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  • John A. Gable
    ... From: John A. Gable To: gg@chapultepec.com Sent: Friday, June 27, 2003 4:22 PM Subject: Your web site Re web site www.theodore-roosevelt.com Sir: The
    Message 1 of 4 , Jun 27, 2003
       
      ----- Original Message -----
      To: gg@...
      Sent: Friday, June 27, 2003 4:22 PM
      Subject: Your web site

      Re web site
       
      Sir:
       
            The fundamental problem with the material by Theodore Roosevelt that you include on your web site is that you do not list any source for the items, such as  newspaper, book by TR, TR's collected works, magazine issue, etc. This makes it impossible to check, in any easy way, the material for accuracy and completeness, and for related items that might be in the original source of publication. Moreover, citing where you found things or get things from is basic to scholarship.
       
            The item you list as Theodore Roosevelt's "Progressive Party Acceptance Speech,"  August 6, 1912 is certainly not that.  I wonder what it is, and where it is from. Can you tell me ? TR's acceptance speech was quite brief, and I print almost all of it for you at the conclusion of this e-mail, with the text taken from the transcript of the 1912 Progressive national convention. The date of TR's nomination and his acceptance remarks, by the way, is August 7 (not 6), 1912. Feel free to post the correct text on your web site. Indeed, I urge you to do so.
       
            You list a speech on your site as the "We Stand at Armageddon" speech of 1912. What you have is "A Confession of Faith," the address TR delivered to the Progressive national convention on August 6, 1912, before he was nominated. This keynote address to the Bull Moose convention has been widely reprinted, and always, so far as I know, under the title of "A Confession of Faith."  See National Edition of the Works of Theodore Roosevelt, Vol.  XVII, pp. 254 -   299. Now, TR says at the conclusion that he will AGAIN say what he said some six weeks before in Chicago when the Republican Party's convention met, "We stand at Armageddon , and we battle for the Lord."
       
            The speech sometimes called the Armageddon speech, the speech when the famous phrase was first used,  was published as "The Case Against the Reactionaries,"  Chicago, June 17, 1912, National Edition, XVII,  pp. 204-231. The text in this edition is taken from the original speech manuscript in the TR Papers, Library of Congress.
       
            I urge you to correct the title of the "Confession of Faith" speech, and as with all material you reprint, please do list some source. Without bibliographical information you marginalize the value of your site to students, researchers, the media, historians, everyone.
       
            I find it very strange that you list on your site Theodore Roosevelt's Annual Messages to Congress as "addresses,  " as the "Annual Address." These were, as stated,  "Annual Messages."  As I am sure you know, no President between John Adams and Woodrow Wilson ever addressed Congress in person, as is done today. TR sent "messages" which were read to Congress.  You will find them all listed as such in Vol. XV of the National Edition of the Works.
       
            When one seeks to put out or disseminate information, one takes on a solemn responsibility to be accurate and to follow the standard rules of scholarship/publication/citation.
       
            I find your web site of interest, and hope this material is of use to you.
       
                                                     John A. Gable
                                                      Executive Director
                                                      Theodore Roosevelt Association
      Appendix.
                           Theodore Roosevelt's Acceptance Remarks at the Progressive National
                                                        Convention, August 7, 1912
            "...I come forward to thank you from my heart for the honor you have conferred on me, and to say of course I accept. I am measuring my words, I have been president, I have seen and known much of life, and I hold it by far the greatest honor and the greatest opportunity that has ever come to me, to be called by you to the leadership for the time being of this great movement in the interests of the American people."
       
      Source, for TR's acceptance and the acceptance speech for Vice President by Hiram W. Johnson, see First National Convention of the Progressive Party,  typed ms., pp. 292-299.  Copies of the typed minutes are in the TR Papers, Library of Congress and the Theodore Roosevelt Collection at Harvard.;
       
       
                                                                  
       
       
    • tbaker@pro-ns.net
      Hello all! I am stumped on finding a bit of info and am asking for your help in this matter. I would normally run to my library and sift thru TR s works, but
      Message 2 of 4 , Jun 28, 2003
        Hello all!

        I am stumped on finding a bit of info and am asking for your help in this
        matter. I would normally run to my library and sift thru TR's works, but the
        Minneapolis Public Library's collection is all in storage as they are building
        a new building - argh! I've tried Bartleby.com and searched thru the online
        works to no avail and now apply to the mercy of the group as a last resort! I
        need to find a needle in a haystack... I KNOW I read this while skimming thru
        his works, but I cannot recall where! In his writtings TR refers to his
        little dog Skip (aquired from John Goff on his Colorado bear hunt in 1905) as
        a 'mongrel'. I have on hand "Letters to his children" and while TR refers to
        Skip as an "absurd little terrier", but it is not in this work. TR mentions
        Skip in this context in a work that is not hunting related (no African game
        trails), possibly in a letter as a passing comment to a relative or political
        person, and after 1905 - and that is all I can recall. If anyone has time, if
        you could crack open a book or two in your personal library and check the
        index for this tidbit on Skip, I would be indebted! (Gosh forbid I attempt to
        quote TR and NOT list a correct source! :-))



        Thanks,

        T.
      • John A. Gable
        In the chapter A Colorado Bear Hunt, in Outdoor Pastimes of an American Hunter, TR discusses Skip, a funny little black and tan. My impression is that
        Message 3 of 4 , Jun 28, 2003
          In the chapter "A Colorado Bear Hunt," in Outdoor Pastimes of an American
          Hunter, TR discusses Skip, " a funny little black and tan." My impression is
          that all or most of Johnny Goff's dogs were mixed breed.
          J. Gable
          ----- Original Message -----
          From: <tbaker@...>
          To: <tr-m@yahoogroups.com>
          Sent: Saturday, June 28, 2003 12:39 PM
          Subject: [tr-m] TR group -If you have the time, help please! (His dog SKIP!)


          > Hello all!
          >
          > I am stumped on finding a bit of info and am asking for your help in this
          > matter. I would normally run to my library and sift thru TR's works, but
          the
          > Minneapolis Public Library's collection is all in storage as they are
          building
          > a new building - argh! I've tried Bartleby.com and searched thru the
          online
          > works to no avail and now apply to the mercy of the group as a last
          resort! I
          > need to find a needle in a haystack... I KNOW I read this while skimming
          thru
          > his works, but I cannot recall where! In his writtings TR refers to his
          > little dog Skip (aquired from John Goff on his Colorado bear hunt in 1905)
          as
          > a 'mongrel'. I have on hand "Letters to his children" and while TR refers
          to
          > Skip as an "absurd little terrier", but it is not in this work. TR
          mentions
          > Skip in this context in a work that is not hunting related (no African
          game
          > trails), possibly in a letter as a passing comment to a relative or
          political
          > person, and after 1905 - and that is all I can recall. If anyone has time,
          if
          > you could crack open a book or two in your personal library and check the
          > index for this tidbit on Skip, I would be indebted! (Gosh forbid I
          attempt to
          > quote TR and NOT list a correct source! :-))
          >
          >
          >
          > Thanks,
          >
          > T.
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > To Post a message, send it to: tr-m@...
          > To Unsubscribe, send a blank message to: tr-m-unsubscribe@...
          >
          > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
          >
          >
        • tbaker@pro-ns.net
          Thank you - very cool :-). I had forgotten about this reference and IMHO it suggests that Skip was a feist, which in this case was likely a fox
          Message 4 of 4 , Jun 30, 2003
            Thank you - very cool :-). I had forgotten about this reference and IMHO it
            suggests that Skip was a feist, which in this case was likely a fox
            terrier/Manchester terrier cross.

            I do have from Jeremy Johnston his wonderful biography on his grandfather, and
            he cites an interview in Outdoor Life where John Goff states the composition
            of his hunting pack.

            >>“I have in my pack –and name them in the order of efficiency
            – foxhounds, bloodhounds, crosses between these two, bull-terriers,
            fox-terriers, fox-terrier crosses with other terriers, and canines that can
            only be called just ‘dog’.” (Outdoor Life, volume. xvi,
            number 3, September 1905)<<

            TR said, about the dogs on the Colorado bear hunt: "“Each brought his
            own dogs; all told, there were 26 hounds and four half blood terriers to help
            worry the bear when at bay.” (The Wilderness Hunter, Outdoor Pastimes
            of an American Hunter, v.1).

            Skip was one of these half blood terriers alright, and half the size of Jack,
            who was a Manchester. (This tidbit somewhere in 'Letters to his children.')
            I know he referred to Skip as a mongrel tho - somewhere! - so if you do run
            across it please clue me in! And in the mean time I will await my library to
            reopen to I can find this tidbit myself. I just hate it when I read it and
            can't find it tho!

            Thanks so much for your help!

            T.








            "John A. Gable" <TRA_Gable@...> wrote:

            > In the chapter "A Colorado Bear Hunt," in Outdoor Pastimes of an American
            > Hunter, TR discusses Skip, " a funny little black and tan." My impression is
            > that all or most of Johnny Goff's dogs were mixed breed.
            > J. Gable
            > ----- Original Message -----
            > From: <tbaker@...>
            > To: <tr-m@yahoogroups.com>
            > Sent: Saturday, June 28, 2003 12:39 PM
            > Subject: [tr-m] TR group -If you have the time, help please! (His dog SKIP!)
            >
            >
            > > Hello all!
            > >
            > > I am stumped on finding a bit of info and am asking for your help in this
            > > matter. I would normally run to my library and sift thru TR's works, but
            > the
            > > Minneapolis Public Library's collection is all in storage as they are
            > building
            > > a new building - argh! I've tried Bartleby.com and searched thru the
            > online
            > > works to no avail and now apply to the mercy of the group as a last
            > resort! I
            > > need to find a needle in a haystack... I KNOW I read this while skimming
            > thru
            > > his works, but I cannot recall where! In his writtings TR refers to his
            > > little dog Skip (aquired from John Goff on his Colorado bear hunt in 1905)
            > as
            > > a 'mongrel'. I have on hand "Letters to his children" and while TR refers
            > to
            > > Skip as an "absurd little terrier", but it is not in this work. TR
            > mentions
            > > Skip in this context in a work that is not hunting related (no African
            > game
            > > trails), possibly in a letter as a passing comment to a relative or
            > political
            > > person, and after 1905 - and that is all I can recall. If anyone has time,
            > if
            > > you could crack open a book or two in your personal library and check the
            > > index for this tidbit on Skip, I would be indebted! (Gosh forbid I
            > attempt to
            > > quote TR and NOT list a correct source! :-))
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > > Thanks,
            > >
            > > T.
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > > To Post a message, send it to: tr-m@...
            > > To Unsubscribe, send a blank message to: tr-m-unsubscribe@...
            > >
            > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
            > >
            > >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > To Post a message, send it to: tr-m@...
            > To Unsubscribe, send a blank message to: tr-m-unsubscribe@...
            >
            > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
            >
            >
            >
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