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Re: [tracker2] New feature for the OT2

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  • James Ewen
    ... Uh... ummm... errr... That s a MANLY kinda love, right? Not that there s anything wrong with the other kind/being
    Message 1 of 7 , May 4, 2007
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      On 5/4/07, Jason Rausch <lists@...> wrote:

      > Joking with love 73's

      Uh... ummm... errr... That's a MANLY kinda love, right?
      <insert lots of Tool Time grunting here>

      Not that there's anything wrong with the other kind/being politically
      correct 73's

      James
      VE6SRV
    • James Ewen
      ... Oh, yeah I forgot to reply to your comment! I wouldn t mind doing that, but I hear that there are going to be at least 2 or 3 other people attending the
      Message 2 of 7 , May 4, 2007
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        On 5/4/07, Jason Rausch <lists@...> wrote:

        > After all of the emails you and I have passed back and
        > fourth in the last month, I am convinced we need to
        > just set a chair aside, just for you in our booth.
        > You'll be there the whole weekend ;o)

        Oh, yeah I forgot to reply to your comment!

        I wouldn't mind doing that, but I hear that there are going to be at
        least 2 or 3 other people attending the Hamvention wandering around
        that would probably want to chat to you guys in your booth. I'm sure
        we could curtain off the booths and sit and have a nice chat session
        for the weekend, but it gets expensive sitting in those private
        cubicles.

        Last time I was there I just about lost my voice talking to all those
        silly people on the outside of my booth. I am going to buy some throat
        lozenges this time. I should send my wife, she can babble all day
        without taking a breath! I'm used to sitting, nodding, and admitting
        that it's all my fault!

        I do hope that we can get together for a little time to discuss APRS
        for a while!

        James
        VE6SRV
      • Keri Morgret
        Is THIS what I paid good money to go to Dayton for? Scott didn t tell me about this type of love at the booth.. Keri N6TME
        Message 3 of 7 , May 4, 2007
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          Is THIS what I paid good money to go to Dayton for? Scott didn't tell
          me about this type of love at the booth..

          Keri
          N6TME

          At 09:48 PM 5/4/2007, James Ewen wrote:
          >On 5/4/07, Jason Rausch <lists@...> wrote:
          >
          > > Joking with love 73's
          >
          >Uh... ummm... errr... That's a MANLY kinda love, right?
          ><insert lots of Tool Time grunting here>
          >
          >Not that there's anything wrong with the other kind/being politically
          >correct 73's
          >
          >James
          >VE6SRV
        • 'Scott Miller'
          It could certainly be done. It already keeps a total count of digi d packets. It d take a little more work to make it a 10-minute count, and to have it
          Message 4 of 7 , May 8, 2007
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            It could certainly be done.  It already keeps a total count of digi'd packets. It'd take a little more work to make it a 10-minute count, and to have it announce the load automatically.
             
            Scott


            From: tracker2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:tracker2@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of James Ewen
            Sent: Friday, May 04, 2007 8:01 PM
            To: tracker2@yahoogroups.com
            Subject: [tracker2] New feature for the OT2

            I just answered a recurring question for the umpteenth time on the
            NWAPRS reflector... How come I see delayed packets.

            My theory that I am sticking with is channel overloading. I run
            UI-Traffic on my home station with UI-View. It allows me to graph the
            traffic that I see at my station. It also sends out an object beacon
            every 10 minutes with the latest channel loading, like this:

            VE6SRV-1>APU25N, TCPIP*,qAC, T2MONTANA: ;SRV
            *040259z5331. 31N\11317. 42W?28 In 10 Minutes

            I keep trying to convice people that even if it is quiet in the
            valley, the channel may be overloaded up at the digipeater. Packets
            that have the hops all used up still get heard at the digipeater, they
            just don't get acted upon. They still use up local air time.

            So I was thinking, maybe I could put a computer up at the digipeater,
            and have the OT2 send the packets to the computer which would be able
            to graph the activity. But then I thought, most people wouldn't want
            to have a computer at the digi, nor would they have internet access
            there. Hmm, what about having the digipeater keep track of the number
            of packets heard, and report that the same as UI-Traffic does. Even
            beyond that it could report packets heard, and packets digipeated.
            This would inform people of how many packets are being heard versus
            the number that get digipeated. It's quite possible to have 30 packets
            heard per minute, but only 10 of those digipeated because the other 20
            had used up paths. To users in the valley below, the channel load
            appears to only be 33% of what the digipeater is hearing.

            This would be a useful tool to teach people that putting digipeaters
            on the absolute highest point around is not such a good thing in high
            use areas. Highly congested areas need to pull the high digis down and
            create more smaller coverage area digis to allow for the higher user
            density.

            To implement something like this would only take a couple variables,
            one to keep a 10 minute timer, one to keep track of the number of
            packets heard, and a final one to keep track of the number of packets
            digipeated. You'd also need a command line switch to enable/disable
            sending the report out. Obviously some people would not want the
            report, and some would. The reporting could be turned on occasionally
            to assess traffic loading, and turned off again later.

            The report could be something along the lines of
            SRV *040259z5331. 31N\11317. 42W?34 of 56 in 10 minutes

            BTW Scott, I'll be at Dayton, and I have a whole sack full of whacky
            ideas I want to throw at you including multiple outgoing path
            settings, and geodigipeating.

            James
            VE6SRV

          • James Ewen
            ... I agree that keeping track of the total number of packets versus number of packets in the last 10 minutes is a bit more of a challenge. The annoucement
            Message 5 of 7 , May 8, 2007
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              On 5/8/07, Scott Miller <scott@...> wrote:

              > It could certainly be done. It already keeps a total count of digi'd packets.
              > It'd take a little more work to make it a 10-minute count, and to have it
              > announce the load automatically.

              I agree that keeping track of the total number of packets versus
              number of packets in the last 10 minutes is a bit more of a challenge.
              The annoucement portion is similar to a status beacon, you just grab
              the appropriate values out of the variables and stuff them into the
              string.

              Another concept that I would like to see in the OT is the concept of
              multiple outgoing paths. This allows us to send position reports
              varying distances. Bob uses a concept that I developed a few years ago
              and showed him. He tossed it aside, but now he has reintroduced the
              concept, and calls it proportional pathing.

              In the APRS world, local objects are of more importance than distant
              objects. Things that are happening closer to us are of more interest
              than things happening far away. Also, things that are happening
              currently are of more importance than things that happened in the
              past. To implement these concepts we want to set up our trackers to
              report current information to those close to us at a reasonably rapid
              rate, while keeping those further away updated at a slower rate. We
              also want to update changing information as soon as it happens, but
              report static information at a slower rate.

              By using multiple length paths, you can send more packets out to those
              close by, while still sending packets out a couple hops as well. We
              use this concept with the 4 LTP settings in the Kantronics line to
              send packets out locally every 10 minutes, out a little further every
              30 minutes, and the longest distance packets every hour.

              In Byon's TinyTrak, you can make this happen using the alternate digi
              paths option. If you set one path to WIDE2-1, and the second to
              WIDE2-2, you can keep people nearby updated in a timely fashion, but
              effectively decrease the load you are creating on neighboring
              digipeaters by 1/2. Having 3 or 4 alternate digi paths can allow even
              better optimization of your channel load. With 4 paths, I can set up
              paths such as: local, WIDE2-1, local, WIDE2-2 (where local is no
              path). If I beacon every 60 seconds, those within simplex range see me
              every minute. Those within one hop see me every 2 minutes, and those
              within 2 hops see me every 4 minutes. This also works with
              SmartBeaconing (tm), just the timing is obviously different. Also,
              with 4 digi paths we can set up the OT2 in digipeater mode with a
              proportional pathing solution like the KPC-3 settings Bob suggests.

              You'll find that people are interested in letting others know where
              they are by beaconing quite often. They also want to tell people for
              miles around where they are. Lots of beacons going out over a long
              path causes network congestion. Alternate digi paths allow people to
              beacon at a rapid rate, and also get their position reports out over a
              long path. Close in the rate is rapid, but the further you go away,
              the slower the effective beacon rate. This type of operation keeps
              everyone happy.

              I told you I had some ideas I wanted to toss at you. There's still more!

              James
              VE6SRV
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