
                  >
                  > --- In walesdna@yahoogroup s.com, David Davies <felinfoel71@ ...> wrote:
                  > >
                  > > Just got my Y deep clade tests back ( Kit ID 69252), not sure what it all means to be honest, but I do know that as far back as I can search ( about 1780) I am as "pure" a welshman as you can get. In fact every person in my entire heritage comes from carmarthenshire!
                  > > My data shows me R1b1b2a1b5
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > L1- L21+ L23+ L49+ M126- M153- M160- M173+ M18- M207+ M222- M269+ M343+ M37- M65- M73- P25+ P310+ P311+ P312+ P66- SRY2627- U106- U152-
                  > >
                  > > Is this typical of welsh?
                  > >
                  > > Dave Davies
                  > >
                  >
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