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RE: [vt100] Vermont

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  • thewashman@aol.com
    Deb, All right!!! Sounds like a challenge. My goal this year is to push as far as I can. I intend to make my tenth finish under 24 hours or to crawl to the
    Message 1 of 17 , Dec 31, 1969
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      Deb,

      All right!!! Sounds like a challenge. My goal this year is to push as far as I can. I intend to make my tenth finish under 24 hours or to crawl to the finish from pushing too hard. You've already had plenty of heat training so we don't care how hot it gets at VT.

      Later,
      Jeff Washburn
    • thewashman@aol.com
      Steve, As you could probably tell, I was trying to tease Ed into going out slowly because the first part is mostly downhill and he will have to consciously
      Message 2 of 17 , Dec 31, 1969
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        Steve,

        As you could probably tell, I was trying to tease Ed into going out slowly because the first part is mostly downhill and he will have to consciously think about slowing down. I will, however, still run the first 12 miles fairly hard but not to get miles in the bank but, rather, because it is the coolest part of the day and it is downhill. Two of the only reasons that I can finish these things. OD is more difficult than Vermont becasue there is so much flat terrain that you tend to run a whole lot more and pay the price later with tired legs. You tend to forget to take walking breaks. Vermont dictates when to walk by giving you a long uphill. As much as I love to run downhill, I sometimes can't wait for an uphill so that I can walk again, which is what I do after the 12 mile aid station. The race begins from there.

        Talk later,
        Jeff Washburn
      • ed516p@aol.com
        thanks Jeff See you there
        Message 3 of 17 , Jun 15, 2000
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          thanks Jeff
          See you there
        • Pero, Stephen M
          Hi Ed... Don t listen to Jeff...;-) Go out easy at Vermont...if I try to put money in the bank at an ultra, then I die a vicious death later on, so I m going
          Message 4 of 17 , Jun 15, 2000
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            Hi Ed...

            Don't listen to Jeff...;-) Go out easy at Vermont...if I try to put money in
            the bank at an ultra, then I die a vicious death later on, so I'm going out
            easy.

            In 98 at the first aid station, I think I wasn't even in the first 100, then
            at the half I was in 42nd and I finished in 23rd..and I ran the 9th best
            paced race. So I think that even paced running is the best way to go and is
            what I am going to do this year, unlike last year when I was too big for my
            britches and decided to "go for it"...and crashed and burned on the side of
            the trail at mile 35...dropping at 42.

            The start is on a rough ATV road for a couple of miles and one is best to
            take it easy on that as You can turn an ankle in the confusion of the crowd.
            Your going by runners and they're going by You...take it easy until the
            first hill, which I think comes at about 2 3/4 miles, where You can then
            walk for the first time...then just ease into a nice pace that will feel
            easy for the rest of the day.

            Boost is just another form of Ensure.

            Instead of Advil, I take Tylenol...1 every 2 hours after 50 miles to ease
            the quad pain...Any Nsaids like Advil, aspirin, etc can mess with Your
            kidneys...just ask Deb.

            For quad strength, I do first of all hill repeats. The downhills get the
            quads and is the best specificity training You can do. A couple of times a
            week I do single leg squats, maybe 3 sets of 20...then straight leg raises
            (3x20)...then lunges (3x20) and then after a bit of rest 100 double legged
            squats, all without weights. Along with this I do a bit of upper body stuff,
            pushups, situps, bicep curls and tricep dips. I do more weights in the
            weight room off season and just settle with the easier stuff now until maybe
            January, where I'll return to the gym.

            My guess about Vermont comparisons is that it is nothing like MMT, some
            parts are close to Laurel but it is more closer to Old Dominion, but OD
            seems to be harder for some reason...it's probably due to Sherman's Gap,
            Veach Gap and Woodstock Tower all coming in the last 20 miles...

            seeya soon,
            Steve

            PS: Tomorrow night I may be doing a night (9pm to approx 2am), full moon
            training run up and back down Mount Washington in NH with Sue Johnston ...
            Fun, Fun, Fun!

            > -----Original Message-----
            > From: ed516p@... [mailto:ed516p@...]
            > Sent: Wednesday, June 14, 2000 10:49 PM
            > To: vt100@egroups.com
            > Subject: Re: [vt100] Vermont
            >
            >
            > Thanks so much Martha, steve and Jeff: I think I saw you
            > Jeff, at Laurel.
            > Martha: Do you eat cold chicken and dumplings??? I dont think
            > I could do that
            > under optimal conditions. I know a few people that use ensure
            > but I cannot
            > handle it. What is Boost? Is it a formula or milk like
            > product??I really am
            > interested. I wish there was a food that had no taste, the perfect
            > combination of all that is good for you and was easy to
            > digest. But all the
            > advice taken together is very helpful. It does confirm
            > several things: there
            > is great variablility among all of us (all an experiment of
            > one....) but also
            > some universals: water, electrolytes, some type of food/fuel,
            > more are using
            > clip than most other mixes ( such as the amino drink I got)
            > and now I have
            > heard quite a few advise against the advill and cafeine.
            > Martha: I will also
            > ty clif shots I never have. Jeff I don't know yet if I should
            > go too hard on
            > the first downhills but will see maybe easy and
            > confortable.,I have done
            > several years worth of marathon level running and now 50s + , yet I
            > constantly start off too strong and regret it later. I
            > probably dont have the
            > discipline you do. Also ; what type of leg workouts do you
            > recomend for
            > downhill (quads on a press, a leg curl on your back or
            > stomach?) besides hill
            > running? Do you think workout with weights should also be
            > tapered before a
            > 100? Thanks to everyone, Vermont sounds like a fun run. BTW:
            > I have heard
            > that it is a relatively faster 100 than most and that instead
            > of trails it is
            > mostly dirt roads, pretty roads but very different from a
            > trail run. The
            > elevations seem close to many of the runs around the
            > Virginia/Maryland area,
            > are the hills about the same as MMT or Laurel? How does it
            > compare to these
            > two?
            >
            > As always thanks much
            >
            > ed
            >
            >
            >
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            >
          • ed516p@aol.com
            Thanks so much Steve; I really feel lucky to be able to get all of this valuable good advice from folks I hardly even know, I know that that is part of the fun
            Message 5 of 17 , Jun 15, 2000
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              Thanks so much Steve;
              I really feel lucky to be able to get all of this valuable good advice from
              folks I hardly even know, I know that that is part of the fun of running
              sharing the trail with a great group of people. wish I was out there with you
              for the night time run.

              See you in Vermont

              ed
            • Pero, Stephen M
              Hi Jeff... Oh I knew what You were doing and is why I included the wink ;-)... You ll probably be ahead of Me for awhile there as I m going out real easy on
              Message 6 of 17 , Jun 16, 2000
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                Hi Jeff...

                Oh I knew what You were doing and is why I included the wink ;-)...

                You'll probably be ahead of Me for awhile there as I'm going out real easy
                on that ATV road, walking that first hill and then as the course flattens
                out try to stay at an easy pace until CTB#1. If I am still feeling ok, I'll
                try to start catching runners from there on in. That's what worked for Me in
                '98 and also pretty much at OD, although I was a bit disappointed in my time
                at OD...really thought I could come in around 21 hours, but that sick
                session in the middle really slowed Me down until dark. Then with Greg
                Loomis by my side I was able to run a little better (with the help of the
                soup and coffee, of course).

                I'm really looking forward to Vt this year...I feel like I am starting to
                get a handle on how to run 100's.

                If You aren't doing anything tonight, and Paula will let You, come up and
                join Sue and I on Mt Washington. We're going to be starting around 9pm and
                finishing around 2 am (my guess). We're running up and back down the auto
                road the day before the race.

                seeya all soon,
                Steve

                PS: I look forward to those hills, too. Especially after CTB.

                > -----Original Message-----
                > From: thewashman@... [mailto:thewashman@...]
                > Sent: Friday, June 16, 2000 4:20 AM
                > To: vt100@egroups.com
                > Subject: RE: [vt100] Vermont
                >
                >
                > Steve,
                >
                > As you could probably tell, I was trying to tease Ed into
                > going out slowly because the first part is mostly downhill
                > and he will have to consciously think about slowing down. I
                > will, however, still run the first 12 miles fairly hard but
                > not to get miles in the bank but, rather, because it is the
                > coolest part of the day and it is downhill. Two of the only
                > reasons that I can finish these things. OD is more difficult
                > than Vermont becasue there is so much flat terrain that you
                > tend to run a whole lot more and pay the price later with
                > tired legs. You tend to forget to take walking breaks.
                > Vermont dictates when to walk by giving you a long uphill.
                > As much as I love to run downhill, I sometimes can't wait for
                > an uphill so that I can walk again, which is what I do after
                > the 12 mile aid station. The race begins from there.
                >
                > Talk later,
                > Jeff Washburn
              • reno_debra@emc.com
                Jeff, I m paying close attention to all these strategies of yours, since YOU ARE THE MAN! and I figure you ve finished more of these things already than I
                Message 7 of 17 , Jun 16, 2000
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                  Jeff,

                  I'm paying close attention to all these strategies of yours, since YOU ARE
                  THE MAN! and I figure you've finished more of these things already than I
                  probably ever will..
                  (race ya to the 12 mile aid station!)
                  deb
                  > -----Original Message-----
                  > From: thewashman@... [SMTP:thewashman@...]
                  > Sent: Friday, June 16, 2000 4:20 AM
                  > To: vt100@egroups.com
                  > Subject: RE: [vt100] Vermont
                  >
                  > Steve,
                  >
                  > As you could probably tell, I was trying to tease Ed into going out slowly
                  > because the first part is mostly downhill and he will have to consciously
                  > think about slowing down. I will, however, still run the first 12 miles
                  > fairly hard but not to get miles in the bank but, rather, because it is
                  > the coolest part of the day and it is downhill. Two of the only reasons
                  > that I can finish these things. OD is more difficult than Vermont becasue
                  > there is so much flat terrain that you tend to run a whole lot more and
                  > pay the price later with tired legs. You tend to forget to take walking
                  > breaks. Vermont dictates when to walk by giving you a long uphill. As
                  > much as I love to run downhill, I sometimes can't wait for an uphill so
                  > that I can walk again, which is what I do after the 12 mile aid station.
                  > The race begins from there.
                  >
                  > Talk later,
                  > Jeff Washburn
                  >
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                • reno_debra@emc.com
                  aha! you took my bait! My REAL plan is to force you out too fast, then watch you die a slow death on the CTB loop! :-) heh, heh... deb
                  Message 8 of 17 , Jun 16, 2000
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                    aha! you took my bait! My REAL plan is to force you out too fast, then
                    watch you die a slow death on the CTB loop! :-)
                    heh, heh...
                    deb

                    > -----Original Message-----
                    > From: thewashman@... [SMTP:thewashman@...]
                    > Sent: Friday, June 16, 2000 12:19 PM
                    > To: vt100@egroups.com
                    > Subject: RE: [vt100] Vermont
                    >
                    > Deb,
                    >
                    > All right!!! Sounds like a challenge. My goal this year is to push as
                    > far as I can. I intend to make my tenth finish under 24 hours or to crawl
                    > to the finish from pushing too hard. You've already had plenty of heat
                    > training so we don't care how hot it gets at VT.
                    >
                    > Later,
                    > Jeff Washburn
                    >
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