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RE: [tracker2] New feature for the OT2

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  • 'Scott Miller'
    It could certainly be done. It already keeps a total count of digi d packets. It d take a little more work to make it a 10-minute count, and to have it
    Message 1 of 7 , May 8, 2007
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      It could certainly be done.  It already keeps a total count of digi'd packets. It'd take a little more work to make it a 10-minute count, and to have it announce the load automatically.
       
      Scott


      From: tracker2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:tracker2@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of James Ewen
      Sent: Friday, May 04, 2007 8:01 PM
      To: tracker2@yahoogroups.com
      Subject: [tracker2] New feature for the OT2

      I just answered a recurring question for the umpteenth time on the
      NWAPRS reflector... How come I see delayed packets.

      My theory that I am sticking with is channel overloading. I run
      UI-Traffic on my home station with UI-View. It allows me to graph the
      traffic that I see at my station. It also sends out an object beacon
      every 10 minutes with the latest channel loading, like this:

      VE6SRV-1>APU25N, TCPIP*,qAC, T2MONTANA: ;SRV
      *040259z5331. 31N\11317. 42W?28 In 10 Minutes

      I keep trying to convice people that even if it is quiet in the
      valley, the channel may be overloaded up at the digipeater. Packets
      that have the hops all used up still get heard at the digipeater, they
      just don't get acted upon. They still use up local air time.

      So I was thinking, maybe I could put a computer up at the digipeater,
      and have the OT2 send the packets to the computer which would be able
      to graph the activity. But then I thought, most people wouldn't want
      to have a computer at the digi, nor would they have internet access
      there. Hmm, what about having the digipeater keep track of the number
      of packets heard, and report that the same as UI-Traffic does. Even
      beyond that it could report packets heard, and packets digipeated.
      This would inform people of how many packets are being heard versus
      the number that get digipeated. It's quite possible to have 30 packets
      heard per minute, but only 10 of those digipeated because the other 20
      had used up paths. To users in the valley below, the channel load
      appears to only be 33% of what the digipeater is hearing.

      This would be a useful tool to teach people that putting digipeaters
      on the absolute highest point around is not such a good thing in high
      use areas. Highly congested areas need to pull the high digis down and
      create more smaller coverage area digis to allow for the higher user
      density.

      To implement something like this would only take a couple variables,
      one to keep a 10 minute timer, one to keep track of the number of
      packets heard, and a final one to keep track of the number of packets
      digipeated. You'd also need a command line switch to enable/disable
      sending the report out. Obviously some people would not want the
      report, and some would. The reporting could be turned on occasionally
      to assess traffic loading, and turned off again later.

      The report could be something along the lines of
      SRV *040259z5331. 31N\11317. 42W?34 of 56 in 10 minutes

      BTW Scott, I'll be at Dayton, and I have a whole sack full of whacky
      ideas I want to throw at you including multiple outgoing path
      settings, and geodigipeating.

      James
      VE6SRV

    • James Ewen
      ... I agree that keeping track of the total number of packets versus number of packets in the last 10 minutes is a bit more of a challenge. The annoucement
      Message 2 of 7 , May 8, 2007
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        On 5/8/07, Scott Miller <scott@...> wrote:

        > It could certainly be done. It already keeps a total count of digi'd packets.
        > It'd take a little more work to make it a 10-minute count, and to have it
        > announce the load automatically.

        I agree that keeping track of the total number of packets versus
        number of packets in the last 10 minutes is a bit more of a challenge.
        The annoucement portion is similar to a status beacon, you just grab
        the appropriate values out of the variables and stuff them into the
        string.

        Another concept that I would like to see in the OT is the concept of
        multiple outgoing paths. This allows us to send position reports
        varying distances. Bob uses a concept that I developed a few years ago
        and showed him. He tossed it aside, but now he has reintroduced the
        concept, and calls it proportional pathing.

        In the APRS world, local objects are of more importance than distant
        objects. Things that are happening closer to us are of more interest
        than things happening far away. Also, things that are happening
        currently are of more importance than things that happened in the
        past. To implement these concepts we want to set up our trackers to
        report current information to those close to us at a reasonably rapid
        rate, while keeping those further away updated at a slower rate. We
        also want to update changing information as soon as it happens, but
        report static information at a slower rate.

        By using multiple length paths, you can send more packets out to those
        close by, while still sending packets out a couple hops as well. We
        use this concept with the 4 LTP settings in the Kantronics line to
        send packets out locally every 10 minutes, out a little further every
        30 minutes, and the longest distance packets every hour.

        In Byon's TinyTrak, you can make this happen using the alternate digi
        paths option. If you set one path to WIDE2-1, and the second to
        WIDE2-2, you can keep people nearby updated in a timely fashion, but
        effectively decrease the load you are creating on neighboring
        digipeaters by 1/2. Having 3 or 4 alternate digi paths can allow even
        better optimization of your channel load. With 4 paths, I can set up
        paths such as: local, WIDE2-1, local, WIDE2-2 (where local is no
        path). If I beacon every 60 seconds, those within simplex range see me
        every minute. Those within one hop see me every 2 minutes, and those
        within 2 hops see me every 4 minutes. This also works with
        SmartBeaconing (tm), just the timing is obviously different. Also,
        with 4 digi paths we can set up the OT2 in digipeater mode with a
        proportional pathing solution like the KPC-3 settings Bob suggests.

        You'll find that people are interested in letting others know where
        they are by beaconing quite often. They also want to tell people for
        miles around where they are. Lots of beacons going out over a long
        path causes network congestion. Alternate digi paths allow people to
        beacon at a rapid rate, and also get their position reports out over a
        long path. Close in the rate is rapid, but the further you go away,
        the slower the effective beacon rate. This type of operation keeps
        everyone happy.

        I told you I had some ideas I wanted to toss at you. There's still more!

        James
        VE6SRV
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