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RE: VIM doesn't need new features?!?!

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  • Suresh Govindachar
    Peter Michaux wrote on April 15, 2007 ... If the user has a certain concept of a project vim gives him many ways to implement that concept. But it is up to
    Message 1 of 7 , Apr 15, 2007
      Peter Michaux wrote on April 15, 2007

      > I like VIM. I want to use VIM as my everyday editor. I even
      > spent a frustrating week trying to determine if VIM could
      > replace Textmate as my main editor. VIM is very good for
      > working with a single file but the concept of a project is not
      > really there.

      If the user has a certain concept of a "project" vim gives him
      many ways to implement that concept. But it is up to him to work
      at defining the concept and using some language (vimL, perl or
      python) to implement it.

      > I looked at plugins, talked with people in #vim about plugins
      > and how to extend VIM.

      A few others have implemented their idea of a "project" and
      offered their work to others as plugins at vim.org.

      > I figured it would probably take a year of spare time for me to
      > learn how and then write the plugin

      Too bad that none of their idea of a "project" matches yours!

      > to do what Textmate can do with respect to projects right when
      > it is installed: a project drawer, project tabs, multiple open
      > projects, project-wide search and selective replace. And now I
      > see that VIM doesn't need more features...
      >
      > http://www.vim.org/soc/ideas.php

      The preceding shows you have trouble reading -- that page has a
      link to a "voting page", which page lists certain core features
      that could be added to vim. If your investigation into plugins
      was as casual as your reading of the above link, then your efforts
      at finding and evaluating existing plugins in relation to your
      notion of a project are likely to have been botched!

      > Darn.
      >
      > Peter
    • Peter Michaux
      ... Vim has many, many features. We don t really need more Peter
      Message 2 of 7 , Apr 15, 2007
        On 4/15/07, Suresh Govindachar <sgovindachar@...> wrote:

        > > to do what Textmate can do with respect to projects right when
        > > it is installed: a project drawer, project tabs, multiple open
        > > projects, project-wide search and selective replace. And now I
        > > see that VIM doesn't need more features...
        > >
        > > http://www.vim.org/soc/ideas.php
        >
        > The preceding shows you have trouble reading -- that page has a
        > link to a "voting page", which page lists certain core features
        > that could be added to vim. If your investigation into plugins
        > was as casual as your reading of the above link, then your efforts
        > at finding and evaluating existing plugins in relation to your
        > notion of a project are likely to have been botched!

        "Vim has many, many features. We don't really need more"

        Peter
      • Milan Vancura
        ... Peter, don t start flames, please. vim-dev list is a very valuable list exactly for the reason that people usualy don t try flaming here. It s easy to take
        Message 3 of 7 , Apr 16, 2007
          > > The preceding shows you have trouble reading -- that page has a
          > > link to a "voting page", which page lists certain core features
          > > that could be added to vim. If your investigation into plugins
          > > was as casual as your reading of the above link, then your efforts
          > > at finding and evaluating existing plugins in relation to your
          > > notion of a project are likely to have been botched!
          >
          > "Vim has many, many features. We don't really need more"

          Peter, don't start flames, please. vim-dev list is a very valuable list exactly
          for the reason that people usualy don't try flaming here.

          It's easy to take one sentence without any context and become upset. Read more
          (as Suresh Govindachar already suggested) and your life will be nicer again.
          Please start with Suresh Govindachar's e-mail, the answer for you is already
          there. The sentence you started a flame with means that it seems we can add new
          features by some script languages (most usualy the internal vim script) and
          don't need to add every bell and whistle in the core vim code.

          And it's true for your problem too: core vim features are strong enough to
          allow "project handling" - but the exact implementation is up to your choice.
          There are several plugins ready at vim.org which you can use or modify.

          So again: please start reading at vim.org again with this information in mind.
          And stop the flame. If you have a concrete question, ask here or at vim-users.

          Thank you and have a nice day,

          Milan Vancura
          --
          Milan Vancura, Prague, Czech Republic, Europe
        • Charles E Campbell Jr
          ... May I suggest taking a look at: http://vim.sourceforge.net/sponsor/vote_results.php Regards, Chip Campbell
          Message 4 of 7 , Apr 16, 2007
            Peter Michaux wrote:

            > And now I see that VIM doesn't need more features...
            >
            > http://www.vim.org/soc/ideas.php

            May I suggest taking a look at:

            http://vim.sourceforge.net/sponsor/vote_results.php

            Regards,
            Chip Campbell
          • Halim, Salman
            I really didn t think Peter said anything that was a flame. Perhaps he didn t read the whole thing, but I, too, initially walked away with the same conclusion
            Message 5 of 7 , Apr 16, 2007
              I really didn't think Peter said anything that was a flame. Perhaps he
              didn't read the whole thing, but I, too, initially walked away with the
              same conclusion was he did, and I *have* been using Vim for a long time.
              (I just know better because I've been here longer.)

              Suresh, on the other hand, was pretty much out of line and actually took
              it to the level of personal attacks. Makes me wonder if he's really
              Sven Guckes in disguise.

              Salman.

              > -----Original Message-----
              > From: Milan Vancura [mailto:milan@...]
              > Sent: Monday, April 16, 2007 3:27 AM
              > To: Vim development list
              > Subject: Re: VIM doesn't need new features?!?!
              >
              > > > The preceding shows you have trouble reading -- that page has a
              > > > link to a "voting page", which page lists certain core features
              > > > that could be added to vim. If your investigation into
              > plugins was
              > > > as casual as your reading of the above link, then your
              > efforts at
              > > > finding and evaluating existing plugins in relation to
              > your notion
              > > > of a project are likely to have been botched!
              > >
              > > "Vim has many, many features. We don't really need more"
              >
              > Peter, don't start flames, please. vim-dev list is a very
              > valuable list exactly for the reason that people usualy don't
              > try flaming here.
              >
              > It's easy to take one sentence without any context and become
              > upset. Read more (as Suresh Govindachar already suggested)
              > and your life will be nicer again.
              > Please start with Suresh Govindachar's e-mail, the answer for
              > you is already there. The sentence you started a flame with
              > means that it seems we can add new features by some script
              > languages (most usualy the internal vim script) and don't
              > need to add every bell and whistle in the core vim code.
              >
              > And it's true for your problem too: core vim features are
              > strong enough to allow "project handling" - but the exact
              > implementation is up to your choice.
              > There are several plugins ready at vim.org which you can use
              > or modify.
              >
              > So again: please start reading at vim.org again with this
              > information in mind.
              > And stop the flame. If you have a concrete question, ask here
              > or at vim-users.
              >
              > Thank you and have a nice day,
              >
              > Milan Vancura
              > --
              > Milan Vancura, Prague, Czech Republic, Europe
              >
            • 范德成
              ... I use vim 6.4, which doesn t have the Tabs feature in vim 7.0, but am still happy with it. To be honest, I do use Visual Studio to browse my working
              Message 6 of 7 , Apr 19, 2007
                Peter Michaux wrote:
                > Hi,
                >
                > I like VIM. I want to use VIM as my everyday editor. I even spent a
                > frustrating week trying to determine if VIM could replace Textmate as
                > my main editor. VIM is very good for working with a single file but
                > the concept of a project is not really there. I looked at plugins,
                > talked with people in #vim about plugins and how to extend VIM. I
                > figured it would probably take a year of spare time for me to learn
                > how and then write the plugin to do what Textmate can do with respect
                > to projects right when it is installed: a project drawer, project
                > tabs, multiple open projects, project-wide search and selective
                > replace. And now I see that VIM doesn't need more features...
                >
                > http://www.vim.org/soc/ideas.php
                >
                > Darn.
                >
                > Peter
                >
                >
                I use vim 6.4, which doesn't have the Tabs feature in vim 7.0, but am
                still happy with it. To be honest, I do use Visual Studio to browse my
                working project, but I also use rosh (written by my self, see
                http://sourceforge.net/projects/winrosh/ ), together with Windows' Task
                Manager, to work with many files in the project. To switch directories
                back and forth and to launch instances of gvim, I use rosh. To do
                editing of several files (not too many, normally 4) at the same time, I
                use gvim. To switch between gvim instances, I use Task Manager. To
                browse the whole project, I use Visual Studio. They work together well.
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