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Viscous digipeating for power savings

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  • Tom Hayward
    ... Not to hijack the thread or anything, but I d really like the ability to ... Do you find that transmitting is a significant portion of your power budget?
    Message 1 of 6 , Mar 8, 2013
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      On Thu, Mar 7, 2013 at 11:55 PM, zl1vfo <zl1vfo@...> wrote:
      >
      Not to hijack the thread or anything, but I'd really like the ability to
      > do Viscous Digipeating, a la
      > <http://wiki.ham.fi/Viscous_APRS_Digipeater>
      >
      > Its very useful for solar powered digis where you have to watch your power
      > budget, yet still be useful.
      >
      > -Ian ZL1VFO

      Do you find that transmitting is a significant portion of your power
      budget? All of the calculations I have done put most of the power into
      standby and receive.

      Tom KD7LXL
    • James Ewen
      ... What s your network load? Any packet coming in with a valid hop request will trigger a digipeat. If you are operating a fill-in digipeater in an area where
      Message 2 of 6 , Mar 8, 2013
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        On Fri, Mar 8, 2013 at 11:18 AM, Tom Hayward <tom@...> wrote:

        > Do you find that transmitting is a significant portion of your power
        > budget? All of the calculations I have done put most of the power into
        > standby and receive.

        What's your network load? Any packet coming in with a valid hop
        request will trigger a digipeat.

        If you are operating a fill-in digipeater in an area where people run
        WIDE1-1 from their high powered mobile stations, or home stations, you
        can get a significant number of transmissions queued.

        If the main digipeaters handle the packet, there's no need to
        digipeat. However that low powered HT nearby that needs a boost should
        be able to get the help it needs.

        If the power budget can't handle the unnecessary requests, the only
        option is to shut it down. If however one could only handle the
        requests that ACTUALLY need a boost, one could reduce the power
        consumption using viscous digipeating.

        --
        James
        VE6SRV
      • Tom Hayward
        ... The places I have considered installing solar digipeaters are all out in the boonies--areas where there are zero permanent APRS users, and maybe a few
        Message 3 of 6 , Mar 8, 2013
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          On Fri, Mar 8, 2013 at 12:46 PM, James Ewen <ve6srv@...> wrote:
          > On Fri, Mar 8, 2013 at 11:18 AM, Tom Hayward <tom@...> wrote:
          >
          > > Do you find that transmitting is a significant portion of your power
          > > budget? All of the calculations I have done put most of the power into
          > > standby and receive.
          >
          > What's your network load? Any packet coming in with a valid hop
          > request will trigger a digipeat.

          The places I have considered installing solar digipeaters are all out
          in the boonies--areas where there are zero permanent APRS users, and
          maybe a few mobile users driving through each day. The solar digi
          would respond to WIDE1-1, SARn-N, and TEMPn-N. It would be able to
          receive many other digipeaters, but not many unused WIDE1-1 paths. All
          the big sites in populated areas around here have commercial power and
          often Internet (for igating, naturally), so I've never considered
          putting a solar digi in a high-traffic area.

          > If the power budget can't handle the unnecessary requests, the only
          > option is to shut it down. If however one could only handle the
          > requests that ACTUALLY need a boost, one could reduce the power
          > consumption using viscous digipeating.

          I understand the point of viscous digipeating, and I would welcome it
          on the Tracker series, I just don't think it would affect my power
          budget much.

          Tom KD7LXL
        • James Ewen
          ... So you are creating RX only digipeaters basically. One would need to use the specialized aliases to be able to get packets back into the area. ... Most
          Message 4 of 6 , Mar 8, 2013
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            On Fri, Mar 8, 2013 at 1:56 PM, Tom Hayward <tom@...> wrote:

            > The places I have considered installing solar digipeaters are all out
            > in the boonies--areas where there are zero permanent APRS users, and
            > maybe a few mobile users driving through each day. The solar digi
            > would respond to WIDE1-1, SARn-N, and TEMPn-N.

            So you are creating RX only digipeaters basically. One would need to
            use the specialized aliases to be able to get packets back into the
            area.

            > I understand the point of viscous digipeating, and I would welcome it
            > on the Tracker series, I just don't think it would affect my power
            > budget much.

            Most likely quite true for you, but for Ian, it obviously does affect
            his power budget.

            Some people like your neighbor Bill WA7NWP advocates that EVERY APRS
            station should support WIDE1-1 digipeating. I would go along with that
            statement if EVERY home station supported ONLY WIDE1-1 via viscous
            digipeating.

            --
            James
            VE6SRV
          • zl1vfo
            Where the digi is, is on the edge of a city, so it will hear a reasonable amount of traffic. The site USED to be mains powered, until the Aircraft NDB beacon
            Message 5 of 6 , Mar 9, 2013
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              Where the digi is, is on the edge of a city, so it will hear a reasonable amount of traffic. The site USED to be mains powered, until the Aircraft NDB beacon was decommisioned after about 50 years of service. So the digi morphed from a Kenwood and a Tiny2/UIDigi to a Maxon Data radio and a OT2 for low power consumption + Solar panel, regulator, and a pair of batteries
              Now, while we are presently in summer here, with days end to end of clear blue sky and heaps of sunlight, power consumtion is not a problem.
              However, in winter, when you can get a week or two of grey skies and rain, then looking to save a bit of power here and there becomes a good idea.
              Viscous digipeating is just another tool in the toolbox, it might save a bit of power, and keep a few more air time slots free for the odd times of the day when things become busy. Either way it's unlikely to harm anything, and more likely to help, so its something that would be good to have available.

              -Ian ZL1VFO

              --- In tracker2@yahoogroups.com, James Ewen <ve6srv@...> wrote:
              >
              > On Fri, Mar 8, 2013 at 1:56 PM, Tom Hayward <tom@...> wrote:
              >
              > > The places I have considered installing solar digipeaters are all out
              > > in the boonies--areas where there are zero permanent APRS users, and
              > > maybe a few mobile users driving through each day. The solar digi
              > > would respond to WIDE1-1, SARn-N, and TEMPn-N.
              >
              > So you are creating RX only digipeaters basically. One would need to
              > use the specialized aliases to be able to get packets back into the
              > area.
              >
              > > I understand the point of viscous digipeating, and I would welcome it
              > > on the Tracker series, I just don't think it would affect my power
              > > budget much.
              >
              > Most likely quite true for you, but for Ian, it obviously does affect
              > his power budget.
              >
              > Some people like your neighbor Bill WA7NWP advocates that EVERY APRS
              > station should support WIDE1-1 digipeating. I would go along with that
              > statement if EVERY home station supported ONLY WIDE1-1 via viscous
              > digipeating.
              >
              > --
              > James
              > VE6SRV
              >
            • captnkliegle
              I ve been running a solar WX digi for years, using an HT (very old Icom HT) makes RX consumption very low, but still 5W on TX into a good high gain antenna.
              Message 6 of 6 , Mar 11, 2013
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                I've been running a solar WX digi for years, using an HT (very old Icom HT) makes RX consumption very low, but still 5W on TX into a good high gain antenna. Even on a cloudy day, my panels still supply a surplus of power. It's the short winter, cloudy days one has to plan for. I use some slightly used 6V golf cart batteries in series for power storage, never an issue!

                Operating equipment:

                Icom IC-24
                KPC-3
                Argentdata WX station (WX data only, not using internal PIC since it won't do digipeating)

                KA1GJU-3



                --- In tracker2@yahoogroups.com, "zl1vfo" <zl1vfo@...> wrote:
                >
                > Where the digi is, is on the edge of a city, so it will hear a reasonable amount of traffic. The site USED to be mains powered, until the Aircraft NDB beacon was decommisioned after about 50 years of service. So the digi morphed from a Kenwood and a Tiny2/UIDigi to a Maxon Data radio and a OT2 for low power consumption + Solar panel, regulator, and a pair of batteries
                > Now, while we are presently in summer here, with days end to end of clear blue sky and heaps of sunlight, power consumtion is not a problem.
                > However, in winter, when you can get a week or two of grey skies and rain, then looking to save a bit of power here and there becomes a good idea.
                > Viscous digipeating is just another tool in the toolbox, it might save a bit of power, and keep a few more air time slots free for the odd times of the day when things become busy. Either way it's unlikely to harm anything, and more likely to help, so its something that would be good to have available.
                >
                > -Ian ZL1VFO
                >
                > --- In tracker2@yahoogroups.com, James Ewen <ve6srv@> wrote:
                > >
                > > On Fri, Mar 8, 2013 at 1:56 PM, Tom Hayward <tom@> wrote:
                > >
                > > > The places I have considered installing solar digipeaters are all out
                > > > in the boonies--areas where there are zero permanent APRS users, and
                > > > maybe a few mobile users driving through each day. The solar digi
                > > > would respond to WIDE1-1, SARn-N, and TEMPn-N.
                > >
                > > So you are creating RX only digipeaters basically. One would need to
                > > use the specialized aliases to be able to get packets back into the
                > > area.
                > >
                > > > I understand the point of viscous digipeating, and I would welcome it
                > > > on the Tracker series, I just don't think it would affect my power
                > > > budget much.
                > >
                > > Most likely quite true for you, but for Ian, it obviously does affect
                > > his power budget.
                > >
                > > Some people like your neighbor Bill WA7NWP advocates that EVERY APRS
                > > station should support WIDE1-1 digipeating. I would go along with that
                > > statement if EVERY home station supported ONLY WIDE1-1 via viscous
                > > digipeating.
                > >
                > > --
                > > James
                > > VE6SRV
                > >
                >
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