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Re: [ujeni] life expectancy

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  • Paul DEVER
    Mismanagement also accounts for a fair share of corruption. If all goverrment dependents had to go to the local hospitals and wait in line, and had to go to
    Message 1 of 10 , Nov 3, 2002
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      Mismanagement also accounts for a fair share of corruption. If all
      goverrment dependents had to go to the local hospitals and wait in line, and
      had to go to the public schools, and had the same access to everything as
      the regular Mr. Phiri did, then many of these peoblems would have been
      solved, yes even AIDS could be under control....coz they would have made
      sure that if they could not get their kids to SAfrica to get the AZT and
      such, that they would teach them about prophylaxis...






      ----Original Message Follows----
      From: "Weber" <weber@...>
      Reply-To: ujeni@yahoogroups.com
      To: <ujeni@yahoogroups.com>
      Subject: Re: [ujeni] life expectancy
      Date: Sat, 2 Nov 2002 20:30:23 -0800

      Hey Paul you are not only a cynic but an accountant, hence you think in
      terms of money. The cause of the almost inconceivably low life expectancy
      ages of course is AIDS, and isn't Botswana one of the more economically
      sound countries on the continent? (or wasn't it until the scourge of AIDS?)
      Do we give it as much aid as other countries? In fact, did I hear Peace
      Corps maybe wasn't going to go or isn't there anymore because the country
      was doing so well? We met a Peace Corps worker from Botswana on Zomba
      Plateau who said that they had more text books in the school where he taught
      in the Okovango Delta than he had had in his school in the U.S. But there
      Botswana is at the top , or should that be bottom, of Mark's list. So maybe
      if we made it so that more AIDS drugs could be affordably available with
      some of those dollars we spend, the life expectancy would go up. I suspect
      that corrupt politicians have access to drugs and they will live forever
      while the countries lose their teachers, their really good hard-working
      civil servants, their health care workers, and their businessmen...the only
      people who can help lift the cloud of doom that seems to hang over the
      southern continent. I forgive you, Paul, for behaving like the accountant
      you are but not for being an inveterate cynic! Cathy




      From: Paul DEVER <pcpaul@...>

      >The cynic in me cries for an accounting of all the dollars spent in US and
      >other foreign aid money to these countries, then compare it to other
      >countries on the continent and see why the stark difference, and why the
      >continued dumping of money as well as tolerance of the disparity...

      >From: holland@...

      >an interesting factoid from The Economist: the 10 countries with the
      lowest
      >average life expectancies are all in africa and almost all in "our part of
      >africa": botswana (36.1 years) , mozambique, swaziland, malawi (39.3),
      >lesotho, sierra leone, burundi, rwanda, zambia, zimbabwe (42.9).
      >
      >-M





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    • Paul DEVER
      Oh, and Cathy, I AM the cynic that keeps the world going...except that sometimes your hubby keeps me in check... It would be nice if we could make people
      Message 2 of 10 , Nov 3, 2002
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        Oh, and Cathy, I AM the cynic that keeps the world going...except that
        sometimes your hubby keeps me in check...

        It would be nice if we could make people understand that throwing money AND
        constructive programs would help, not just money, and nnot just grass roots
        education programs...

        All these combined would help us in the end...

        Did I tell you about the time we went to Timbuktou?????

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      • Luz Huntington
        Cathy and Scott make some good points. For me, after reading these emails, the only thing I can think about is how I wish people in African nations, the United
        Message 3 of 10 , Nov 3, 2002
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          Cathy and Scott make some good points. For me, after reading these emails,
          the only thing I can think about is how I wish people in African nations,
          the United States and all over would use condoms more. Its such a cheap way
          to prevent AIDS and its aftermath.

          Luz






          >From: "Weber" <weber@...>
          >Reply-To: ujeni@yahoogroups.com
          >To: <ujeni@yahoogroups.com>
          >Subject: Re: [ujeni] life expectancy
          >Date: Sat, 2 Nov 2002 20:30:23 -0800
          >
          >Hey Paul you are not only a cynic but an accountant, hence you think in
          >terms of money. The cause of the almost inconceivably low life expectancy
          >ages of course is AIDS, and isn't Botswana one of the more economically
          >sound countries on the continent? (or wasn't it until the scourge of AIDS?)
          >Do we give it as much aid as other countries? In fact, did I hear Peace
          >Corps maybe wasn't going to go or isn't there anymore because the country
          >was doing so well? We met a Peace Corps worker from Botswana on Zomba
          >Plateau who said that they had more text books in the school where he
          >taught
          >in the Okovango Delta than he had had in his school in the U.S. But there
          >Botswana is at the top , or should that be bottom, of Mark's list. So
          >maybe
          >if we made it so that more AIDS drugs could be affordably available with
          >some of those dollars we spend, the life expectancy would go up. I suspect
          >that corrupt politicians have access to drugs and they will live forever
          >while the countries lose their teachers, their really good hard-working
          >civil servants, their health care workers, and their businessmen...the only
          >people who can help lift the cloud of doom that seems to hang over the
          >southern continent. I forgive you, Paul, for behaving like the accountant
          >you are but not for being an inveterate cynic! Cathy
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >From: Paul DEVER <pcpaul@...>
          >
          > >The cynic in me cries for an accounting of all the dollars spent in US
          >and
          > >other foreign aid money to these countries, then compare it to other
          > >countries on the continent and see why the stark difference, and why the
          > >continued dumping of money as well as tolerance of the disparity...
          >
          > >From: holland@...
          >
          > >an interesting factoid from The Economist: the 10 countries with the
          >lowest
          > >average life expectancies are all in africa and almost all in "our part
          >of
          > >africa": botswana (36.1 years) , mozambique, swaziland, malawi (39.3),
          > >lesotho, sierra leone, burundi, rwanda, zambia, zimbabwe (42.9).
          > >
          > >-M
          >
          >
          >


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        • Paul DEVER
          Good point, too...however, I remember FSNs telling me about the local hospitals which would reuse needles for shots, and not all the time sterilize them. Also,
          Message 4 of 10 , Nov 3, 2002
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            Good point, too...however, I remember FSNs telling me about the local
            hospitals which would reuse needles for shots, and not all the time
            sterilize them.

            Also, I am not sure how many transfusions go on in Malawi or elsewhere, so
            that is another source of AIDS...






            ----Original Message Follows----
            From: "Luz Huntington" <luzhunt@...>
            Reply-To: ujeni@yahoogroups.com
            To: ujeni@yahoogroups.com
            Subject: Re: [ujeni] life expectancy
            Date: Sun, 03 Nov 2002 17:08:41 +0000

            Cathy and Scott make some good points. For me, after reading these emails,
            the only thing I can think about is how I wish people in African nations,
            the United States and all over would use condoms more. Its such a cheap way
            to prevent AIDS and its aftermath.

            Luz






            >From: "Weber" <weber@...>
            >Reply-To: ujeni@yahoogroups.com
            >To: <ujeni@yahoogroups.com>
            >Subject: Re: [ujeni] life expectancy
            >Date: Sat, 2 Nov 2002 20:30:23 -0800
            >
            >Hey Paul you are not only a cynic but an accountant, hence you think in
            >terms of money. The cause of the almost inconceivably low life expectancy
            >ages of course is AIDS, and isn't Botswana one of the more economically
            >sound countries on the continent? (or wasn't it until the scourge of
            AIDS?)
            >Do we give it as much aid as other countries? In fact, did I hear Peace
            >Corps maybe wasn't going to go or isn't there anymore because the country
            >was doing so well? We met a Peace Corps worker from Botswana on Zomba
            >Plateau who said that they had more text books in the school where he
            >taught
            >in the Okovango Delta than he had had in his school in the U.S. But there
            >Botswana is at the top , or should that be bottom, of Mark's list. So
            >maybe
            >if we made it so that more AIDS drugs could be affordably available with
            >some of those dollars we spend, the life expectancy would go up. I
            suspect
            >that corrupt politicians have access to drugs and they will live forever
            >while the countries lose their teachers, their really good hard-working
            >civil servants, their health care workers, and their businessmen...the
            only
            >people who can help lift the cloud of doom that seems to hang over the
            >southern continent. I forgive you, Paul, for behaving like the
            accountant
            >you are but not for being an inveterate cynic! Cathy
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >From: Paul DEVER <pcpaul@...>
            >
            > >The cynic in me cries for an accounting of all the dollars spent in US
            >and
            > >other foreign aid money to these countries, then compare it to other
            > >countries on the continent and see why the stark difference, and why the
            > >continued dumping of money as well as tolerance of the disparity...
            >
            > >From: holland@...
            >
            > >an interesting factoid from The Economist: the 10 countries with the
            >lowest
            > >average life expectancies are all in africa and almost all in "our part
            >of
            > >africa": botswana (36.1 years) , mozambique, swaziland, malawi (39.3),
            > >lesotho, sierra leone, burundi, rwanda, zambia, zimbabwe (42.9).
            > >
            > >-M
            >
            >
            >


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          • Christine Chumbler
            Life expectancy in Botswana was pushing 70 years before AIDS. Also, PC is planning to go back into that country as part of Bush s doubling the size of the
            Message 5 of 10 , Nov 4, 2002
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              Life expectancy in Botswana was pushing 70 years before AIDS. Also, PC
              is planning to go back into that country as part of Bush's doubling the
              size of the agency hoohaw.

              >>> weber@... 11/2/02 11:30 PM >>>
              Hey Paul you are not only a cynic but an accountant, hence you think
              in
              terms of money. The cause of the almost inconceivably low life
              expectancy
              ages of course is AIDS, and isn't Botswana one of the more
              economically
              sound countries on the continent? (or wasn't it until the scourge of
              AIDS?)
              Do we give it as much aid as other countries? In fact, did I hear
              Peace
              Corps maybe wasn't going to go or isn't there anymore because the
              country
              was doing so well? We met a Peace Corps worker from Botswana on Zomba
              Plateau who said that they had more text books in the school where he
              taught
              in the Okovango Delta than he had had in his school in the U.S. But
              there
              Botswana is at the top , or should that be bottom, of Mark's list. So
              maybe
              if we made it so that more AIDS drugs could be affordably available
              with
              some of those dollars we spend, the life expectancy would go up. I
              suspect
              that corrupt politicians have access to drugs and they will live
              forever
              while the countries lose their teachers, their really good
              hard-working
              civil servants, their health care workers, and their businessmen...the
              only
              people who can help lift the cloud of doom that seems to hang over the
              southern continent. I forgive you, Paul, for behaving like the
              accountant
              you are but not for being an inveterate cynic! Cathy




              From: Paul DEVER <pcpaul@...>

              >The cynic in me cries for an accounting of all the dollars spent in US
              and
              >other foreign aid money to these countries, then compare it to other
              >countries on the continent and see why the stark difference, and why
              the
              >continued dumping of money as well as tolerance of the disparity...

              >From: holland@...

              >an interesting factoid from The Economist: the 10 countries with the
              lowest
              >average life expectancies are all in africa and almost all in "our
              part of
              >africa": botswana (36.1 years) , mozambique, swaziland, malawi
              (39.3),
              >lesotho, sierra leone, burundi, rwanda, zambia, zimbabwe (42.9).
              >
              >-M




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            • Paul DEVER
              Does that bode well or not: 1. It is an indicator of politics (which I thought PC was above...) 2. PC failed (by not putting systems in place to keep it
              Message 6 of 10 , Nov 4, 2002
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                Does that bode well or not:

                1. It is an indicator of politics (which I thought PC was above...)

                2. PC failed (by not putting systems in place to keep it running properly
                after departure.)

                3. PC left (along with other agencies a culture of dependence a la "Lords of
                Poverty")

                4. AIDS is taking over.

                I like none of these selections...






                ----Original Message Follows----
                From: "Christine Chumbler" <cchumble@...>
                Reply-To: ujeni@yahoogroups.com
                To: <ujeni@yahoogroups.com>
                Subject: Re: [ujeni] life expectancy
                Date: Mon, 04 Nov 2002 09:32:37 -0500

                Life expectancy in Botswana was pushing 70 years before AIDS. Also, PC
                is planning to go back into that country as part of Bush's doubling the
                size of the agency hoohaw.

                >>> weber@... 11/2/02 11:30 PM >>>
                Hey Paul you are not only a cynic but an accountant, hence you think
                in
                terms of money. The cause of the almost inconceivably low life
                expectancy
                ages of course is AIDS, and isn't Botswana one of the more
                economically
                sound countries on the continent? (or wasn't it until the scourge of
                AIDS?)
                Do we give it as much aid as other countries? In fact, did I hear
                Peace
                Corps maybe wasn't going to go or isn't there anymore because the
                country
                was doing so well? We met a Peace Corps worker from Botswana on Zomba
                Plateau who said that they had more text books in the school where he
                taught
                in the Okovango Delta than he had had in his school in the U.S. But
                there
                Botswana is at the top , or should that be bottom, of Mark's list. So
                maybe
                if we made it so that more AIDS drugs could be affordably available
                with
                some of those dollars we spend, the life expectancy would go up. I
                suspect
                that corrupt politicians have access to drugs and they will live
                forever
                while the countries lose their teachers, their really good
                hard-working
                civil servants, their health care workers, and their businessmen...the
                only
                people who can help lift the cloud of doom that seems to hang over the
                southern continent. I forgive you, Paul, for behaving like the
                accountant
                you are but not for being an inveterate cynic! Cathy




                From: Paul DEVER <pcpaul@...>

                >The cynic in me cries for an accounting of all the dollars spent in US
                and
                >other foreign aid money to these countries, then compare it to other
                >countries on the continent and see why the stark difference, and why
                the
                >continued dumping of money as well as tolerance of the disparity...

                >From: holland@...

                >an interesting factoid from The Economist: the 10 countries with the
                lowest
                >average life expectancies are all in africa and almost all in "our
                part of
                >africa": botswana (36.1 years) , mozambique, swaziland, malawi
                (39.3),
                >lesotho, sierra leone, burundi, rwanda, zambia, zimbabwe (42.9).
                >
                >-M




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