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new vim user

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  • mag rat
    I just downloaded vim on my pc which is running on windows Millenium (ME). It is a tar file and I would like to know if I can use it as an editor in Window?
    Message 1 of 14 , Dec 2, 2003
      I just downloaded vim on my pc which is running on
      windows Millenium (ME). It is a tar file and I would
      like to know if I can use it as an editor in Window?
      If so how do I unzip this file?

      thanks
      mag

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    • Antoine J. Mechelynck
      ... I think you can untar a tarball using WinZip, and use it if it is really a Windows version; however, I also think that you can find a more recent Win32
      Message 2 of 14 , Dec 2, 2003
        mag rat <dazzletoo@...> wrote:
        > I just downloaded vim on my pc which is running on
        > windows Millenium (ME). It is a tar file and I would
        > like to know if I can use it as an editor in Window?
        > If so how do I unzip this file?
        >
        > thanks
        > mag
        >
        > __________________________________
        > Do you Yahoo!?
        > Protect your identity with Yahoo! Mail AddressGuard
        > http://antispam.yahoo.com/whatsnewfree

        I think you can untar a tarball using WinZip, and use it if it is really a
        "Windows" version; however, I also think that you can find a more recent
        Win32 version (with more bugfixes) through a link at
        http://cream.sourceforge.net/vim.html . Steve Hall periodically recompiles
        it with the latest bugfixes and the latest runtime files. As of this
        writing, the version currently available there is 6.2.154.

        Best regards,
        Tony.
      • Rena and Terrance Cohen
        If you have a tar file then you may not have a Windows version, at least not a recent one. You should follow this link, download and install gvim62.exe:
        Message 3 of 14 , Dec 3, 2003
          If you have a tar file then you may not have a Windows version, at least
          not a recent one.

          You should follow this link, download and install gvim62.exe:
          http://www.vim.org/download.php#pc

          Enjoy!
          Terrance.

          Antoine J. Mechelynck wrote:

          >mag rat <dazzletoo@...> wrote:
          >
          >
          >>I just downloaded vim on my pc which is running on
          >>windows Millenium (ME). It is a tar file and I would
          >>like to know if I can use it as an editor in Window?
          >>If so how do I unzip this file?
          >>
          >>thanks
          >>mag
          >>
          >>__________________________________
          >>Do you Yahoo!?
          >>Protect your identity with Yahoo! Mail AddressGuard
          >>http://antispam.yahoo.com/whatsnewfree
          >>
          >>
          >
          >I think you can untar a tarball using WinZip, and use it if it is really a
          >"Windows" version; however, I also think that you can find a more recent
          >Win32 version (with more bugfixes) through a link at
          >http://cream.sourceforge.net/vim.html . Steve Hall periodically recompiles
          >it with the latest bugfixes and the latest runtime files. As of this
          >writing, the version currently available there is 6.2.154.
          >
          >Best regards,
          >Tony.
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
        • Xen
          Hi, It s not like I m really all that new to VIM but I can t say I ve ever used it in a decent way. Much of what I know is just muscle memory from a past life.
          Message 4 of 14 , May 18, 2014
            Hi,

            It's not like I'm really all that new to VIM but I can't say I've ever used it in a decent way.

            Much of what I know is just muscle memory from a past life.

            The way you use some long deceased piece of software (or a game) and still remember all the shortcuts.

            But I've never known even how to use multiple windows or several buffers in the same window. I'm using it through Putty on some Debian shell server.

            It's been my Linux editor of choice since forever, but that was mostly because there was nothing that came even remotely close. I've never fancied anything like Emacs and the only other alternative seems to have been Pico/Nano/Joe.

            Some of VIM is the fact that I've never read much help documentation, the other part is that even if I know the buttons, I still mess up regulary. I mean I regularly execute commands by accident and I don't even know what commands they are and suddenly parts of text are gone or pasted. And sometimes I seem to accidentily undo a host of changes and I don't know how to redo them.

            But the reason I'm here today is that I've started writing some PHP software on that shell server and my old VIM style is becoming a bit too limited even for me :p.

            Mouse-based copy & paste through Putty has its limitations and I wasn't even able to disable the auto-indent last time I tried. So right now I only use it for singe lines (no \n) but it's still not exactly anywhere near my editing 'skills' back when I was using Borland's Turbo Pascal editor in DOS.

            A lot of the difficulty of VIM is also that some commands require too much brain processing power for me. Examples are the b,B,w,W commands that are so unintuitive to me that I mess them up every time I use them to navigate, except as part of "cw", "dw", "cW" and "dW". On Windows I would use ctrl-right and ctrl-left to quicly traverse lines of text, but on VIM I use the arrow keys only. Or, when I'm in a hurry I will scan the text that I want to end up at and do a / search for that text. But that itself is too much brain effort.

            Brain effort is also the reason I so greatly dislike the Windows 7 changes to (config) navigation. They want you to always enter search queries. Ubuntu also has something like that now that they call the Dash or something. The problem with these things is not only that you have to think about what you want to search (instead of mindlessly finding the right spot by part muscle memory and part stupidity) but also that these search fields are slow to respond and they interrupt your flow of activity when you just want to keep going.

            One of the best things about VIM is that your typing speed is basically the only bottleneck in what you can achieve. Many commands do not require any ctrl-key combinations and I don't know about other people's hands, but shift-key has always been much faster for me than ctrl-key.

            I also have no idea how to input special characters like Latin characters. If I enter them they issue strange commands in VIM that I don't want or know about. Perhaps in editing source material it's better not to use any character set like UTF8 but rather write things like Ōsaka, but how useful that is for other things is beyond me.

            The whole benefit of VIM is that you don't need any brainpower for the commands you have memorized into muscle memory. It's fast, uninhibited workflow. You can be like a real code hacker in VIM :p.

            Like one of those people who actually do stuff. That's actually meant to do something :p.

            Anyway, if you have any tips or suggestions, I'd love to hear them.

            I started looking into VIM more because I had started writing some documentation for my code and I realized there was no color syntax highlighting. And then I didn't get that to work, and in the end it turned out my .vimrc must have had a hardcoded runtime path pointing to vim63 or something similar, instead of the current version of 73 that is installed. I have no idea if it did, because I overwrote it with someone else's .vimrc that ALSO pointed to a vim63 folder and which bricked the loading of all syntax files :((.

            Anyway, now my colors work. I'm using koehler and it is decent, I just need to change the color of commented text (too bright) and of quoted text (too colorful). Also, it seems to use a different color for known PHP functions as for unknown PHP functions. The benefit of this is too much for simple minds such as myself to understand, and it doesn't even cover all functions (like convert_uuencode() was left out).

            It's time for some happy coding :).

            Regards, Xen.

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          • Ethan Hereth
            ... Xen, Just a couple, perhaps obvious, questions/tips: Have you run through vimtutor? I remember the first time I walked all the way through that after
            Message 5 of 14 , May 19, 2014
              On Sun, May 18, 2014 at 10:34 PM, Xen <xen@...> wrote:
              > Hi,
              >
              > It's not like I'm really all that new to VIM but I can't say I've ever used it in a decent way.
              >
              > Much of what I know is just muscle memory from a past life.
              >
              > The way you use some long deceased piece of software (or a game) and still remember all the shortcuts.
              >
              > But I've never known even how to use multiple windows or several buffers in the same window. I'm using it through Putty on some Debian shell server.
              >
              > It's been my Linux editor of choice since forever, but that was mostly because there was nothing that came even remotely close. I've never fancied anything like Emacs and the only other alternative seems to have been Pico/Nano/Joe.
              >
              > Some of VIM is the fact that I've never read much help documentation, the other part is that even if I know the buttons, I still mess up regulary. I mean I regularly execute commands by accident and I don't even know what commands they are and suddenly parts of text are gone or pasted. And sometimes I seem to accidentily undo a host of changes and I don't know how to redo them.
              >
              > But the reason I'm here today is that I've started writing some PHP software on that shell server and my old VIM style is becoming a bit too limited even for me :p.
              >
              > Mouse-based copy & paste through Putty has its limitations and I wasn't even able to disable the auto-indent last time I tried. So right now I only use it for singe lines (no \n) but it's still not exactly anywhere near my editing 'skills' back when I was using Borland's Turbo Pascal editor in DOS.
              >
              > A lot of the difficulty of VIM is also that some commands require too much brain processing power for me. Examples are the b,B,w,W commands that are so unintuitive to me that I mess them up every time I use them to navigate, except as part of "cw", "dw", "cW" and "dW". On Windows I would use ctrl-right and ctrl-left to quicly traverse lines of text, but on VIM I use the arrow keys only. Or, when I'm in a hurry I will scan the text that I want to end up at and do a / search for that text. But that itself is too much brain effort.
              >
              > Brain effort is also the reason I so greatly dislike the Windows 7 changes to (config) navigation. They want you to always enter search queries. Ubuntu also has something like that now that they call the Dash or something. The problem with these things is not only that you have to think about what you want to search (instead of mindlessly finding the right spot by part muscle memory and part stupidity) but also that these search fields are slow to respond and they interrupt your flow of activity when you just want to keep going.
              >
              > One of the best things about VIM is that your typing speed is basically the only bottleneck in what you can achieve. Many commands do not require any ctrl-key combinations and I don't know about other people's hands, but shift-key has always been much faster for me than ctrl-key.
              >
              > I also have no idea how to input special characters like Latin characters. If I enter them they issue strange commands in VIM that I don't want or know about. Perhaps in editing source material it's better not to use any character set like UTF8 but rather write things like Ōsaka, but how useful that is for other things is beyond me.
              >
              > The whole benefit of VIM is that you don't need any brainpower for the commands you have memorized into muscle memory. It's fast, uninhibited workflow. You can be like a real code hacker in VIM :p.
              >
              > Like one of those people who actually do stuff. That's actually meant to do something :p.
              >
              > Anyway, if you have any tips or suggestions, I'd love to hear them.
              >
              > I started looking into VIM more because I had started writing some documentation for my code and I realized there was no color syntax highlighting. And then I didn't get that to work, and in the end it turned out my .vimrc must have had a hardcoded runtime path pointing to vim63 or something similar, instead of the current version of 73 that is installed. I have no idea if it did, because I overwrote it with someone else's .vimrc that ALSO pointed to a vim63 folder and which bricked the loading of all syntax files :((.
              >
              > Anyway, now my colors work. I'm using koehler and it is decent, I just need to change the color of commented text (too bright) and of quoted text (too colorful). Also, it seems to use a different color for known PHP functions as for unknown PHP functions. The benefit of this is too much for simple minds such as myself to understand, and it doesn't even cover all functions (like convert_uuencode() was left out).
              >
              > It's time for some happy coding :).
              >
              > Regards, Xen.
              >

              Xen,

              Just a couple, perhaps obvious, questions/tips:

              Have you run through vimtutor? I remember the first time I walked all
              the way through that after having used Vim a lot for a few years and I
              still learned some things that I didn't know.

              As far as becoming proficient with Vim, I found that for me the best
              way was to find a couple/few good Vim cheat sheets and keep them by
              the computer to reference when I couldn't quite remember how to best
              complete the task at hand, until I no longer had to look at them.

              There are a ton of good intermediate/advanced introductions to Vim on
              the web; so much so that it very well can be overwhelming.

              Also, don't neglect to reference the built in :help in Vim. This can
              be an overwhelming reference but it is most complete. You might just
              start by running :help and following your nose for a while!

              One last thing, and I certainly don't mean to toot my own horn, but I
              have an 'Introduction to Vim' write up that I use here and there to
              get new users at my workplace introduced to the Vim editor. It's far
              from complete and I have high hopes of sometime adding much more to
              it, but it is yet another flavor out there that you may or may not
              find useful. (Any, hopefully constructive, feedback is always
              welcome.) Please find the intro here:

              https://github.com/advocateddrummer/vim-introduction

              Good luck, and just wait around a bit, there are many seasoned pros
              out there in this group. I'm sure you'll get some more sage advice
              from some of them.

              Ethan Alan

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            • Gary Johnson
              ... [...] ... I would certainly second the suggestion to review vimtutor. Then I would look at Bram s video, 7 Habits For Effective Text Editing ,
              Message 6 of 14 , May 19, 2014
                On 2014-05-19, Ethan Hereth wrote:
                > On Sun, May 18, 2014 at 10:34 PM, Xen wrote:
                > > Hi,
                > >
                > > It's not like I'm really all that new to VIM but I can't say
                > > I've ever used it in a decent way.
                > >
                > > Much of what I know is just muscle memory from a past life.

                [...]

                > > Anyway, if you have any tips or suggestions, I'd love to hear them.

                > Xen,
                >
                > Just a couple, perhaps obvious, questions/tips:
                >
                > Have you run through vimtutor? I remember the first time I walked all
                > the way through that after having used Vim a lot for a few years and I
                > still learned some things that I didn't know.

                I would certainly second the suggestion to review vimtutor.

                Then I would look at Bram's video, "7 Habits For Effective Text
                Editing", http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p6K4iIMlouI. It was pretty
                easy to learn everything there was to know about vi. That's no
                longer true with Vim--there are just so many commands now. Bram
                offers some good advice for improving your effectiveness at
                performing the tasks _you_ do most often.

                Reading this list regularly really helps, too. I'm always learning
                something new from it.

                As Ethan wrote, there are a lot of good tutorials and blog articles
                on the Web, too. It helps to get recommendations from experienced
                users, though, since there are also a lot of articles out there from
                well-meaning authors who really don't understand Vim very well.

                Regards,
                Gary

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              • Kartik Singhal
                On Tue, May 20, 2014 at 5:08 AM, Ethan Hereth ... After spending those precious 20-30 minutes with vimtutor, I think one of the best options is to read A Byte
                Message 7 of 14 , May 19, 2014
                  On Tue, May 20, 2014 at 5:08 AM, Ethan Hereth
                  <advocateddrummer@...> wrote:
                  > Have you run through vimtutor? I remember the first time I walked all
                  > the way through that after having used Vim a lot for a few years and I
                  > still learned some things that I didn't know.

                  After spending those precious 20-30 minutes with vimtutor, I think one
                  of the best options is to read A Byte of Vim:
                  http://www.swaroopch.com/notes/vim/

                  It's a tiny book and helps one understand how things work in Vim. Just
                  after a few chapters into the book you will realize it's not so much
                  of brain work. :)

                  HTH
                  --
                  Kartik
                  http://k4rtik.wordpress.com/

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                • John Little
                  I d emphasize Ethan s point about the help. Learn to use it, and you ve learned to use vim, by and large. BTW, ... For some ... maybe. After a decade and a
                  Message 8 of 14 , May 19, 2014
                    I'd emphasize Ethan's point about the help. Learn to use it, and you've learned to use vim, by and large.

                    BTW,
                    On Tuesday, May 20, 2014 12:58:47 PM UTC+12, Gary Johnson wrote:

                    > It was pretty easy to learn everything there was to know about vi.

                    For some ... maybe. After a decade and a half I was still learning, and after that vim's help told me more about vi. I mention this so as not to discourage the OP, just in case he's merely mortal.

                    Regards, John Little

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                  • BPJ
                    Xen wrote, ... I also used to have problems with those, until I realized that they have or can be thought to have mnemonic names, which may not be obvious if
                    Message 9 of 14 , May 20, 2014
                      Xen wrote,
                      >> A lot of the difficulty of VIM is also that some commands
                      >> require too much brain processing power for me. Examples are
                      >> the b,B,w,W commands that are so unintuitive to me that I mess
                      >> them up every time I use them to navigate, except as part of
                      >> "cw", "dw", "cW" and "dW".

                      I also used to have problems with those, until I realized that
                      they have or can be thought to have mnemonic names, which may not
                      be obvious if English isn't your native language:

                      Key Mnemonic

                      |b| |b|eginning of this word
                      |B| |B|eginning of a bigger chunk -- B is a big b!
                      |e| |e|nd of this word
                      |E| |E|nd of a bigger chunk
                      |w| |w|hitespace after word included
                      |W| |W|hitespace after bigger chunk included

                      The w and W mnemonics *are* a bit contrieved, but the included
                      whitespace is the important difference from e and E, and once I
                      came up with them the served me well -- I almost never used w or
                      W before that! Now of course I hardly need them anymore.

                      Ethan Hereth wrote:
                      > As far as becoming proficient with Vim, I found that for me the
                      > best way was to find a couple/few good Vim cheat sheets and
                      > keep them by the computer to reference when I couldn't quite
                      > remember how to best complete the task at hand, until I no
                      > longer had to look at them.

                      I would also encourage everyone to write their own cheat sheet
                      with the things they use/need often, and revising it, removing
                      things from the cheat sheet as you memorize them, and adding
                      new things which seem useful as you discover them in the help
                      or online.

                      Of course one should browse around in the :help, which is great
                      *if you know where to look*. Unfortunately in my experience
                      that is far from always the case. I wonder how that could be
                      improved?

                      Then there is of course Google

                      "vim phrase describing what it is I want to do"

                      Remember: the more specific your query the more specific your
                      answers. Use normal English describing what you are looking
                      for, rather than trying to come up with a few keywords -- i.e.
                      express your needs as is most natural to the brain. Google
                      knows how to make the most out of it. I actually find things in
                      the online vimdoc with google more easily than I find them
                      with :help...

                      /bpj

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                    • Xenn
                      ... Thanks a bunch! Can you imagine I never knew about the e after all those years? So basically I was coupling two things together (b and w) that were not
                      Message 10 of 14 , May 20, 2014
                        Op Tue, 20 May 2014 10:13:47 +0200 schreef BPJ <bpj@...>:

                        > I also used to have problems with those, until I realized that
                        > they have or can be thought to have mnemonic names, which may not
                        > be obvious if English isn't your native language:
                        >
                        > Key Mnemonic
                        >
                        > |b| |b|eginning of this word
                        > |B| |B|eginning of a bigger chunk -- B is a big b!
                        > |e| |e|nd of this word
                        > |E| |E|nd of a bigger chunk
                        > |w| |w|hitespace after word included
                        > |W| |W|hitespace after bigger chunk included

                        Thanks a bunch! Can you imagine I never knew about the "e" after all those
                        years? So basically I was coupling two things together (b and w) that were
                        not each others opposites. I believe this is the answer I was seeking.

                        > I would also encourage everyone to write their own cheat sheet
                        > with the things they use/need often, and revising it, removing
                        > things from the cheat sheet as you memorize them, and adding
                        > new things which seem useful as you discover them in the help
                        > or online.

                        Yeah, perhaps that would be useful, if only if it is a manageable subset
                        of the help that you can work with (there are SO many different commands
                        that almost do the same thing, you just don't need all of them, just a
                        decent workflow in the way of opening and closing files and windows. There
                        are a lot of commands that combine other commands in one, but you may
                        simply not need that at that point).


                        To the rest who replied: I was actually hoping for more specific answers
                        to the topics/issues I had described, rather than a generic "you can look
                        there to find your answers" kind of obvious non-solution. Cause you know,
                        if I was that eager to dive into help files and manuals, I would have
                        specifically asked for the best help files/tutorials, instead of
                        describing my issues myself.

                        And of course I plan to keep reading this group, since accidental
                        discovery is the easiest way of discovery. I've generally found it is also
                        easier to learn something by helping someone else solve something, than
                        trying to learn it for yourself by yourself. Other people's problems are
                        often neatly contained (from your point of view) whereas your own problems
                        (projects) can seem like a huge mountain to climb.

                        Few weeks ago I was visiting the Wordpress.org forums and even though I
                        hardly know anything about Wordpress, my vastly superior hacking skills
                        still allowed me to be of service to some people, and in the process I
                        learned (relearned) much about SQL and regexp. Which will subsequently
                        come very useful for myself. It would really have been a pain to learn it
                        for myself by myself. I was happy to be dealing with other people's modest
                        problems :p.

                        Right now I know mostly everything about PHP preg_ functions and how to
                        effectively use them. And now I've seen some Python code that can do the
                        same thing but in a very different way? I am writing something to traverse
                        the Facebook graph and came across someone who has written pretty much the
                        exact same thing I am trying to write, only he wrote it in Python. And his
                        Python style was not to use intricate regexp queries but to manually find
                        and traverse start and end positions of strings he wanted to match and
                        looping that until he'd found everything, after which an error occurred
                        and his "except:" code would then handle the transit to the next phase of
                        execution, all within the while loop. In PHP you use
                        preg_match_all($pattern, $text, $matches, PREG_SET_ORDER) to obtain an
                        array of matches and every element contains all the subpatterns you
                        wanted, [0] for the entire string, [1] for the first subpattern, and so
                        on. I bet those Python ways are more efficient? I.e. less expensive. I am
                        planning to combine his code with mine so that my PHP becomes a front-end
                        while the Python becomes an asynchronous back-end. That's also useful
                        because the PHP would run on the webserver while the Python would run on
                        the shell server.

                        Anyway, that's all a different subject.

                        Thanks for your help so far.

                        Regards, Xen.


                        >
                        > Of course one should browse around in the :help, which is great
                        > *if you know where to look*. Unfortunately in my experience
                        > that is far from always the case. I wonder how that could be
                        > improved?
                        >
                        > Then there is of course Google
                        >
                        > "vim phrase describing what it is I want to do"
                        >
                        > Remember: the more specific your query the more specific your
                        > answers. Use normal English describing what you are looking
                        > for, rather than trying to come up with a few keywords -- i.e.
                        > express your needs as is most natural to the brain. Google
                        > knows how to make the most out of it. I actually find things in
                        > the online vimdoc with google more easily than I find them
                        > with :help...
                        >
                        > /bpj
                        >


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                      • Dan Lowe
                        ... Please keep using whatever works best for you, but I d guess most Vim users think of w as word, and one way you can think of these are as jumps. So it s
                        Message 11 of 14 , May 21, 2014
                          On Tue, May 20, 2014, at 01:13 AM, BPJ wrote:
                          >
                          > I also used to have problems with those, until I realized that
                          > they have or can be thought to have mnemonic names, which may not
                          > be obvious if English isn't your native language:
                          >
                          > Key Mnemonic
                          >
                          > |b| |b|eginning of this word
                          > |B| |B|eginning of a bigger chunk -- B is a big b!
                          > |e| |e|nd of this word
                          > |E| |E|nd of a bigger chunk
                          > |w| |w|hitespace after word included
                          > |W| |W|hitespace after bigger chunk included
                          >
                          > The w and W mnemonics *are* a bit contrieved, but the included
                          > whitespace is the important difference from e and E, and once I
                          > came up with them the served me well -- I almost never used w or
                          > W before that! Now of course I hardly need them anymore.

                          Please keep using whatever works best for you, but I'd guess most Vim
                          users think of w as "word," and one way you can think of these are as
                          jumps. So it's not that "w" in "dw" means "delete this word," what it
                          means is "delete from here until you run into the next word." In the
                          same way that "w" without an action before it means "jump to the next
                          word."

                          Dan


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                        • BPJ
                          ... My problem is that I can t by any stretch of imagination think of what s sjumped over by W as a word -- it s usually at least one word and then some
                          Message 12 of 14 , May 21, 2014
                            2014-05-21 15:44, Dan Lowe skrev:
                            >
                            >
                            > On Tue, May 20, 2014, at 01:13 AM, BPJ wrote:
                            >>
                            >> I also used to have problems with those, until I realized that
                            >> they have or can be thought to have mnemonic names, which may not
                            >> be obvious if English isn't your native language:
                            >>
                            >> Key Mnemonic
                            >>
                            >> |b| |b|eginning of this word
                            >> |B| |B|eginning of a bigger chunk -- B is a big b!
                            >> |e| |e|nd of this word
                            >> |E| |E|nd of a bigger chunk
                            >> |w| |w|hitespace after word included
                            >> |W| |W|hitespace after bigger chunk included
                            >>
                            >> The w and W mnemonics *are* a bit contrieved, but the included
                            >> whitespace is the important difference from e and E, and once I
                            >> came up with them the served me well -- I almost never used w or
                            >> W before that! Now of course I hardly need them anymore.
                            >
                            > Please keep using whatever works best for you, but I'd guess most Vim
                            > users think of w as "word," and one way you can think of these are as
                            > jumps. So it's not that "w" in "dw" means "delete this word," what it
                            > means is "delete from here until you run into the next word." In the
                            > same way that "w" without an action before it means "jump to the next
                            > word."

                            My 'problem' is that I can't by any stretch of imagination think
                            of what's sjumped over by W as a 'word' -- it's usually at least
                            one word and then some punctuation. I'm probably a dinosaur for
                            havings so restrictive a view of what a 'word' is, but so be it.
                            I guess I could rephrase it as "W: whitespace-delimited chunk".
                            (I realize that the store of available letters to assign to
                            actions was and is limited BTW, so it's no big deal!)

                            /bpj


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                          • Elijah Griffin
                            ... Don t think of what is jumped over, think of what it finds. W jumps to the start of the next word, whatever jumble is in the way. I often use W for
                            Message 13 of 14 , May 21, 2014
                              BPJ wrote:
                              > My 'problem' is that I can't by any stretch of imagination think
                              > of what's sjumped over by W as a 'word' -- it's usually at least
                              > one word and then some punctuation. I'm probably a dinosaur for
                              > havings so restrictive a view of what a 'word' is, but so be it.
                              > I guess I could rephrase it as "W: whitespace-delimited chunk".

                              Don't think of what is jumped over, think of what it finds. 'W' jumps
                              to the start of the next word, whatever jumble is in the way. I often
                              use 'W' for header editing, but in code I find it not as useful as
                              the find character commands:

                              f find forward
                              F find backward
                              t go to character
                              T go to character backwards
                              ; repeat last f, F, t, or T
                              , repeat last f, F, t, or T but in opposite direction

                              $string = sprintf("example %s line, for explanations\n", $perl);

                              With the cursor on the first character of the example line, "3fs" will
                              jump to the "s" in "%s". From there ";" jumps to the last letter in
                              explanations. "tp" jumps to the "$" before "perl", and "cfl" replaces
                              up to the last letter in "$perl".

                              Using "f" / "t" appropriately lets me leverage the value of "n" and "."
                              to find things to change and then repeat my last edit. The "cfl" edit
                              starting from the "$" is the same change even if the line looks like
                              one of these:

                              $perl = 'Perl, ';
                              $perl.=$version;
                              $perl_version = $perl;
                              $string = sprintf("example %s line%s\n", $perl, $is_plural);

                              Myself, I never could get 'S' to sink in to my mind. 's', delete
                              current chararacter and start inserting, makes sense with the
                              mnemonic of "change a word into a plural", particularly "y" => "ies"
                              plurals. The line mode change for 'S', which is just a synonym for
                              'cc' never felt right. Consequently I've usually just remapped it
                              (:map) in most of my .exrc / .vimrc files.

                              Elijah

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                            • BPJ
                              ... No it jumps to the beginning of the next whitespace-delimited chunk, which may begin in any non-whitespace character. As a linguist I m a bit picky about
                              Message 14 of 14 , May 22, 2014
                                2014-05-21 23:27, Elijah Griffin skrev:
                                > BPJ wrote:
                                >> >My 'problem' is that I can't by any stretch of imagination think
                                >> >of what's sjumped over by W as a 'word' -- it's usually at least
                                >> >one word and then some punctuation. I'm probably a dinosaur for
                                >> >havings so restrictive a view of what a 'word' is, but so be it.
                                >> >I guess I could rephrase it as "W: whitespace-delimited chunk".

                                > Don't think of what is jumped over, think of what it finds. 'W' jumps
                                > to the start of the next word, whatever jumble is in the way.

                                No it jumps to the beginning of the next whitespace-delimited
                                chunk, which may begin in any non-whitespace character. As a
                                linguist I'm a bit picky about the definition of "word",
                                whether you jump to, from or over whatever you do or don't
                                define as a word. There is a linguistic truism that a word
                                can't be defined by linguistic criteria alone, so the least
                                common denominator is 'what goes beteen whitespace', but it
                                usually doesn't include punctuation. My beef is with the
                                definition of the text objects as such: w recognises a word but
                                W recognises something else/more. It's clearly me needing to
                                change my semantic habits! :-)

                                /bpj

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