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Re: http://vimhelp.appspot.com/

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  • Bram Moolenaar
    ... To make another version of the help files useful the search should be working. Perhaps it s indeed a matter of waiting for the indexing. Where do you get
    Message 1 of 14 , Oct 3, 2010
      Carlo Teubner wrote:

      > Sorry, I sent that off too early. To elaborate:
      >
      > * It's built on Google App Engine
      > * It regularly retrieves the latest doc files from
      > http://vim.googlecode.com/hg/runtime/doc/ and processes them
      > * The Google custom search it uses doesn't work, presumably since
      > Google hasn't indexed the contents yet
      >
      > Please let me know any feedback. I'm going to hold off advertising its
      > existence more widely (i.e. vim_use list) for now.
      >
      > Bram, let me know if you approve of this or would like any changes to
      > it. Everyone else, hope you like it.

      To make another version of the help files useful the search should be
      working. Perhaps it's indeed a matter of waiting for the indexing.

      Where do you get the HTML files? Do you generate them somehow or do you
      use the distributed ones?

      Navigation from a page to main help file is problematic. Add a link to
      help.txt on every page?

      --
      Married is a three ring circus:
      First comes the engagement ring.
      Then comes the wedding ring.
      Then comes the suffering.

      /// Bram Moolenaar -- Bram@... -- http://www.Moolenaar.net \\\
      /// sponsor Vim, vote for features -- http://www.Vim.org/sponsor/ \\\
      \\\ download, build and distribute -- http://www.A-A-P.org ///
      \\\ help me help AIDS victims -- http://ICCF-Holland.org ///

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    • Ben Fritz
      ... Compare the main page of vimhelp.appspot.com to the main page of vimdoc.sourceforge.net/htmldoc/ I notice that on vimhelp.appspot.com, the CTRL-D, CTRL-T,
      Message 2 of 14 , Oct 4, 2010
        On Oct 3, 12:06 pm, Carlo <carlo.teub...@...> wrote:
        > Sorry, I sent that off too early. To elaborate:
        >
        > * It's built on Google App Engine
        > * It regularly retrieves the latest doc files fromhttp://vim.googlecode.com/hg/runtime/doc/and processes them
        > * The Google custom search it uses doesn't work, presumably since
        > Google hasn't indexed the contents yet
        >
        > Please let me know any feedback. I'm going to hold off advertising its
        > existence more widely (i.e. vim_use list) for now.
        >
        > Bram, let me know if you approve of this or would like any changes to
        > it. Everyone else, hope you like it.
        >

        Compare the main page of vimhelp.appspot.com to the main page of
        vimdoc.sourceforge.net/htmldoc/

        I notice that on vimhelp.appspot.com, the CTRL-D, CTRL-T, CTRL-O, etc.
        are all nicely colored, indicating that something is recognized as
        special about them, but that is all. On sourceforge, these are all
        links. Although the sourceforge docs are not colored, I find them more
        useful in this specific case. Is this something that can be fixed?

        You have a good idea of an automatic update mechanism, certainly. I
        find that out-of-data help files online can be very annoying.

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      • Carlo
        ... Fixed now for CTRL-sequences and some other miscellaneous cases. Although it s true that the way that vimdoc.sf.net links absolutely everything that is
        Message 3 of 14 , Oct 6, 2010
          On 4 Oct, 14:34, Ben Fritz <fritzophre...@...> wrote:
          > On Oct 3, 12:06 pm, Carlo <carlo.teub...@...> wrote:
          >
          > > Sorry, I sent that off too early. To elaborate:
          >
          > > * It's built on Google App Engine
          > > * It regularly retrieves the latest doc files fromhttp://vim.googlecode.com/hg/runtime/doc/andprocesses them
          > > * The Google custom search it uses doesn't work, presumably since
          > > Google hasn't indexed the contents yet
          >
          > > Please let me know any feedback. I'm going to hold off advertising its
          > > existence more widely (i.e. vim_use list) for now.
          >
          > > Bram, let me know if you approve of this or would like any changes to
          > > it. Everyone else, hope you like it.
          >
          > Compare the main page of vimhelp.appspot.com to the main page of
          > vimdoc.sourceforge.net/htmldoc/
          >
          > I notice that on vimhelp.appspot.com, the CTRL-D, CTRL-T, CTRL-O, etc.
          > are all nicely colored, indicating that something is recognized as
          > special about them, but that is all. On sourceforge, these are all
          > links. Although the sourceforge docs are not colored, I find them more
          > useful in this specific case. Is this something that can be fixed?

          Fixed now for CTRL-sequences and some other miscellaneous cases.
          Although it's true that the way that vimdoc.sf.net links absolutely
          everything that is linkable has its advantages. Perhaps I will
          experiment later on with making more things links, without making them
          stand out too much from the other text.

          Regarding Bram's comment, I've also added some quick links to the top
          and bottom of each page.

          > You have a good idea of an automatic update mechanism, certainly. I
          > find that out-of-data help files online can be very annoying.

          Thanks. To respond to Bram's query on this: I've got an hourly cronjob
          that downloads http://vim.googlecode.com/hg/runtime/doc/ and all .txt
          files listed there. (It uses the HTTP "ETag" cacheing mechanism to
          minimise traffic, and to notice when files haven't changed.) It then
          generates the HTML-ified versions.

          By the way, the site search works now.

          Carlo

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        • Bram Moolenaar
          ... Thanks, the pages look good now, the links at the top are very useful. Search still doesn t work for me. -- hundred-and-one symptoms of being an internet
          Message 4 of 14 , Oct 8, 2010
            Carlo Teubner wrote:

            > On 4 Oct, 14:34, Ben Fritz <fritzophre...@...> wrote:
            > > On Oct 3, 12:06 pm, Carlo <carlo.teub...@...> wrote:
            > >
            > > > Sorry, I sent that off too early. To elaborate:
            > >
            > > > * It's built on Google App Engine
            > > > * It regularly retrieves the latest doc files fromhttp://vim.googlecode.com/hg/runtime/doc/andprocesses them
            > > > * The Google custom search it uses doesn't work, presumably since
            > > > Google hasn't indexed the contents yet
            > >
            > > > Please let me know any feedback. I'm going to hold off advertising its
            > > > existence more widely (i.e. vim_use list) for now.
            > >
            > > > Bram, let me know if you approve of this or would like any changes to
            > > > it. Everyone else, hope you like it.
            > >
            > > Compare the main page of vimhelp.appspot.com to the main page of
            > > vimdoc.sourceforge.net/htmldoc/
            > >
            > > I notice that on vimhelp.appspot.com, the CTRL-D, CTRL-T, CTRL-O, etc.
            > > are all nicely colored, indicating that something is recognized as
            > > special about them, but that is all. On sourceforge, these are all
            > > links. Although the sourceforge docs are not colored, I find them more
            > > useful in this specific case. Is this something that can be fixed?
            >
            > Fixed now for CTRL-sequences and some other miscellaneous cases.
            > Although it's true that the way that vimdoc.sf.net links absolutely
            > everything that is linkable has its advantages. Perhaps I will
            > experiment later on with making more things links, without making them
            > stand out too much from the other text.
            >
            > Regarding Bram's comment, I've also added some quick links to the top
            > and bottom of each page.
            >
            > > You have a good idea of an automatic update mechanism, certainly. I
            > > find that out-of-data help files online can be very annoying.
            >
            > Thanks. To respond to Bram's query on this: I've got an hourly cronjob
            > that downloads http://vim.googlecode.com/hg/runtime/doc/ and all .txt
            > files listed there. (It uses the HTTP "ETag" cacheing mechanism to
            > minimise traffic, and to notice when files haven't changed.) It then
            > generates the HTML-ified versions.
            >
            > By the way, the site search works now.

            Thanks, the pages look good now, the links at the top are very useful.

            Search still doesn't work for me.

            --
            hundred-and-one symptoms of being an internet addict:
            250. You've given up the search for the "perfect woman" and instead,
            sit in front of the PC until you're just too tired to care.

            /// Bram Moolenaar -- Bram@... -- http://www.Moolenaar.net \\\
            /// sponsor Vim, vote for features -- http://www.Vim.org/sponsor/ \\\
            \\\ download, build and distribute -- http://www.A-A-P.org ///
            \\\ help me help AIDS victims -- http://ICCF-Holland.org ///

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          • Carlo Teubner
            Just a brief update: the site has seen a few improvements, notably everything that can be is now linked; although words that are not highlighted are not in any
            Message 5 of 14 , Oct 18, 2010
              Just a brief update: the site has seen a few improvements, notably
              everything that can be is now linked; although words that are not
              highlighted are not in any way marked as a link, except when you
              mouse-over. I thought this is an acceptable compromise between
              usability and looks. Also it mirrors the way the help files look
              within Vim. Finally, the Googlebots now appear to have made up their
              hivemind to index the whole site, so the custom search is now working
              properly.

              I'd be grateful for reports of any problems with the site, e.g.
              whether it looks bad in certain browsers, since I haven't tested it
              very much across browsers.

              Carlo

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            • Ben Fritz
              ... This page looks pretty terrible in Opera, Safari, Chrome, and IE8: http://vimhelp.appspot.com/options.txt.html The entire page is shifted left off the
              Message 6 of 14 , Oct 18, 2010
                On Oct 18, 4:43 pm, Carlo Teubner <carlo.teub...@...> wrote:
                >
                > I'd be grateful for reports of any problems with the site, e.g.
                > whether it looks bad in certain browsers, since I haven't tested it
                > very much across browsers.
                >

                This page looks pretty terrible in Opera, Safari, Chrome, and IE8:

                http://vimhelp.appspot.com/options.txt.html

                The entire page is shifted left off the screen, and does not allow
                scrolling to see the content. In Opera I can use the "fit page to
                width" feature or disable CSS to view it but I think something is
                wrong with the CSS. I apparently do not have Firefox installed on this
                computer (I thought I did, not sure what happened there) so I did not
                look on Firefox.

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              • Christian J. Robinson
                ... It looks fine in my Firefox, but you re right, it s definitely rendering badly in Opera. It shows the same problem in Konqueror 3.5.4. - Christian -- If
                Message 7 of 14 , Oct 18, 2010
                  On Mon, 18 Oct 2010, Ben Fritz wrote:

                  > This page looks pretty terrible in Opera, Safari, Chrome, and IE8:
                  >
                  > http://vimhelp.appspot.com/options.txt.html
                  >
                  > [...] I apparently do not have Firefox installed on this computer (I
                  > thought I did, not sure what happened there) so I did not look on
                  > Firefox.

                  It looks fine in my Firefox, but you're right, it's definitely
                  rendering badly in Opera. It shows the same problem in Konqueror
                  3.5.4.

                  - Christian

                  --
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                  solve them. -- Isaac Asimov
                  Christian J. Robinson <heptite@...> http://christianrobinson.name/

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                • Benjamin R. Haskell
                  ... It s the fact that the outermost content has a style of: float: left; position: relative; left: 50% And the next nested has a style of: float:
                  Message 8 of 14 , Oct 18, 2010
                    On Mon, 18 Oct 2010, Ben Fritz wrote:

                    >
                    > On Oct 18, 4:43 pm, Carlo Teubner wrote:
                    >>
                    >> I'd be grateful for reports of any problems with the site, e.g.
                    >> whether it looks bad in certain browsers, since I haven't tested it
                    >> very much across browsers.
                    >>
                    >
                    > This page looks pretty terrible in Opera, Safari, Chrome, and IE8:
                    >
                    > http://vimhelp.appspot.com/options.txt.html
                    >
                    > The entire page is shifted left off the screen, and does not allow
                    > scrolling to see the content. In Opera I can use the "fit page to
                    > width" feature or disable CSS to view it but I think something is
                    > wrong with the CSS. I apparently do not have Firefox installed on this
                    > computer (I thought I did, not sure what happened there) so I did not
                    > look on Firefox.

                    It's the fact that the outermost content <div> has a style of:
                    float: left; position: relative; left: 50%
                    And the next nested <div> has a style of:
                    float: left; position: relative; left: -50%

                    The inner div containing most of the page's content gets pushed off to
                    the left. If you decrease the size of the browser window, you can
                    actually push it all the way off the left side.

                    I'm not sure what the positive-percentage left offset paired with the
                    identical-but-negative-percentage left offset is supposed to accomplish,
                    but it doesn't seem to work with the floated divs. May as well not use
                    it, as I don't think Firefox's rendering is correct, anyway. (Seems
                    like there should be widths specified on one or both of the divs for the
                    relative percentages to be useful.)

                    --
                    Best,
                    Ben

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                  • Antonio Colombo
                    Hi everybody, the problem is that the options.txt page contains a single very long line, line # 4334. This should be taken care of, either with some ad hoc
                    Message 9 of 14 , Oct 19, 2010
                      Hi everybody,

                      the problem is that the "options.txt" page
                      contains a single very long line, line # 4334.
                      This should be taken care of, either with some
                      "ad hoc" code or with a general solution.

                      Antonio
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                    • Bee
                      ... I copied the html and css files to my Mac and removed the two div s with the 50% and -50%, it then displays beautifully in Safari and Firefox, EVEN with
                      Message 10 of 14 , Oct 19, 2010
                        On Oct 19, 12:02 am, "Antonio Colombo" <azc...@...> wrote:
                        > the problem is that the "options.txt" page
                        > contains a single very long line, line # 4334.

                        I copied the html and css files to my Mac and removed the two div's
                        with the 50% and -50%, it then displays beautifully in Safari and
                        Firefox, EVEN with that long line.

                        What is the intent of those div's?

                        -Bill

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                      • Carlo
                        The two divs are there to make the block centered, while keeping the text itself left-aligned. I got this trick from
                        Message 11 of 14 , Oct 31, 2010
                          The two divs are there to make the <pre> block centered, while keeping
                          the text itself left-aligned. I got this trick from
                          http://stackoverflow.com/questions/1269589/css-center-block-but-left-align-contents
                          Admittedly I'm not very experienced with CSS so this might not be the
                          best way of doing it.

                          I've fixed the issue with overlong lines like in options.txt with some
                          more CSS trickery. I've tested it in latest Firefox, Opera, Chrome and
                          IE and it looks fine; haven't tested older browsers.

                          Also, non-ASCII characters like on that very long line in options.txt
                          should now display fine in all browsers (I had to mark the content as
                          UTF-8 in the HTTP headers).

                          The source code is available at http://github.com/c4rlo/vimhelp,
                          including the Google App Engine config files.

                          Let me know if anyone still sees any problems.

                          Thanks,
                          Carlo

                          On 19 Oct, 19:36, Bee <beeyaw...@...> wrote:
                          > On Oct 19, 12:02 am, "Antonio Colombo" <azc...@...> wrote:
                          >
                          > > the problem is that the "options.txt" page
                          > > contains a single very long line, line # 4334.
                          >
                          > I copied the html and css files to my Mac and removed the two div's
                          > with the 50% and -50%, it then displays beautifully in Safari and
                          > Firefox, EVEN with that long line.
                          >
                          > What is the intent of those div's?
                          >
                          > -Bill

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                        • Ben Fritz
                          ... Nicely done, it looks much better. ... Only minor ones. There is a horizontal scrollbar present even though there does not seem to be any content to scroll
                          Message 12 of 14 , Oct 31, 2010
                            On Oct 31, 7:07 am, Carlo <carlo.teub...@...> wrote:
                            > I've fixed the issue with overlong lines like in options.txt with some
                            > more CSS trickery. I've tested it in latest Firefox, Opera, Chrome and
                            > IE and it looks fine; haven't tested older browsers.
                            >

                            Nicely done, it looks much better.

                            >
                            > Let me know if anyone still sees any problems.
                            >

                            Only minor ones. There is a horizontal scrollbar present even though
                            there does not seem to be any content to scroll to. Also, it doesn't
                            validate.

                            http://validator.w3.org/

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