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Re: [Unmuzzled Ox] query & riposte to riposte

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  • souvienstoidemoublier
    Well, I am not quite sure where you have been, perhaps you have not seen the Microsoft Light of Day. It has now gone beyond the corporations merely attaching
    Message 1 of 40 , Dec 5, 2005
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      Well, I am not quite sure where you have been, perhaps you have not
      seen the Microsoft Light of Day. It has now gone beyond the
      corporations merely attaching their names to things like stadiums and
      auditoriums, they now own parts of the language. We no longer have
      "split infinitives", they are "Black & Decker split infinitives" . . .

      The word "priceless" has been licensed to Mastercard until 2025. It is
      unbecoming for you to use their word in an inappropriate and
      disrespectful manner.

      --- In unmuzzledox@yahoogroups.com, "Kirby Olson" <kirbyolson2@h...>
      wrote:
      >
      > That's nitpicking.
      >
      >
      > >From: souvienstoidemoublier <no_reply@yahoogroups.com>
      > >Reply-To: unmuzzledox@yahoogroups.com
      > >To: unmuzzledox@yahoogroups.com
      > >Subject: Re: [Unmuzzled Ox] query & riposte to riposte
      > >Date: Sun, 04 Dec 2005 20:30:58 -0000
      > >
      > >Aren't you supposed to state the number of American soldiers
      killed,
      > >and the financial expense, and then the number of American
      civilians
      > >killed, and the financial expense, and the number of Iraqi
      civilians
      > >killed and the financial expense, and the number of enemy
      combatants
      > >killed and the financial expense, and the number of wounded and the
      > >financial expense, and the reconstruction required and its
      financial
      > >expense, and the other financial expenses of the operation, before
      > >you say "priceless?"
      > >
      > >--- In unmuzzledox@yahoogroups.com, "Kirby Olson" <kirbyolson2@h...
      >
      > >wrote:
      > > >
      > > > To put the word "deliberately" before the word "killed" would
      put
      > >your
      > > > question into a more honest framework, Michael.
      > > >
      > > > I don't think Bush has ever deliberately killed any innocent
      > >people. Bin
      > > > Laden on the other hand, has. He's even killed some of his own
      men
      > >without
      > > > telling them they were on suicide missions and laughed about it.
      > > >
      > > > There's a world of difference between those two leaders. To
      begin
      > >with,
      > > > Bush was elected president. Bin Laden appointed himself. No
      one
      > >has
      > > > elected him head of anything. He's a lawless bandit operating
      > >without any
      > > > authority whatsoever for his illegal actions. Bin LAden
      actually
      > >has a
      > > > fatwa on his head from the leader of the Spanish Muslims.
      > > >
      > > > Many Muslims in America are working with the FBI and the CIA to
      try
      > >to rat
      > > > out the rats in their midst. There was a good article on this
      in
      > >the
      > > > November 21, 2005 Time Magazine, which is hardly leftist.
      > > >
      > > > Imam Mohammed Agid, who is the leader of a Virginia mosque, had
      > >this to say,
      > > > "The terrorists are murderers, and God will deal with them on
      > >Judgment Day."
      > > > (p. 60).
      > > >
      > > > Moderate Muslims like Bush. It's just the outlaw ones, the ones
      > >with no
      > > > legitimate government, and no true religious authority, who hate
      > >him.
      > > >
      > > > What Bush has done for Iraq is priceless. All over the country
      > >businesses
      > > > are opening (especially in Turkistan and other areas outside of
      > >Saddam's
      > > > Sunni triangle). Of course the women of Afghanistan who are now
      > >able to
      > > > read and write and attend classes (this is millions of people)
      are
      > > > benefitting.
      > > >
      > > > Bush is a wonderful man and most of the world sees this.
      > > >
      > > > Even Hillary Clinton is for the war. Lieberman is for the war.
      > >Lots of
      > > > Democrats realize it's a good thing in the long run. Of course
      in
      > >the short
      > > > run it's horrifying. Democracy is worth fighting for. It's the
      > >key concept
      > > > of the last two hundred years. It sure beats tyranny. Do you
      know
      > >the work
      > > > of the prizewinner Amartya Sen and his book Inequality
      Reexamined?
      > >He
      > > > argues that there's never been a famine in a democratic country.
      > > >
      > > > Try Christmas in Mogadishu and then tell me there's no
      difference.
      > > >
      > > > -- Kirby
      > > >
      > > >
      > > > >From: mandreox <no_reply@yahoogroups.com>
      > > > >Reply-To: unmuzzledox@yahoogroups.com
      > > > >To: unmuzzledox@yahoogroups.com
      > > > >Subject: Re: [Unmuzzled Ox] query & riposte
      > > > >Date: Sun, 04 Dec 2005 15:09:28 -0000
      > > > >
      > > > >It's amazing our difference in political perception. Everybody
      > >lies.
      > > > >When someone says he never lies, that's a sure "tell" you're
      > >talking
      > > > >to a con man. Are you over-invested, perhaps, in Bush?
      Otherwise,
      > >why
      > > > >would you try to con us about the con-man-in-chief?
      > > > >
      > > > >No American president wreaked as much havoc on the world as
      Hitler.
      > > > >On the other hand, has Bush by now killed more innocent people
      than
      > > > >Osama Bin Laden?
      > > > >
      > > > >--- In "Kirby Olson" wrote:
      > > > >
      > > > > > I really don't think Bush is a liar. I think he's overly
      > > > >idealistic, and I
      > > > > > think he's full of war. He reminds me of the Greek God
      Ares.
      > >He
      > > > >even walks
      > > > > > as if he's dancing, and Ares was the god of the dance.
      > > > > >
      > > > > > I can't see how Bush's war in Iraq will bring an end to
      America.
      > > > > >
      > > > > > It's Israel that is the central problem -- Hussein was
      lobbing
      > > > >scuds into
      > > > > > Israel, and then later paying suicide bombers 25 grand per
      > >family
      > > > >who
      > > > > > exploded themselves in Israel.
      > > > > >
      > > > > > Personally, I'm wildly in favor of the Jews. I've always
      loved
      > > > >them.
      > > > > > Breaking up Iraq and turning it into a Democracy is
      partially a
      > > > >kind of
      > > > > > Zionization of the Middle East. This is something that's
      needed
      > > > >doing for
      > > > > > 1400 years.
      > > > > >
      > > > > > I don't think Bush ever lies. He's just wild for the Jews.
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      >
    • souvienstoidemoublier
      It took a good while for this post to post, sometimes I wonder if there is some sort of computerized monitor system and that if certain words or content show
      Message 40 of 40 , Dec 5, 2005
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        It took a good while for this post to post, sometimes I wonder if
        there is some sort of computerized monitor system and that if certain
        words or content show up, it gets sent somewhere for review or for a
        heads up somewhere

        --- In unmuzzledox@yahoogroups.com, souvienstoidemoublier <no_reply@y
        ...> wrote:
        >
        > On the other hand, it sold a lot of flags, gave Lee Greenwood a
        > revival, caused a boom in the rubber glove industry [we might even
        > have gotten to see Bruce Springsteen, Peewee Herman, Rudy Guiliani,
        > Willie Nelson, Luciano Pavarroti, and Pamela Anderson on the same
        > stage] . . . you apparently didn't take milo-economics in college or
        > you would realize that you are in the syndicate and that what is
        good
        > for the syndicate is good for you . . . the purported "freedom" of
        the
        > Iraqis is actually the big downside of it all, freedom spreading
        > around takes away a lot of the oomph of Lee Greenwood's "I'm proud
        to
        > be an American, where at least I know I'm free", if freedom gets
        > around all over the place, it won't be special, and pride is about
        > being special, and he might end up having to sing something like
        "I'm
        > mildly pleased with myself to be an American, where at least we
        > invented 'Gilligan's Island'" . . . this is why we NEED bad
        situations
        > around the world, so we can be proud to be an American.
        >
        > However, we do have a rule, we can't have too many at the same time,
        > one or two is about it, the rest need to just take a number or buzz
        > off . . .
        >
        > A number of years ago, I had an idea for a black comedy in which two
        > guys are stuck with several warehouses of yellow ribbons left over
        > from the Iran hostage situation so unfortunately resolved by Reagan
        > and North in order to take care of the Contras . . . so the two guys
        > scheme up some fake terrorist group to take hostages so that their
        > product will be back in demand.
        >
        > Only it offends a number of dangerous parties in a number of
        different
        > quarters . . .
        >
        > --- In unmuzzledox@yahoogroups.com, "Kirby Olson" <kirbyolson2@h...>
        > wrote:
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > > Souvien is right that a better cost-benefit analysis could be done
        > in regard
        > > to the war than simply to say that freedom is priceless. Of
        course
        > it's
        > > pricey.
        > >
        > > But it's hard to do the cost-benfit analysis very exactly. The
        day
        > of the
        > > World Trade Strike cost New York State 108 billion dollars in
        direct
        > costs.
        > > Building down, people dead. In the following year about another
        > amount that
        > > big was drained due to businesses moving out of state, etc. The
        > indirect
        > > costs that came out of that in turn are very difficult to discern.
        > >
        > > The number of dead on both sides in the wars to follow are easier
        to
        > > establish -- a little over 2000 soldiers.
        > >
        > > In the day of the WTC attack there were about 3500 lost if you
        don't
        > count
        > > those on the planes.
        > >
        > > Bin Laden did plan the WTC attack, but he had only a loose
        > understanding if
        > > anything with Hussein.
        > >
        > > Hussein did applaud the attack. He may have eventually made a
        deal
        > with Bin
        > > Laden. If so the resources of Hussein and Bin Laden together
        might
        > have
        > > made for a monumental attack that would have dwarfed 9/11. It's
        > hard to
        > > know.
        > >
        > > When Reagan hit Qaddafi I was afraid there would be such a huge
        > attack but
        > > in fact Qaddafi stood down and that was the end of Libyan terror.
        > >
        > > Perhaps this kind of manly standing up and knocking the other down
        > is
        > > respected and understood in that part of the world.
        > >
        > > They certainly don't respect the Christian slaves of Darfur.
        > Genocide is
        > > going to be their lot and there seems to be little to stop it.
        > Oddly, the
        > > lleft never protests this. Maybe because the dead are Christians.

        > I don't
        > > know. They seem to only be squeamish about some dead, not others.
        > >
        > > As part of the cost-benefit analysis though of the dust-ups in the
        > Mid-East
        > > we'd have to compare it to the war for independence while
        adjusting
        > for
        > > inflation. I don't have the resources for this but I do know that
        > in the
        > > first battle that was fought in Brooklyn Washington lost almost
        3000
        > men.
        > >
        > > The little war of attrition that's going on now will sorely test
        the
        > nerves.
        > > Some of the explosive devices are miraculously monstrous. How
        do
        > you
        > > price out lives? How do you compare them to a vague goal or a
        more
        > or less
        > > difficult concept to define such as freedom? A half million died
        in
        > the
        > > Civil War.
        > >
        > > For Cindy Sheehan I'm sure the price of a hangnail would be too
        much
        > even to
        > > establish electricity and running water. I'm not sure at what
        point
        > Bush
        > > would cut and run. He's made of stronger stuff, I think. Just
        war
        > doctrine
        > > argues that we have to be able to win the war. We can't endlessly
        > widow the
        > > population. I'd stay in there for three more years if I were Bush
        > and then
        > > see if Hillary or Condoleeza gets the next round. I'd just love
        > that
        > > match-up and all the wild debates.
        > >
        > > But Souvien is right -- war is pricey. So is peace at any price
        > which is
        > > what the left seems to want. I myself am a centrist -- perhaps
        the
        > only one
        > > in existence.
        > >
        > > -- Kirby
        > >
        >
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