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Re: A New Member

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  • kalleaho@mappi.helsinki.fi
    ... Yes indeed. In fact I was just rereading your paper Tuning, Tonality, and Twenty-Two-Tone Temperament and I m going to tune my system that way today and
    Message 1 of 7 , Aug 1, 2001
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      --- In tuning@y..., "Paul Erlich" <paul@s...> wrote:

      > I'm assuming you're familiar with my solution for 22-tET, which
      > omits the "E" keys on the keyboard, thus placing the "naturals" of
      > my decatonic system on the black keys, with the white keys
      > acting as "sharps" and "flats" . . . yes?

      Yes indeed. In fact I was just rereading your paper "Tuning,
      Tonality, and Twenty-Two-Tone Temperament" and I'm going to tune my
      system that way today and give it a try.

      I have to ask what is your relation to JI?

      This far I myself have been interested in both the temperaments and
      just intonation. Personally I find it wise to tune scales derived
      from Combination Product Sets or Tonality Diamonds in Just Intonation
      since it is not particularly important to be able to modulate in
      these systems. Strictly pure intervals give these scales an eerie
      edge. I don't find justly tuned intervals boring at all as some
      people do.

      I am also interested in synthetic scales (which do not have any
      prototypes in Just Intonation) because I'm a fan of Olivier Messiaen
      and Iannis Xenakis.

      Kalle
    • kalleaho@mappi.helsinki.fi
      Hi Dan and many thanks for your reply! Unfortunately the rents have been going up here in Finland too, especially in Helsinki. That s mainly because some
      Message 2 of 7 , Aug 1, 2001
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        Hi Dan
        and many thanks for your reply!

        Unfortunately the rents have been going up here in Finland too,
        especially in Helsinki. That's mainly because some people in the
        Nokia Corporation have too much money and their landlords want their
        share of it too. And so they raise all rents in the city.

        Nevertheless my rent is still under 250$ since I reside in
        Ostrobotnia Student's Union's flatlet which has 17 1/2 square meters
        of space. Nowadays this is very rare so I'm very fortunate. I can
        even concentrate on my studies and not take jobs for whole year if I
        live modestly. This is very important since I want to have time to
        make music too.

        Kalle
      • Paul Erlich
        ... of ... A love-hate relationship :) Seriously, as you can see in the paper, I think consonance has a huge amount to do with approximating simple JI ratios,
        Message 3 of 7 , Aug 1, 2001
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          --- In tuning@y..., kalleaho@m... wrote:
          > --- In tuning@y..., "Paul Erlich" <paul@s...> wrote:
          >
          > > I'm assuming you're familiar with my solution for 22-tET, which
          > > omits the "E" keys on the keyboard, thus placing the "naturals"
          of
          > > my decatonic system on the black keys, with the white keys
          > > acting as "sharps" and "flats" . . . yes?
          >
          > Yes indeed. In fact I was just rereading your paper "Tuning,
          > Tonality, and Twenty-Two-Tone Temperament" and I'm going to tune my
          > system that way today and give it a try.
          >
          > I have to ask what is your relation to JI?

          A love-hate relationship :) Seriously, as you can see in the paper, I
          think consonance has a huge amount to do with approximating simple JI
          ratios, but when it comes to tuning systems, I agree with Dave Keenan
          that some form of temperament (not necessarily equal temperament) can
          usually have more benefits than costs. We study these matters quite a
          bit on <tuning-math@yahoogroups.com>.
          >
          > This far I myself have been interested in both the temperaments and
          > just intonation.

          Hopefully, by "temperaments" you don't just mean equal temperaments.

          > Personally I find it wise to tune scales derived
          > from Combination Product Sets or Tonality Diamonds in Just
          Intonation
          > since it is not particularly important to be able to modulate in
          > these systems.

          That makes absolutely perfect sense. However, many composers who have
          used these JI structures, such as Harry Partch and Kraig Grady, have
          embedded them in larger JI scales which "fill the holes" in a way
          that allows for many more consonant relationships, as well as a sort
          of full melodic flexibility. These scales generally conform to
          Fokker's conception of "periodicity blocks" in the lattice. Dave
          Keenan has shown convincingly that certain very fine temperings (NOT
          ETs -- think meantone as a simple example) of these larger JI scales
          can _greatly_ increase the number of consonant relationships, while
          (to our ears) not materially decreasing the consonance of each of
          these intervals. The details, and general principles, of all this are
          being discussed mainly on <tuning-math@yahoogroups.com>, but much is
          to be found in the archives of this list. Dave Keenan has also
          constructed "microtemperaments" for JI scales that are not
          periodicity blocks, for example Dean Drummond's "zoomoozophone" scale.

          > Strictly pure intervals give these scales an eerie
          > edge. I don't find justly tuned intervals boring at all as some
          > people do.

          I would at least try out some of Dave Keenan's microtemperaments, to
          see if the quality of the slightly-tempered intervals is
          aesthetically useful to you.
          >
          > I am also interested in synthetic scales (which do not have any
          > prototypes in Just Intonation) because I'm a fan of Olivier
          Messiaen
          > and Iannis Xenakis.

          You might be surprised how synthetic scales can often be related to
          just intonation scales with certain "commas" tempered out . . .
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