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Re: Incensation and the Congregation

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  • stephen_r1937
    ... whenever one ... the middle, ... the Holy ... exiting the ... then turn ... Father Igumen Joseph is right about this. I think most people would do this if
    Message 1 of 22 , Oct 9, 2008
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      --- In ustav@yahoogroups.com, holytransf@... wrote:
      >
      > No one is expected to "walk backward" out of the church but,
      whenever one
      > passes from one side of the church to the other he should stop at
      the middle,
      > facing the Holy Doors, sign himself with the Holy Cross, bow toward
      the Holy
      > Altar and then continue on and also, when leaving the church, before
      exiting the
      > nave, turn and face eastward, sign himself with the Holy Cross, and
      then turn
      > and exit. What is so difficult about that?

      Father Igumen Joseph is right about this.

      I think most people would do this if they were taught to do it. The
      Old Believers, who whatever their faults in many ways set a good
      example for the rest of us, upon entering resp. leaving the church say
      three prayers: "God, be merciful to me a sinner"; "Thou hast created
      me; Lord, have mercy on me"; and "I have sinned without measure; Lord,
      forgive me", crossing themselves and bowing at each.

      And I recall some years ago in Mexico observing how the Catholic
      population, whenever they passed a church on the street, would cross
      themselves; men would remove their hats when passing the church door.
      This was also our custom, and is now much neglected. These practices
      are aids to the remembrance of God; it is worth the slight effort it
      takes to observe them and teach them. As Fr Joseph says, "What is so
      difficult?"

      Stephen
    • Nikita Simmons
      It is interesting to note that in pre-Nikonian Russian practice (pre-1655, and still observed by the Old Believers) the temple is not censed in this manner at
      Message 2 of 22 , Oct 12, 2008
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        It is interesting to note that in pre-Nikonian Russian practice
        (pre-1655, and still observed by the Old Believers) the temple is not
        censed in this manner at all. The priest or deacon stands on the solea
        (the raised level area just in front of the Holy Doors) and does the
        censing from there. After censing the icons on the iconostasis (as one
        does in all the other ethnic traditions), the priest or deacon stands
        in the middle of the solea and directs the motion of the censor first
        to the image of the Pantocrator in the rotunda, then the processional
        icon at the entrance of the right choir, then the people on the right
        choir, the left processional icon, the left choir, the left half of
        the congregation, the right half of the congregation, then the people
        standing in the narthex; he then turns around and re-enters the altar
        and finishes up as usual. If the bishop is present, he is censed first
        and last when the censing is done outside the altar.

        The whole process is not really dramatically different from the Greek
        and modern Russian traditions, except that the deacon or priest stands
        in one location and points the censor in the direction of the icons
        and people, instead of actually making the rounds. Thus, no "sunflower
        move" (which pleases me greatly!).

        Nikita Simmons
        Woodburn, Oregon

        --- In ustav@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Robinson" <stevenpaul4@...> wrote:
        >
        > Yes, it is called the "sunflower move". :)
        > I used to do it because everyone else did it in my former parish,
        but was told it is not appropriate, but a lot of parishes somehow end
        up doing it and the priests don't correct it.
        > Sbdn. Steven
        >
        > ----- Original Message -----
        > From: Daniel Petras
        > To: ustav@yahoogroups.com
        > Sent: Tuesday, October 07, 2008 5:35 AM
        > Subject: [ustav] Incensation and the Congregation
        >
        >
        > I have seen in some places that when the priest incenses the whole
        interior of the Church, they turn and follow him with their eyes. In
        this the common custom?
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        >
      • David M. Petras
        Thank you very much to those who have responded to my question. Your answers were to the point and very helpful.
        Message 3 of 22 , Oct 13, 2008
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          Thank you very much to those who have responded to my question. Your
          answers were to the point and very helpful.
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