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Re: MacVim as (a kind of) Framework

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  • Tae
    ... Well, probably no on 10.7... I think that I ve set the deployment target to 10.8 (or to default which would be 10.8 on my machine). When I get back from
    Message 1 of 9 , Jun 4 11:56 PM
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      > Binary below crashes on launch on Mac OS X 10.7.5. Was it expected to
      > work?
      Well, probably no on 10.7... I think that I've set the deployment target to 10.8 (or to default which would be 10.8 on my machine). When I get back from work, I'll check. As for 10.8, I checked that the binary at least launches and works (at least the few minutes I tried =) on two machines: the build machine and one another 10.8 machine.

      Best,
      Tae

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    • Tae
      Hi. The crash may have been caused because of the deployment target being 10.8 (well, I m not sure, maybe I just broke something...). Try to build it on your
      Message 2 of 9 , Jun 5 2:18 PM
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        Hi.

        The crash may have been caused because of the deployment target being 10.8 (well, I'm not sure, maybe I just broke something...). Try to build it on your machine: first do the CC=clang-configure-make-thing and then build the target in App- or Xcode.

        Tae

        Dave Land wrote:
        > Hello,
        >
        > Binary below crashes on launch on Mac OS X 10.7.5. Was it expected to work?
        >
        > I can send you the crash info that pops up if it is of use to you.
        >
        > Dave
        >
        > On Jun 4, 2013, at 12:29 PM, Tae Won Ha wrote:
        >
        >> Hi.
        >>
        >> About a month ago, I started to factor out a framework part from MacVim:
        >>
        >> https://github.com/qvacua/macvim
        >>
        >> I now can build a MacVim app which consists of two parts: a Vim framework (with vim+runtime and supporting classes like MMVimView) and an app which uses that framework. There are two new targets:
        >>
        >> - MacVimFramework: This is the framework.
        >> - MacVimWithFramework: This is a copy of the MacVim target which uses the above framework.
        >>
        >> The binary can be found here:
        >>
        >> https://www.dropbox.com/s/hpczl4fo2zxg4zh/MacVimWithFramework.app.zip
        >>
        >> It's compiled on 10.8 and I hope that it works on other machines, too. (It works on my machine, ;-)
        >>
        >> There are yet many rough edges though, for example:
        >>
        >> - You cannot call the framework a real framework yet: it's just a collection of classes that can be compiled in a separate framework target.
        >> - Sometimes I just blindly refactored, not really having carefully read the whole code or having thought about whether it's a sensible separation of code. Well, just get it done first and then refactor again, I'd say...
        >> - The framework uses PSMTabBarControl, ie it expects the client-app to include it.
        >> - Things can be in a broken state, eg all new windows have a fixed hard-coded size...
        >>
        >> However, I think/hope that it can serve as a base for a real MacVim-framework. I'll try to consolidate the code base further and start to think about how to make it a real and easy to use framework.
        >>
        >> Best,
        >> Tae
        >>
        >> PS. I'm sorry that I ignored the usual formatting of the code.
        >> PPS. I started to migrate the code to ARC; well, at least for two small files.
        >>
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        >
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      • björn
        ... I don t have much to say other than have fun hacking away on this. Unfortunately, getting things to compile as a framework is the easy part -- how to deal
        Message 3 of 9 , Jun 9 7:43 AM
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          On Tue, Jun 4, 2013 at 9:29 PM, Tae Won Ha wrote:
          > Hi.
          >
          > About a month ago, I started to factor out a framework part from MacVim:
          >
          > https://github.com/qvacua/macvim
          >
          > I now can build a MacVim app which consists of two parts: a Vim framework
          > (with vim+runtime and supporting classes like MMVimView) and an app which
          > uses that framework. There are two new targets:
          >
          > - MacVimFramework: This is the framework.
          > - MacVimWithFramework: This is a copy of the MacVim target which uses the
          > above framework.
          >
          > The binary can be found here:
          >
          > https://www.dropbox.com/s/hpczl4fo2zxg4zh/MacVimWithFramework.app.zip
          >
          > It's compiled on 10.8 and I hope that it works on other machines, too. (It
          > works on my machine, ;-)
          >
          > There are yet many rough edges though, for example:
          >
          > - You cannot call the framework a real framework yet: it's just a collection
          > of classes that can be compiled in a separate framework target.
          > - Sometimes I just blindly refactored, not really having carefully read the
          > whole code or having thought about whether it's a sensible separation of
          > code. Well, just get it done first and then refactor again, I'd say...
          > - The framework uses PSMTabBarControl, ie it expects the client-app to
          > include it.
          > - Things can be in a broken state, eg all new windows have a fixed
          > hard-coded size...
          >
          > However, I think/hope that it can serve as a base for a real
          > MacVim-framework. I'll try to consolidate the code base further and start to
          > think about how to make it a real and easy to use framework.
          >
          > Best,
          > Tae
          >
          > PS. I'm sorry that I ignored the usual formatting of the code.
          > PPS. I started to migrate the code to ARC; well, at least for two small
          > files.

          I don't have much to say other than have fun hacking away on this.
          Unfortunately, getting things to compile as a framework is the easy
          part -- how to deal with the fact that Vim is an application and not
          just a view will require more thought (I have no good solution, and
          I've spent some time thinking on this).

          Björn

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        • Tae
          ... I agree. However, it s the first part. :) ... Yes, that s true. I think that one cannot get the perfect solution—if it exists at all—at the first time.
          Message 4 of 9 , Jun 10 12:48 AM
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            > Unfortunately, getting things to compile as a framework is the easy
            > part

            I agree. However, it's the first part. :)

            > how to deal with the fact that Vim is an application and not just a
            > view will require more thought (I have no good solution, and I've
            > spent some time thinking on this).

            Yes, that's true. I think that one cannot get the perfect solution—if it exists at all—at the first time. I like more the iterative approach: first get a working version—even it is crappy—collect feedback and gradually improve it. When the direction should be completely wrong, well, start over; now you know how not to do it and why. :)

            BTW: Is there a easy way to forbid certain commands, eg :e or :tabe, being sent to the Vim-backend? As far as I can see, not the complete command :e is sent to the backend, but each character separately. Well, I could discard the result coming back from the backend (and undo the command), but this would be very ugly...

            Best,
            Tae

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          • Yuma Antoine Decaux
            But as a blind programmer, i d like to know whether something can be done to the macvim framework to render it accessible. Was it done in objective c? or what
            Message 5 of 9 , Jun 10 12:52 AM
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              But as a blind programmer, i'd like to know whether something can be done to the macvim framework to render it accessible. Was it done in objective c? or what programming language? I've downloaded it and the window appears just as such, with nothing inside. If it's programmed with the coco framework, there's just a few triggers to add to make it accessible to voice over screen reader users.

              If anyone hears my request, please do contact me as i am very interested to fund this project, at least for accessibility.

              Best regards,

              Yuma


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            • björn
              ... I have looked in to accessibility support, but it is severely complicated by the fact that MacVim is a multiprocess application. I know that the guys
              Message 6 of 9 , Jun 11 11:59 AM
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                On Mon, Jun 10, 2013 at 9:52 AM, Yuma Antoine Decaux wrote:
                > But as a blind programmer, i'd like to know whether something can be done to the macvim framework to render it accessible. Was it done in objective c? or what programming language? I've downloaded it and the window appears just as such, with nothing inside. If it's programmed with the coco framework, there's just a few triggers to add to make it accessible to voice over screen reader users.
                >
                > If anyone hears my request, please do contact me as i am very interested to fund this project, at least for accessibility.

                I have looked in to accessibility support, but it is severely
                complicated by the fact that MacVim is a multiprocess application. I
                know that the guys working on WebKit managed to do something similar
                so that is a place to start looking for anybody interested.

                The best MacVim can offer now is that you go into Preferences and
                disable the Core Text renderer. Then you'll at least get some
                rudimentary voice over support.

                Björn

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              • Eric Weir
                ... A little off-topic, but I really like this. Not a software developer, but it strikes me as the best way in life, in work, in organizations, in politics,
                Message 7 of 9 , Jun 14 7:54 AM
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                  On Jun 10, 2013, at 3:48 AM, Tae wrote:

                  > I think that one cannot get the perfect solution—if it exists at all—at the first time. I like more the iterative approach: first get a working version—even it is crappy—collect feedback and gradually improve it. When the direction should be completely wrong, well, start over; now you know how not to do it and why. :)

                  A little off-topic, but I really like this. Not a software developer, but it strikes me as the best way in life, in work, in organizations, in politics, etc., etc. Did anyone ever get it right the first time in anything? Failure is always an opportunity to learn---if we choose to take it.

                  Thanks,
                  ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
                  Eric Weir
                  Decatur, GA
                  eeweir@...

                  “A thing is right when it tends to preserve the integrity, stability
                  and beauty of the biotic community. It is wrong when it tends otherwise.”

                  - Aldo Leopold







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