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Re: Pre-Summer Tracker Test

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  • captcurt@flash.net
    ... Is this based on the data in the Last Path line? If so, this makes sense as it was from my home location which is rich with APRS coverage. EN82hi ...
    Message 1 of 12 , Apr 28, 2010
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      --- In tracker2@yahoogroups.com, "Alan" <alan@...> wrote:
      >
      >
      > > Path was left at OT2 Default of Wide1-1, WIDE2-2
      > > Curt
      > > KU8L
      >
      > It appears your path was a single hop WIDE2-1.
      > http://aprs.fi/info/KU8L

      Is this based on the data in the "Last Path" line? If so, this makes sense as it was from my home location which is rich with APRS coverage. EN82hi



      >
      > Unfortunately Hessu of APRS.FI considers a single hop of WIDE2-1 as a digi forwarding error. So if you look at your Heard stations list it's almost empty of heard stations. The WIDE2-1 path is a valid single hop path, and the bread crumbs all show up, just no reception credit is giving to anyone that gated or digied you while running WIDE2-1.
      >
      > Your RAW shows you went directly into I-gates more than through digis.
      > http://aprs.fi/?c=raw&call=KU8L&limit=1000&view=normal

      Not sure I understand the significance of this. I would think that was good..tie up less resource, yes? I Just want the best tracking coverage without being a resource hog.

      >
      > Maybe next trip you can try the USA's recommended mobile path "WIDE1-1,WIDE2-1". It's 2 hops, and will be digied by Fillins too, not just WIDEn-N digis.
      >
      > Alan
      >


      I am going to go back and read my info on the difference this makes in the handling of my beacons...At this point I don't recall the difference in effect of WIDE1-1,WIDE2-2 and WIDE1-1, WIDE2-1


      THanks for all the information gentlemen. I'll actually have 8 weeks of running nearly every day to fine tune this operation so should have a pretty good handle on it all by the end.

      I'm making one more pre-summer test run on the same route in 2 weeks so will try the WIDE2-1 and see how it does. Is there a link that explains this USA mobile path? Don't recall seeing it referenced before.

      Curt
      KU8L
    • captcurt@flash.net
      Thanks Lynn: There are a couple of long periods that straightlined because we had the system shutdown for a while while we used the single power outlet to
      Message 2 of 12 , Apr 28, 2010
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        Thanks Lynn:

        There are a couple of long periods that "straightlined" because we had the system shutdown for a while while we used the single power outlet to charge up other devices in the car :)

        Thanks for taking the time to do this for us.

        Curt
        KU8L

        --- In tracker2@yahoogroups.com, "Lynn W. Deffenbaugh (Mr)" <ldeffenb@...> wrote:
        >
        > I generated APRS coverage maps from the data I had on-hand for KU8L.
        > You can see them at:
        >
        > http://ldeffenb.dnsalias.net.nyud.net/Tracking/Misc/KU8L*
        >
        > There are probably larger holes there than you saw on your trip. My
        > collection server has been having some issues recently and has dropped
        > chunks of data.
        >
        > Lynn (D) - KJ4ERJ
        >
        > captcurt@... wrote:
        > > Well.. the Nuvi 350/OT2 performed very well over the weekend as we drove 2500Miles from Detroit to Tampa and return. We monitored its operation via a smart phone looking at aprs.fi and only saw a brief time thru the cumberland gap area of S KY/N TN where we did not get coverage.
        > >
        > > Was using the system out of a small portable soft bag running a Kenwood TM241A on mid power setting. Antenna was a homebrew 5/8 wave on top of a sedan.
        > >
        > > The messaging from the Nuvi seemed to work and we are considering the system ready for the 15000mile summer tour.
        > >
        > > I did see the Nuvi lock up once but it came right back with a restart. Its still running ver 6.0
        > >
        > > Path was left at OT2 Default of Wide1-1, WIDE2-2
        > >
        > > Thanks to all that answered my newbie questions.
        > >
        > > Curt
        > > KU8L
        > >
        >
      • Lynn W. Deffenbaugh (Mr)
        ... http://www.aprs.org/fix14439.html Lynn (D) - K4JERJ
        Message 3 of 12 , Apr 28, 2010
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          captcurt@... wrote:
          >
          > I'm making one more pre-summer test run on the same route in 2 weeks so will try the WIDE2-1 and see how it does. Is there a link that explains this USA mobile path? Don't recall seeing it referenced before.
          >

          http://www.aprs.org/fix14439.html

          Lynn (D) - K4JERJ
        • Keith VE7GDH
          Curt KU8L wrote... ... The difference is that the first is a three hop path and the second is a two hop path. The recommended path for mobile stations in North
          Message 4 of 12 , Apr 28, 2010
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            Curt KU8L wrote...

            > I am going to go back and read my info on the difference this makes
            > in the handling of my beacons... At this point I don't recall the
            > difference in effect of WIDE1-1,WIDE2-2 and WIDE1-1,WIDE2-1

            The difference is that the first is a three hop path and the second is
            a two hop path. The recommended path for mobile stations in North
            America is WIDE1-1,WIDE2-1 but there will be places where a longer
            path is needed, either to reach another other station on RF, or to make it
            to an IGate where it is more than two digi hops to the next IGate.

            73 es cul - Keith VE7GDH
            --
            "I may be lost, but I know exactly where I am!"
          • captcurt@flash.net
            Thanks Keith and Lynn: I ll read that info If I set the 3 hop path, does it ALWAYS go three or will it stop as soon as it hits an I Gate? I thought it stops
            Message 5 of 12 , Apr 29, 2010
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              Thanks Keith and Lynn:

              I'll read that info

              If I set the 3 hop path, does it ALWAYS go three or will it stop as soon as it hits an I Gate?

              I thought it stops when it hits the IGate.

              Or, if it gets to multiples, and some are digi's, will they keep it going out to the path max?

              Curt

              --- In tracker2@yahoogroups.com, "Keith VE7GDH" <ve7gdh@...> wrote:
              >
              > Curt KU8L wrote...
              >
              > > I am going to go back and read my info on the difference this makes
              > > in the handling of my beacons... At this point I don't recall the
              > > difference in effect of WIDE1-1,WIDE2-2 and WIDE1-1,WIDE2-1
              >
              > The difference is that the first is a three hop path and the second is
              > a two hop path. The recommended path for mobile stations in North
              > America is WIDE1-1,WIDE2-1 but there will be places where a longer
              > path is needed, either to reach another other station on RF, or to make it
              > to an IGate where it is more than two digi hops to the next IGate.
              >
              > 73 es cul - Keith VE7GDH
              > --
              > "I may be lost, but I know exactly where I am!"
              >
            • Lynn W. Deffenbaugh (Mr)
              The path affects RF only. Digis don t know if/when a packet hits an IGate, so if there s an un-used path component and they re set up to respond to it, they
              Message 6 of 12 , Apr 29, 2010
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                The path affects RF only. Digis don't know if/when a packet hits an
                IGate, so if there's an un-used path component and they're set up to
                respond to it, they will. The APRS-IS duplicate detector will only
                propagate the first packet to be introduced, so you'll never know how
                many digis and/or IGates subsequently dealt with your packet.

                So, every packet you send with a WIDE1-1,WIDE2-2 will be digi'd by
                practically every digi that hears it simplex (WIDE2's typically act on
                WIDE1 as well). A simplex-local IGate may have also heard the packet
                and gated it to the -IS on your original transmission, but the RF
                doesn't know that, so a WIDE1*,WIDE2-2 packet is digid back onto RF. A
                wider circle of digis will now (hopefully) hear the packet, especially
                WIDE2 digis. They'll repeat it as WIDE1*,WIDE2-1 in a much wider
                circle. A bunch more IGates will hear that transmission and their
                duplicate detector (the original packet having already propagated to
                them) will simply ignore it. You'll never know that happened. But all
                of the WIDE2 digis in that much wider circle will hear it for the first
                time so they'll also act on it, retransmitting now as a WIDE1,WIDE2*.
                By now, you've probably lit up a 300+ mile radius from your actual
                location and, in many areas of the country, have hit 6 or 8 or more IGates.

                WIDE1-1,WIDE2-1 is sufficient in most areas, especially near major
                cities. When you get out in the sticks (fewer and further between), you
                might benefit from WIDE1-1,WIDE2-2, but in many of those areas, just
                getting simplex to the first digi is the hard part. If you can make it
                there, you'll probably make it to an IGate, even with WIDE1-1,WIDE2-1.

                I really wish we could tell the difference between an original WIDE2-1
                that was used up vs an original WIDE2-2. If I could do so reliably
                (really difficult with the proportional pathing people out there), I
                could do some serious analysis of whether or where WIDE2-2 was actually
                necessary to get to an IGate.

                Of course, one of the major purposes of APRS is mobile awareness. This
                is the primary reason I use WIDE1-1,WIDE2-1 in normal situations, but
                bump it up to WIDE1-1,WIDE2-2 on road trips. That way, people
                monitoring the RF-side, will see my mobile approaching and departing
                from a larger distance. But when I'm staying in one area, I drop back
                to my normal WIDE1-1,WIDE2-1 so as not to pollute the surrounding
                countryside with my day-to-day movements.

                Lynn (D) - KJ4ERJ - T2-135/DR-135 as KJ4ERJ-9 and KJ4OVQ-9

                captcurt@... wrote:
                > Thanks Keith and Lynn:
                >
                > I'll read that info
                >
                > If I set the 3 hop path, does it ALWAYS go three or will it stop as soon as it hits an I Gate?
                >
                > I thought it stops when it hits the IGate.
                >
                > Or, if it gets to multiples, and some are digi's, will they keep it going out to the path max?
                >
                > Curt
                >
                > --- In tracker2@yahoogroups.com, "Keith VE7GDH" <ve7gdh@...> wrote:
                >
                >> Curt KU8L wrote...
                >>
                >>
                >>> I am going to go back and read my info on the difference this makes
                >>> in the handling of my beacons... At this point I don't recall the
                >>> difference in effect of WIDE1-1,WIDE2-2 and WIDE1-1,WIDE2-1
                >>>
                >> The difference is that the first is a three hop path and the second is
                >> a two hop path. The recommended path for mobile stations in North
                >> America is WIDE1-1,WIDE2-1 but there will be places where a longer
                >> path is needed, either to reach another other station on RF, or to make it
                >> to an IGate where it is more than two digi hops to the next IGate.
                >>
                >> 73 es cul - Keith VE7GDH
                >> --
                >> "I may be lost, but I know exactly where I am!"
                >>
              • captcurt@flash.net
                This sounds like a reasonable approach for an extensive road trip. I saw in the info link you sent earlier regarding the proportional paths...the OT2 does not
                Message 7 of 12 , Apr 29, 2010
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                  This sounds like a reasonable approach for an extensive road trip.

                  I saw in the info link you sent earlier regarding the proportional paths...the OT2 does not offer that option as far as I can tell. I will be using the smart beaconing function however and will try that on the same Detroit-Tampa route again in 2 weeks...

                  Curt
                  KU8L

                  --- In tracker2@yahoogroups.com, "Lynn W. Deffenbaugh (Mr)" <ldeffenb@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > The path affects RF only. Digis don't know if/when a packet hits an
                  > IGate, so if there's an un-used path component and they're set up to
                  > respond to it, they will. The APRS-IS duplicate detector will only
                  > propagate the first packet to be introduced, so you'll never know how
                  > many digis and/or IGates subsequently dealt with your packet.
                  >
                  > So, every packet you send with a WIDE1-1,WIDE2-2 will be digi'd by
                  > practically every digi that hears it simplex (WIDE2's typically act on
                  > WIDE1 as well). A simplex-local IGate may have also heard the packet
                  > and gated it to the -IS on your original transmission, but the RF
                  > doesn't know that, so a WIDE1*,WIDE2-2 packet is digid back onto RF. A
                  > wider circle of digis will now (hopefully) hear the packet, especially
                  > WIDE2 digis. They'll repeat it as WIDE1*,WIDE2-1 in a much wider
                  > circle. A bunch more IGates will hear that transmission and their
                  > duplicate detector (the original packet having already propagated to
                  > them) will simply ignore it. You'll never know that happened. But all
                  > of the WIDE2 digis in that much wider circle will hear it for the first
                  > time so they'll also act on it, retransmitting now as a WIDE1,WIDE2*.
                  > By now, you've probably lit up a 300+ mile radius from your actual
                  > location and, in many areas of the country, have hit 6 or 8 or more IGates.
                  >
                  > WIDE1-1,WIDE2-1 is sufficient in most areas, especially near major
                  > cities. When you get out in the sticks (fewer and further between), you
                  > might benefit from WIDE1-1,WIDE2-2, but in many of those areas, just
                  > getting simplex to the first digi is the hard part. If you can make it
                  > there, you'll probably make it to an IGate, even with WIDE1-1,WIDE2-1.
                  >
                  > I really wish we could tell the difference between an original WIDE2-1
                  > that was used up vs an original WIDE2-2. If I could do so reliably
                  > (really difficult with the proportional pathing people out there), I
                  > could do some serious analysis of whether or where WIDE2-2 was actually
                  > necessary to get to an IGate.
                  >
                  > Of course, one of the major purposes of APRS is mobile awareness. This
                  > is the primary reason I use WIDE1-1,WIDE2-1 in normal situations, but
                  > bump it up to WIDE1-1,WIDE2-2 on road trips. That way, people
                  > monitoring the RF-side, will see my mobile approaching and departing
                  > from a larger distance. But when I'm staying in one area, I drop back
                  > to my normal WIDE1-1,WIDE2-1 so as not to pollute the surrounding
                  > countryside with my day-to-day movements.
                  >
                  > Lynn (D) - KJ4ERJ - T2-135/DR-135 as KJ4ERJ-9 and KJ4OVQ-9
                  >
                  > captcurt@... wrote:
                  > > Thanks Keith and Lynn:
                  > >
                  > > I'll read that info
                  > >
                  > > If I set the 3 hop path, does it ALWAYS go three or will it stop as soon as it hits an I Gate?
                  > >
                  > > I thought it stops when it hits the IGate.
                  > >
                  > > Or, if it gets to multiples, and some are digi's, will they keep it going out to the path max?
                  > >
                  > > Curt
                  > >
                  > > --- In tracker2@yahoogroups.com, "Keith VE7GDH" <ve7gdh@> wrote:
                  > >
                  > >> Curt KU8L wrote...
                  > >>
                  > >>
                  > >>> I am going to go back and read my info on the difference this makes
                  > >>> in the handling of my beacons... At this point I don't recall the
                  > >>> difference in effect of WIDE1-1,WIDE2-2 and WIDE1-1,WIDE2-1
                  > >>>
                  > >> The difference is that the first is a three hop path and the second is
                  > >> a two hop path. The recommended path for mobile stations in North
                  > >> America is WIDE1-1,WIDE2-1 but there will be places where a longer
                  > >> path is needed, either to reach another other station on RF, or to make it
                  > >> to an IGate where it is more than two digi hops to the next IGate.
                  > >>
                  > >> 73 es cul - Keith VE7GDH
                  > >> --
                  > >> "I may be lost, but I know exactly where I am!"
                  > >>
                  >
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