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TR given credit (but can anyone prove this?)

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  • tbaker@pro-ns.net
    For those just tuning in, I am a dog breed researcher and my focus is the American Rat Terrier. There is much on the web crediting TR with naming the Rat
    Message 1 of 3 , Jan 30, 2004
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      For those just tuning in, I am a dog breed researcher and my focus is the
      American Rat Terrier. There is much on the web crediting TR with naming the
      Rat Terrier breed, and I believe this is false - down to the last drop! I
      have again come across info that credits TR with naming the RAT, and I offer
      it to the group for comments.

      >>
      A tenacious Terrier of questionable ancestry, named "Skip", was acquired on a
      trip near the Grand Canyon by our 26th President, Theodore Roosevelt, and
      resided there in The White House during Roosevelt’s presidency. The
      breed's name is attributed to T.R., coined up in honor of his own
      Terriers’ who promptly exterminated the many thousands of rats that
      infested The White House after the demolition of the old Jefferson
      greenhouses, and during the subsequent construction of additional wings.>>

      I have contacted the White House History Association who can find NO
      indication or evidence of a rat infestation of the White House during TR's
      time. Where did this tidbit come from then? Was a vermin infestation
      mentioned in any letters to relatives?

      Concrete facts I have found are very hard to find, but misinformation is MUCH
      HARDER to disprove once its gets taken for fact!

      Any imput is appreciated!
    • John A. Gable
      Skip was a mongrel hound dog/hunting dog from Colorado. TR had many kinds of dogs, mostly mongrels. I have heard that the White House had rats and used rat
      Message 2 of 3 , Jan 30, 2004
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        Skip was a mongrel hound dog/hunting dog from Colorado. TR had many kinds of
        dogs, mostly mongrels. I have heard that the White House had rats and used
        rat terriers, but I don't know where I heard that. I have never seen a claim
        that TR named the rat terrier as such, and therefore tend to doubt that.
        John Gable at TRA in Oyster Bay
        ----- Original Message -----
        From: <tbaker@...>
        To: <tr-m@yahoogroups.com>
        Sent: Friday, January 30, 2004 2:21 PM
        Subject: [tr-m] TR given credit (but can anyone prove this?)


        > For those just tuning in, I am a dog breed researcher and my focus is the
        > American Rat Terrier. There is much on the web crediting TR with naming
        the
        > Rat Terrier breed, and I believe this is false - down to the last drop! I
        > have again come across info that credits TR with naming the RAT, and I
        offer
        > it to the group for comments.
        >
        > >>
        > A tenacious Terrier of questionable ancestry, named "Skip", was acquired
        on a
        > trip near the Grand Canyon by our 26th President, Theodore Roosevelt, and
        > resided there in The White House during Roosevelt’s presidency. The
        > breed's name is attributed to T.R., coined up in honor of his own
        > Terriers’ who promptly exterminated the many thousands of rats that
        > infested The White House after the demolition of the old Jefferson
        > greenhouses, and during the subsequent construction of additional wings.>>
        >
        > I have contacted the White House History Association who can find NO
        > indication or evidence of a rat infestation of the White House during TR's
        > time. Where did this tidbit come from then? Was a vermin infestation
        > mentioned in any letters to relatives?
        >
        > Concrete facts I have found are very hard to find, but misinformation is
        MUCH
        > HARDER to disprove once its gets taken for fact!
        >
        > Any imput is appreciated!
        >
        >
        >
        > To Post a message, send it to: tr-m@...
        > To Unsubscribe, send a blank message to: tr-m-unsubscribe@...
        >
        >
        > Yahoo! Groups Links
        >
        > To visit your group on the web, go to:
        > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/tr-m/
        >
        > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
        > tr-m-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
        >
        > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
        > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
        >
        >
      • tbaker@pro-ns.net
        Hey John! I have done some digging into TR - the RAT and the myth and am still trying to nail down just how this rumour of TR naming the rat terrier came
        Message 3 of 3 , Jan 31, 2004
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          Hey John!

          I have done some digging into "TR - the RAT and the myth" and am still trying
          to nail down just how this rumour of TR naming the rat terrier came about. I
          have my theories :-). TR had two Manchester terriers, both named Jack, and
          the Manchester terrier in the latter 1800's and early 1900's was actually
          called a 'rat terrier', as it was one of the breeds specifically used in
          ratting competition. (Can you just SEE TR at a ratting match? I bet he'd
          have gone to one!) Thus when he moved into the White House with Jack, he had
          a 'rat terrier' - of sorts. I am thinking that either the attention of the
          news media of the day got it out that the White House had rats because TR had
          a rat terrier (ie Manchester), or that the Rat terrier breed clubs have done
          some very poor homework (and indeed in some cases I feel TR has been exploited
          by this forced association.) In any event, nearly and dog will kill rats, and
          from what I can tell TR also bred Scotties on his ranch and (since birth
          control for dogs is never easy) from the film footage I can where dogs are
          shown, many dogs that are claimed by Rat terrier enthusiasts to be Rat
          terriers are likely scottie mixes, and scotties will do a mean number on
          vermin also.

          Check out my "History of the Rat Terrier in a Nutshell" for a teeny bit of TR
          history and the Rat Terrier. And please feel free to communicate any errors!
          I have drawn some of my history from this group and I want to make sure I have
          it right.

          And if anyone can knows where I should look to verify the demolition of the
          green house and the thousands of rats please contact me.

          Thanks,

          Theresa

          T's History of the Rat Terrier in a Nutshell:

          http://members.aol.com/cutzpy/rthistory.html


          My kennel album -
          RatpiT Kennels: Inproving the breed ONE litter at a time!

          http://www.imageevent.com/rheller









          "John A. Gable" <TRA_Gable@...> wrote:

          > Skip was a mongrel hound dog/hunting dog from Colorado. TR had many kinds of
          > dogs, mostly mongrels. I have heard that the White House had rats and used
          > rat terriers, but I don't know where I heard that. I have never seen a claim
          > that TR named the rat terrier as such, and therefore tend to doubt that.
          > John Gable at TRA in Oyster Bay
          > ----- Original Message -----
          > Wrom: AAFXISHJEXXIMQZUIVO
          > To: <tr-m@yahoogroups.com>
          > Sent: Friday, January 30, 2004 2:21 PM
          > Subject: [tr-m] TR given credit (but can anyone prove this?)
          >
          >
          > > For those just tuning in, I am a dog breed researcher and my focus is the
          > > American Rat Terrier. There is much on the web crediting TR with naming
          > the
          > > Rat Terrier breed, and I believe this is false - down to the last drop! I
          > > have again come across info that credits TR with naming the RAT, and I
          > offer
          > > it to the group for comments.
          > >
          > > >>
          > > A tenacious Terrier of questionable ancestry, named "Skip", was acquired
          > on a
          > > trip near the Grand Canyon by our 26th President, Theodore Roosevelt, and
          > > resided there in The White House during Roosevelt’s presidency. The
          > > breed's name is attributed to T.R., coined up in honor of his own
          > > Terriers’ who promptly exterminated the many thousands of rats that
          > > infested The White House after the demolition of the old Jefferson
          > > greenhouses, and during the subsequent construction of additional wings.>>
          > >
          > > I have contacted the White House History Association who can find NO
          > > indication or evidence of a rat infestation of the White House during TR's
          > > time. Where did this tidbit come from then? Was a vermin infestation
          > > mentioned in any letters to relatives?
          > >
          > > Concrete facts I have found are very hard to find, but misinformation is
          > MUCH
          > > HARDER to disprove once its gets taken for fact!
          > >
          > > Any imput is appreciated!
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > > To Post a message, send it to: tr-m@...
          > > To Unsubscribe, send a blank message to: tr-m-unsubscribe@...
          > >
          > >
          > > Yahoo! Groups Links
          > >
          > > To visit your group on the web, go to:
          > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/tr-m/
          > >
          > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
          > > tr-m-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
          > >
          > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
          > > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
          > >
          > >
          >
          >
          >
          > To Post a message, send it to: tr-m@...
          > To Unsubscribe, send a blank message to: tr-m-unsubscribe@...
          >
          >
          > Yahoo! Groups Links
          >
          > To visit your group on the web, go to:
          > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/tr-m/
          >
          > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
          > tr-m-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
          >
          > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
          > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
          >
          >
          >
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