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RE: Fwd: VIM 7.1 compilation error

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  • Ben Peterson
    Hi, Wouldn t hangul be a very big keymap? If the keymap was for individual jamo it would be manageable but I m not sure how vim would then combine the jamo.
    Message 1 of 3 , Aug 3, 2007
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      Hi,

      Wouldn't hangul be a very big keymap? If the keymap was for individual jamo it would be manageable but I'm not sure how vim would then combine the jamo. If it is for all hangul characters it will be very large -- unless I am missing something.

      On the other hand, it should also be relatively easy to generate the keymap automatically...

      Benjamin

      -----Original Message-----
      From: vim_multibyte@... [mailto:vim_multibyte@...] On Behalf Of Edward L. Fox
      Sent: 03 August 2007 16:23
      To: vim_dev@...
      Cc: Bram Moolenaar; vim-dev; vim-multibyte@...; um.kiwon@...
      Subject: Re: Fwd: VIM 7.1 compilation error


      Hi Shawn Kim,

      On 8/3/07, Shawn Kim <orchistro@...> wrote:
      > [...]
      > In those system, I don't seem to have many choices.
      > I MUST compile vim enabling hangulinput feature and then use it to
      > type in Hangul.
      > It would never be enough to stress the necessity and the importance of
      > that feature for Koreans.
      > I would be devastated if that feature is to removed :'O

      OK, I see. But I'm still wondered that could this feature be
      implemented as a keymap? Like this:

      1. :set keymap=kana

      2. Type "ohayougozaimasu" will produce:

      おはようございます。

      If we could implement the Hangul input as a keymap, we can simply drop
      the Hangul automata without any difficulty then.

      >
      > Regards,
      > Shawn.
      >
      > P.S. Personally, using XIM with vim is kind of confusing.
      > If you were typing Hangul in input mode, and then you escape from that
      > mode by pressing upon ESC,
      > XIM is still in Hangul input mode. So, any of your comands won't work
      > until you switch to English input mode by
      > pressing Shift+Space. It is very unconvinient and confusing.
      > As it seems that I can seem to control XIM out of it, like sending
      > signal or something, for me,
      > it is just more appreciated using hangulinput feature. :-)

      Just type ":help imactivatekey" and read this part of the manual,
      maybe it's useful for you. :-)

      >
      > [...]


      In peace,

      Edward L. Fox

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    • Ben Peterson
      Hi, True, one would have to make two separate attempts, one for old-style and one for new-style Romanization. There are other problems too, now that I think
      Message 2 of 3 , Aug 3, 2007
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        Hi,

        True, one would have to make two separate attempts, one for old-style
        and one for new-style Romanization.

        There are other problems too, now that I think about it:

        1) Some Korean syllables have different final consonants when written
        but not when spoken. It is difficult to express this in romanization.
        2) Hundreds of mappings would start the same way as each other (e.g.
        Se, Set, Seok, Seo, Seot, Seok etc) which might make entering them via
        the mapping system a bit odd (would it pick 'Se' if you hesitated part
        of the way through typing 'Seoul'?)

        3) As you know, neither romanization system is unambiguous because it
        is sometimes impossible to tell where a syllable ends. Normally you
        wouldn't want to type 'Se-o-ul', but if you did, how would the keymap
        tell it apart from 'Seo-ul'? I think you'd need to actually type the
        hyphens or something.

        Hm, this actually sounds very very hard :(

        Still I might generating a keymap (from the composed hangul character
        area of the Unicode charts) over the weekend and see what happens.

        Benjamin


        -----Original Message-----
        From: vim_multibyte@...
        [mailto:vim_multibyte@...] On Behalf Of Shawn Kim
        Sent: 03 August 2007 17:37
        To: vim_multibyte@...
        Cc: vim_dev@...; Bram Moolenaar; vim-dev;
        vim-multibyte@...; um.kiwon@...
        Subject: Re: Fwd: VIM 7.1 compilation error


        Ben Peterson wrote:
        > Hi,
        >
        > Wouldn't hangul be a very big keymap? If the keymap was for
        individual jamo it would be manageable but I'm not sure how vim would
        then combine the jamo. If it is for all hangul characters it will be
        very large -- unless I am missing something.
        >
        > On the other hand, it should also be relatively easy to generate the
        keymap automatically...
        >
        > Benjamin
        >
        >
        Replying to all,

        Hi, Benjamin,

        Yes, It is a huge set of letters.
        There are more than 10,000 letters that can possibly be made up, even
        excluding obsoleted ones.

        And there is a criticism I found about that method :

        http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Revised_Romanization_of_Korean#Criticism

        Thanks for your comment

        Shawn.




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      • Bram Moolenaar
        ... I hesitate removing the Hangul support without knowing for sure that it is not needed. Browsing through the messages I do see remarks that it might still
        Message 3 of 3 , Aug 3, 2007
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          Edward L. Fox wrote:

          > Sorry for sending mail in HTML format, as the following content has some
          > images to display.
          >
          > Do you think we should deprecate the build-in Hangul supporting since the
          > next version of VIM? So far as I know, the Hangul supporting conflicted with
          > XIM module, which is more useful for Asian users. That's why the official
          > Vim pre-built binary never enable this option. Some Korean users also
          > noticed that the latest sources couldn't be built with this option enabled.
          > I think all the users will use input method later, so I'd like to disable
          > the "Hangul automata" from now on.
          >
          > And if possible, we could also supply a Hangul input method by using the
          > keymap mechanism, just like the kana (Japanese letters) keymap ported by me.
          > I know nothing about Korean so I hope any Korean friend could help me with
          > this issue.

          I hesitate removing the Hangul support without knowing for sure that it
          is not needed. Browsing through the messages I do see remarks that it
          might still be useful to a few people.

          Perhaps the Hangul support can be changed to also work for UTF-8?

          The compilation error is easy to fix: Don't define FEAT_XFONTSET when
          using GTK2.

          --
          From "know your smileys":
          :-) Funny
          |-) Funny Oriental
          (-: Funny Australian

          /// Bram Moolenaar -- Bram@... -- http://www.Moolenaar.net \\\
          /// sponsor Vim, vote for features -- http://www.Vim.org/sponsor/ \\\
          \\\ download, build and distribute -- http://www.A-A-P.org ///
          \\\ help me help AIDS victims -- http://ICCF-Holland.org ///

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