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Re: [tracker2] Re: Not transmitting while moving

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  • Lynn W. Deffenbaugh (Mr)
    4) wow, flutter, picket-fencing, and other RF interference while mobile. Especially from a lower-powered transmitter. I routinely deliver more packets
    Message 1 of 24 , Dec 7, 2011
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      4) wow, flutter, picket-fencing, and other RF interference while
      mobile. Especially from a lower-powered transmitter.

      I routinely deliver more packets sitting on parking lots beaconing
      slowly than I do while mobile. Lots of strange things happen when in
      motion and AX.25 requires every single bit to be perfect to have a good
      packet.

      Lynn (D) - KJ4ERJ - Author of APRSISCE for Windows Mobile and Win32

      On 12/7/2011 2:20 PM, francois.rogez wrote:
      >
      > --- In tracker2@yahoogroups.com, James Ewen<ve6srv@...> wrote:
      >> On Tue, Dec 6, 2011 at 10:17 PM, francois.rogez<ffdef@...> wrote:
      >>
      >>> I can see packets on aprs.fi almost every minutes while stopped, but almost no packet while driving.
      >>>
      >>> Any suggestions on how to make this work while moving?
      >> What's your outgoing path?
      >>
      >> The only packets I see are ALL using N6EX-4 70 km across Los Angeles.
      >>
      >> http://aprs.fi/?c=raw&call=WZ6FR-2
      >>
      >> It's amazing you are being heard at all. Use WIDE2-1 as your outgoing
      >> path and try again.
      >>
      >> --
      >> James
      >> VE6SRV
      >>
      > Thanks James,
      >
      > I have changed my path to WIDE2-1, but there was no improvement.
      > I am guessing that those far-away i-gates are just quicker to put the data on aprs-is.
      >
      > So, I am looking at what could possibly happen when moving:
      > 1 - unwanted profile change
      > 2 - weird power supply issue
      > 3 - GPS loosing lock
      >
      > I don't think it's (1) because I duplicated the same settings on both profiles
      > I don't know how to troubleshoot (2). I am seeing between 13 and 14V, and don't have tools to check for rapid fluctuations
      > So I would like to poke at (3)
      >
      > I tried the SNOOP command to look at the data coming from the GPS, but the T2-301 responded "invalid command". Firmware is 54746
      > Can the ADS-GM1 be connected to a computer serial port directly, and will it receive power?
      >
      > In the meantime, I enabled the "save" checkbox for the GPS position to see if it results in more transmissions.
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > ------------------------------------
      >
      > Yahoo! Groups Links
      >
      >
      >
      >
    • djhuff@rockwellcollins.com
      I would echo what Lynn is saying as well, I might suggest the following items. 1. Try driving somewhere with a laptop connected to the GPS via RS232, and a GPS
      Message 2 of 24 , Dec 7, 2011
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        I would echo what Lynn is saying as well, I might suggest the following items.
        1. Try driving somewhere with a laptop connected to the GPS via RS232, and a GPS logging program. (or try a Y cable) This helps rule out the GPS losing lock.
        2. Try running the system using a 12V battery instead of vehicle power. Most hams I know have at least one 12v battery somewhere, or you can get one cheap.
        3. Drive around in a big square, or similar pattern, try to pull into a parking lot somewhere, and stop for a minute. It will be easier to know if your GPS configuration is getting into the internet.
        4. Find a scanner or handheld radio, and tune to your local APRS frequency (144.39 in the US), after a while, your ear will be able to tell if what you hear sounds normal.

        Hope this helps,
        Dave W0IM




        From:        "Lynn W. Deffenbaugh (Mr)" <ldeffenb@...>
        To:        tracker2@yahoogroups.com
        Date:        12/07/2011 01:57 PM
        Subject:        Re: [tracker2] Re: Not transmitting while moving
        Sent by:        tracker2@yahoogroups.com




         

        4) wow, flutter, picket-fencing, and other RF interference while
        mobile. Especially from a lower-powered transmitter.

        I routinely deliver more packets sitting on parking lots beaconing
        slowly than I do while mobile. Lots of strange things happen when in
        motion and AX.25 requires every single bit to be perfect to have a good
        packet.

        Lynn (D) - KJ4ERJ - Author of APRSISCE for Windows Mobile and Win32

        On 12/7/2011 2:20 PM, francois.rogez wrote:
        >
        > --- In
        tracker2@yahoogroups.com, James Ewen<ve6srv@...> wrote:
        >> On Tue, Dec 6, 2011 at 10:17 PM, francois.rogez<ffdef@...> wrote:
        >>
        >>> I can see packets on aprs.fi almost every minutes while stopped, but almost no packet while driving.
        >>>
        >>> Any suggestions on how to make this work while moving?
        >> What's your outgoing path?
        >>
        >> The only packets I see are ALL using N6EX-4 70 km across Los Angeles.
        >>
        >>
        http://aprs.fi/?c=raw&call=WZ6FR-2
        >>
        >> It's amazing you are being heard at all. Use WIDE2-1 as your outgoing
        >> path and try again.
        >>
        >> --
        >> James
        >> VE6SRV
        >>
        > Thanks James,
        >
        > I have changed my path to WIDE2-1, but there was no improvement.
        > I am guessing that those far-away i-gates are just quicker to put the data on aprs-is.
        >
        > So, I am looking at what could possibly happen when moving:
        > 1 - unwanted profile change
        > 2 - weird power supply issue
        > 3 - GPS loosing lock
        >
        > I don't think it's (1) because I duplicated the same settings on both profiles
        > I don't know how to troubleshoot (2). I am seeing between 13 and 14V, and don't have tools to check for rapid fluctuations
        > So I would like to poke at (3)
        >
        > I tried the SNOOP command to look at the data coming from the GPS, but the T2-301 responded "invalid command". Firmware is 54746
        > Can the ADS-GM1 be connected to a computer serial port directly, and will it receive power?
        >
        > In the meantime, I enabled the "save" checkbox for the GPS position to see if it results in more transmissions.
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > ------------------------------------
        >
        > Yahoo! Groups Links
        >
        >
        >
        >



      • Lynn W. Deffenbaugh (Mr)
        And I just noticed your subject was Not transmitting , but yet you re body talked about seeing packets on aprs.fi . Those are actually two different things
        Message 3 of 24 , Dec 7, 2011
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          And I just noticed your subject was "Not transmitting", but yet you're body talked about seeing "packets on aprs.fi".  Those are actually two different things and two different problems.  Your proposal of GPS losing fix would cause a "not transmitting" while most of the other issues (paths, noisy RF, profile changes) would cause those transmissions to not make it through an IGate to aprs.fi.  So I'd suggest a new first step.

          0) - Drive around with someone else and stare at the transmit indicator on your rig to determine if it's a "not transmitting" issue or a "not arriving to aprs.fi" issue.

          Lynn (D) - KJ4ERJ - Author of APRSISCE for Windows Mobile and Win32

          On 12/7/2011 3:24 PM, djhuff@... wrote: I would echo what Lynn is saying as well, I might suggest the following items.
          1. Try driving somewhere with a laptop connected to the GPS via RS232, and a GPS logging program. (or try a Y cable) This helps rule out the GPS losing lock.
          2. Try running the system using a 12V battery instead of vehicle power. Most hams I know have at least one 12v battery somewhere, or you can get one cheap.
          3. Drive around in a big square, or similar pattern, try to pull into a parking lot somewhere, and stop for a minute. It will be easier to know if your GPS configuration is getting into the internet.
          4. Find a scanner or handheld radio, and tune to your local APRS frequency (144.39 in the US), after a while, your ear will be able to tell if what you hear sounds normal.

          Hope this helps,
          Dave W0IM




          From:        "Lynn W. Deffenbaugh (Mr)" <ldeffenb@...>
          To:        tracker2@yahoogroups.com
          Date:        12/07/2011 01:57 PM
          Subject:        Re: [tracker2] Re: Not transmitting while moving
          Sent by:        tracker2@yahoogroups.com




           

          4) wow, flutter, picket-fencing, and other RF interference while
          mobile. Especially from a lower-powered transmitter.

          I routinely deliver more packets sitting on parking lots beaconing
          slowly than I do while mobile. Lots of strange things happen when in
          motion and AX.25 requires every single bit to be perfect to have a good
          packet.

          Lynn (D) - KJ4ERJ - Author of APRSISCE for Windows Mobile and Win32

          On 12/7/2011 2:20 PM, francois.rogez wrote:
          >
          > --- In
          tracker2@yahoogroups.com, James Ewen<ve6srv@...> wrote:
          >> On Tue, Dec 6, 2011 at 10:17 PM, francois.rogez<ffdef@...> wrote:
          >>
          >>> I can see packets on aprs.fi almost every minutes while stopped, but almost no packet while driving.
          >>>
          >>> Any suggestions on how to make this work while moving?
          >> What's your outgoing path?
          >>
          >> The only packets I see are ALL using N6EX-4 70 km across Los Angeles.
          >>
          >>
          http://aprs.fi/?c=raw&call=WZ6FR-2
          >>
          >> It's amazing you are being heard at all. Use WIDE2-1 as your outgoing
          >> path and try again.
          >>
          >> --
          >> James
          >> VE6SRV
          >>
          > Thanks James,
          >
          > I have changed my path to WIDE2-1, but there was no improvement.
          > I am guessing that those far-away i-gates are just quicker to put the data on aprs-is.
          >
          > So, I am looking at what could possibly happen when moving:
          > 1 - unwanted profile change
          > 2 - weird power supply issue
          > 3 - GPS loosing lock
          >
          > I don't think it's (1) because I duplicated the same settings on both profiles
          > I don't know how to troubleshoot (2). I am seeing between 13 and 14V, and don't have tools to check for rapid fluctuations
          > So I would like to poke at (3)
          >
          > I tried the SNOOP command to look at the data coming from the GPS, but the T2-301 responded "invalid command". Firmware is 54746
          > Can the ADS-GM1 be connected to a computer serial port directly, and will it receive power?
          >
          > In the meantime, I enabled the "save" checkbox for the GPS position to see if it results in more transmissions.
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > ------------------------------------
          >
          > Yahoo! Groups Links
          >
          >
          >
          >




        • James Ewen
          ... It is very strange that only one digipeater in all of LA can hear you... looking at the last 1000 packets, it looks like there are other issues afoot that
          Message 4 of 24 , Dec 7, 2011
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            On Wed, Dec 7, 2011 at 12:20 PM, francois.rogez <ffdef@...> wrote:

            > I have changed my path to WIDE2-1, but there was no improvement.
            > I am guessing that those far-away i-gates are just quicker to put the data on aprs-is.

            It is very strange that only one digipeater in all of LA can hear
            you... looking at the last 1000 packets, it looks like there are other
            issues afoot that make it very difficult for us to diagnose the issues
            from what we can see based on the heavily filtered APRS-IS feed.

            2011-12-05 10:16:57 MST:
            WZ6FR-2>APOT21,WA6JFK-1,WIDE1*,WIDE2-1,qAR,N6EX-3:!3412.12N/11810.35W.142/00012.5V

            That shows that for at least a little bit you were using a
            WIDE1-1,WIDE2-1 outgoing path.

            2011-12-05 10:29:47 MST:
            WZ6FR-2>APOT21,N6EX-4*,qAR,WL7AG-10:!3412.12N/11810.35W.142/000/A=00127912.5V

            This packet not long after shows only a single used up hop handled by
            N6EX-4, with no trace of the original path used. Shortly after again
            we see another packet with the WIDE1-1,WIDE2-1 remnants, which
            probably indicates that you are running that path, and the APRS
            network in LA is screwed up and destroying the path as it is handled.

            That still doesn't explain why N6EX-4 handles so many of the packets.
            Are you on an alternate frequency, or on 144.390?

            N6NEX-4 appears to be handling the majority packets, packets that
            probably have been handled by other digipeaters, but due to
            misconfigured settings in N6EX-4, we can not see where the packet has
            been.

            Without being able to see what is happening on RF in your area we have
            little chance of being able to help diagnose the problem.

            The APRS-IS view of your area shows a number of digipeaters close to
            your location. You should be heard by them. Do you have another radio?
            If you could download a copy of APRSISCE/32 and set that up with a
            soundcard modem tied into the second radio (or if you have another
            APRS rig, tie that into APRSISCE/32), we could get some visibility
            into your local network, and you would also be able to see what is
            happening as well.

            --
            James
            VE6SRV
          • francois.rogez
            ... I understand that there will be limits to what my system can do. However I would like to eliminate problem caused by setup errors.
            Message 5 of 24 , Dec 7, 2011
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              --- In tracker2@yahoogroups.com, "Lynn W. Deffenbaugh (Mr)" <ldeffenb@...> wrote:
              >
              > 4) wow, flutter, picket-fencing, and other RF interference while
              > mobile. Especially from a lower-powered transmitter.
              >
              > I routinely deliver more packets sitting on parking lots beaconing
              > slowly than I do while mobile. Lots of strange things happen when in
              > motion and AX.25 requires every single bit to be perfect to have a good
              > packet.
              >
              > Lynn (D) - KJ4ERJ - Author of APRSISCE for Windows Mobile and Win32

              I understand that there will be limits to what my system can do. However I would like to eliminate problem caused by setup errors.
            • francois.rogez
              ... Thanks Dave 1) I don t know how to do that. This GPS gets its power (5V) from the DB9 cable, so it won t work if plugged into a usb/serial adapter. I was
              Message 6 of 24 , Dec 7, 2011
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                --- In tracker2@yahoogroups.com, djhuff@... wrote:
                >
                > I would echo what Lynn is saying as well, I might suggest the following
                > items.
                > 1. Try driving somewhere with a laptop connected to the GPS via RS232, and
                > a GPS logging program. (or try a Y cable) This helps rule out the GPS
                > losing lock.
                > 2. Try running the system using a 12V battery instead of vehicle power.
                > Most hams I know have at least one 12v battery somewhere, or you can get
                > one cheap.
                > 3. Drive around in a big square, or similar pattern, try to pull into a
                > parking lot somewhere, and stop for a minute. It will be easier to know if
                > your GPS configuration is getting into the internet.
                > 4. Find a scanner or handheld radio, and tune to your local APRS frequency
                > (144.39 in the US), after a while, your ear will be able to tell if what
                > you hear sounds normal.
                >
                > Hope this helps,
                > Dave W0IM

                Thanks Dave
                1) I don't know how to do that. This GPS gets its power (5V) from the DB9 cable, so it won't work if plugged into a usb/serial adapter. I was hoping the SNOOP command would accomplish that but it is not recognized.
                2,3) Good idea, I will try this tomorrow.
                4) I have a handheld that can display APRS packets. It is receiving the T2-301 packets, but I am at home, so this was expected. I will try this again tomorrow while driving.
              • francois.rogez
                ... True, for now all I know is that the packets don t get to APRS.FI while moving. There are several parking place from which I get to APRS.FI reliably. I
                Message 7 of 24 , Dec 7, 2011
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                  --- In tracker2@yahoogroups.com, "Lynn W. Deffenbaugh (Mr)" <ldeffenb@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > And I just noticed your subject was "Not transmitting", but yet you're
                  > body talked about seeing "packets on aprs.fi". Those are actually two
                  > different things and two different problems. Your proposal of GPS
                  > losing fix would cause a "not transmitting" while most of the other
                  > issues (paths, noisy RF, profile changes) would cause those
                  > transmissions to not make it through an IGate to aprs.fi. So I'd
                  > suggest a new first step.
                  >
                  > 0) - Drive around with someone else and stare at the transmit indicator
                  > on your rig to determine if it's a "not transmitting" issue or a "not
                  > arriving to aprs.fi" issue.
                  >

                  True, for now all I know is that the packets don't get to APRS.FI while moving.
                  There are several parking place from which I get to APRS.FI reliably.
                  I also receive RF packets on my handheld while at home.
                  I will do some test like you suggested tomorrow.
                • francois.rogez
                  ... Yes, I used that path before switching to WIDE2-2 as you suggested yesterday. ... 144.39 I don t know enough about paths to recognize a problem with the
                  Message 8 of 24 , Dec 7, 2011
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                    --- In tracker2@yahoogroups.com, James Ewen <ve6srv@...> wrote:
                    >
                    > On Wed, Dec 7, 2011 at 12:20 PM, francois.rogez <ffdef@...> wrote:
                    >
                    > > I have changed my path to WIDE2-1, but there was no improvement.
                    > > I am guessing that those far-away i-gates are just quicker to put the data on aprs-is.
                    >
                    > It is very strange that only one digipeater in all of LA can hear
                    > you... looking at the last 1000 packets, it looks like there are other
                    > issues afoot that make it very difficult for us to diagnose the issues
                    > from what we can see based on the heavily filtered APRS-IS feed.
                    >
                    > 2011-12-05 10:16:57 MST:
                    > WZ6FR-2>APOT21,WA6JFK-1,WIDE1*,WIDE2-1,qAR,N6EX-3:!3412.12N/11810.35W.142/00012.5V
                    >
                    > That shows that for at least a little bit you were using a
                    > WIDE1-1,WIDE2-1 outgoing path.

                    Yes, I used that path before switching to WIDE2-2 as you suggested yesterday.

                    >
                    > 2011-12-05 10:29:47 MST:
                    > WZ6FR-2>APOT21,N6EX-4*,qAR,WL7AG-10:!3412.12N/11810.35W.142/000/A=00127912.5V
                    >
                    > This packet not long after shows only a single used up hop handled by
                    > N6EX-4, with no trace of the original path used. Shortly after again
                    > we see another packet with the WIDE1-1,WIDE2-1 remnants, which
                    > probably indicates that you are running that path, and the APRS
                    > network in LA is screwed up and destroying the path as it is handled.
                    >
                    > That still doesn't explain why N6EX-4 handles so many of the packets.
                    > Are you on an alternate frequency, or on 144.390?

                    144.39
                    I don't know enough about paths to recognize a problem with the digipeaters or igates, but I'll try to learn.

                    >
                    > N6NEX-4 appears to be handling the majority packets, packets that
                    > probably have been handled by other digipeaters, but due to
                    > misconfigured settings in N6EX-4, we can not see where the packet has
                    > been.
                    >
                    > Without being able to see what is happening on RF in your area we have
                    > little chance of being able to help diagnose the problem.
                    >
                    > The APRS-IS view of your area shows a number of digipeaters close to
                    > your location. You should be heard by them. Do you have another radio?
                    > If you could download a copy of APRSISCE/32 and set that up with a
                    > soundcard modem tied into the second radio (or if you have another
                    > APRS rig, tie that into APRSISCE/32), we could get some visibility
                    > into your local network, and you would also be able to see what is
                    > happening as well.
                    >
                    > --
                    > James
                    > VE6SRV
                    >

                    I will try to set-up APRSISCE/32, but I have a mac, so it may take some work.
                  • francois.rogez
                    ... Ok, I have APRSISCE/32 running on my mac using Parallel and connected to my Kenwood TH-D72. This was easier than I expected. I have turned off APRS-IS to
                    Message 9 of 24 , Dec 7, 2011
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                      --- In tracker2@yahoogroups.com, James Ewen <ve6srv@...> wrote:
                      > If you could download a copy of APRSISCE/32 and set that up with a
                      > soundcard modem tied into the second radio (or if you have another
                      > APRS rig, tie that into APRSISCE/32), we could get some visibility
                      > into your local network, and you would also be able to see what is
                      > happening as well.
                      >
                      > --
                      > James
                      > VE6SRV
                      >

                      Ok, I have APRSISCE/32 running on my mac using Parallel and connected to my Kenwood TH-D72. This was easier than I expected.
                      I have turned off APRS-IS to see only RF.
                      Could you elaborate on what data I should be collecting and how to share it?

                      Thanks
                    • Lynn W. Deffenbaugh (Mr)
                      What callsign-ssid do you have configured in APRSIS32? Please ensure that the following options are checked: Enables / Logging / File Enabled - Puts all trace
                      Message 10 of 24 , Dec 8, 2011
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                        What callsign-ssid do you have configured in APRSIS32?

                        Please ensure that the following options are checked:

                        Enables / Logging / File Enabled - Puts all trace logs to APRSIS32*.LOG

                        Enables / Logging / <YourD72PortName> - This will log all activity on
                        the RF port

                        Enables / Logging / Packets (especially since you have APRS-IS disabled)

                        Enables / Ports / Log All - This will make *.PKT files with all RF
                        received packets

                        If you let it run this way while doing the tests you can see what the
                        D72 is receiving live in Enables / View Logs / <YourD72PortName> and
                        even after the test you can examine the *.PKT or APRSIS32*.LOG files to
                        see what all was received by the D72 and delivered to APRSIS32.

                        Lynn (D) - KJ4ERJ - Author of APRSISCE for Windows Mobile and Win32

                        On 12/8/2011 12:34 AM, francois.rogez wrote:
                        >
                        > --- In tracker2@yahoogroups.com, James Ewen<ve6srv@...> wrote:
                        >> If you could download a copy of APRSISCE/32 and set that up with a
                        >> soundcard modem tied into the second radio (or if you have another
                        >> APRS rig, tie that into APRSISCE/32), we could get some visibility
                        >> into your local network, and you would also be able to see what is
                        >> happening as well.
                        >>
                        >> --
                        >> James
                        >> VE6SRV
                        >>
                        > Ok, I have APRSISCE/32 running on my mac using Parallel and connected to my Kenwood TH-D72. This was easier than I expected.
                        > I have turned off APRS-IS to see only RF.
                        > Could you elaborate on what data I should be collecting and how to share it?
                        >
                        > Thanks
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        > ------------------------------------
                        >
                        > Yahoo! Groups Links
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                      • francois.rogez
                        ... I will follow those instructions in detail tonight. However based on what I saw yesterday, hooking up the D72 to the computer causes the D72 to become deaf
                        Message 11 of 24 , Dec 8, 2011
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                          --- In tracker2@yahoogroups.com, "Lynn W. Deffenbaugh (Mr)" <ldeffenb@...> wrote:
                          >
                          > What callsign-ssid do you have configured in APRSIS32?
                          >
                          > Please ensure that the following options are checked:
                          >
                          > Enables / Logging / File Enabled - Puts all trace logs to APRSIS32*.LOG
                          >
                          > Enables / Logging / <YourD72PortName> - This will log all activity on
                          > the RF port
                          >
                          > Enables / Logging / Packets (especially since you have APRS-IS disabled)
                          >
                          > Enables / Ports / Log All - This will make *.PKT files with all RF
                          > received packets
                          >
                          > If you let it run this way while doing the tests you can see what the
                          > D72 is receiving live in Enables / View Logs / <YourD72PortName> and
                          > even after the test you can examine the *.PKT or APRSIS32*.LOG files to
                          > see what all was received by the D72 and delivered to APRSIS32.
                          >
                          > Lynn (D) - KJ4ERJ - Author of APRSISCE for Windows Mobile and Win32
                          >

                          I will follow those instructions in detail tonight.

                          However based on what I saw yesterday, hooking up the D72 to the computer causes the D72 to become deaf to all except the packets coming directly from my t2-301 which is a few feet away.
                          The USB cable has ferrite beads on both ends, so I don't know how to improve this.
                        • Lynn W. Deffenbaugh (Mr)
                          ... I don t have a D72, but just connecting it to a PC shouldn t, in my mind, change what packets it can hear and/or decode, unless your PC is an RF radiator.
                          Message 12 of 24 , Dec 8, 2011
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                            On 12/8/2011 10:45 AM, francois.rogez wrote:
                            > However based on what I saw yesterday, hooking up the D72 to the computer causes the D72 to become deaf to all except the packets coming directly from my t2-301 which is a few feet away.
                            > The USB cable has ferrite beads on both ends, so I don't know how to improve this.

                            I don't have a D72, but just connecting it to a PC shouldn't, in my
                            mind, change what packets it can hear and/or decode, unless your PC is
                            an RF radiator. Is it just the physical connection, or do you mean that
                            running an APRS client like APRSISCE/32 causes this change in the D72?
                            What are the indications you see that you interpret as becoming "deaf"
                            vs when it is not deaf?

                            Lynn (D) - KJ4ERJ - Author of APRSISCE for Windows Mobile and Win32
                          • francois.rogez
                            ... Update: Thank you all for the good suggestions After driving with a D72 in the car, I receive good packets on the hand-held almost every time ( a few open
                            Message 13 of 24 , Dec 9, 2011
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                              --- In tracker2@yahoogroups.com, "francois.rogez" <ffdef@...> wrote:
                              >
                              > Hi there, just joined and looking for help with a new T2-301.
                              >
                              > Setup:
                              > ADS-GM1 GPS Receiver plugged into serial port B (using ADS splitter cable)
                              > I use port A to run OTWINCFG using Parallel on a mac for setup, or ZTERM for looking at received waypoints
                              > power is provided from my car battery through ADS serial+power cable
                              >
                              > Currently, I have turned off smart beaconing and trying to transmit every minute (planning to slow this down and use smart beaconing as soon as I finished troubleshooting).
                              >
                              > I can see packets on aprs.fi almost every minutes while stopped, but almost no packet while driving.
                              >
                              > Any suggestions on how to make this work while moving?
                              > Thanks
                              >
                              > WZ6FR-2
                              >

                              Update:

                              Thank you all for the good suggestions

                              After driving with a D72 in the car, I receive good packets on the hand-held almost every time ( a few open the squelch, but don't display - I assume those are corrupted)

                              So, the GPS and tracker are fine, and the remaining problem is either RF or path related.
                              Using aprs.fi, I see several people being tracked very well in the same general area.

                              Given the fairly good performance while parked, I am guessing that the setting is ok, but that moving degrades the RF performance enough to become unusable.

                              Any suggestion on improving performance?
                              Current setup: T2-301 with power level set at 99 (~9W?), 2m/70cm magnetic antenna on roof of the car.
                            • Scott Miller
                              The antenna is probably where I d start. I get much better results from a more rigid 5/8 wave than the thin 1/4 wave magmounts while moving. Scott
                              Message 14 of 24 , Dec 12, 2011
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                                The antenna is probably where I'd start. I get much better results from
                                a more rigid 5/8 wave than the thin 1/4 wave magmounts while moving.

                                Scott

                                On 12/9/2011 1:24 PM, francois.rogez wrote:
                                >
                                >
                                > --- In tracker2@yahoogroups.com <mailto:tracker2%40yahoogroups.com>,
                                > "francois.rogez" <ffdef@...> wrote:
                                > >
                                > > Hi there, just joined and looking for help with a new T2-301.
                                > >
                                > > Setup:
                                > > ADS-GM1 GPS Receiver plugged into serial port B (using ADS splitter
                                > cable)
                                > > I use port A to run OTWINCFG using Parallel on a mac for setup, or
                                > ZTERM for looking at received waypoints
                                > > power is provided from my car battery through ADS serial+power cable
                                > >
                                > > Currently, I have turned off smart beaconing and trying to transmit
                                > every minute (planning to slow this down and use smart beaconing as soon
                                > as I finished troubleshooting).
                                > >
                                > > I can see packets on aprs.fi almost every minutes while stopped, but
                                > almost no packet while driving.
                                > >
                                > > Any suggestions on how to make this work while moving?
                                > > Thanks
                                > >
                                > > WZ6FR-2
                                > >
                                >
                                > Update:
                                >
                                > Thank you all for the good suggestions
                                >
                                > After driving with a D72 in the car, I receive good packets on the
                                > hand-held almost every time ( a few open the squelch, but don't display
                                > - I assume those are corrupted)
                                >
                                > So, the GPS and tracker are fine, and the remaining problem is either RF
                                > or path related.
                                > Using aprs.fi, I see several people being tracked very well in the same
                                > general area.
                                >
                                > Given the fairly good performance while parked, I am guessing that the
                                > setting is ok, but that moving degrades the RF performance enough to
                                > become unusable.
                                >
                                > Any suggestion on improving performance?
                                > Current setup: T2-301 with power level set at 99 (~9W?), 2m/70cm
                                > magnetic antenna on roof of the car.
                                >
                                >
                              • francois.rogez
                                Thanks Scott, I will look into that for a future antenna Here is an update, and maybe an end to this topic: After spending more time looking at the aprs.fi
                                Message 15 of 24 , Dec 14, 2011
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                                  Thanks Scott, I will look into that for a future antenna

                                  Here is an update, and maybe an end to this topic:

                                  After spending more time looking at the aprs.fi data and map, I believe that the current performance of my setup (GPS, T2-301, antenna) is quite good: I can hit repeaters several tens of miles away when the topography is favorable (and, I guess, when those repeaters are not already busy dealing with some other packets that I can't hear).

                                  It looks like my mistake was to think that the area where I live ought to have good coverage from the nearby high-altitude digi's. In fact, there is clearly a shadowed area at the base of the mountain where the coverage varies within short distances.
                                  This statement is based on 2 things:
                                  - looking at those packets that made it to aprs.fi and what stations heard me directly
                                  - driving around with a laptop announcing the callsign of the digi's being heard directly

                                  I would like to refine this into more systematic coverage maps:
                                  1 - a map showing where I send a packet from, and whether I hear it echoed back
                                  2 - a map showing the locations where I received any packets from each digi

                                  For (1) I would need a way to detect when the t2-301 decided to send a packet
                                  For (1) and (2) I would need a way to get a GPS position, and a way to log all the time (a laptop is not a good long-term solution). Probably something with a micro-controller and flash memory card.

                                  I will start a new topic when/if I seriously get started with this idea.

                                  Thanks to all that helped rule out issue with the radio/TNC/GPS.



                                  --- In tracker2@yahoogroups.com, Scott Miller <scott@...> wrote:
                                  >
                                  > The antenna is probably where I'd start. I get much better results from
                                  > a more rigid 5/8 wave than the thin 1/4 wave magmounts while moving.
                                  >
                                  > Scott
                                  >
                                  > > So, the GPS and tracker are fine, and the remaining problem is either RF
                                  > > or path related.
                                  > > Using aprs.fi, I see several people being tracked very well in the same
                                  > > general area.
                                  > >
                                  > > Given the fairly good performance while parked, I am guessing that the
                                  > > setting is ok, but that moving degrades the RF performance enough to
                                  > > become unusable.
                                  > >
                                  > > Any suggestion on improving performance?
                                  > > Current setup: T2-301 with power level set at 99 (~9W?), 2m/70cm
                                  > > magnetic antenna on roof of the car.
                                  > >
                                  > >
                                  >
                                • Lynn W. Deffenbaugh (Mr)
                                  ... Download a copy of APRSISCE/32 and switch it over the latest development version following instructions on the wiki at http://aprsisce.wikidot.com/
                                  Message 16 of 24 , Dec 14, 2011
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                                    On 12/14/2011 1:14 PM, francois.rogez wrote:
                                    > I would like to refine this into more systematic coverage maps:
                                    > 1 - a map showing where I send a packet from, and whether I hear it echoed back
                                    > 2 - a map showing the locations where I received any packets from each digi
                                    >
                                    > For (1) I would need a way to detect when the t2-301 decided to send a packet
                                    > For (1) and (2) I would need a way to get a GPS position, and a way to log all the time (a laptop is not a good long-term solution). Probably something with a micro-controller and flash memory card.

                                    Download a copy of APRSISCE/32 and switch it over the latest development
                                    version following instructions on the wiki at http://aprsisce.wikidot.com/

                                    APRSISCE/32 can draw realtime packet paths using your actual coordinates
                                    as each packet is received and the last known locations of not only the
                                    originating station but also every digipeater that handled the packet.

                                    Lynn (D) - KJ4ERJ - Author of APRSISCE for Windows Mobile and Win32
                                  • francois.rogez
                                    ... Hi Lynn, Are you advising me to run APRSISCE/32 in my car? I would have to figure what are my options for hardware as I do not want to use my laptop. For
                                    Message 17 of 24 , Dec 14, 2011
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                                      --- In tracker2@yahoogroups.com, "Lynn W. Deffenbaugh (Mr)" <ldeffenb@...> wrote:
                                      >
                                      > On 12/14/2011 1:14 PM, francois.rogez wrote:
                                      > > I would like to refine this into more systematic coverage maps:
                                      > > 1 - a map showing where I send a packet from, and whether I hear it echoed back
                                      > > 2 - a map showing the locations where I received any packets from each digi
                                      > >
                                      > > For (1) I would need a way to detect when the t2-301 decided to send a packet
                                      > > For (1) and (2) I would need a way to get a GPS position, and a way to log all the time (a laptop is not a good long-term solution). Probably something with a micro-controller and flash memory card.
                                      >
                                      > Download a copy of APRSISCE/32 and switch it over the latest development
                                      > version following instructions on the wiki at http://aprsisce.wikidot.com/
                                      >
                                      > APRSISCE/32 can draw realtime packet paths using your actual coordinates
                                      > as each packet is received and the last known locations of not only the
                                      > originating station but also every digipeater that handled the packet.
                                      >
                                      > Lynn (D) - KJ4ERJ - Author of APRSISCE for Windows Mobile and Win32
                                      >

                                      Hi Lynn,

                                      Are you advising me to run APRSISCE/32 in my car? I would have to figure what are my options for hardware as I do not want to use my laptop.

                                      For home, it could be a nice way to display the data if there is some kind of log file that I can create through other means while driving, and then ingest into APRSISCE/32 once I get home.
                                      Setting up APRSISCE/32 at home with its own receiver would not quite achieve what I am after.
                                    • Fred Hillhouse
                                      I run APRSISCE on an HTC Tilt in my car when I am not running APRSIS32 on my Netbook. The Tilt is used for my daily runs while the Netbook is used for longer
                                      Message 18 of 24 , Dec 14, 2011
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                                        I run APRSISCE on an HTC Tilt in my car when I am not running APRSIS32 on my Netbook. The Tilt is used for my daily runs while the Netbook is used for longer trips. Both make for a nice view into the world of APRS. Both units, connect to my ArgentData OT2 in KISS mode. The Tilt uses Bluetooth while the Netbook is a wired connection. I do not use my Tilt for a phone. It has no SIM card in it.
                                         
                                        I have a mobile desk in my vehicle that either can sit on securely.
                                         
                                        Of course at home, a radio, TNC (hardware or software) connected to APRSIS32 makes for a great application.
                                         
                                        Best regards,
                                        Fred, N7FMH
                                         
                                         


                                        From: tracker2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:tracker2@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of francois.rogez
                                        Sent: Wednesday, December 14, 2011 14:51
                                        To: tracker2@yahoogroups.com
                                        Subject: [tracker2] Re: Not transmitting while moving

                                         



                                        --- In tracker2@yahoogroups.com, "Lynn W. Deffenbaugh (Mr)" <ldeffenb@...> wrote:

                                        >
                                        > On 12/14/2011 1:14
                                        PM, francois.rogez wrote:
                                        > > I would like to refine this into more
                                        systematic coverage maps:
                                        > > 1 - a map showing where I send a packet
                                        from, and whether I hear it echoed back
                                        > > 2 - a map showing the
                                        locations where I received any packets from each digi
                                        > >
                                        > >
                                        For (1) I would need a way to detect when the t2-301 decided to send a packet
                                        > > For (1) and (2) I would need a way to get a GPS position,
                                        and a way to log all the time (a laptop is not a good long-term solution). Probably something with a micro-controller and flash memory card.
                                        >
                                        > Download a copy of APRSISCE/32 and switch it over the latest
                                        development
                                        > version following instructions on the wiki at
                                        href="http://aprsisce.wikidot.com/">http://aprsisce.wikidot.com/
                                        >
                                        > APRSISCE/32 can draw realtime packet paths using your actual
                                        coordinates
                                        > as each packet is received and the last known locations of
                                        not only the
                                        > originating station but also every digipeater that handled
                                        the packet.
                                        >
                                        > Lynn (D) - KJ4ERJ - Author of APRSISCE for Windows
                                        Mobile and Win32
                                        >

                                        Hi Lynn,

                                        Are you advising me to run APRSISCE/32 in my car? I would have to figure what are my options for hardware as I do not want to use my laptop.

                                        For home, it could be a nice way to display the data if there is some kind of log file that I can create through other means while driving, and then ingest into APRSISCE/32 once I get home.
                                        Setting up APRSISCE/32 at home with its own receiver would not quite achieve what I am after.

                                      • Lynn W. Deffenbaugh (Mr)
                                        Yes, the proposal was to take the laptop mobile while you are doing the research, not necessarily as a full-time installation. Currently APRSISCE/32 has no
                                        Message 19 of 24 , Dec 14, 2011
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                                          Yes, the proposal was to take the laptop mobile while you are doing the
                                          research, not necessarily as a full-time installation.

                                          Currently APRSISCE/32 has no means to inject such data, but there may be
                                          a way to do it with a mobile -IS server connected to from your home
                                          station and let the home station capture all packet receptions live from
                                          the mobile IGate. It would require mobile Internet access for the
                                          mobile laptop, but it could be done.

                                          Lynn (D) - KJ4ERJ - Author of APRSISCE for Windows Mobile and Win32

                                          On 12/14/2011 2:51 PM, francois.rogez wrote:
                                          >
                                          > --- In tracker2@yahoogroups.com, "Lynn W. Deffenbaugh (Mr)"<ldeffenb@...> wrote:
                                          >> On 12/14/2011 1:14 PM, francois.rogez wrote:
                                          >>> I would like to refine this into more systematic coverage maps:
                                          >>> 1 - a map showing where I send a packet from, and whether I hear it echoed back
                                          >>> 2 - a map showing the locations where I received any packets from each digi
                                          >>>
                                          >>> For (1) I would need a way to detect when the t2-301 decided to send a packet
                                          >>> For (1) and (2) I would need a way to get a GPS position, and a way to log all the time (a laptop is not a good long-term solution). Probably something with a micro-controller and flash memory card.
                                          >> Download a copy of APRSISCE/32 and switch it over the latest development
                                          >> version following instructions on the wiki at http://aprsisce.wikidot.com/
                                          >>
                                          >> APRSISCE/32 can draw realtime packet paths using your actual coordinates
                                          >> as each packet is received and the last known locations of not only the
                                          >> originating station but also every digipeater that handled the packet.
                                          >>
                                          >> Lynn (D) - KJ4ERJ - Author of APRSISCE for Windows Mobile and Win32
                                          >>
                                          > Hi Lynn,
                                          >
                                          > Are you advising me to run APRSISCE/32 in my car? I would have to figure what are my options for hardware as I do not want to use my laptop.
                                          >
                                          > For home, it could be a nice way to display the data if there is some kind of log file that I can create through other means while driving, and then ingest into APRSISCE/32 once I get home.
                                          > Setting up APRSISCE/32 at home with its own receiver would not quite achieve what I am after.
                                          >
                                          >
                                          >
                                          > ------------------------------------
                                          >
                                          > Yahoo! Groups Links
                                          >
                                          >
                                          >
                                          >
                                        • Marcel S
                                          You may find the digi coverage maps on aprs.fi quite useful to debug good coverage zones as well. Note that these maps a based on the number of packets
                                          Message 20 of 24 , Dec 14, 2011
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                                            You may find the digi coverage maps on aprs.fi quite useful to debug good
                                            coverage zones as well. Note that these maps a based on the number of
                                            packets received in an area and not necessarily the quality of signals from
                                            there. See example at: http://aprs.fi/heard/a/N6EX-1

                                            (You'll want to use SPLAT! for actual propagation mapping. Or visit the
                                            KE5QHX site: http://k5ehx.net/repeaters/qrepeater.php)

                                            Cheers,

                                            -Marcel AI6MS

                                            On Wed, Dec 14, 2011 at 10:14 AM, francois.rogez <ffdef@...> wrote:

                                            > **
                                            >
                                            >
                                            > Thanks Scott, I will look into that for a future antenna
                                            >
                                            > Here is an update, and maybe an end to this topic:
                                            >
                                            > After spending more time looking at the aprs.fi data and map, I believe
                                            > that the current performance of my setup (GPS, T2-301, antenna) is quite
                                            > good: I can hit repeaters several tens of miles away when the topography is
                                            > favorable (and, I guess, when those repeaters are not already busy dealing
                                            > with some other packets that I can't hear).
                                            >
                                            > It looks like my mistake was to think that the area where I live ought to
                                            > have good coverage from the nearby high-altitude digi's. In fact, there is
                                            > clearly a shadowed area at the base of the mountain where the coverage
                                            > varies within short distances.
                                            > This statement is based on 2 things:
                                            > - looking at those packets that made it to aprs.fi and what stations
                                            > heard me directly
                                            > - driving around with a laptop announcing the callsign of the digi's being
                                            > heard directly
                                            >
                                            > I would like to refine this into more systematic coverage maps:
                                            > 1 - a map showing where I send a packet from, and whether I hear it echoed
                                            > back
                                            > 2 - a map showing the locations where I received any packets from each digi
                                            >
                                            > For (1) I would need a way to detect when the t2-301 decided to send a
                                            > packet
                                            > For (1) and (2) I would need a way to get a GPS position, and a way to log
                                            > all the time (a laptop is not a good long-term solution). Probably
                                            > something with a micro-controller and flash memory card.
                                            >
                                            > I will start a new topic when/if I seriously get started with this idea.
                                            >
                                            > Thanks to all that helped rule out issue with the radio/TNC/GPS.
                                          • francois.rogez
                                            Thanks for the links; this probably answers my question, although I might still do my own survey for fun.
                                            Message 21 of 24 , Dec 14, 2011
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                                              Thanks for the links; this probably answers my question, although I might still do my own survey for fun.

                                              --- In tracker2@yahoogroups.com, Marcel S <ki6qdj@...> wrote:
                                              >
                                              > You may find the digi coverage maps on aprs.fi quite useful to debug good
                                              > coverage zones as well. Note that these maps a based on the number of
                                              > packets received in an area and not necessarily the quality of signals from
                                              > there. See example at: http://aprs.fi/heard/a/N6EX-1
                                              >
                                              > (You'll want to use SPLAT! for actual propagation mapping. Or visit the
                                              > KE5QHX site: http://k5ehx.net/repeaters/qrepeater.php)
                                              >
                                              > Cheers,
                                              >
                                              > -Marcel AI6MS
                                              >
                                              > On Wed, Dec 14, 2011 at 10:14 AM, francois.rogez <ffdef@...> wrote:
                                              >
                                              > > **
                                              > >
                                              > >
                                              > > Thanks Scott, I will look into that for a future antenna
                                              > >
                                              > > Here is an update, and maybe an end to this topic:
                                              > >
                                              > > After spending more time looking at the aprs.fi data and map, I believe
                                              > > that the current performance of my setup (GPS, T2-301, antenna) is quite
                                              > > good: I can hit repeaters several tens of miles away when the topography is
                                              > > favorable (and, I guess, when those repeaters are not already busy dealing
                                              > > with some other packets that I can't hear).
                                              > >
                                              > > It looks like my mistake was to think that the area where I live ought to
                                              > > have good coverage from the nearby high-altitude digi's. In fact, there is
                                              > > clearly a shadowed area at the base of the mountain where the coverage
                                              > > varies within short distances.
                                              > > This statement is based on 2 things:
                                              > > - looking at those packets that made it to aprs.fi and what stations
                                              > > heard me directly
                                              > > - driving around with a laptop announcing the callsign of the digi's being
                                              > > heard directly
                                              > >
                                              > > I would like to refine this into more systematic coverage maps:
                                              > > 1 - a map showing where I send a packet from, and whether I hear it echoed
                                              > > back
                                              > > 2 - a map showing the locations where I received any packets from each digi
                                              > >
                                              > > For (1) I would need a way to detect when the t2-301 decided to send a
                                              > > packet
                                              > > For (1) and (2) I would need a way to get a GPS position, and a way to log
                                              > > all the time (a laptop is not a good long-term solution). Probably
                                              > > something with a micro-controller and flash memory card.
                                              > >
                                              > > I will start a new topic when/if I seriously get started with this idea.
                                              > >
                                              > > Thanks to all that helped rule out issue with the radio/TNC/GPS.
                                              >
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