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Re: Help with suppressing display of certain characters.

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  • björn
    ... Judging from how Tony s example renders in TextEdit and in MacVim.app I d say this is a problem with MacVim. Unfortunately, I think this kind of problem
    Message 1 of 18 , Jun 12, 2008
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      2008/6/12 Tony Mechelynck <antoine.mechelynck@...>:
      > On 12/06/08 15:09, itabtabai wrote:
      >> Can't upload, e-mail is rejected!
      >> My first time using rapidshare, I hope the link is the right one:
      >>
      >> http://rapidshare.com/files/121921145/macvim.gif.html
      >>
      >
      > Hmmm....
      > - Is your Vim version compiled with +arabic ?
      > - It could be a problem with your console if you weren't using gvim
      > - I'm attaching a _small_ text file in UTF-8, which contains one line in
      > vocalized Arabic. My gvim (in 'rightleft' mode of course) displays it
      > correctly, with the vowels above or below the proper consonants and the
      > latters properly joined where appropriate. Do you see it correctly in
      > GUI mode? The text is a commonly "polite" form of salutation,
      > "as-salaamu `alaykum wa-rahmatu 'llaahi wa-barakaatuhu", or in English,
      > "Peace upon you and God's benevolence and His blessings"; if your mailer
      > displays the text attachment inline, that ought to give you a point of
      > comparison.

      Judging from how Tony's example renders in TextEdit and in MacVim.app
      I'd say this is a problem with MacVim. Unfortunately, I think this
      kind of problem is going to be tremendously hard to fix with the
      current renderer but it might be possible with the ATSUI based
      renderer. In any case, I don't think I can do much about it in MacVim
      right now. Sorry. :-(

      Jiang (if you are reading this), do you think you can get Tony's file
      to render with ATSUI?

      Björn

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    • itabtabai
      It might be a MacVim problem after all since it renders well on your gvim . I am not sure if there is a +arabic literal configuration option. Do you mean
      Message 2 of 18 , Jun 12, 2008
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        It might be a MacVim problem after all since it renders well on your
        "gvim".
        I am not sure if there is a "+arabic" literal configuration option. Do
        you mean "multibyte" "huge" ./configure options? The "set arabic"
        command works, so I am assuming that I've built with arabic support.

        Note that the images I've sent are using the most decent fonts that
        MacVim would display. I've been through more bad fonts at display,
        e.g. some fonts would eat up the first character on the line. Not to
        mention that when "arabic" is set and display becomes RTL the line
        numbering would get messed up.

        Should I compile MacVim with gvim support, maybe that would solve the
        problem?

        On Jun 12, 4:46 pm, Tony Mechelynck <antoine.mechely...@...>
        wrote:
        > On 12/06/08 15:09, itabtabai wrote:
        >
        > > Can't upload, e-mail is rejected!
        > > My first time using rapidshare, I hope the link is the right one:
        >
        > >http://rapidshare.com/files/121921145/macvim.gif.html
        >
        > Hmmm....
        > - Is your Vim version compiled with +arabic ?
        > - It could be a problem with your console if you weren't using gvim
        > - I'm attaching a _small_ text file in UTF-8, which contains one line in
        > vocalized Arabic. My gvim (in 'rightleft' mode of course) displays it
        > correctly, with the vowels above or below the proper consonants and the
        > latters properly joined where appropriate. Do you see it correctly in
        > GUI mode? The text is a commonly "polite" form of salutation,
        > "as-salaamu `alaykum wa-rahmatu 'llaahi wa-barakaatuhu", or in English,
        > "Peace upon you and God's benevolence and His blessings"; if your mailer
        > displays the text attachment inline, that ought to give you a point of
        > comparison.
        >
        > Best regards,
        > Tony.
        > --
        > The bureaucracy is expanding to meet the needs of an expanding
        > bureaucracy.
        >
        > [salaam-rahma.txt]أَلسَّلام٠ Ø¹ÙŽÙ„َيْك٠مْ وَرَحْمَة٠ Ù±Ù„له٠ ÙˆÙŽÙŽØ¨ÙŽØ±ÙŽÙƒØ§ØªÙ Ù‡Ù
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      • itabtabai
        ... would display +arabic. Sorry I didn t understand your +arabic question. ... --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this
        Message 3 of 18 , Jun 12, 2008
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          Just a follow-up:
          :version
          would display +arabic.
          Sorry I didn't understand your "+arabic" question.

          On Jun 12, 5:15 pm, itabtabai <itabta...@...> wrote:
          > It might be a MacVim problem after all since it renders well on your
          > "gvim".
          > I am not sure if there is a "+arabic" literal configuration option. Do
          > you mean "multibyte" "huge" ./configure options? The "set arabic"
          > command works, so I am assuming that I've built with arabic support.
          >
          > Note that the images I've sent are using the most decent fonts that
          > MacVim would display. I've been through more bad fonts at display,
          > e.g. some fonts would eat up the first character on the line. Not to
          > mention that when "arabic" is set and display becomes RTL the line
          > numbering would get messed up.
          >
          > Should I compile MacVim with gvim support, maybe that would solve the
          > problem?
          >
          > On Jun 12, 4:46 pm, Tony Mechelynck <antoine.mechely...@...>
          > wrote:
          >
          > > On 12/06/08 15:09, itabtabai wrote:
          >
          > > > Can't upload, e-mail is rejected!
          > > > My first time using rapidshare, I hope the link is the right one:
          >
          > > >http://rapidshare.com/files/121921145/macvim.gif.html
          >
          > > Hmmm....
          > > - Is your Vim version compiled with +arabic ?
          > > - It could be a problem with your console if you weren't using gvim
          > > - I'm attaching a _small_ text file in UTF-8, which contains one line in
          > > vocalized Arabic. My gvim (in 'rightleft' mode of course) displays it
          > > correctly, with the vowels above or below the proper consonants and the
          > > latters properly joined where appropriate. Do you see it correctly in
          > > GUI mode? The text is a commonly "polite" form of salutation,
          > > "as-salaamu `alaykum wa-rahmatu 'llaahi wa-barakaatuhu", or in English,
          > > "Peace upon you and God's benevolence and His blessings"; if your mailer
          > > displays the text attachment inline, that ought to give you a point of
          > > comparison.
          >
          > > Best regards,
          > > Tony.
          > > --
          > > The bureaucracy is expanding to meet the needs of an expanding
          > > bureaucracy.
          >
          > > [salaam-rahma.txt]أَلسَّلام٠ Ø¹ÙŽÙ„َيْك٠مْ وَرَحْمَة٠ Ù±Ù„له٠ ÙˆÙŽÙŽØ¨ÙŽØ±ÙŽÙƒØ§ØªÙ Ù‡Ù
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        • Tony Mechelynck
          ... To see if it is compiled with +arabic enabled, look at the output of :version . On the first line after Features enabled [+] or not [-]: , the first item
          Message 4 of 18 , Jun 12, 2008
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            On 12/06/08 16:15, itabtabai wrote:
            > It might be a MacVim problem after all since it renders well on your
            > "gvim".
            > I am not sure if there is a "+arabic" literal configuration option. Do
            > you mean "multibyte" "huge" ./configure options? The "set arabic"
            > command works, so I am assuming that I've built with arabic support.

            To see if it is compiled with +arabic enabled, look at the output of
            ":version". On the first line after "Features enabled [+] or not [-]:",
            the first item is usually either "+arabic" (feature enabled) or
            "-arabic" (feature disabled). If it is disabled, your version of Vim
            probably knows nothing about how to shape Arabic letters within words or
            about how to place harakat (i.e., short vowels with or without tanueen,
            as well as shadda and sukuun) on top of consonants (or under them as the
            case may be).

            >
            > Note that the images I've sent are using the most decent fonts that
            > MacVim would display. I've been through more bad fonts at display,
            > e.g. some fonts would eat up the first character on the line. Not to
            > mention that when "arabic" is set and display becomes RTL the line
            > numbering would get messed up.

            If setting 'arabic' makes the display RTL, your version is probably
            compiled with Arabic script support.

            >
            > Should I compile MacVim with gvim support, maybe that would solve the
            > problem?

            Compiling Vim with GUI support (be it the X11 GUI or the native-Mac GUI)
            would at least eliminate any problems due to running Vim inside
            Terminal.app. Or are you already running in GUI mode but with some
            dark-background colorscheme?


            Best regards,
            Tony.
            --
            BEDEVERE: And that, my lord, is how we know the Earth to be banana-shaped.
            "Monty Python and the Holy Grail" PYTHON (MONTY)
            PICTURES LTD

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          • itabtabai
            Running MacVim.app with dark background color scheme. Running vim inside Terminal.app for arabic support is worthless. Apple doesn t even properly support
            Message 5 of 18 , Jun 12, 2008
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              Running MacVim.app with dark background color scheme.

              Running vim inside Terminal.app for arabic support is worthless. Apple
              doesn't even properly support arabic in it's applications to say the
              least.

              On Jun 12, 5:47 pm, Tony Mechelynck <antoine.mechely...@...>
              wrote:
              > On 12/06/08 16:15, itabtabai wrote:
              >
              > > It might be a MacVim problem after all since it renders well on your
              > > "gvim".
              > > I am not sure if there is a "+arabic" literal configuration option. Do
              > > you mean "multibyte" "huge" ./configure options? The "set arabic"
              > > command works, so I am assuming that I've built with arabic support.
              >
              > To see if it is compiled with +arabic enabled, look at the output of
              > ":version". On the first line after "Features enabled [+] or not [-]:",
              > the first item is usually either "+arabic" (feature enabled) or
              > "-arabic" (feature disabled). If it is disabled, your version of Vim
              > probably knows nothing about how to shape Arabic letters within words or
              > about how to place harakat (i.e., short vowels with or without tanueen,
              > as well as shadda and sukuun) on top of consonants (or under them as the
              > case may be).
              >
              >
              >
              > > Note that the images I've sent are using the most decent fonts that
              > > MacVim would display. I've been through more bad fonts at display,
              > > e.g. some fonts would eat up the first character on the line. Not to
              > > mention that when "arabic" is set and display becomes RTL the line
              > > numbering would get messed up.
              >
              > If setting 'arabic' makes the display RTL, your version is probably
              > compiled with Arabic script support.
              >
              >
              >
              > > Should I compile MacVim with gvim support, maybe that would solve the
              > > problem?
              >
              > Compiling Vim with GUI support (be it the X11 GUI or the native-Mac GUI)
              > would at least eliminate any problems due to running Vim inside
              > Terminal.app. Or are you already running in GUI mode but with some
              > dark-background colorscheme?
              >
              > Best regards,
              > Tony.
              > --
              > BEDEVERE: And that, my lord, is how we know the Earth to be banana-shaped.
              >                   "Monty Python and the Holy Grail" PYTHON (MONTY)
              > PICTURES LTD
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            • itabtabai
              Just wanted to thank everyone. I got gvim, using fink, and bitstream sans mono ... the display is so crisp it makes me cry! ...
              Message 6 of 18 , Jun 12, 2008
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                Just wanted to thank everyone.

                I got gvim, using fink, and bitstream sans mono ... the display is so
                crisp it makes me cry!

                On Jun 12, 6:01 pm, itabtabai <itabta...@...> wrote:
                > Running MacVim.app with dark background color scheme.
                >
                > Running vim inside Terminal.app for arabic support is worthless. Apple
                > doesn't even properly support arabic in it's applications to say the
                > least.
                >
                > On Jun 12, 5:47 pm, Tony Mechelynck <antoine.mechely...@...>
                > wrote:
                >
                > > On 12/06/08 16:15, itabtabai wrote:
                >
                > > > It might be a MacVim problem after all since it renders well on your
                > > > "gvim".
                > > > I am not sure if there is a "+arabic" literal configuration option. Do
                > > > you mean "multibyte" "huge" ./configure options? The "set arabic"
                > > > command works, so I am assuming that I've built with arabic support.
                >
                > > To see if it is compiled with +arabic enabled, look at the output of
                > > ":version". On the first line after "Features enabled [+] or not [-]:",
                > > the first item is usually either "+arabic" (feature enabled) or
                > > "-arabic" (feature disabled). If it is disabled, your version of Vim
                > > probably knows nothing about how to shape Arabic letters within words or
                > > about how to place harakat (i.e., short vowels with or without tanueen,
                > > as well as shadda and sukuun) on top of consonants (or under them as the
                > > case may be).
                >
                > > > Note that the images I've sent are using the most decent fonts that
                > > > MacVim would display. I've been through more bad fonts at display,
                > > > e.g. some fonts would eat up the first character on the line. Not to
                > > > mention that when "arabic" is set and display becomes RTL the line
                > > > numbering would get messed up.
                >
                > > If setting 'arabic' makes the display RTL, your version is probably
                > > compiled with Arabic script support.
                >
                > > > Should I compile MacVim with gvim support, maybe that would solve the
                > > > problem?
                >
                > > Compiling Vim with GUI support (be it the X11 GUI or the native-Mac GUI)
                > > would at least eliminate any problems due to running Vim inside
                > > Terminal.app. Or are you already running in GUI mode but with some
                > > dark-background colorscheme?
                >
                > > Best regards,
                > > Tony.
                > > --
                > > BEDEVERE: And that, my lord, is how we know the Earth to be banana-shaped.
                > >                   "Monty Python and the Holy Grail" PYTHON (MONTY)
                > > PICTURES LTD
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              • Kenneth Reid Beesley
                You might just post a short sequence of Unicode code-point values, e.g. (beginning) 0x0643 (kaaf) 0x064F (Damma) 0x062A (taa ) 0x0650 (kasra)
                Message 7 of 18 , Jun 12, 2008
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                  You might just post a short sequence of Unicode code-point values, e.g.

                  (beginning)

                  0x0643 (kaaf)
                  0x064F (Damma)
                  0x062A (taa')
                  0x0650 (kasra)
                  0x0628 (baa')
                  0x064E (fatHa)
                  0x062A (taa')
                  0x0652 (sukuun)

                  (end)

                  and explain what is not being rendered correctly. (Here the kaaf-taa'-
                  baa'-taa' should
                  be displayed properly connected, right-to-left; the Damma should
                  appear above the (initial-form) kaaf, the kasra should appear below
                  the (medial-form) taa', the fatHa should appear above the (medial-
                  form) baa', and the sukuun should appear above the (final-form) taa'.

                  Please specify which font you are using.

                  Best,

                  Ken


                  On 12 Jun 2008, at 07:09, itabtabai wrote:

                  >
                  > Can't upload, e-mail is rejected!
                  > My first time using rapidshare, I hope the link is the right one:
                  >
                  > http://rapidshare.com/files/121921145/macvim.gif.html
                  >
                  > On Jun 12, 3:38 pm, Nico Weber <nicolaswe...@...> wrote:
                  >> Hi,
                  >>
                  >>> Sorry guys, but it is my first time here, I've got two comparative
                  >>> screenshots and a sample text file. How do I post them?
                  >>
                  >> you could use the "upload file" button athttp://groups.google.com/group/vim_mac
                  >> , post them to rapidshare, or append them to a mail if the files
                  >> are
                  >> not too big.
                  >>
                  >> Nico
                  > >


                  ******************************
                  Kenneth R. Beesley, D.Phil.
                  P.O. Box 540475
                  North Salt Lake, UT
                  84054 USA






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                • Tony Mechelynck
                  ... Well, so much the better for you. FWIW, in Bitstream Vera Sans Mono I see the harakat (Arabic short vowels etc.) one cell left of where they should be, but
                  Message 8 of 18 , Jun 12, 2008
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                    On 12/06/08 23:13, itabtabai wrote:
                    > Just wanted to thank everyone.
                    >
                    > I got gvim, using fink, and bitstream sans mono ... the display is so
                    > crisp it makes me cry!

                    Well, so much the better for you.

                    FWIW, in Bitstream Vera Sans Mono I see the harakat (Arabic short vowels
                    etc.) one cell left of where they should be, but in Courier New I see
                    them just where they belong -- using the same text file and the same
                    gvim binary.

                    Best regards,
                    Tony.
                    --
                    Philogyny recapitulates erogeny; erogeny recapitulates philogyny.

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                  • Jjgod Jiang
                    Hi,On Thu, Jun 12, 2008 at 6:56 AM, björn wrote: Judging from how Tony s example renders in TextEdit and in MacVim.app I d
                    Message 9 of 18 , Jun 12, 2008
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                      Hi,

                      On Thu, Jun 12, 2008 at 6:56 AM, björn <bjorn.winckler@...> wrote:
                      > Judging from how Tony's example renders in TextEdit and in MacVim.app
                      > I'd say this is a problem with MacVim. Unfortunately, I think this
                      > kind of problem is going to be tremendously hard to fix with the
                      > current renderer but it might be possible with the ATSUI based
                      > renderer. In any case, I don't think I can do much about it in MacVim
                      > right now. Sorry. :-(
                      >
                      > Jiang (if you are reading this), do you think you can get Tony's file
                      > to render with ATSUI?

                      Sorry for the delayed reply. I don't think it will work properly like
                      TextEdit did.
                      At least not for now, but I'll try to investigate this (Just as I told
                      Ben in my last
                      mail on vim_mac list).

                      - Jiang

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                    • itabtabai
                      Hi Ken, I ve uploaded screenshots of the display with different fonts on both MacVim and gvim. http://rapidshare.com/files/122137390/Archive.tbz.html All fonts
                      Message 10 of 18 , Jun 13, 2008
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                        Hi Ken,

                        I've uploaded screenshots of the display with different fonts on both
                        MacVim and gvim.

                        http://rapidshare.com/files/122137390/Archive.tbz.html

                        All fonts are displayed at size 20. My comments on the screenshots:
                        gvim-bitsreamB.png: Crisp, nice, spread, and easy on the eyes.
                        macvim-dejavuB.png: The more diacritics (harakaat) I put the more the
                        line number is pushed off screen and the letters start having gaps.
                        macvim-dejavuB2.png: Only just starting to type.
                        macvim-dejavuB3.png: Only one letter and it's ""haraka" and the line
                        number is already pushed.

                        Tony,
                        The rest for you:
                        gvim-courierNR.png: Not bad. But you note the gaps due to "harakaat".
                        gvim-courierNB.png: Nice, crisp, but not as easy on the eyes as
                        bitstream/dejavu. Bitstream/dejavu spreading/cursivness is very neat.
                        gvim-courier10B.png: Gaps are very clear.

                        So, my conclusion from all the above is that the defect of display is
                        not only MacVim specific. It also relates to the fonts used in a less
                        intrusive manner. While some fonts do produce gaps as worst case
                        scenario on gvim, almost all fonts don't work properly with diacritics/
                        harakaat on MacVim. Also the fact that none monospaced fonts don't
                        display properly in MacVim nor gvim.

                        On Jun 13, 12:24 am, Kenneth Reid Beesley <krbees...@...> wrote:
                        > You might just post a short sequence of Unicode code-point values, e.g.
                        >
                        > (beginning)
                        >
                        > 0x0643     (kaaf)
                        > 0x064F     (Damma)
                        > 0x062A     (taa')
                        > 0x0650     (kasra)
                        > 0x0628     (baa')
                        > 0x064E    (fatHa)
                        > 0x062A    (taa')
                        > 0x0652    (sukuun)
                        >
                        > (end)
                        >
                        > and explain what is not being rendered correctly.  (Here the kaaf-taa'-
                        > baa'-taa' should
                        > be displayed properly connected, right-to-left; the Damma should  
                        > appear above the (initial-form) kaaf, the kasra should appear below  
                        > the (medial-form) taa', the fatHa should appear above the (medial-
                        > form) baa', and the sukuun should appear above the (final-form) taa'.
                        >
                        > Please specify which font you are using.
                        >
                        > Best,
                        >
                        > Ken
                        >
                        > On 12 Jun 2008, at 07:09, itabtabai wrote:
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        > > Can't upload, e-mail is rejected!
                        > > My first time using rapidshare, I hope the link is the right one:
                        >
                        > >http://rapidshare.com/files/121921145/macvim.gif.html
                        >
                        > > On Jun 12, 3:38 pm, Nico Weber <nicolaswe...@...> wrote:
                        > >> Hi,
                        >
                        > >>> Sorry guys, but it is my first time here, I've got two comparative
                        > >>> screenshots and a sample text file. How do I post them?
                        >
                        > >> you could use the "upload file" button athttp://groups.google.com/group/vim_mac
                        > >>   , post them to rapidshare, or append them to a mail if the files  
                        > >> are
                        > >> not too big.
                        >
                        > >> Nico
                        >
                        > ******************************
                        > Kenneth R. Beesley, D.Phil.
                        > P.O. Box 540475
                        > North Salt Lake, UT
                        > 84054  USA
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