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General Menaion

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  • Russell Kimball
    Why are the troparia from the Matins canon for the Feast of the Exaltation preferred over the use of the troparia from the canon for a Hierarch from the
    Message 1 of 12 , Oct 1, 2000
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      Why are the troparia from the Matins canon for the Feast of the Exaltation preferred over the use of the troparia from the canon for a Hierarch from the General Menaion for the last four troparia during the beatitudes from  the service for St Eumneius?
       
      Joseph  
    • MM Ossorgin
      on 10/1/00 7:04 PM, Russell Kimball at rkimbal1@maine.rr.com wrote: Why are the troparia from the Matins canon for the Feast of the Exaltation preferred over
      Message 2 of 12 , Oct 1, 2000
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        Re: [ustav] General Menaion on 10/1/00 7:04 PM, Russell Kimball at rkimbal1@... wrote:

        Why are the troparia from the Matins canon for the Feast of the Exaltation preferred over the use of the troparia from the canon for a Hierarch from the General Menaion for the last four troparia during the beatitudes from  the service for St Eumneius?

        Joseph  

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        Dear Joseph,

        I would not term it a preference but rather a function of what is instructed by the service in the menaion itself.  I thought it might be the relative importance of the feast versus the particular saint, so I checked the adjacent services.  In this case, the service doesn't specify any troparia for the saint but rather:
        "On the Beatitudes, 6 troparia: from Odes V and VI of the canon of the feast."
        (The typikon would then have you take 6 from the resurrection and 4 from the afterfeast for a total of 10.)   

        The same scenario happens for St. Sophia (9.16) but for St. Euphemia (9.16) the service includes troparia for the saint:
        "8 troparia: 4 from Ode III of the canon of the feast, and 4 from Ode VI of the canon of the martyr."
        (The typikon would then have you take 4 from the resurrection, 4 from the afterfeast and 4 from the martyr for a total of 12.)

        This is a hopefully a start in answering your question.

        In Christ, Michael       
      • kclaib
        Christ is in our midst ! Does anyone know the availability of a good bound General Menaion for home use ? I ve looked in all my favorite catalogs and don t see
        Message 3 of 12 , Jul 15, 2002
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          Christ is in our midst !
          Does anyone know the availability of a good bound General Menaion for
          home use ? I've looked in all my favorite catalogs and don't see one.
          I know of at least one on the web I could print, but I'd rather have
          a nice book if possible.

          Many thanks,
          Reader Kevin
        • stephen_r1937
          Dear Reader Kevin The translation by Orloff of a century ago was reprinted by N. P. Brill, 1421 East Grove Street, Bloomington, IL 61701, in 1984. This is
          Message 4 of 12 , Jul 15, 2002
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            Dear Reader Kevin

            The translation by Orloff of a century ago was reprinted by N. P.
            Brill, 1421 East Grove Street, Bloomington, IL 61701, in 1984. This
            is very complete, but one has to revise a bit here and there because
            of Orloff's sometimes bizarre style. The binding is a sort of "Class
            A library bnding", in other words a real source of rectal discomfort
            if you actually want to use the book. A more recent edition is _The
            General Menaion of the Orthodox Church_ published by Christ the
            Savior Brotherhood; I don't know the date because my copy lacks the
            title page. This is not as complete as Orloff, and omits all mention
            of special melodies, which are abundant in the General Menaion--one
            aspect of the impoverished octoechos of the Russian Church for the
            past two centuries is this tendency to leave out rubrics about
            special melodies. This is in a comb binding with paper covers. A
            good bound edition? I hope someone out there knows of one and will
            tell us about it.

            Stephen Reynolds
            -

            -- In ustav@y..., "kclaib" <kevin.claiborne@i...> wrote:
            > Christ is in our midst !
            > Does anyone know the availability of a good bound General Menaion
            for
            > home use ? I've looked in all my favorite catalogs and don't see
            one.
            > I know of at least one on the web I could print, but I'd rather
            have
            > a nice book if possible.
            >
            > Many thanks,
            > Reader Kevin
          • Ploverleigh@aol.com
            In a message dated 7/15/02 5:41:33 PM, stephen.r@lycos.com writes:
            Message 5 of 12 , Jul 16, 2002
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              In a message dated 7/15/02 5:41:33 PM, stephen.r@... writes:

              << Dear Reader Kevin

              The translation by Orloff of a century ago was reprinted by N. P.
              Brill, 1421 East Grove Street, Bloomington, IL 61701, in 1984. This
              is very complete, but one has to revise a bit here and there because
              of Orloff's sometimes bizarre style. >>

              Oddly enough, there is a place on the web where you can d/l all Orloff's
              General Menaion.

              http://www.ccel.org/a/anonymous/menaion/htm/TOC.htm

              You can get it as text files or graphic scans.

              I understand that the Brotherhood of St. Seraphim in Walsingham issued a
              comb-bound edition of it, giving the special melodies. How far they revised
              Orloff's text I know not.

              Also, FWIW, Fr. Efrem of Manchester, England, has a website of very good
              translations into contemporary English. His site includes translations of the
              Services Greeks call "Anonymoi." This corresponds to the Slavonic General
              Menaion, but is not the same as it, as comparison will show.

              http://www.anastasis.org.uk/

              His comment about the Greek Anonymoi might well be given here:

              >>Many Orthodox Christians who want to make the daily offices of the Church
              part of their prayer cannot afford, or do not have easy access to, the
              complete set of service books of the Church. This even applies to a number of
              small parishes and communities. In both the Greek and Slav traditions
              therefore compendia have been published to meet this need. The Slavonic
              General Menaion, which contains full offices for all possibilities, even for
              feasts of the Lord and Mother of God, and provision for full festal
              celebration with Doxastika, Polyeleos and so forth, has been translated a
              number of times into English. The equivalent Greek volume, called the
              Anthologion, or Anthology, has not. Indeed it is not easy to obtain in Greek,
              since nowadays most churches possess complete sets of service books, and a
              number of Greek publishing houses have issued popular editions of all the
              books fairly cheaply, though many of these are riddled with misprints. In En
              glish there does not as yet exist a complete set of service books in any
              form. The following translation may therefore fill a need.

              The Greek Anthologion is not quite the same as the Slavonic General Menaion,,
              and its contents may be briefly described. The first part gives the full
              office for the major feasts, including those of Saints who are, to use the
              technical term, ‘feasted’. The second part gives a ‘General Menaion’ for
              ‘anonymous Saints who are not feasted’, what Western books would call the
              ‘Common of Saints’. Each office therefore consists of the minimum
              requirement of three Stichera for Vespers and a Canon, with the Kathisma
              after the third Ode, for Matins. Some editions also give a Doxastikon at
              Vespers, ‘if you want’ [to celebrate the Saint with greater solemnity]. This
              provides enough material for ordinary Sundays and weekdays.

              In the Anthologion this ‘Common of Saints’ is preceded by a series of three
              Stichera in each of the eight Tones to the Mother of God, it being assumed
              that at Vespers three Stichera to the Mother of God will be sung and three to
              the Saint of the day. The third part consists of an abbreviated Oktoichos for
              weekdays. This consists of Aposticha for Vespers, and Kathismata and two
              Canons for Matins together with Aposticha for Lauds. One Tone is used each
              day, Tones Three and Seven being omitted, probably because they are
              considered the most ‘secular’ of the eight.
              >>

              Here are the services Fr. Efrem gives. If I'm lucky, they might act as links.

              Office for a Prophet
              Office for an Apostle
              Office for Two or More Apostles
              Office for a Bishop
              Office for a Hieromartyr
              Office for a Martyr
              Office for Two or More Martyrs
              Office for an Ascetic
              Office for a Woman Martyr
              Office for Two or More Women martyrs
              Office for a Woman Ascetic
            • BAUMGARTH@FORDHAM.EDU
              Christ is in our midst! I recall that an Orthodox Monastery in the United Kingdom (I believe it is dedicated to the Theotokos) had a full Slavic General
              Message 6 of 12 , Jul 17, 2002
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                Christ is in our midst!
                I recall that an Orthodox Monastery in the United Kingdom (I believe it
                is dedicated to the Theotokos) had a full Slavic General Menaion. It was
                rendered in traditional liturgical English and a posting some time ago on
                ustav indicated that the book was back in print. Anybody know the specific
                reference?
                Dn. Patrick
              • BAUMGARTH@FORDHAM.EDU
                Christ is in our midst! I went into the ustav archives and there is information about this tranlation of the General Menaion on message 1063 (March 18, 1999).
                Message 7 of 12 , Jul 17, 2002
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                  Christ is in our midst!
                  I went into the ustav archives and there is information about this
                  tranlation of the General Menaion on message 1063 (March 18, 1999).
                  Dn. Patrick



                  BAUMGARTH@FORDHA
                  M.EDU To: ustav@yahoogroups.com
                  cc:
                  07/17/02 10:20 Subject: Re: [ustav] Re: General Menaion
                  AM
                  Please respond
                  to ustav







                  Christ is in our midst!
                  I recall that an Orthodox Monastery in the United Kingdom (I believe it
                  is dedicated to the Theotokos) had a full Slavic General Menaion. It was
                  rendered in traditional liturgical English and a posting some time ago on
                  ustav indicated that the book was back in print. Anybody know the specific
                  reference?
                  Dn. Patrick




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                • stephen_r1937
                  I found the message, from Fr Pancratios Sanders, but the address that was supposed to be provided, to which one would write to order the book, was missing.
                  Message 8 of 12 , Jul 19, 2002
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                    I found the message, from Fr Pancratios Sanders, but the address that
                    was supposed to be provided, to which one would write to order the
                    book, was missing.

                    Stephen Reynolds


                    --- In ustav@y..., BAUMGARTH@F... wrote:
                    >
                    > Christ is in our midst!
                    > I went into the ustav archives and there is information about
                    this
                    > tranlation of the General Menaion on message 1063 (March 18, 1999).
                    > Dn. Patrick
                    >
                    >
                    >

                    >
                    BAUMGARTH@FORDHA

                    > M.EDU To:
                    ustav@y...
                    >
                    cc:

                    > 07/17/02 10:20 Subject: Re: [ustav]
                    Re: General Menaion
                    >
                    AM

                    > Please
                    respond

                    > to
                    ustav

                    >

                    >

                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > Christ is in our midst!
                    > I recall that an Orthodox Monastery in the United Kingdom (I
                    believe it
                    > is dedicated to the Theotokos) had a full Slavic General Menaion.
                    It was
                    > rendered in traditional liturgical English and a posting some time
                    ago on
                    > ustav indicated that the book was back in print. Anybody know the
                    specific
                    > reference?
                    > Dn. Patrick
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
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                    >
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                    > http://www.orthodox.net/services
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