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Re: Vim version 6.0am ALPHA available

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  • Bohdan Vlasyuk
    ... I always thought that CVS provides convenient means to keep remotes up to date. If, despite of my beliefs, CVS is generally used to kill disk space and
    Message 1 of 16 , Jul 2, 2001
      On Mon, Jul 02, 2001 at 04:26:58AM -0400, Matt Dunford wrote:

      > I'll update the cvs for you.
      I always thought that CVS provides convenient means to keep remotes up
      to date. If, despite of my beliefs, CVS is generally used to kill disk
      space and create mess among others, I'm sorry, I was wrong, and next
      time I'll download huge .bz2 to boost vim.org traffic scores.


      --
    • Zdenek Sekera
      Bohdan, you are wrong here: ... It surely does, for some. For those unfortunate ones that are behind the firewall, it s often inaccessible due to admin
      Message 2 of 16 , Jul 2, 2001
        Bohdan,

        you are wrong here:
        Bohdan Vlasyuk wrote:
        >
        > On Mon, Jul 02, 2001 at 04:26:58AM -0400, Matt Dunford wrote:
        >
        > > I'll update the cvs for you.
        > I always thought that CVS provides convenient means to keep remotes up
        > to date.

        It surely does, for some. For those unfortunate ones that are behind
        the firewall, it's often inaccessible due to admin restrictions.
        E.g. I can't use it (and many others).
        So much for your (a bit, IMHO) provocative statement.

        I think a day or two of delay with updating should not be a problem,
        huh??

        > If, despite of my beliefs, CVS is generally used to kill disk
        > space and create mess among others, I'm sorry, I was wrong,

        You are wrong when stating this.

        > and next
        > time I'll download huge .bz2 to boost vim.org traffic scores.

        I don't think that the vim.org traffic score measures anything,
        do you? And since we are at it: how can the CVS source be any shorter
        than the .bz2 source file?

        Friendly,

        ---Zdenek

        ---Zdenek
      • Matt Dunford
        ... I ve updated the cvs repository for 6.0am. Please email me if you have any problems. -- Rich and poor rub shoulders Yahweh has made them both. -- proverbs
        Message 3 of 16 , Jul 2, 2001
          * Bram Moolenaar <Bram@...> [010701 15:31]:
          >
          > [...] *snip*
          >
          > You can find Vim 6.0 here: ftp://ftp.vim.org/pub/vim/unreleased/
          >
          > unix/vim-6.0am.tar.bz2 sources + runtime files, bzip2 compressed
          > unix/vim-6.0am-rt1.tar.gz runtime files part 1
          > unix/vim-6.0am-rt2.tar.gz runtime files part 2
          > unix/vim-6.0am-src1.tar.gz sources part 1
          > unix/vim-6.0am-src2.tar.gz sources part 2
          >
          > extra/vim-6.0am-extra.tar.gz extra files
          > extra/vim-6.0am-lang.tar.gz multi-language files
          >

          I've updated the cvs repository for 6.0am. Please email me if you have
          any problems.

          --
          Rich and poor rub shoulders
          Yahweh has made them both.
          -- proverbs
          --
        • Matt Dunford
          ... Nope, cvs is a versioning control system. More info here: http://www.gnu.org/software/cvs/cvs.html http://www.gnu.org/manual/cvs/html_node/cvs_toc.html
          Message 4 of 16 , Jul 2, 2001
            * Bohdan Vlasyuk <bohdan@...> [010702 04:40]:
            > On Mon, Jul 02, 2001 at 04:26:58AM -0400, Matt Dunford wrote:
            >
            > > I'll update the cvs for you.
            > I always thought that CVS provides convenient means to keep remotes up
            > to date. If, despite of my beliefs, CVS is generally used to kill disk
            > space and create mess among others, I'm sorry, I was wrong, and next
            > time I'll download huge .bz2 to boost vim.org traffic scores.

            Nope, cvs is a versioning control system. More info here:
            http://www.gnu.org/software/cvs/cvs.html
            http://www.gnu.org/manual/cvs/html_node/cvs_toc.html

            You could even type 'man cvs'.

            --
            Death and life are in the gift of the tongue
            those who indulge it must eat the fruit it yields.
            -- proverbs
            --
          • Matt Dunford
            ... You can t access CVS because you re behind a firewall? Perhaps look into httptunnel if you want to, uhm, get around any restrictions. ;-)
            Message 5 of 16 , Jul 2, 2001
              * Zdenek Sekera <zs@...> [010702 04:51]:
              >
              > > > I'll update the cvs for you.
              > > I always thought that CVS provides convenient means to keep remotes up
              > > to date.
              >
              > It surely does, for some. For those unfortunate ones that are behind
              > the firewall, it's often inaccessible due to admin restrictions.
              > E.g. I can't use it (and many others).
              > So much for your (a bit, IMHO) provocative statement.
              >
              > I think a day or two of delay with updating should not be a problem,
              > huh??

              You can't access CVS because you're behind a firewall? Perhaps look
              into httptunnel if you want to, uhm, get around any restrictions. ;-)

              http://www.nocrew.org/software/httptunnel.html

              I've never used it myself, but I've heard good things about it.

              --
              A nation without superstition would be a nation of philosophers, and
              philosophers would never obey.
              -- the Memoirs of Jacques Casanova
              --
            • Vince Negri
              ... I believe CVSGui (www.cvsgui.org) has built-in support for access through a firewall via http tunnelling. Works for me :) Vince Legal Disclaimer: Any views
              Message 6 of 16 , Jul 2, 2001
                > * Zdenek Sekera <zs@...> [010702 04:51]:
                > > It surely does, for some. For those unfortunate ones that are behind
                > > the firewall, it's often inaccessible due to admin restrictions.
                > > E.g. I can't use it (and many others).
                > > So much for your (a bit, IMHO) provocative statement.
                >
                I believe CVSGui (www.cvsgui.org) has built-in support
                for access through a firewall via http tunnelling. Works
                for me :)

                Vince

                Legal Disclaimer: Any views expressed by the sender of this message are
                not necessarily those of Application Solutions Ltd. Information in this
                e-mail may be confidential and is for the use of the intended recipient
                only, no mistake in transmission is intended to waive or compromise such
                privilege. Please advise the sender if you receive this e-mail by mistake.
              • Thomas Köhler
                On Mon, Jul 02, 2001 at 05:17:35AM -0400, ... Good thing: Can tunnel almost everything. Bad thing: Needs another machine in the outside world with full access
                Message 7 of 16 , Jul 2, 2001
                  On Mon, Jul 02, 2001 at 05:17:35AM -0400,
                  Matt Dunford <zoot@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > * Zdenek Sekera <zs@...> [010702 04:51]:
                  > >
                  > > > > I'll update the cvs for you.
                  > > > I always thought that CVS provides convenient means to keep remotes up
                  > > > to date.
                  > >
                  > > It surely does, for some. For those unfortunate ones that are behind
                  > > the firewall, it's often inaccessible due to admin restrictions.
                  > > E.g. I can't use it (and many others).
                  > > So much for your (a bit, IMHO) provocative statement.
                  > >
                  > > I think a day or two of delay with updating should not be a problem,
                  > > huh??
                  >
                  > You can't access CVS because you're behind a firewall? Perhaps look
                  > into httptunnel if you want to, uhm, get around any restrictions. ;-)
                  >
                  > http://www.nocrew.org/software/httptunnel.html
                  >
                  > I've never used it myself, but I've heard good things about it.

                  Good thing: Can tunnel almost everything.
                  Bad thing: Needs another machine in the outside world with full access
                  to the internet. Many people (especially those who can't access vim's
                  CVS because they are behind a firewall) will be out of luck because of
                  this.

                  Ciao,
                  Thomas

                  --
                  Thomas Köhler Email: jean-luc@... | LCARS - Linux
                  <>< WWW: http://jeanluc-picard.de | for Computers
                  IRC: jeanluc | on All Real
                  PGP public key available from Homepage! | Starships
                • Bram Moolenaar
                  ... No, I don t use CVS. I m too chaotic for that. I mostly work on several changes at the same time. Using CVS only slows me down. ... Johannes Zellner has
                  Message 8 of 16 , Jul 2, 2001
                    Bohdan Vlasyuk wrote:

                    > On Mon, Jul 02, 2001 at 10:04:38AM +0200, Aschwin Marsman wrote:
                    >
                    > >>> You can find Vim 6.0 here: ftp://ftp.vim.org/pub/vim/unreleased/
                    > >> Is CVS no longer maintained ?? There's still 60al there:
                    > > CVS is not updated by Bram, therefore it can take a while until its
                    > > up-to-date again. (Shouldn't we add this to the FAQ, or solve it by
                    > > updating CVS before the announcement takes place?)
                    > Is it so hard to update CVS ?? Does Bram keeps his source tree in CVS?

                    No, I don't use CVS. I'm too chaotic for that. I mostly work on several
                    changes at the same time. Using CVS only slows me down.

                    > If he does, what's the problem to type few keystrokes and leave it in
                    > background ?? I don't think updating will take any longer than 5
                    > minutes.

                    Johannes Zellner has always updated the CVS (using the released versions),
                    which has worked fine. He's on holidays now, but someone else replaces him.
                    If it takes a few more hours before the CVS is updated, don't panic!

                    The 5 minutes it takes to do an automatic CVS update isn't the problem. It's
                    the moments where something goes wrong and I would spend hours to find out how
                    to fix it. I'm glad someone else has taking this upon him, it leaves me more
                    time to work on Vim itself.

                    [next message]
                    > space and create mess among others, I'm sorry, I was wrong, and next
                    > time I'll download huge .bz2 to boost vim.org traffic scores.

                    Don't bother. Vim is already the most often downloaded software package from
                    ftp.nluug.nl. Red Hat Linux beats it if you count the Mbytes downloaded
                    though.

                    --
                    hundred-and-one symptoms of being an internet addict:
                    61. Your best friends know your e-mail address, but neither your phone number
                    nor the address where you live.

                    /// Bram Moolenaar -- Bram@... -- http://www.moolenaar.net \\\
                    ((( Creator of Vim -- http://vim.sf.net -- ftp://ftp.vim.org/pub/vim )))
                    \\\ Help me helping AIDS orphans in Uganda - http://iccf-holland.org ///
                  • Jussi Hagman
                    ... Even if I do not know that much about CVS... For the initial download it obviously can not, but usually the diff between two somewhat closely related
                    Message 9 of 16 , Jul 2, 2001
                      Quoting Zdenek Sekera (zs@...):
                      > And since we are at it: how can the CVS source be any shorter
                      > than the .bz2 source file?

                      Even if I do not know that much about CVS...

                      For the initial download it obviously can not, but usually the diff
                      between two somewhat closely related versions of the source tree is
                      smaller than the whole package.

                      Greets,
                      Jussi

                      --
                      Jussi Hagman CS in Åbo Akademi University
                      Studentbyn 4 D 33 juhagman@...
                      20540 Åbo jhagman@...
                      Finland
                    • Vince Negri
                      ... If you are doing an update from the last version, cvs sends just the diffs which are applied using patch automatically. Moreover, there is an option by
                      Message 10 of 16 , Jul 2, 2001
                        > > And since we are at it: how can the CVS source be any shorter
                        > > than the .bz2 source file?
                        >
                        If you are doing an update from the last version, cvs sends
                        just the diffs which are applied using "patch" automatically.
                        Moreover, there is an option by which the patches are gzipped
                        before sending and unzipped on arrival, so overall the process
                        is quite efficient. :-)

                        What I value most about getting the sources via CVS, though, is
                        that when updating, it merges the changes into my tree and tries
                        to preserve whatever hacks I have done ;) So for example, I don't
                        need to keep tweaking feature.h.

                        Vince


                        Legal Disclaimer: Any views expressed by the sender of this message are
                        not necessarily those of Application Solutions Ltd. Information in this
                        e-mail may be confidential and is for the use of the intended recipient
                        only, no mistake in transmission is intended to waive or compromise such
                        privilege. Please advise the sender if you receive this e-mail by mistake.
                      • Preben Guldberg
                        ... I had a look at which files that were included where. In src2 , I saw a lot of gui stuff and other files for icing on the cake. Not sure excactly what the
                        Message 11 of 16 , Jul 2, 2001
                          Thus wrote Bram Moolenaar (Bram@...) on [010701]:

                          > The distribution files for Unix have been reorganised. The ".gz" files are
                          > now small enough to fit on a floppy. These can be used by (old) standalone
                          > systems. There is one big ".bz2" file that contains everything.

                          I had a look at which files that were included where. In "src2", I saw
                          a lot of gui stuff and other files for icing on the cake. Not sure
                          excactly what the rationale (besides file size of tarballs) was, though.

                          I decided to compile vim with the src2 file only, but found that a few
                          files extra were needed (eg. Makefile). What I could do (with a bit of
                          tweaking) was:

                          $ gzip -cd vim-6.0am-src2.tar.gz | tar tf - >src2.list
                          $ gzip -cd vim-6.0am-src2.tar.gz | tar vxf - \
                          `egrep -v '\.([ch]|pro|x[pb]m)$' src2.list` \
                          vim60am/src/os_unix.h vim60am/src/os_unixx.h \
                          vim60am/src/proto/os_unix.pro
                          $ gzip -cd ~/downloads/vim/vim-6.0am-src1.tar.gz | tar xf -
                          $ cd vim60am/src
                          $ ./configure --disable-gui --without-x && make && make installvimbin

                          The tweaking involved was to make a check for (FEAT_CSCOPE) in proto.h
                          and remove targets for cscope anc xcmdsrv stuff in the Makefile.

                          I see no reason why the check in proto.h should not be there in the
                          first place.

                          As the result of the same build on the full sources do not build
                          cscope and xcmdsrv, I guess they ought to be treated a bit special,
                          too.

                          Btw, a tarball of the resulting set of files is ~1.2M - still under the
                          size of a floppy.

                          Peppe
                          --
                          "Before you criticize someone, walk
                          Preben "Peppe" Guldberg __/-\__ a mile in his shoes. That way, if
                          c928400@... (o o) he gets angry, he'll be a mile away
                          ----------------------oOOo (_) oOOo-- - and barefoot." --Sarah Jackson
                        • Bram Moolenaar
                          ... Not much really. I just had to split it up so that each archive was smaller than 1.4M. The current split up was the simplest to do in the Makefile that
                          Message 12 of 16 , Jul 2, 2001
                            Preben Peppe Guldberg wrote:

                            > > The distribution files for Unix have been reorganised. The ".gz" files are
                            > > now small enough to fit on a floppy. These can be used by (old) standalone
                            > > systems. There is one big ".bz2" file that contains everything.
                            >
                            > I had a look at which files that were included where. In "src2", I saw
                            > a lot of gui stuff and other files for icing on the cake. Not sure
                            > excactly what the rationale (besides file size of tarballs) was, though.

                            Not much really. I just had to split it up so that each archive was smaller
                            than 1.4M. The current split up was the simplest to do in the Makefile that
                            generates them.

                            > I decided to compile vim with the src2 file only, but found that a few
                            > files extra were needed (eg. Makefile). What I could do (with a bit of
                            > tweaking) was:

                            This is not supposed to work. You need both source archives. I think it's
                            too difficult to try to use one archive for a minimal Vim. Trying to define
                            what "minimal" is would already lead to lots of discussions.

                            For the runtime archives I have put the indent/syntax/plugin scripts
                            separately in one archive. This would allow replacing just this one when new
                            versions of the script files become available. I'll also move "filetype.vim"
                            and "scripts.vim" there, these tend to change often.

                            --
                            hundred-and-one symptoms of being an internet addict:
                            83. Batteries in the TV remote now last for months.

                            /// Bram Moolenaar -- Bram@... -- http://www.moolenaar.net \\\
                            ((( Creator of Vim -- http://vim.sf.net -- ftp://ftp.vim.org/pub/vim )))
                            \\\ Help me helping AIDS orphans in Uganda - http://iccf-holland.org ///
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