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RE: new Vim book

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  • Mike Hansen
    ... I purchased this book from the publisher s web site last weekend. I bought the combo PDF and dead-tree version. I haven t got the dead-tree version yet,
    Message 1 of 11 , Aug 1, 2007
      > -----Original Message-----
      > From: vim_use@...
      > [mailto:vim_use@...] On Behalf Of Bram Moolenaar
      > Sent: Wednesday, August 01, 2007 9:00 AM
      > To: vim-announce@...; vim-dev@...; vim@...;
      > vim-mac@...; vim-multibyte@...
      > Subject: new Vim book
      >
      >
      >
      > Kim Schulz has written a book on using Vim The full title is:
      > "Hacking Vim: A Cookbook to get the Most out of the Latest
      > Vim Editor".
      >
      > I have written a bit of info about it on this page:
      > http://iccf-holland.org/click5.html

      I purchased this book from the publisher's web site last weekend. I
      bought the combo PDF and dead-tree version. I haven't got the dead-tree
      version yet, but I'm reading the PDF. I thought the first chapter on the
      history of vi, Vim, and vi clones wasn't really that necessary and could
      have been spent on other hacking topics. I'm in the middle of the 2nd
      chapter now. Note: The 2nd chapter is the sample chapter available for
      download. It's pretty good. So far, I think the book will be helpful in
      learning more about Vim.

      Mike

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    • Tony Mechelynck
      ... I ve had a look at the online sample chapter and it sounds quite slow-paced to me. I m tempted to say second grade level but that would be caricature. I
      Message 2 of 11 , Aug 1, 2007
        Mike Hansen wrote:
        >
        >
        >> -----Original Message-----
        >> From: vim_use@...
        >> [mailto:vim_use@...] On Behalf Of Bram Moolenaar
        >> Sent: Wednesday, August 01, 2007 9:00 AM
        >> To: vim-announce@...; vim-dev@...; vim@...;
        >> vim-mac@...; vim-multibyte@...
        >> Subject: new Vim book
        >>
        >>
        >>
        >> Kim Schulz has written a book on using Vim The full title is:
        >> "Hacking Vim: A Cookbook to get the Most out of the Latest
        >> Vim Editor".
        >>
        >> I have written a bit of info about it on this page:
        >> http://iccf-holland.org/click5.html
        >
        > I purchased this book from the publisher's web site last weekend. I
        > bought the combo PDF and dead-tree version. I haven't got the dead-tree
        > version yet, but I'm reading the PDF. I thought the first chapter on the
        > history of vi, Vim, and vi clones wasn't really that necessary and could
        > have been spent on other hacking topics. I'm in the middle of the 2nd
        > chapter now. Note: The 2nd chapter is the sample chapter available for
        > download. It's pretty good. So far, I think the book will be helpful in
        > learning more about Vim.
        >
        > Mike

        I've had a look at the online sample chapter and it sounds quite "slow-paced"
        to me. I'm tempted to say second grade level but that would be caricature. I
        guess seventh grade is more realistic (and even that may exhibit a warped
        perception). Personally I prefer Bram (et al.)'s documentation: vimtutor, user
        manual, reference manual. YMMV.


        Best regards,
        Tony.
        --
        Once, adv.:
        Enough.
        -- Ambrose Bierce, "The Devil's Dictionary"

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      • Mike Hansen
        ... Well, since you are what I d consider a Vim guru, I wouldn t think that this book would be of any use to you. I d consider your expertise in Vim to be very
        Message 3 of 11 , Aug 1, 2007
          > >> Kim Schulz has written a book on using Vim The full title is:
          > >> "Hacking Vim: A Cookbook to get the Most out of the Latest
          > >> Vim Editor".
          > >>
          > >> I have written a bit of info about it on this page:
          > >> http://iccf-holland.org/click5.html
          > >
          > > I purchased this book from the publisher's web site last weekend. I
          > > bought the combo PDF and dead-tree version. I haven't got
          > the dead-tree
          > > version yet, but I'm reading the PDF. I thought the first
          > chapter on the
          > > history of vi, Vim, and vi clones wasn't really that
          > necessary and could
          > > have been spent on other hacking topics. I'm in the middle
          > of the 2nd
          > > chapter now. Note: The 2nd chapter is the sample chapter
          > available for
          > > download. It's pretty good. So far, I think the book will
          > be helpful in
          > > learning more about Vim.
          > >
          > > Mike
          >
          > I've had a look at the online sample chapter and it sounds
          > quite "slow-paced"
          > to me. I'm tempted to say second grade level but that would
          > be caricature. I
          > guess seventh grade is more realistic (and even that may
          > exhibit a warped
          > perception). Personally I prefer Bram (et al.)'s
          > documentation: vimtutor, user
          > manual, reference manual. YMMV.
          >
          >
          > Best regards,
          > Tony.

          Well, since you are what I'd consider a Vim guru, I wouldn't think that
          this book would be of any use to you. I'd consider your expertise in Vim
          to be very advanced. From what little I've read so far, I say the book
          is targeted at users of intermediate or just beyond beginner level of
          expertise in Vim. My opinion may change as I get farther in the book.

          Mike

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        • Tony Mechelynck
          ... Don t flatter me; there I lots of things about Vim that I know only spottily, if at all. Even yesterday I reported as a bug something that was actually a
          Message 4 of 11 , Aug 1, 2007
            Mike Hansen wrote:
            >
            >
            >>>> Kim Schulz has written a book on using Vim The full title is:
            >>>> "Hacking Vim: A Cookbook to get the Most out of the Latest
            >>>> Vim Editor".
            >>>>
            >>>> I have written a bit of info about it on this page:
            >>>> http://iccf-holland.org/click5.html
            >>> I purchased this book from the publisher's web site last weekend. I
            >>> bought the combo PDF and dead-tree version. I haven't got
            >> the dead-tree
            >>> version yet, but I'm reading the PDF. I thought the first
            >> chapter on the
            >>> history of vi, Vim, and vi clones wasn't really that
            >> necessary and could
            >>> have been spent on other hacking topics. I'm in the middle
            >> of the 2nd
            >>> chapter now. Note: The 2nd chapter is the sample chapter
            >> available for
            >>> download. It's pretty good. So far, I think the book will
            >> be helpful in
            >>> learning more about Vim.
            >>>
            >>> Mike
            >> I've had a look at the online sample chapter and it sounds
            >> quite "slow-paced"
            >> to me. I'm tempted to say second grade level but that would
            >> be caricature. I
            >> guess seventh grade is more realistic (and even that may
            >> exhibit a warped
            >> perception). Personally I prefer Bram (et al.)'s
            >> documentation: vimtutor, user
            >> manual, reference manual. YMMV.
            >>
            >>
            >> Best regards,
            >> Tony.
            >
            > Well, since you are what I'd consider a Vim guru, I wouldn't think that
            > this book would be of any use to you. I'd consider your expertise in Vim
            > to be very advanced. From what little I've read so far, I say the book
            > is targeted at users of intermediate or just beyond beginner level of
            > expertise in Vim. My opinion may change as I get farther in the book.
            >
            > Mike

            Don't flatter me; there I lots of things about Vim that I know only spottily,
            if at all. Even yesterday I reported as a bug something that was actually a
            feature (well, I would call it a misfeature but at least it was documented,
            intended behaviour. I just hadn't done my homework.)

            My greatest joy was when I read the announcement about the (then) new
            ":helpgrep" command. When was it? ah, gotcha. 6.1.423. There are a number of
            gurus still around who remember Vim 5, I don't. Call me a greenhorn guru at best.

            One of my strengths is multi-encoding support, but that's only because I
            delved early (for me) and assiduously into ":help Unicode" and ":help
            keymap-file-format"; and the reason I was motivated was because I wanted to
            write a multilingual Welcome page. Now I'm proud of it,
            http://users.skynet.be/antoine.mechelynck/ and it's true Unicode: &entities;
            were cumbersome to the point of unusability. (I have another multilingual page
            which is a different kind of fun, at
            http://users.skynet.be/antoine.mechelynck/other/imbecile.htm -- cave paginam!)
            The latest thing I added to them both was favicons; but I wander.

            What I did, anyone can do, given enough time and dedication.


            Best regards,
            Tony.

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          • Bill McCarthy
            ... I scanned the first few pages and came across an example of using :match to highlight the portion of a line longer than ... But this mini-redundancy isn t
            Message 5 of 11 , Aug 1, 2007
              On Wed 1-Aug-07 12:03pm -0600, Tony Mechelynck wrote:

              > I've had a look at the online sample chapter and it sounds
              > quite "slow-paced" to me. I'm tempted to say second grade
              > level but that would be caricature. I guess seventh grade
              > is more realistic (and even that may exhibit a warped
              > perception). Personally I prefer Bram (et al.)'s
              > documentation: vimtutor, user manual, reference manual.
              > YMMV.

              I scanned the first few pages and came across an example of
              using :match to highlight the portion of a line longer than
              73 characters. The example is:

              :match errorMsg /\%>73v.\+/

              Of course that could have been written as:

              :match ErrorMsg /\%73v.\+/

              or, I think better (at least shorter):

              :match ErrorMsg /\%>73v./

              But this mini-redundancy isn't what caught my attention,
              the explanation states that the 'v' causes '.\+' to be
              treated as very special.

              (1) the 'v' causes '\%>' to operate on virtual columns and
              (2) if '.\+' were treated as very special, as /\v%>73v.\+/
              only plus signs and the character before them would be
              highlighted when beyond 73 virtual columns.

              --
              Best regards,
              Bill


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            • liviu.vasut@gmail.com
              Hi Tony, this is not related to the subject, sorry! I just had to thank Tony for the link to his page. I was looking for the Dào-dé Jīng book written both
              Message 6 of 11 , Aug 2, 2007
                Hi Tony,
                this is not related to the subject, sorry!
                I just had to thank Tony for the link to his page. I was looking for
                the Dào-dé Jīng book written both in chinese and other language for
                years. I had one in hard copy (translated in my native language!), I
                borrowed it to a 'friend' and never saw it from then.... very sad.
                Some of the links are broken though. Are you planning to check on the
                site soon? I will try to mirror it every 3-4 weeks until it's ok :).
                Thanks again for the link, I found many things inside that relate to
                me.
                Liviu

                On Aug 1, 10:30 pm, Tony Mechelynck <antoine.mechely...@...>
                wrote:

                > One of my strengths is multi-encoding support, but that's only because I
                > delved early (for me) and assiduously into ":help Unicode" and ":help
                > keymap-file-format"; and the reason I was motivated was because I wanted to
                > write a multilingual Welcome page. Now I'm proud of it,http://users.skynet.be/antoine.mechelynck/and it's true Unicode: &entities;
                > were cumbersome to the point of unusability. (I have another multilingual page
                > which is a different kind of fun, athttp://users.skynet.be/antoine.mechelynck/other/imbecile.htm-- cave paginam!)
                > The latest thing I added to them both was favicons; but I wander.
                >
                > What I did, anyone can do, given enough time and dedication.
                >
                > Best regards,
                > Tony.


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              • Franco Saliola
                ... The first command I was ever taught was ... He clearly wasn t a fan. Franco -- --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this
                Message 7 of 11 , Aug 4, 2007
                  On 8/4/07, zzapper <zzapper@...> wrote:

                  > A new book on VIM is to be welcomed. I still remember the
                  > documentation I was given to learn VI ( on a torn off piece of paper)
                  >
                  > i insert
                  > x delete a character
                  > :wq to save & exit

                  The first command I was ever taught was

                  :q!

                  He clearly wasn't a fan.

                  Franco

                  --

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                • Ted Pavlic
                  ... FWIW, I ve been pretty disappointed with the book. Just as sections get interesting, it refers the reader to help pages. I was hoping it would serve as a
                  Message 8 of 11 , Aug 16, 2007
                    > I've had a look at the online sample chapter and it sounds quite
                    > "slow-paced" to me. I'm tempted to say second grade level but that
                    > would be caricature. I guess seventh grade is more realistic (and
                    > even that may exhibit a warped perception). Personally I prefer Bram
                    > (et al.)'s documentation: vimtutor, user manual, reference manual.
                    > YMMV.

                    FWIW, I've been pretty disappointed with the book. Just as sections get
                    interesting, it refers the reader to help pages. I was hoping it would
                    serve as a good text reference with a nice index that I could use to
                    look things up when I want to do something new in Vim7. I was
                    disappointed to find how TINY the book is.

                    All of the introductory material in the book suggests that it should be
                    for experts looking to augment their skills. However, it seems more
                    accurate that it's for beginners looking to become experts.

                    An expert may get more out of a good quick reference taped to the wall.

                    It's great that there's a new book out about Vim7. However, it would be
                    a lot cooler if someone took the time to come up with a nice
                    comprehensive up-to-date Vim reference that had sections catered for
                    people looking to do something more advanced.

                    --Ted

                    --
                    Ted Pavlic <ted@...>

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                  • Ted Pavlic
                    ... Oh, and the index in the back of the book (3 pages, two fronts and one back) is really shotty. Granted, lots of people neglect tables of contents, but
                    Message 9 of 11 , Aug 16, 2007
                      > FWIW, I've been pretty disappointed with the book. Just as sections get
                      > interesting, it refers the reader to help pages. I was hoping it would
                      > serve as a good text reference with a nice index that I could use to
                      > look things up when I want to do something new in Vim7. I was
                      > disappointed to find how TINY the book is.

                      Oh, and the index in the back of the book (3 pages, two fronts and one
                      back) is really shotty. Granted, lots of people neglect tables of
                      contents, but shouldn't the index at least be more complete than the
                      TOC? (the TOC is 4 pages, two fronts and two backs)

                      I was hoping to have a textual reference with a good index that I could
                      peruse. :(

                      --Ted

                      --
                      Ted Pavlic <ted@...>

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                    • Tony Mechelynck
                      ... I guess nothing beats the vimtutor and the online help. Especially with help tag completion and helpgrep. Best regards, Tony. -- A musician of more
                      Message 10 of 11 , Aug 16, 2007
                        Ted Pavlic wrote:
                        >> I've had a look at the online sample chapter and it sounds quite
                        >> "slow-paced" to me. I'm tempted to say second grade level but that
                        >> would be caricature. I guess seventh grade is more realistic (and
                        >> even that may exhibit a warped perception). Personally I prefer Bram
                        >> (et al.)'s documentation: vimtutor, user manual, reference manual.
                        >> YMMV.
                        >
                        > FWIW, I've been pretty disappointed with the book. Just as sections get
                        > interesting, it refers the reader to help pages. I was hoping it would
                        > serve as a good text reference with a nice index that I could use to
                        > look things up when I want to do something new in Vim7. I was
                        > disappointed to find how TINY the book is.
                        >
                        > All of the introductory material in the book suggests that it should be
                        > for experts looking to augment their skills. However, it seems more
                        > accurate that it's for beginners looking to become experts.
                        >
                        > An expert may get more out of a good quick reference taped to the wall.
                        >
                        > It's great that there's a new book out about Vim7. However, it would be
                        > a lot cooler if someone took the time to come up with a nice
                        > comprehensive up-to-date Vim reference that had sections catered for
                        > people looking to do something more advanced.
                        >
                        > --Ted
                        >

                        I guess nothing beats the vimtutor and the online help. Especially with help
                        tag completion and helpgrep.


                        Best regards,
                        Tony.
                        --
                        A musician of more ambition than talent composed an elegy at
                        the death of composer Edward MacDowell. She played the elegy for the
                        pianist Josef Hoffman, then asked his opinion. "Well, it's quite
                        nice," he replied, but don't you think it would be better if ..."
                        "If what?" asked the composer.
                        "If ... if you had died and MacDowell had written the elegy?"

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