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Re: Patch 7.3.536

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  • tux.
    ... There is an upper-cased sharp s in German. It just looks different. -- You received this message from the vim_dev maillist. Do not top-post! Type your
    Message 1 of 4 , Jun 1, 2012
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      Bram Moolenaar schrob am 01. Jun. 2012 um 17:47 Zeit:
      > ! {0xe0,0xf6,1,-32}, /* 0xdf (German sharp s) is not upper-cased */


      There is an upper-cased sharp s in German. It just looks different.

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    • Bram Moolenaar
      ... Mostly SS is used for the upper case version, if at all. The uppser-case sharp s is not in latin1. Wikipedia: ß is nearly unique among the letters of
      Message 2 of 4 , Jun 1, 2012
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        Tux wrote:

        > Bram Moolenaar schrob am 01. Jun. 2012 um 17:47 Zeit:
        > > ! {0xe0,0xf6,1,-32}, /* 0xdf (German sharp s) is not upper-cased */
        >
        >
        > There is an upper-cased sharp s in German. It just looks different.

        Mostly SS is used for the upper case version, if at all. The
        uppser-case sharp s is not in latin1. Wikipedia:

        ß is nearly unique among the letters of Latin alphabet in that it had no
        traditional upper case form. This is because it never occurs initially,
        and traditional German printing in blackletter never used all-caps.

        However, there have been repeated attempts to introduce an upper case ß.
        Such letterforms can be found in some older German books and some modern
        signage and product design. Since April 4, 2008 Unicode 5.1.0 has
        included it ("ẞ") as U+1E9E LATIN CAPITAL LETTER SHARP

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        /// Bram Moolenaar -- Bram@... -- http://www.Moolenaar.net \\\
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      • Tony Mechelynck
        ... Yes, usually ß → SS when converting a word to all-caps. The problem of course is that this operation is not reversible, except in de-CH, where ss is
        Message 3 of 4 , Jun 1, 2012
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          On 01/06/12 18:52, Bram Moolenaar wrote:
          >
          > Tux wrote:
          >
          >> Bram Moolenaar schrob am 01. Jun. 2012 um 17:47 Zeit:
          >>> ! {0xe0,0xf6,1,-32}, /* 0xdf (German sharp s) is not upper-cased */
          >>
          >>
          >> There is an upper-cased sharp s in German. It just looks different.
          >
          > Mostly SS is used for the upper case version, if at all. The
          > uppser-case sharp s is not in latin1. Wikipedia:

          Yes, usually ß → SS when converting a word to all-caps. The problem of
          course is that this operation is not reversible, except in de-CH, where
          ss is used in lowercase even where de-DE uses ß. In Switzerland, ß (or
          black-letter ſz) is only used nowadays to give inscriptions an
          "old-fashioned" look.

          >
          > ß is nearly unique among the letters of Latin alphabet in that it had no
          > traditional upper case form. This is because it never occurs initially,
          > and traditional German printing in blackletter never used all-caps.
          >
          > However, there have been repeated attempts to introduce an upper case ß.
          > Such letterforms can be found in some older German books and some modern
          > signage and product design. Since April 4, 2008 Unicode 5.1.0 has
          > included it ("ẞ") as U+1E9E LATIN CAPITAL LETTER SHARP
          >

          Here is what Unicode charts tell me:

          http://www.unicode.org/charts/PDF/U0080.pdf under 00DF:
          ß 00DF LATIN SMALL LETTER SHARP S
          = Eszett
          * German
          * uppercase is “SS”
          * in origin a ligature of 017F ſ and 0073 s
          → 03B2 β greek small letter beta
          → 1E9E ẞ latin capital letter sharp s

          http://www.unicode.org/charts/PDF/U1E00.pdf under 1E9E:
          ẞ 1E9E LATIN CAPITAL LETTER SHARP S
          * lowercase is 00DF ß
          → 00DF ß latin small letter sharp s

          IOW, according to Unicode, lowercase of ẞ is ß but uppercase of ß is SS
          — understand who can.

          N.B. My father has a German atlas printed before WWI in a Roman (i.e.
          not Fraktur and not blackletter) typeface; there the uppercase of ß was
          SZ (e.g. RUSZLAND for Russia). This would be "more" reversible since
          -sz- could only happen in German in a compound word, at the boundary
          between a wordpart ending in s followed by a wordpart beginning with z.


          Best regards,
          Tony.
          --
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          PICTURES LTD

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