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Re: vim split window editing => separate window editing?

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  • stosss
    Marc, the time stamp on your computer is in the future. ... -- In the days of ancient Rome when the republic was still a republic, Lucius Cassius, one of the
    Message 1 of 12 , Feb 2, 2013
      Marc, the time stamp on your computer is in the future.

      On Sat, Feb 2, 2013 at 3:23 PM, Marc Weber <marco-oweber@...> wrote:
      > Excerpts from Linda W's message of Sat Feb 02 20:11:33 +0100 2013:
      >> If vim can split a window and edit the same file in multiple places,
      >> shouldn't
      >> it be possible to have those windows be "disconnected" and really be
      >> separate windows -- and still edit the same file?
      > Always talk about why you're missing it.
      >
      > a) making a copy is cheap
      > :enew then copy paste buf contents
      >
      > b) opening a second vim instance is cheap, too.
      >
      > So why bother about such complex confusing setup you're talking about?
      >
      > Marc Weber
      >
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      >



      --
      "In the days of ancient Rome when the republic was still a republic,
      Lucius Cassius, one of the city's most venerated consuls, famously
      coined the phrase cui bono.

      It means As a benefit to whom?, and Lucius Cassius, inquisitive and
      analytical by nature, was always asking the question... whether he was
      investigating a crime or unraveling political corruption." - Simon
      Black

      Like I have always said, "Follow the flow of the money it always
      reveals the truth."

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    • Christian Brabandt
      Hi Linda! ... You can achieve something like this with the client-server feature and two separate gvim instances. regards, Christian -- Bei den Ursachen
      Message 2 of 12 , Feb 2, 2013
        Hi Linda!

        On Sa, 02 Feb 2013, Linda W wrote:

        > If vim can split a window and edit the same file in multiple places,
        > shouldn't
        > it be possible to have those windows be "disconnected" and really be
        > separate windows -- and still edit the same file?
        >
        > I don't think there's is a way to currently do that in vim (???)...
        > but would it be that hard to change vim to allow such? -- one instance
        > of vim with multiple windows open onto the same set of buffers (or same
        > file?)...
        >
        > How would it be more difficult than running with split windows?
        >
        > RFE??

        You can achieve something like this with the client-server feature and
        two separate gvim instances.

        regards,
        Christian
        --
        Bei den Ursachen unbekannter wichtiger Begebenheiten raten wir immer
        auf angenehme oder unangenehme, selten auf wahrscheinliche und
        natürliche.
        -- Jean Paul

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      • Linda W
        ... If I change contents in one file, it doesn t update in the other. I don t want to have to merge N copies. ... What would be confusing is trying to merge
        Message 3 of 12 , Feb 2, 2013
          Benjamin R. Haskell wrote:
          > On Sat, 2 Feb 2013, Marc Weber wrote:
          >
          >> Excerpts from Linda W's message of Sat Feb 02 20:11:33 +0100 2013:
          >>
          >> a) making a copy is cheap
          >> :enew then copy paste buf contents
          ----
          If I change contents in one file, it doesn't update in the other.
          I don't want to have to merge 'N' copies.

          >>
          >> So why bother about such complex confusing setup you're talking about?
          ----
          What would be confusing is trying to merge all those copies
          you suggest I make.

          >
          > She just seems to want it as a separate window, instead of being
          > crammed into the same Gvim application window.
          ---
          Yep. Many applications have the ability to detach parts of the app...
          >
          > But, I don't suspect the request will be fulfilled. It'd be too
          > complicated to implement in terminal Vim. And Gvim is structured such
          > that there's a single top-level application window. I haven't looked,
          > but I don't think there's a nice way to handle multiple detachable
          > windows without rewriting (much/most of) the GUI code.
          ---
          Really? I thought there was an ability to tear off menus at some point?
          Or am I hallucinating that? ;-)



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        • Benjamin R. Haskell
          ... I believe the tear-off menus are a built-in feature of GTK+. (Where you need only specify true for some This menu can be torn off property.) IIRC,
          Message 4 of 12 , Feb 2, 2013
            On Sat, 2 Feb 2013, Linda W wrote:

            > Benjamin R. Haskell wrote:
            >> She just seems to want it as a separate window, instead of being
            >> crammed into the same Gvim application window.
            > ---
            > Yep. Many applications have the ability to detach parts of the app...
            >>
            >> But, I don't suspect the request will be fulfilled. It'd be too
            >> complicated to implement in terminal Vim. And Gvim is structured
            >> such that there's a single top-level application window. I haven't
            >> looked, but I don't think there's a nice way to handle multiple
            >> detachable windows without rewriting (much/most of) the GUI code.
            > ---
            > Really? I thought there was an ability to tear off menus at some point?
            > Or am I hallucinating that? ;-)

            I believe the tear-off menus are a built-in feature of GTK+. (Where you
            need only specify 'true' for some "This menu can be torn off" property.)
            IIRC, letting other things be "tear off" isn't as simple.

            I could be wrong. I thankfully haven't had to do much GTK programming
            in a while. Googling "GTK tear off windows" finds GtkHandleBox, so it
            /might/ be as simple as turning the (vim) tabs into handle boxes.

            --
            Best,
            Ben

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          • Marc Weber
            Well - opening the same file multiple time is no that bad, because you can make vim - safe the buf if you leave insert mode - reload the buf it has changed Its
            Message 5 of 12 , Feb 2, 2013
              Well - opening the same file multiple time is no that bad, because you
              can make vim
              - safe the buf if you leave insert mode
              - reload the buf it has changed
              Its not perfect. If you need assistance with it I'll write a new
              plugin.

              If you use google there is a chance to find some somewhat working
              collaborative editing implementations for Vim.

              Eg try googling for "collaborative editing vim github"
              (I haven't tested those), there may be more implementations.

              Next option: use emacs: It can do it. Evil implements most important Vim
              modal editing commands just fine.

              I hope that this reply is more helpful than my first one.

              Marc Weber

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            • ping
              ... that s not an eamcs-only feature. try nrrwrgn: http://www.vim.org/scripts/script.php?script_id=3075 one of my most favorite plugins... -- -- You received
              Message 6 of 12 , Feb 2, 2013
                On 2/2/2013 5:30 PM, Marc Weber wrote:
                > Next option: use emacs: It can do it. Evil implements most important Vim
                > modal editing commands just fine.
                that's not an "eamcs-only" feature.

                try nrrwrgn:
                http://www.vim.org/scripts/script.php?script_id=3075

                one of my most favorite plugins...

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              • Marc Weber
                Hi Linda [1] ... (first mail) Please clarify what you mean by window . In Vim terminology a window is a rectangular region which can display a buffer. Muliple
                Message 7 of 12 , Feb 3, 2013
                  Hi Linda

                  [1]
                  > it be possible to have those windows be "disconnected" and really be
                  > separate windows
                  (first mail)
                  Please clarify what you mean by "window". In Vim terminology a window is
                  a rectangular region which can display a buffer. Muliple windows create
                  a layout. See :h window.

                  in OS terminology a window is something with a [x] at the top right,
                  something you can resize, close, minimize, move to other deskopts etc.
                  thus something like gvim, firefox, open office, etc.

                  [2]
                  > What would be confusing is trying to merge all those copies
                  > you suggest I make.
                  (later mail)

                  See comments about what narrow region plugin does (bottom)
                  Its a little bit confusing, so try again explaining what you mean by
                  - window
                  - merge
                  - disconnected?
                  (eg why disconnect if you want to merge later)

                  So please try again explaining your workflow, what you want to do.

                  What does emacs provide (just try it):

                  emacsclient --daemon

                  then any terminal:
                  emacsclient -c (new window)
                  emacsclient -c (new second window, but internal state is shared in
                  the daemon running)

                  Thus you have two separate OS windows which "merge" automatically -
                  as long as everything is running as same user on the same machine.

                  This feel like collaborative editing (eg titatnpad etherpad or
                  google document like) - but requires all emacs windows to run on the
                  same computer and as the same user (?)

                  For that reason I suggested looking at collaborative editing plugins
                  if they exist.


                  http://www.vim.org/scripts/script.php?script_id=3075
                  NrrwRgn (A Narrow Region Plugin)
                  description:

                  This is a script emulates Emacs Narrowing feature, by opening a selected
                  range in a new scratch buffer.

                  In the scratch buffer simply save it and the changes will be copied
                  into the original file.
                  This is only a very simple help. You should probably read the help,
                  that is provided with the plugin. See :h NarrowRegion

                  Can "copying back to the original buffer" be called "merging"?
                  Depends on what you're looking for. I agree its useful.


                  Maybe try all of those solutions - to get a better understanding what
                  works and what not - and then come back and ask more specific questions.

                  Marc Weber

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                • vim@...
                  ... From my understanding, Linda would like a second OS-window (and she is already familiar with vim-windows), something that would only be available in a
                  Message 8 of 12 , Feb 3, 2013
                    On Sun, 03 Feb 2013 09:29:59 +0100, Marc Weber wrote:
                    > > it be possible to have those windows be "disconnected" and really
                    > > be separate windows
                    > (first mail)
                    > Please clarify what you mean by "window". In Vim terminology a
                    > window is a rectangular region which can display a buffer. Muliple
                    > windows create a layout. See :h window.
                    >
                    > in OS terminology a window is something with a [x] at the top right,
                    > something you can resize, close, minimize, move to other deskopts
                    > etc. thus something like gvim, firefox, open office, etc.

                    From my understanding, Linda would like a second OS-window (and she
                    is already familiar with vim-windows), something that would only be
                    available in a gvim. Additionally, such multiple-OS-windows can be
                    done via an in-proc (one executable running, multiple OS-windows
                    showing from that one proc) or out-of-proc (multiple executables
                    running; such as using --remote commands).

                    -tim



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