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RE: [ujeni] Forgot one thing! My 2 cents...

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  • Luz Huntington
    Joanna, Scott, John and Mark, I am also a bit hesitant to contribute to this discussion but do think I have an important point to make. I really like Joanna s
    Message 1 of 5 , Mar 11, 2004
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      Joanna, Scott, John and Mark,
      I am also a bit hesitant to contribute to this discussion but do think I
      have an important point to make. I really like Joanna's logical approach to
      monies spent on international health issues but ultimately I must side with
      Scott. I do feel it is extremely important to restore the health of the most
      productive adults in the community, those that need to provide for their
      children and elders. What will the future of African countries be like if
      AIDS wipes out their current generation of family providers? Treatment is
      very important and its success conveys a great deal of hope that can not be
      measured in terms of money.

      The specific point that I wish to add puts the focus back on our own
      country. Public health in the United States has shuffled much of its funding
      into bioterrorism preparedness since 9/11. It can be argued that that
      funding could be better spent on issues of malnutrition in our own country's
      poor or funneled into more immunization programs, etc. I witnessed the need
      for better immunization surviellance and nutrition programs in the Navajo
      Nation right here on American soil. I think a good bit of this discussion
      centers on social justice issues. And before we decide to stop funding AIDS
      chemotherapeutic agents in Africa we might want to simply look at ourselves
      and the justice in the way we funnel monies in our own country. I do not
      mean to imple that bioterrorism preparedness is unimportant--I just think
      its important to reflect back on ourselves and our own country when it comes
      to limiting resources and social justice.

      I welcome any thoughts on my point and hope I have explained myself clearly
      so as not to offend any one.

      Thanks for the great discussion.
      Luz


      >From: "Holland, Mark" <holland@...>
      >Reply-To: ujeni@yahoogroups.com
      >To: "'ujeni@yahoogroups.com'" <ujeni@yahoogroups.com>
      >Subject: RE: [ujeni] Forgot one thing!
      >Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 08:23:21 -0500
      >
      >Since this isn't my area at all I'm going to risk sounding ignorant, but
      >there are some great books by Paul Farmer on this topic specifically.
      >Twice at least in the past 20 years he has launched a treatment program
      >using first-world drugs in a third-world context, first for tuberculosis
      >and now for HIV. His thesis is that since prevention is observably not
      >working there is an obligation to move to treatment, regardless of funding
      >considerations. If the funds are lacking, he argues, it's necessary to
      >generate them.
      >
      >If I'm understanding correctly each new intervention he has tried has
      >eventually shown measurable results. Whether the model is portable I don't
      >know; perhaps his success is due primarily to his personal abilities and
      >stature.
      >
      >The Uses of Haiti, Tracy Kidder's biography Mountains beyond Mountains, and
      >Infections and Inequalities are all worth a read.
      >
      >Mark

      _________________________________________________________________
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    • Joanna Hooper
      Luz, Thank you for input. I personally really appreciate simply having a group of savvy and interested individuals to discuss the issue with. I think that
      Message 2 of 5 , Mar 11, 2004
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        Luz,

        Thank you for input. I personally really appreciate simply having a group
        of savvy and interested individuals to discuss the issue with. I think
        that you make some excellent points. When we do look at our own health
        care system, it is certainly not centered on prevention and we often end up
        performing costly tertiary level care for some while others do not have any
        sort of basic level health care. As far as vaccination rates, I find it
        appalling that there are many underdeveloped nations who have more
        effective vaccination programs (and subsequently rates) than we do.

        I also think that your point of the hope that treatment provides is an
        important one. Perhaps by giving people hope that there is something that
        can be done about this devastating disease will open dialog on a very real
        and firsthand sense and encourage others to be screened as well. Perhaps
        it will increase screening and awareness of HIV status now that something
        can be done about it to help the infected individual. I think that all of
        these will probably help.

        I also think that it should be said that it is a little silly for me to
        squabble about where aid dollars should go when the money from our
        involvement in Iraq for just one day could go a long way toward improving
        and extending millions of lives world-wide.

        I hope, though, that the people who are to receive ARVs will also (along
        with their family members) receive insecticide treated nets, and that there
        are projects in place to try to improve high nutrient food availability
        such as community gardens, and perhaps solar oven projects to teach people
        how to treat their water with the sun thereby providing them with safer
        drinking water. Basically, I think that a more holistic approach need to
        be taken in improving the morbidity and mortality of AIDS patients, and
        perhaps this is already happening--I don't know.


        Joanna

        --On Thursday, March 11, 2004 3:18 PM +0000 Luz Huntington
        <luzhunt@...> wrote:

        > Joanna, Scott, John and Mark,
        > I am also a bit hesitant to contribute to this discussion but do think I
        > have an important point to make. I really like Joanna's logical approach
        > to monies spent on international health issues but ultimately I must
        > side with Scott. I do feel it is extremely important to restore the
        > health of the most productive adults in the community, those that need
        > to provide for their children and elders. What will the future of
        > African countries be like if AIDS wipes out their current generation of
        > family providers? Treatment is very important and its success conveys a
        > great deal of hope that can not be measured in terms of money.
        >
        > The specific point that I wish to add puts the focus back on our own
        > country. Public health in the United States has shuffled much of its
        > funding into bioterrorism preparedness since 9/11. It can be argued that
        > that funding could be better spent on issues of malnutrition in our own
        > country's poor or funneled into more immunization programs, etc. I
        > witnessed the need for better immunization surviellance and nutrition
        > programs in the Navajo Nation right here on American soil. I think a
        > good bit of this discussion centers on social justice issues. And before
        > we decide to stop funding AIDS chemotherapeutic agents in Africa we
        > might want to simply look at ourselves and the justice in the way we
        > funnel monies in our own country. I do not mean to imple that
        > bioterrorism preparedness is unimportant--I just think its important to
        > reflect back on ourselves and our own country when it comes to limiting
        > resources and social justice.
        >
        > I welcome any thoughts on my point and hope I have explained myself
        > clearly so as not to offend any one.
        >
        > Thanks for the great discussion.
        > Luz
        >
        >
        >> From: "Holland, Mark" <holland@...>
        >> Reply-To: ujeni@yahoogroups.com
        >> To: "'ujeni@yahoogroups.com'" <ujeni@yahoogroups.com>
        >> Subject: RE: [ujeni] Forgot one thing!
        >> Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 08:23:21 -0500
        >>
        >> Since this isn't my area at all I'm going to risk sounding ignorant, but
        >> there are some great books by Paul Farmer on this topic specifically.
        >> Twice at least in the past 20 years he has launched a treatment program
        >> using first-world drugs in a third-world context, first for tuberculosis
        >> and now for HIV. His thesis is that since prevention is observably not
        >> working there is an obligation to move to treatment, regardless of
        >> funding considerations. If the funds are lacking, he argues, it's
        >> necessary to generate them.
        >>
        >> If I'm understanding correctly each new intervention he has tried has
        >> eventually shown measurable results. Whether the model is portable I
        >> don't know; perhaps his success is due primarily to his personal
        >> abilities and stature.
        >>
        >> The Uses of Haiti, Tracy Kidder's biography Mountains beyond Mountains,
        >> and Infections and Inequalities are all worth a read.
        >>
        >> Mark
        >
        > _________________________________________________________________
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      • johooper@unm.edu
        Luz, You mentioned that you worked with the Navajo Nation. I am currently working on a project looking at diabetes prevention among Native Americans here in
        Message 3 of 5 , Mar 11, 2004
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          Luz,

          You mentioned that you worked with the Navajo Nation. I am currently
          working on a project looking at diabetes prevention among Native
          Americans here in New Mexico. As part of my background research, I am
          particularly interested in the food commodities programs and perhaps
          how them impacted the local diet and changed it from the traditional
          healthier foods to ones high in fat and high glycemic index
          carbohydrates. Although I have heard people make reference to it, I
          am having a hard time finding any information that documents this
          historic event specifically in the literature searches that I have
          done. Do you have any references or ideas as to where I could find
          this information--for that matter, does anyone?

          Joanna


          Quoting Luz Huntington <luzhunt@...>:

          > <html><body>
          >
          >
          > <tt>
          > Joanna, Scott, John and Mark,<BR>
          > I am also a bit hesitant to contribute to this discussion but do
          > think I <BR>
          > have an important point to make. I really like Joanna's logical
          > approach to <BR>
          > monies spent on international health issues but ultimately I must
          > side with <BR>
          > Scott. I do feel it is extremely important to restore the health of
          > the most <BR>
          > productive adults in the community, those that need to provide for
          > their <BR>
          > children and elders. What will the future of African countries be
          > like if <BR>
          > AIDS wipes out their current generation of family providers?
          > Treatment is <BR>
          > very important and its success conveys a great deal of hope that can
          > not be <BR>
          > measured in terms of money.<BR>
          > <BR>
          > The specific point that I wish to add puts the focus back on our own
          > <BR>
          > country. Public health in the United States has shuffled much of its
          > funding <BR>
          > into bioterrorism preparedness since 9/11. It can be argued that that
          > <BR>
          > funding could be better spent on issues of malnutrition in our own
          > country's <BR>
          > poor or funneled into more immunization programs, etc. I witnessed
          > the need <BR>
          > for better immunization surviellance and nutrition programs in the
          > Navajo <BR>
          > Nation right here on American soil. I think a good bit of this
          > discussion <BR>
          > centers on social justice issues. And before we decide to stop
          > funding AIDS <BR>
          > chemotherapeutic agents in Africa we might want to simply look at
          > ourselves  <BR>
          > and the justice in the way we funnel monies in our own country. I do
          > not <BR>
          > mean to imple that bioterrorism preparedness is unimportant--I just
          > think <BR>
          > its important to reflect back on ourselves and our own country when
          > it comes <BR>
          > to limiting resources and social justice.<BR>
          > <BR>
          > I welcome any thoughts on my point and hope I have explained myself
          > clearly <BR>
          > so as not to offend any one.<BR>
          > <BR>
          > Thanks for the great discussion.<BR>
          > Luz<BR>
          > <BR>
          > <BR>
          > >From: "Holland, Mark" <holland@...><BR>
          > >Reply-To: ujeni@yahoogroups.com<BR>
          > >To: "'ujeni@yahoogroups.com'"
          > <ujeni@yahoogroups.com><BR>
          > >Subject: RE: [ujeni] Forgot one thing!<BR>
          > >Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 08:23:21 -0500<BR>
          > ><BR>
          > >Since this isn't my area at all I'm going to risk sounding
          > ignorant, but <BR>
          > >there are some great books by Paul Farmer on this topic
          > specifically.  <BR>
          > >Twice at least in the past 20 years he has launched a treatment
          > program <BR>
          > >using first-world drugs in a third-world context, first for
          > tuberculosis <BR>
          > >and now for HIV.  His thesis is that since prevention is
          > observably not <BR>
          > >working there is an obligation to move to treatment, regardless
          > of funding <BR>
          > >considerations.  If the funds are lacking, he argues, it's
          > necessary to <BR>
          > >generate them.<BR>
          > ><BR>
          > >If I'm understanding correctly each new intervention he has tried
          > has <BR>
          > >eventually shown measurable results.  Whether the model is
          > portable I don't <BR>
          > >know; perhaps his success is due primarily to his personal
          > abilities and <BR>
          > >stature.<BR>
          > ><BR>
          > >The Uses of Haiti, Tracy Kidder's biography Mountains beyond
          > Mountains, and <BR>
          > >Infections and Inequalities are all worth a read.<BR>
          > ><BR>
          > >Mark<BR>
          > <BR>
          > _________________________________________________________________<BR>
          > Get a FREE online computer virus scan from McAfee when you click
          > here. <BR>
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        • Luz Huntington
          Joanna, I can t think of any references off the top of my head. I think most of what I have learned has come from a couple of radio shows I heard on KUYI Hopi
          Message 4 of 5 , Mar 12, 2004
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            Joanna,
            I can't think of any references off the top of my head. I think most of what
            I have learned has come from a couple of radio shows I heard on KUYI Hopi
            Radio. I do have some colleagues I can ask and I will see if anything
            surfaces in my assigned readings this week in my American Indian Health and
            Health Care class; we are just about to start our discussion on Diabetes.

            I will keep you posted, Luz


            >From: johooper@...
            >Reply-To: ujeni@yahoogroups.com
            >To: ujeni@yahoogroups.com
            >Subject: RE: [ujeni] Forgot one thing! My 2 cents...
            >Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 13:08:18 -0700
            >
            >Luz,
            >
            >You mentioned that you worked with the Navajo Nation. I am currently
            >working on a project looking at diabetes prevention among Native
            >Americans here in New Mexico. As part of my background research, I am
            >particularly interested in the food commodities programs and perhaps
            >how them impacted the local diet and changed it from the traditional
            >healthier foods to ones high in fat and high glycemic index
            >carbohydrates. Although I have heard people make reference to it, I
            >am having a hard time finding any information that documents this
            >historic event specifically in the literature searches that I have
            >done. Do you have any references or ideas as to where I could find
            >this information--for that matter, does anyone?
            >
            >Joanna
            >
            >
            >Quoting Luz Huntington <luzhunt@...>:
            >
            > > <html><body>
            > >
            > >
            > > <tt>
            > > Joanna, Scott, John and Mark,<BR>
            > > I am also a bit hesitant to contribute to this discussion but do
            > > think I <BR>
            > > have an important point to make. I really like Joanna's logical
            > > approach to <BR>
            > > monies spent on international health issues but ultimately I must
            > > side with <BR>
            > > Scott. I do feel it is extremely important to restore the health of
            > > the most <BR>
            > > productive adults in the community, those that need to provide for
            > > their <BR>
            > > children and elders. What will the future of African countries be
            > > like if <BR>
            > > AIDS wipes out their current generation of family providers?
            > > Treatment is <BR>
            > > very important and its success conveys a great deal of hope that can
            > > not be <BR>
            > > measured in terms of money.<BR>
            > > <BR>
            > > The specific point that I wish to add puts the focus back on our own
            > > <BR>
            > > country. Public health in the United States has shuffled much of its
            > > funding <BR>
            > > into bioterrorism preparedness since 9/11. It can be argued that that
            > > <BR>
            > > funding could be better spent on issues of malnutrition in our own
            > > country's <BR>
            > > poor or funneled into more immunization programs, etc. I witnessed
            > > the need <BR>
            > > for better immunization surviellance and nutrition programs in the
            > > Navajo <BR>
            > > Nation right here on American soil. I think a good bit of this
            > > discussion <BR>
            > > centers on social justice issues. And before we decide to stop
            > > funding AIDS <BR>
            > > chemotherapeutic agents in Africa we might want to simply look at
            > > ourselves  <BR>
            > > and the justice in the way we funnel monies in our own country. I do
            > > not <BR>
            > > mean to imple that bioterrorism preparedness is unimportant--I just
            > > think <BR>
            > > its important to reflect back on ourselves and our own country when
            > > it comes <BR>
            > > to limiting resources and social justice.<BR>
            > > <BR>
            > > I welcome any thoughts on my point and hope I have explained myself
            > > clearly <BR>
            > > so as not to offend any one.<BR>
            > > <BR>
            > > Thanks for the great discussion.<BR>
            > > Luz<BR>
            > > <BR>
            > > <BR>
            > > >From: "Holland, Mark" <holland@...><BR>
            > > >Reply-To: ujeni@yahoogroups.com<BR>
            > > >To: "'ujeni@yahoogroups.com'"
            > > <ujeni@yahoogroups.com><BR>
            > > >Subject: RE: [ujeni] Forgot one thing!<BR>
            > > >Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 08:23:21 -0500<BR>
            > > ><BR>
            > > >Since this isn't my area at all I'm going to risk sounding
            > > ignorant, but <BR>
            > > >there are some great books by Paul Farmer on this topic
            > > specifically.  <BR>
            > > >Twice at least in the past 20 years he has launched a treatment
            > > program <BR>
            > > >using first-world drugs in a third-world context, first for
            > > tuberculosis <BR>
            > > >and now for HIV.  His thesis is that since prevention is
            > > observably not <BR>
            > > >working there is an obligation to move to treatment, regardless
            > > of funding <BR>
            > > >considerations.  If the funds are lacking, he argues, it's
            > > necessary to <BR>
            > > >generate them.<BR>
            > > ><BR>
            > > >If I'm understanding correctly each new intervention he has tried
            > > has <BR>
            > > >eventually shown measurable results.  Whether the model is
            > > portable I don't <BR>
            > > >know; perhaps his success is due primarily to his personal
            > > abilities and <BR>
            > > >stature.<BR>
            > > ><BR>
            > > >The Uses of Haiti, Tracy Kidder's biography Mountains beyond
            > > Mountains, and <BR>
            > > >Infections and Inequalities are all worth a read.<BR>
            > > ><BR>
            > > >Mark<BR>
            > > <BR>
            > > _________________________________________________________________<BR>
            > > Get a FREE online computer virus scan from McAfee when you click
            > > here. <BR>
            > > <a
            > > href="http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?
            >cid=3963">http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?
            >cid=3963</a><BR>
            > > <BR>
            > > </tt>
            > >
            > >
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          • johooper@unm.edu
            Thanks a lot Luz! Joanna ... G ... I ... 4 ... / ... 3 ... 4 ... o
            Message 5 of 5 , Mar 12, 2004
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              Thanks a lot Luz!

              Joanna

              Quoting Luz Huntington <luzhunt@...>:

              > Joanna,
              > I can't think of any references off the top of my head. I think most
              > of what
              > I have learned has come from a couple of radio shows I heard on KUYI
              > Hopi
              > Radio. I do have some colleagues I can ask and I will see if anything
              >
              > surfaces in my assigned readings this week in my American Indian
              > Health and
              > Health Care class; we are just about to start our discussion on
              > Diabetes.
              >
              > I will keep you posted, Luz
              >
              >
              > >From: johooper@...
              > >Reply-To: ujeni@yahoogroups.com
              > >To: ujeni@yahoogroups.com
              > >Subject: RE: [ujeni] Forgot one thing! My 2 cents...
              > >Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 13:08:18 -0700
              > >
              > >Luz,
              > >
              > >You mentioned that you worked with the Navajo Nation. I am
              > currently
              > >working on a project looking at diabetes prevention among Native
              > >Americans here in New Mexico. As part of my background research, I
              > am
              > >particularly interested in the food commodities programs and
              > perhaps
              > >how them impacted the local diet and changed it from the
              > traditional
              > >healthier foods to ones high in fat and high glycemic index
              > >carbohydrates. Although I have heard people make reference to it,
              > I
              > >am having a hard time finding any information that documents this
              > >historic event specifically in the literature searches that I have
              > >done. Do you have any references or ideas as to where I could find
              > >this information--for that matter, does anyone?
              > >
              > >Joanna
              > >
              > >
              > >Quoting Luz Huntington <luzhunt@...>:
              > >
              > > > <html><body>
              > > >
              > > >
              > > > <tt>
              > > > Joanna, Scott, John and Mark,<BR>
              > > > I am also a bit hesitant to contribute to this discussion but do
              > > > think I <BR>
              > > > have an important point to make. I really like Joanna's logical
              > > > approach to <BR>
              > > > monies spent on international health issues but ultimately I
              > must
              > > > side with <BR>
              > > > Scott. I do feel it is extremely important to restore the health
              > of
              > > > the most <BR>
              > > > productive adults in the community, those that need to provide
              > for
              > > > their <BR>
              > > > children and elders. What will the future of African countries
              > be
              > > > like if <BR>
              > > > AIDS wipes out their current generation of family providers?
              > > > Treatment is <BR>
              > > > very important and its success conveys a great deal of hope that
              > can
              > > > not be <BR>
              > > > measured in terms of money.<BR>
              > > > <BR>
              > > > The specific point that I wish to add puts the focus back on our
              > own
              > > > <BR>
              > > > country. Public health in the United States has shuffled much of
              > its
              > > > funding <BR>
              > > > into bioterrorism preparedness since 9/11. It can be argued that
              > that
              > > > <BR>
              > > > funding could be better spent on issues of malnutrition in our
              > own
              > > > country's <BR>
              > > > poor or funneled into more immunization programs, etc. I
              > witnessed
              > > > the need <BR>
              > > > for better immunization surviellance and nutrition programs in
              > the
              > > > Navajo <BR>
              > > > Nation right here on American soil. I think a good bit of this
              > > > discussion <BR>
              > > > centers on social justice issues. And before we decide to stop
              > > > funding AIDS <BR>
              > > > chemotherapeutic agents in Africa we might want to simply look
              > at
              > > > ourselves  <BR>
              > > > and the justice in the way we funnel monies in our own country. I
              > do
              > > > not <BR>
              > > > mean to imple that bioterrorism preparedness is unimportant--I
              > just
              > > > think <BR>
              > > > its important to reflect back on ourselves and our own country
              > when
              > > > it comes <BR>
              > > > to limiting resources and social justice.<BR>
              > > > <BR>
              > > > I welcome any thoughts on my point and hope I have explained
              > myself
              > > > clearly <BR>
              > > > so as not to offend any one.<BR>
              > > > <BR>
              > > > Thanks for the great discussion.<BR>
              > > > Luz<BR>
              > > > <BR>
              > > > <BR>
              > > > >From: "Holland, Mark"
              > <holland@...><BR>
              > > > >Reply-To: ujeni@yahoogroups.com<BR>
              > > > >To: "'ujeni@yahoogroups.com'"
              > > > <ujeni@yahoogroups.com><BR>
              > > > >Subject: RE: [ujeni] Forgot one thing!<BR>
              > > > >Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 08:23:21 -0500<BR>
              > > > ><BR>
              > > > >Since this isn't my area at all I'm going to risk sounding
              > > > ignorant, but <BR>
              > > > >there are some great books by Paul Farmer on this topic
              > > > specifically.  <BR>
              > > > >Twice at least in the past 20 years he has launched a
              > treatment
              > > > program <BR>
              > > > >using first-world drugs in a third-world context, first for
              > > > tuberculosis <BR>
              > > > >and now for HIV.  His thesis is that since prevention
              > is
              > > > observably not <BR>
              > > > >working there is an obligation to move to treatment,
              > regardless
              > > > of funding <BR>
              > > > >considerations.  If the funds are lacking, he argues,
              > it's
              > > > necessary to <BR>
              > > > >generate them.<BR>
              > > > ><BR>
              > > > >If I'm understanding correctly each new intervention he has
              > tried
              > > > has <BR>
              > > > >eventually shown measurable results.  Whether the model
              > is
              > > > portable I don't <BR>
              > > > >know; perhaps his success is due primarily to his personal
              > > > abilities and <BR>
              > > > >stature.<BR>
              > > > ><BR>
              > > > >The Uses of Haiti, Tracy Kidder's biography Mountains beyond
              > > > Mountains, and <BR>
              > > > >Infections and Inequalities are all worth a read.<BR>
              > > > ><BR>
              > > > >Mark<BR>
              > > > <BR>
              > > >
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